You should vote for your candidates in smaller elections. A third-party candidate is not going to bum-rush the presidency without having seats in the senate and congress and in local office.
It's not going to happen. Vote for the lesser of evils in the Presidential election until you've voted some support into other offices. I happen to like Obama and not think he's the lesser of two evils, but that's just me.
I thought that maybe someone arguing that things weren't taking out of context would link to the full text. Better luck next time. Thanks, Nathan Curry
It's absurd. There's no moral superiority in the left. It rationalizes racism against white people, and its environmental stances are a joke. You are innately divisive, because you judge people on everything.
I thought it was the domain of the religious fanatics to judge people for stuff like homosexuality, oral sex, sex before marriage, and whatnot. It used to be that the republicans were the good guys in the censorship wars, but no longer.
I thought it was the domain of the religious fanatics to judge people based upon their belief or non-belief in a god or no god. And control whether or not people can get an abortion. It's a gray area, that's why there's so much disagreement. There shouldn't be a law against it.
It's the republicans and religious fanatics who put more people in prison and put more people to death, which goes a long way towards taking away someone's rights.
There's no moral superiority on your side, and you don't need to come out like a bunch of thugs and pretend that there is, because I'm not and no one else is going to believe it.
You know, I shudder to think of Mike Huckabee as president, but I think he's actually a decent guy. And he said Jesus was too smart to get into politics. And I think that goes a long way to dispelling the myth you're propagating about there being morality in politics. Especially Republican/Democrat politics.
F. Ralph Motherfucking Douchbag Nader and all the idiot hippies that thought he was a good choice
Hippies don't vote, really.
This time, I'm sort of pissed at Mr. Nader for running, but Al Gore should have been able to beat Bush. Seriously. Even with the election fraud. And he could have chosen not to fold like a lawn chair. But he didn't
"I heard Ambassador Peck on an interview yesterday did anybody else see or hear him? He was on FOX News, this is a white man, and he was upsetting the FOX News commentators to no end, he pointed out, a white man, an ambassador, he pointed out that what Malcolm X said when he was silenced by Elijah Mohammad was in fact true, he said Americas chickens, are coming home to roost."
"We took this country by terror away from the Sioux, the Apache, Arikara, the Comanche, the Arapaho, the Navajo. Terrorism.
"We took Africans away from their country to build our way of ease and kept them enslaved and living in fear. Terrorism.
"We bombed Grenada and killed innocent civilians, babies, non-military personnel.
"We bombed the black civilian community of Panama with stealth bombers and killed unarmed teenage and toddlers, pregnant mothers and hard working fathers.
"We bombed Qaddafi's home, and killed his child. Blessed are they who bash your children's head against the rock.
"We bombed Iraq. We killed unarmed civilians trying to make a living. We bombed a plant in Sudan to pay back for the attack on our embassy, killed hundreds of hard working people, mothers and fathers who left home to go that day not knowing that they'd never get back home.
"We bombed Hiroshima. We bombed Nagasaki, and we nuked far more than the thousands in New York and the Pentagon and we never batted an eye.
"Kids playing in the playground. Mothers picking up children after school. Civilians, not soldiers, people just trying to make it day by day.
"We have supported state terrorism against the Palestinians and black South Africans, and now we are indignant because the stuff that we have done overseas is now brought right back into our own front yards. America's chickens are coming home to roost.
"Violence begets violence. Hatred begets hatred. And terrorism begets terrorism. A white ambassador said that y'all, not a black militant. Not a reverend who preaches about racism. An ambassador whose eyes are wide open and who is trying to get us to wake up and move away from this dangerous precipice upon which we are now poised. The ambassador said the people we have wounded don't have the military capability we have. But they do have individuals who are willing to die and take thousands with them. And we need to come to grips with that."
It would be like not being racist, but attending the KKK meetings because you liked the way you looked in the uniform.
The premise of the KKK is that white people are genetically superior. (Rebuttal.)
The premise of black anger is: 1. Slavery in general 2. Slaves were bred like animals. 3. Slaves were raped, and that was totally cool. 4. Slaves were murdered for trying to educate themselves 5. The whole Jim Crow thing 6. Black voter disenfranchisement up through the black civil rights movement (what 1964, was it?) 7. Black voter disenfranchisement in 2000 (this is undeniable. Look it up) 8. Racist police force that until the last 50 years or so could kill black men or rape a black woman with zero fear of repercussions.
Shall I continue? It's not even remotely comparable.
Obama's preacher is a racist, a white person voting for him would be like a black person voting for a white man whose preacher is a Klansman.
Except that Wright grew up being called nigger. The Klansman is uncomfortable with black people, and he maintains they are monkeys, lynches them, or whatever. White people are a majority, and black people are subject to violence and discrimination every day from people who are visually indistinguishable from 70% of the population.
Also, Wright doesn't hate white people. You've seen, like everyone else has, 45 seconds total out of 20 years preaching. He makes a case against the rich white guys that create(d) the policies that disenfranchise the black people. He says God doesn't bless america for killing innocent people, he damns america for killing people (quote, "It's in the Bible").
So yeah, he's got anger that stems from living in a segregated society. Oh, and Chicago has some of the worst problems with police racism in the country, for what it's worth.
My attitude that the laws here are no match for ethics, and I can only think of an imaginary country where the laws are relatively representative of ethics? I'm not sure you understood what I meant.
In this whole Rev. Wright thing, it's become very very apparent how the media neglects their responsibility to a)elevate the dialog and b)at least show a 5-minute clip before condemning a man. People expect all of their leaders to be saints, and it's ridiculous.
The only thing that Rev. Wright said that was ridiculous was that the govt created the AIDS virus to kill black people. But then, he also believes in a homonid living in the sky, so I give him a free pass on that. Beyond that, he said:
1. God doesn't bless America for killing innocent people, he damns America for killing innocent people. 2. And he said that our violence in the world begets violence at home.
Which are both teachings straight from the motherfucking Bible, everybody. People are pissed because a preacher preaches from the Bible? Come the fuck on. [/tangent] oh, look at that. my captcha is "tedious".:-)
I thought that saying 'atheists have' meant 'all atheists have' not 'some' but English is my second language, so I probably made a mistake..
Well, I should have been more specific. People tend to interpret however they feel like it, but generally, if you don't say all or some, it's a toss-up. So you weren't wrong to make sure I meant what you thought I meant. As someone who also speaks two languages (Spanish being my second), I'd like to congratulate you on your excellent spelling and grammar. I couldn't tell it was your second language.:-)
Not only child molesters, but also genocides. Ask your favorite search engine about Von Wernich the catholic priest who is been convicted for genocide in Argentina and still can give misa (I don't know the English word, it may be something like miss o mass. It's the act to gather people, preach and the other stuff involving the Christian Sunday ritual)
Not only child molesters, but also genocides. Ask your favorite search engine about Von Wernich the catholic priest who is been convicted for genocide in Argentina and still can give misa (I don't know the English word, it may be something like miss o mass. It's the act to gather people, preach and the other stuff involving the Christian Sunday ritual)
I agree that atheism hasn't the same organized structure as atheists, but you've taken what I said out of context. I'm saying that if you can't attack a dogmatic belief such as "god created the earth in seven days," you can't attack a dogmatic belief such as "black people are inferior."
Neither has any basis in any fact, and is the result of being taught rote memorization of bullshit. Retort?
I note that in your example of nonreligious dogma, the abortion example was quite contrived: 'unnatural' isn't much of a justification! So apparently it isn't that easy to find nonreligions dogma..
I think it's a fine justification, if that's what you believe. I know people who do believe that cutting yourself up is to be avoided at almost all costs. I suppose unnatural is bad wording.
As for non-religious dogma: 1. Patriotism 2. Social Policy 3. Economic Policy 4. Foreign Policy 5. General Life Values (what is important in life? Money? Stability? Freedom of expression?
"And some atheists have dogma too" there fixed for you.
Not all religious people have dogma, either. In composition, the word "some" in that context is an empty word, because that's what the sentence already meant. But I appreciate your desire for specificity.
By the same vein, it's not cool even among Anons to insult Scientology itself - but the CHURCH of Scientology (as opposed to the Freezone)?
First off, Scientology isn't a Church. They charge admission, and they're a for-profit organization. They're not recognized as a real religion in Belgium, Russia, Canada, Greece, France, Germany, the United Kingdom. It's respected here in the US because anyone with enough money to purchase a free ride gets one in this society. CoS have loads of power.
I was talking about the Catholic Church with someone the other day, and they were arguing that you can't condemn the religion as a whole. I maintain, however, that if the Pope gets to tell you you're not Catholic, it's organized enough to criticize as a whole.
What I think you CAN'T criticize is an individual's drive for spiritual growth. If their religion involves slandering people and destroying their lives (CoS) or protecting child molestors (Catholic Church), then please, criticize them. In other words, while the person's spiritual practice may be above reproach, the dogma is just a set of ideas and ideals just like any atheist would have. For example:
(I'm not really picking sides, just giving examples) Religious - God says you should be nice to poor people Nonreligious - The best interest of humanity dictates you should be nice to poor people Religious - Abortion is wrong because God says so Nonreligious - Abortion is wrong because it's unnatural to kill your own progeny
I think that what people call religious belief is just dogma. And atheists have dogma too. If dogma is above reproach, we are in a world of shit, my friend.
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"Going too far" in the context of politics is somewhat different than what "any preacher would say." I'm not sure I get why this is difficult for you.
But still, read the text of what he said. He says that it's in the Bible that God damns people for killing innocents. And that's pretty damn true.
You should vote for your candidates in smaller elections. A third-party candidate is not going to bum-rush the presidency without having seats in the senate and congress and in local office.
It's not going to happen. Vote for the lesser of evils in the Presidential election until you've voted some support into other offices. I happen to like Obama and not think he's the lesser of two evils, but that's just me.
I thought that maybe someone arguing that things weren't taking out of context would link to the full text. Better luck next time.
Thanks,
Nathan Curry
I thought it was the domain of the religious fanatics to judge people for stuff like homosexuality, oral sex, sex before marriage, and whatnot. It used to be that the republicans were the good guys in the censorship wars, but no longer.
I thought it was the domain of the religious fanatics to judge people based upon their belief or non-belief in a god or no god. And control whether or not people can get an abortion. It's a gray area, that's why there's so much disagreement. There shouldn't be a law against it.
It's the republicans and religious fanatics who put more people in prison and put more people to death, which goes a long way towards taking away someone's rights.
You know, I shudder to think of Mike Huckabee as president, but I think he's actually a decent guy. And he said Jesus was too smart to get into politics. And I think that goes a long way to dispelling the myth you're propagating about there being morality in politics. Especially Republican/Democrat politics.
Or are you just talking about the 45 second clips on constant rotation in the media?
http://ac360.blogs.cnn.com/2008/03/21/the-full-story-behind-rev-jeremiah-wrights-911-sermon/
Read away, and tell me what's wrong with what he said.
Hippies don't vote, really.
This time, I'm sort of pissed at Mr. Nader for running, but Al Gore should have been able to beat Bush. Seriously. Even with the election fraud. And he could have chosen not to fold like a lawn chair. But he didn't
http://ac360.blogs.cnn.com/2008/03/21/the-full-story-behind-rev-jeremiah-wrights-911-sermon/
Is this not a completely 100% positive message? What's negative about this message? Tell me.
He didn't even say that. He said that we reap what we sow. Biblically speaking. It's a fine line, but it deserves to be drawn.
The premise of the KKK is that white people are genetically superior. (Rebuttal.)
The premise of black anger is:
1. Slavery in general
2. Slaves were bred like animals.
3. Slaves were raped, and that was totally cool.
4. Slaves were murdered for trying to educate themselves
5. The whole Jim Crow thing
6. Black voter disenfranchisement up through the black civil rights movement (what 1964, was it?)
7. Black voter disenfranchisement in 2000 (this is undeniable. Look it up)
8. Racist police force that until the last 50 years or so could kill black men or rape a black woman with zero fear of repercussions.
Shall I continue? It's not even remotely comparable.
Except that Wright grew up being called nigger. The Klansman is uncomfortable with black people, and he maintains they are monkeys, lynches them, or whatever. White people are a majority, and black people are subject to violence and discrimination every day from people who are visually indistinguishable from 70% of the population.
Also, Wright doesn't hate white people. You've seen, like everyone else has, 45 seconds total out of 20 years preaching. He makes a case against the rich white guys that create(d) the policies that disenfranchise the black people. He says God doesn't bless america for killing innocent people, he damns america for killing people (quote, "It's in the Bible").
So yeah, he's got anger that stems from living in a segregated society. Oh, and Chicago has some of the worst problems with police racism in the country, for what it's worth.
So I consistently hate everything and everyone as soon as I find out it exists.
My attitude that the laws here are no match for ethics, and I can only think of an imaginary country where the laws are relatively representative of ethics? I'm not sure you understood what I meant.
:-)
In this whole Rev. Wright thing, it's become very very apparent how the media neglects their responsibility to a)elevate the dialog and b)at least show a 5-minute clip before condemning a man. People expect all of their leaders to be saints, and it's ridiculous.
The only thing that Rev. Wright said that was ridiculous was that the govt created the AIDS virus to kill black people. But then, he also believes in a homonid living in the sky, so I give him a free pass on that. Beyond that, he said:
1. God doesn't bless America for killing innocent people, he damns America for killing innocent people.
2. And he said that our violence in the world begets violence at home.
Which are both teachings straight from the motherfucking Bible, everybody. People are pissed because a preacher preaches from the Bible? Come the fuck on.
[/tangent]
oh, look at that. my captcha is "tedious".
there you go again, injecting logic into the debate. sheesh.
Because the laws are better in umm... errr... hmmm... uhh... min...istan?
Yes, and M.C. Escher-style.
s/Fixed it for you./Goddamn, this thread is getting tedious./g
:-)
Goddamn, this thread is getting tedious.
yes, because you were looking for *information* on pedophilia and necrophilia, not *pictures*, right?
I suppose. still, I never thought clicking on a link and having it turn out to be a goatse would be a relief. but apparently, that day has come. :-)
Well, I should have been more specific. People tend to interpret however they feel like it, but generally, if you don't say all or some, it's a toss-up. So you weren't wrong to make sure I meant what you thought I meant. As someone who also speaks two languages (Spanish being my second), I'd like to congratulate you on your excellent spelling and grammar. I couldn't tell it was your second language.
I didn't mean to quote someone else, by the way.
The word is indeed "mass," for what it's worth.
I agree that atheism hasn't the same organized structure as atheists, but you've taken what I said out of context. I'm saying that if you can't attack a dogmatic belief such as "god created the earth in seven days," you can't attack a dogmatic belief such as "black people are inferior."
Neither has any basis in any fact, and is the result of being taught rote memorization of bullshit. Retort?
I think it's a fine justification, if that's what you believe. I know people who do believe that cutting yourself up is to be avoided at almost all costs. I suppose unnatural is bad wording.
As for non-religious dogma:
1. Patriotism
2. Social Policy
3. Economic Policy
4. Foreign Policy
5. General Life Values (what is important in life? Money? Stability? Freedom of expression?
Not all religious people have dogma, either. In composition, the word "some" in that context is an empty word, because that's what the sentence already meant. But I appreciate your desire for specificity.
First off, Scientology isn't a Church. They charge admission, and they're a for-profit organization. They're not recognized as a real religion in Belgium, Russia, Canada, Greece, France, Germany, the United Kingdom. It's respected here in the US because anyone with enough money to purchase a free ride gets one in this society. CoS have loads of power.
I was talking about the Catholic Church with someone the other day, and they were arguing that you can't condemn the religion as a whole. I maintain, however, that if the Pope gets to tell you you're not Catholic, it's organized enough to criticize as a whole.
What I think you CAN'T criticize is an individual's drive for spiritual growth. If their religion involves slandering people and destroying their lives (CoS) or protecting child molestors (Catholic Church), then please, criticize them. In other words, while the person's spiritual practice may be above reproach, the dogma is just a set of ideas and ideals just like any atheist would have. For example:
(I'm not really picking sides, just giving examples)
Religious - God says you should be nice to poor people
Nonreligious - The best interest of humanity dictates you should be nice to poor people
Religious - Abortion is wrong because God says so
Nonreligious - Abortion is wrong because it's unnatural to kill your own progeny
I think that what people call religious belief is just dogma. And atheists have dogma too. If dogma is above reproach, we are in a world of shit, my friend.
Well you're just like Hitler