yeah we have to stick together, and I thought i did a good job of directing at the "type" who does that, using his comment as example...didn't keep it personal to splab but i did call him/her out...which our uid club is allowed to do within limits
serving web pages to 100,000,000 concurrent users tracking their behavior accessing the same DB of products, manipulating the data users see by behavior modeling,and hosting all the infra structure on 4 IBM mainframes that the NSA, int'l criminals, and a bored Zuck can view instantly, run the web front ends on 10,000 virtualized linux boxes running slackware linux (2002) and IBM Java 1.3....
everything not in bold is a question of networking and internet coding and graphic design
facebook needs all those engineers to mine our data & make it available to outside parties
**i am impressed** with how facebook.com's scalability and speed, I don't deny it at all...but like I said, alot of what makes www.facebook.com "facebook" is just basic transfer of images and text with alot of interface layers as to harvest data...
i'm amazed at how much Computer Science and Network Engineering (or telecommunications) overlap.
I did an MS in Information & Communication Science and part of our required coursework was to get a CCNA. They integrated the Cisco coursework and test into their own stuff. It really boosted their hire rate for graduates b/c anyone w/ a CCNA can find work somewhere.
We did alot of stuff in signal processing and encoding that is very similar to the 'bit twiddling' you guys are talking about. Headers, flags, etc its all there...we used stuff like Dijkstra's algorithm but not to the same complexity as CS.
The craziest stuff we did was beamforming & satellite stuff...that was fun
Mr. O'Reilly it's really cool that you're taking the time to answer our questions. Thanks much!
My question: How can we make categorically better coding instruction books? What's the next step? I mean coding or programming in the general sense. Here on slashdot, the consensus is that the best coding language "depends on the job." In that environment, most coding tasks involve using an IDE and then editing specific parts of a codebase by hand. The language is a conduit to transfer information/instructions. Is there a way to instruct someone in the skills to find the right command quickly for most situations, regardless of coding language?
So much of a coder's time is spent searching through stacks of code books **just to find "how to do..." one thing** they know they language can do, in my experience.
This is really awesome from a tech/biz perspective AND an employment perspective I hope y'all realize...
I can just picture the job descriptions from NFL teams (and college too of course)
> game programmer (to make their simulations) > database coder (idk what they'd use to store play data from both practice and games to use for the simulations, and what language they'd use to call it and present it on the tablet, but figuring all this shit out...linking the data table of plays to the user's screen will take some work) > "front end designer" (b/c i see so many of these job postings) > you get the idea
lots of jobs in telling these rich assholes how to use their new tech stuff...
The woman below responded, "You must be in Management."
Yes. People who are in management often have these characteristics: "You have risen to where you are due to a large quantity of hot air...you expect people beneath you to solve your problems."
That's often true.
It's not some kind of "yin/yang" relationship, however.
Customers and co-workers also ask for help.
Both groups have **reason to expect help**
That's the difference here...the "dork/troll" behavior I described happens in a context where, for whatever reason, there is a reasonable expectation that the person being asked the question can help...in the case I put up for examination, it was b/c he even posted a comment with a serious tone using jargon (that may be technically right, as the story elucidated).
Also, management, at some kind of level, has to exist. Directing resources and making decisions on the meta level (which worker will do what job, how to structure workflow, how to train managers, etc) has to be done inasmuch as the system's complexity demands.
Management cannot possibly know all the information to the same level as all the specialists she manages. Invariably, **with certainty** the person being managed will have some piece of **specific technical knowledge** that the manager needs but does not have.
Management will always need to ask questions of people "below" them who know more...otherwise there would be no point. We are stupid if we fault managers inherently for asking questions!
note about "management"...it is a function first, a part of a complex system...it could be done by one human with full authority who delegates (sometimes by heredity) or the work/decisions required can be accomplished/made in a distributed manner of some sort...my comments here are about "management" the cybernetic necessity not one dipshit wearing khakis.
if you think someone asks a dumb question...(I always say, there are no dumb quesitons, just dumb people who ask quesitons)...just **make fun of them**
it's ok to just make fun of someone...it's honorable...if in your opinion, the question really is obvious then don't pretend to help by rattling off bullshit, just make fun of them if you want to express yourself somehow
Thank you for giving us an a *perfect* example, in the wild, of *exactly* how techies answer questions condescendingly & with making big assumptions, but most importantly, demonstrating you have a high level of technical knowledge, but not ***ACTUALLY FIXING THE PROBLEM***
People like you have been making tech obnoxious for decades, and it needs to stop./. bear witness:
OP says no maintenance at the Alzheimers home, my suggestion needs no intervention **on the Alzheimer homes part** once it's up and running.
If OP wants something that requires **absolutely no setup, no software, no hardware and magic internet rainbows, then he is shit out of luck**. But that's not how I read the request.
It is perfect. All the elements are there. This kind of response typifies interactions between people with tech problems and those who claim to be able to fix them.
First, obviously OP was asking about **low maintenence for everyone** not just one subset. This is the language voodoo. Conjuring a dichotomy of meaning where there is none.
2nd, we see the dork/troll complete the circle by insinuating that OP was ("obviously!") being unreasonable thinking they could get something at required **absolutely** no maintenence...for that he's, of course, "shit out of luck"
But OP didn't as for "absolutely no maintenence"...but for the dork/troll that doesn't matter. This whole thing was a way for parent to demonstrate superiority by dropping some jargon & then making the original person out to be dumb for ever asking the question.
***WE MUST STOP DOING THIS FOREVER***
It's ruining our industry, and our work life quality. People hate a person who (having demonstrated their technical knowledge by dropping jargon) wastes their time.
When people need help, it's wrong to use that as an opportunity to make yourself look smarter. It only makes everything worse, and it causes the other person to hate you and tech in general.
Just stop. Forever. The whole routine...let's just end it...
....and that's where the whole discussion goes off the rails. It seems like a simple concept..as you say, "the teachers knew what they were doing and how to teach things"...but anything "tech" is going to draw money, hype, and BS artists (irresistable to politicians)
We need **coding** or, if you prefer **programming** class in high schools.
as a distinction from your standard "computer" class...the one that teaches the history of computing and a survey of the technology
Part of the problem is the "STEM" concept has taken hold in mainstream parlance. It's a reductive concept...it turns something that ***anyone who went to high school understands*** the subjects of math and science in all their incarnations...and makes it into something that idiot education people can yell about.
I used to be an "education person" and I'm not insulting the profession...most teachers who follow modern teaching methods would completely agree with what I'm saying.
Education funding should be a non-issue. It's about as obvious as wiping your ass...it's just basic survival instinct.
I'm not making false dichotomies about the politics...****education funding issues are all Republican's fault****
The GOP uses artificial budget scarcity as a way to privatize school systems (justified by all the horrible test scores from the underfunded schools).
But look...STEM, whateverthefuckthatmeans...if it means Math and Science and the application thereof...stuff like coding...then lets do it.
Also, let's make a Computer survey class a prerequisite...just like all high schoolers must know a minimum of biology...seriously technology literacy should be factored in there.
The objective of any firewall is to prevent traffic on all unused ports in order to limit potential attack vectors. This is a given and no specific threat needs to be stated.
honestly you could not be more wrong/trolling...
you completely avoided the question
**of course** the objective of any firewall is to do as you say, but stating that fact is not an answer to GP's question
I really want to hear a good answer to GP's question....I used to have my CCNA, but mostly did database and research query stuff...I'd really like to see a specific answer to the question
You really are trolling more than just GP...you're trolling all of us, everyone on here who is an industry professional should have a decent ***specific*** answer to GP's question.
To top it off, you accuse GP of acting like a typical "bureaucrat"
It sounds like you're some bureaucrat trying to justify the costs of standard security practices.
No.
Just dead wrong.
bureaucratic functionaries don't ask analytical questions that demand real world, specific answers...and they use manipulative language to justify **getting a bigger budget** as well
yeah i agree...esp. about silly ways otherwise unskilled make themselves feel superior...it's cheap & dumb...reminds me of Dungeons & Dragons for some reason...
we can get pedantic about the difference between "coding" and "programming" languages...but others have gone down that road & it's never-ending
we need a consistent paradigm
HTML & CSS are coding languages...they are a defined set of symbols that contain commands run on a computer (specifically by a browser)...yes they are not "original gangster" coding languages that you can brag about..but they are a unique set of code that commands a machine...it's "code"
not all people who use HTML/CSS are "coders"
it's like back before facebook.com came online, one of the only options was Myspace...kids would get into the HTML & CSS via an interface and just randomly change color numbers and hack it up
**that's not coding**
whoever made the CSS for a site like...well facebook.com....is surely a coder
keep your bragging rights, bro...you're more of a 'real' coder...but it's reductive and pedantic to say "CSS is not a programming language"
it's a semantic argument, IMHO...but you totally missed the joke
if the defining criteria is your code language can do something another cannot, then have C++ render a hypertext document with linked photos & text into a browser
still it's *semantics*...it's all machines following code pounded by a monkey
i love that someone just downmodded **only my responses** on this deepthread between me and dblll (whom i still suspect may have multiple accounts, regardless of UID)
i protest these downmods...either downmod us both or not at all...
They have a nice little drop-down to select year/quarter and links to financial statements...it's all right there
My problem is I don't know how to read this MBA/budget speak...
I looked at 2009, their xls "financials" info...Q4...
Saw the breakout by sector tab, but the categories were type of services (servers, 'client', etc) but couldn't see where there was a "Public Sector" or anything similar...couldn't find a category for type of client.
Also, I"m a bit miffed that my GP post was labeled "troll"...seriously...not trolling...trying to find out info here that we all, in our industry, should have some idea of...
And what's with the threat? If you feel you really are being trolled then just do it instead of threatening to do so.
it''s about 'dblll' or is it 'dbIII'....trollers use screen names with lots of capital 'i' and lowercase 'L' so they can post from multiple accounts...*that* would necessitate an email to the moderators (it's happened before, but another/.'er emailed and reported them before I did...also, i've had people insert 'i's for 'L's to mimic my account)
i thought you were doing that...i checked a few variations when you replied and it appears you only use the one screenname (i wasn't going to check this if you didn't respond)
also, IMHO you definitely seemed to be trolling with your comment
but look, you have at least tried to defend yourself, which is a sign you're not, at heart, just trolling
Slashdot Mirror
yeah we have to stick together, and I thought i did a good job of directing at the "type" who does that, using his comment as example...didn't keep it personal to splab but i did call him/her out...which our uid club is allowed to do within limits
everything not in bold is a question of networking and internet coding and graphic design
facebook needs all those engineers to mine our data & make it available to outside parties
**i am impressed** with how facebook.com's scalability and speed, I don't deny it at all...but like I said, alot of what makes www.facebook.com "facebook" is just basic transfer of images and text with alot of interface layers as to harvest data...
i'm amazed at how much Computer Science and Network Engineering (or telecommunications) overlap.
I did an MS in Information & Communication Science and part of our required coursework was to get a CCNA. They integrated the Cisco coursework and test into their own stuff. It really boosted their hire rate for graduates b/c anyone w/ a CCNA can find work somewhere.
We did alot of stuff in signal processing and encoding that is very similar to the 'bit twiddling' you guys are talking about. Headers, flags, etc its all there...we used stuff like Dijkstra's algorithm but not to the same complexity as CS.
The craziest stuff we did was beamforming & satellite stuff...that was fun
My friend from grad school who has a research job at Cisco always said the same thing.
Mr. O'Reilly it's really cool that you're taking the time to answer our questions. Thanks much!
My question: How can we make categorically better coding instruction books? What's the next step? I mean coding or programming in the general sense. Here on slashdot, the consensus is that the best coding language "depends on the job." In that environment, most coding tasks involve using an IDE and then editing specific parts of a codebase by hand. The language is a conduit to transfer information/instructions. Is there a way to instruct someone in the skills to find the right command quickly for most situations, regardless of coding language?
So much of a coder's time is spent searching through stacks of code books **just to find "how to do..." one thing** they know they language can do, in my experience.
Thanks again.
how in the world could someone mod my comment a "troll"???
this has to be personal but i cant imagine someone taking the time...
honestly, my above comment may be, in your opinion, stupid...but it's just a genuine comment...I'm stoked for us to get good jobs
This is really awesome from a tech/biz perspective AND an employment perspective I hope y'all realize...
I can just picture the job descriptions from NFL teams (and college too of course)
> game programmer (to make their simulations)
> database coder (idk what they'd use to store play data from both practice and games to use for the simulations, and what language they'd use to call it and present it on the tablet, but figuring all this shit out...linking the data table of plays to the user's screen will take some work)
> "front end designer" (b/c i see so many of these job postings)
> you get the idea
lots of jobs in telling these rich assholes how to use their new tech stuff...
Yes. People who are in management often have these characteristics: "You have risen to where you are due to a large quantity of hot air...you expect people beneath you to solve your problems."
That's often true.
It's not some kind of "yin/yang" relationship, however.
Customers and co-workers also ask for help.
Both groups have **reason to expect help**
That's the difference here...the "dork/troll" behavior I described happens in a context where, for whatever reason, there is a reasonable expectation that the person being asked the question can help...in the case I put up for examination, it was b/c he even posted a comment with a serious tone using jargon (that may be technically right, as the story elucidated).
Also, management, at some kind of level, has to exist. Directing resources and making decisions on the meta level (which worker will do what job, how to structure workflow, how to train managers, etc) has to be done inasmuch as the system's complexity demands.
Management cannot possibly know all the information to the same level as all the specialists she manages. Invariably, **with certainty** the person being managed will have some piece of **specific technical knowledge** that the manager needs but does not have.
Management will always need to ask questions of people "below" them who know more...otherwise there would be no point. We are stupid if we fault managers inherently for asking questions!
note about "management"...it is a function first, a part of a complex system...it could be done by one human with full authority who delegates (sometimes by heredity) or the work/decisions required can be accomplished/made in a distributed manner of some sort...my comments here are about "management" the cybernetic necessity not one dipshit wearing khakis.
lol it all relates to linux of course
seriously tho...I forgot one thing...
if you think someone asks a dumb question...(I always say, there are no dumb quesitons, just dumb people who ask quesitons)...just **make fun of them**
it's ok to just make fun of someone...it's honorable...if in your opinion, the question really is obvious then don't pretend to help by rattling off bullshit, just make fun of them if you want to express yourself somehow
Splab, you should get some kind of Golden Raspberry Webby Award...
Splab, thank you.
Thank you for giving us an a *perfect* example, in the wild, of *exactly* how techies answer questions condescendingly & with making big assumptions, but most importantly, demonstrating you have a high level of technical knowledge, but not ***ACTUALLY FIXING THE PROBLEM***
People like you have been making tech obnoxious for decades, and it needs to stop. /. bear witness:
It is perfect. All the elements are there. This kind of response typifies interactions between people with tech problems and those who claim to be able to fix them.
First, obviously OP was asking about **low maintenence for everyone** not just one subset. This is the language voodoo. Conjuring a dichotomy of meaning where there is none.
2nd, we see the dork/troll complete the circle by insinuating that OP was ("obviously!") being unreasonable thinking they could get something at required **absolutely** no maintenence...for that he's, of course, "shit out of luck"
But OP didn't as for "absolutely no maintenence"...but for the dork/troll that doesn't matter. This whole thing was a way for parent to demonstrate superiority by dropping some jargon & then making the original person out to be dumb for ever asking the question.
***WE MUST STOP DOING THIS FOREVER***
It's ruining our industry, and our work life quality. People hate a person who (having demonstrated their technical knowledge by dropping jargon) wastes their time.
When people need help, it's wrong to use that as an opportunity to make yourself look smarter. It only makes everything worse, and it causes the other person to hate you and tech in general.
Just stop. Forever. The whole routine...let's just end it...
We need **coding** or, if you prefer **programming** class in high schools.
as a distinction from your standard "computer" class...the one that teaches the history of computing and a survey of the technology
Part of the problem is the "STEM" concept has taken hold in mainstream parlance. It's a reductive concept...it turns something that ***anyone who went to high school understands*** the subjects of math and science in all their incarnations...and makes it into something that idiot education people can yell about.
I used to be an "education person" and I'm not insulting the profession...most teachers who follow modern teaching methods would completely agree with what I'm saying.
Education funding should be a non-issue. It's about as obvious as wiping your ass...it's just basic survival instinct.
I'm not making false dichotomies about the politics...****education funding issues are all Republican's fault****
The GOP uses artificial budget scarcity as a way to privatize school systems (justified by all the horrible test scores from the underfunded schools).
But look...STEM, whateverthefuckthatmeans...if it means Math and Science and the application thereof...stuff like coding...then lets do it.
Also, let's make a Computer survey class a prerequisite...just like all high schoolers must know a minimum of biology...seriously technology literacy should be factored in there.
honestly you could not be more wrong/trolling...
you completely avoided the question
**of course** the objective of any firewall is to do as you say, but stating that fact is not an answer to GP's question
I really want to hear a good answer to GP's question....I used to have my CCNA, but mostly did database and research query stuff...I'd really like to see a specific answer to the question
You really are trolling more than just GP...you're trolling all of us, everyone on here who is an industry professional should have a decent ***specific*** answer to GP's question.
To top it off, you accuse GP of acting like a typical "bureaucrat"
No.
Just dead wrong.
bureaucratic functionaries don't ask analytical questions that demand real world, specific answers...and they use manipulative language to justify **getting a bigger budget** as well
yeah i agree...esp. about silly ways otherwise unskilled make themselves feel superior...it's cheap & dumb...reminds me of Dungeons & Dragons for some reason...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E...
it's a relevant language to the conversation
we can get pedantic about the difference between "coding" and "programming" languages...but others have gone down that road & it's never-ending
we need a consistent paradigm
HTML & CSS are coding languages...they are a defined set of symbols that contain commands run on a computer (specifically by a browser)...yes they are not "original gangster" coding languages that you can brag about..but they are a unique set of code that commands a machine...it's "code"
not all people who use HTML/CSS are "coders"
it's like back before facebook.com came online, one of the only options was Myspace...kids would get into the HTML & CSS via an interface and just randomly change color numbers and hack it up
**that's not coding**
whoever made the CSS for a site like...well facebook.com....is surely a coder
keep your bragging rights, bro...you're more of a 'real' coder...but it's reductive and pedantic to say "CSS is not a programming language"
it's a semantic argument, IMHO...but you totally missed the joke
if the defining criteria is your code language can do something another cannot, then have C++ render a hypertext document with linked photos & text into a browser
still it's *semantics*...it's all machines following code pounded by a monkey
the quotes make it official! take it to the bank!
look man, I lol'ed when you said this:
so in the spirit of progress, "I apologize"
it's still possible you have other accounts (as i guess the same is possible for me) but fsk it
thanks for the info!
i love that someone just downmodded **only my responses** on this deepthread between me and dblll (whom i still suspect may have multiple accounts, regardless of UID)
i protest these downmods...either downmod us both or not at all...
I went here: http://www.microsoft.com/inves...
They have a nice little drop-down to select year/quarter and links to financial statements...it's all right there
My problem is I don't know how to read this MBA/budget speak...
I looked at 2009, their xls "financials" info...Q4...
Saw the breakout by sector tab, but the categories were type of services (servers, 'client', etc) but couldn't see where there was a "Public Sector" or anything similar...couldn't find a category for type of client.
Also, I"m a bit miffed that my GP post was labeled "troll"...seriously...not trolling...trying to find out info here that we all, in our industry, should have some idea of...
Is there any way to find out how much of M$ revenue/profits are due to government & other public sector contracts?
It's our money, so I'd be nice to know how much we're paying them.
ok, fine, let's agree to mostly agree
it''s about 'dblll' or is it 'dbIII'....trollers use screen names with lots of capital 'i' and lowercase 'L' so they can post from multiple accounts...*that* would necessitate an email to the moderators (it's happened before, but another /.'er emailed and reported them before I did...also, i've had people insert 'i's for 'L's to mimic my account)
i thought you were doing that...i checked a few variations when you replied and it appears you only use the one screenname (i wasn't going to check this if you didn't respond)
also, IMHO you definitely seemed to be trolling with your comment
but look, you have at least tried to defend yourself, which is a sign you're not, at heart, just trolling
clear you're a troll who likes to start arguments over nothing
respond again and I will actually take the time to email the moderators and report you