" But those error reports often come from application crashes that don't take down the system. And most of the one's I've seen are from non-MS applications. It's kind of like how Konqueror or some other KDE app will crash and pop the segmentation fault box."
well thats microsofts fault for allowing so many userland hooks into the damn kernel. i have been using Linux, *BSD, and even Solaris for years and at no point have i ever had an application crash a system. i once had an nvidia driver lockup (well X and the v-terms stopped working) a Linux system. but its a device driver,(shitty one at that) not an application.
I'll agree with the idea that scre.... err bugs are normal. some types of bugs are even acceptable. but when you keep having major bugs of the same variety over and over and over again then you are doing something wrong.
microsoft might have raping... err making a profit down pat, no argument there. but who's to say how they make a profit is morally or legally legit ? last i checked they got slapped by the DoJ, that (regardless of punishment) says something.
secondly my car came with a 5 year bumper to bumper warranty. i didnt pay extra for it. but last i check MS didnt even offer up 5 years of free updates/upgrades. if you buy (as in spend money on) anything you are entitled to a warranty, most states and countries have laws regulating warranties on physical items.... but not software, the upgrade/patch cycle is to much of a cash cow for that.
and coming from a coder/sysadmin bugs are somebodies fault, cause somebody missed something. its simple logic man, some tire company made faulty tires about 2 years ago, [namely they blew out at high speeds (65mph+).] that was somebodies fault, same has microsoft's latest exploit, cisco's etc... difference ? the tire company got sued big time. software makers ? nothing yet, but you can bet your ass that in the next 10 years that will change, it will get to the point that software makers/distributers are held accountable. (hopefully)
my point was more to the effect of if they hold americans to that standard they should hold indians to the same standard, OR hold americans to a lower standard. for instance why should a python programmer here need 5+ years experience but they would hire an indian straight from a bootcamp (cert classes in bulk) ? why not lower the american standards and pay someone who didnt go to college 20 - 30k/year to code python ? (and even though the indian himself might make 10k per year, he will still COST identical to the american, due to things like training, management re-location or travel etc...)
believe me coming from somebody on the inside of this industry it is not the "money saver" that forbes and the like would have you think it is.
either pay them equal pay to what americans make, or pay the americans to do the "white collar" work and offshore things like document imaging and the like.
but to be blunt there really is no clean cut solution.
There is a remarkably arrogant attitude here in the US that we Americans are born with a soverign right to get paid more than someone with equivilant skills in other countries
right.....
IBM needs programmers. They can hire one American, or three people in another country.
yeah. that thought process enforces the prior attitude. i have a problem with IBM (or any other AMERICAN company who makes 75% of its income from AMERICANS and AMERICAN bussiness) paying some inferior indian tech $350 a month to take my job, complaning that noone is buying there products and saying i make to much because.....
A) IBM, mcdonalds etc... set the standard cost of living in this country. I am powerless to change it.
B) If i dont make X amount i cannot spend X amount. hence removing a large amount of "luxury" goods from the list of things i buy, and driving stocks down, causing more layoffs etc...
C) If IBM or Sun or whomever keeps outsourcing their labor where are they going to get customers ? and indian who makes $350 per month cannot afford a $2000 PC. and the americans are now unemployed.
its funny to me that you people dont acknowledge the simple truth about the trend of outsourcing. they are doing it because it is cheaper, meaning the top 1% get richer and everyone else gets to be dirt poor, and yes we will all end up being dirt poor because as i stated before, the american is unemployed and the indian who makes $350/month cannot afford "luxury" items.
so yay for bringing down the middle class, something that communism tried to do and was ridiculed for half a century for it.
and lastly as i have stated several hundred times, indian labor is not as effecient as american labor. its a proven statistic that americans are the most effecient workers on the planet. will that change ? who the hell knows. but i work for an outsourcing company that has offices in india and america and i can tell you that it takes 5 indians to do the work of the average american, especially if that work has something to do with free thought or problem solving.
***NOTE: not all indians are bad at problem solving. but the ones who make dirt for pay are.
oh and one other thing, american companies have ridiculous standards as far as hiring americans, but indians arent typically held to those standards. (ie we just hired to japanese speaking techs where i work, they were required to have 2 years in a production unix/linux enviroment and 5 years networking experience. the indians that do the same job on the night shift ? no experience. but they do have MCSE's... which means dick to us since we dont touch microsoft products.) so perhaps it is the american companies who set the standards to high ?...... and if it is why the hell should the middle class americans suffer ?
behind door # 1> we have a gov't so corrupt and nasty that it makes the us gov't look like sweden.
behind door # 2> coutries that are by an large always at war, and still aren't caught up to the rest of the world as far as technology/quality of life
behind door # 3> a country that would still be identicle to ethiopia if not for having a mass-population, being located in asia, and being able to offer up semi-literate people for cheap labor.
YAY !!! where do i sign up.
and flame me all you want i have been to india and parts of eastern europe. and i work for an outsourcing company that has offices in india, so i know exactly how "good" indians are at our jobs.
and exactly why is it management never gets offshored ?
Re:Jobs dont have to be enjoyable.
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Working Hard?
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you really need to take a look out the window sometime.
Teachers have the most important job in the world! ?
not really. you can live without teachers.
i hate to break you the news but working in a shitty enviroment will take whatever joy you have out of you.
The enviornment doesnt matter, all that matters is the results!
so you have never had a job have you ? give it a few years in a shitty enviroment and tell me that.
i know many people like this. and they are the sadest bunch i have ever known.
The problem isnt that people dont live life, the problem is because people dont live life like you, you cannot understand or accept it. Having alot of money and buying alot of toys is pointless.
so when did i advocate being greedy ? i never said a damn thing about being greedy. you seem to think that the best way to live life is being a work-whore, i disagree, and YOU DONT UNDERSTAND that. its simple, to me working constantly to help people who by and large wont help themselves is fucking retarded. i want to enjoy life, you know travel, do things that i want to do when i want to do them and how i want to do them, working in a field you love wont change the fact that your not doing it on your own terms. sombody else is telling you what to do.
go ahead dedicate your whole life to something. then when your 65 you will notice that your life was worthless because you are alone, and you have never experienced anything but your job.
So what? I can have a million dollars and still be alone, then my life was ALOT more worthless than if I dedicated myself completely to my work. Look you have absolutely no control over who you'll meet in life, none at all, so why bother focusing on who you'll meet between now and age 65?
actually going out and doing things dramatically effects who you will meet. having a million dollars and being alone is just as fucking pointless as working your whole life and being alone. i'm glad you accept that your life is going to be lonely and pointless. congratulations!
Re:The problem is people take jobs just for the mo
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this is the most condesending and retarded thing i have read in a long long time......
you assume that people can just quit. no strings attached and no problems what so ever. you couldnt be that stupid ! some people can't quit because of bills, some can't quit because of sick children, or a pregnant wife, there are millions of reasons as to why someone works the job they do, and for you to say that they dont matter is the most high-horse obnocsious shit you could say.
his brothers job does matter. your ass eats dont you ? you go shopping ? you like the things you want to actually be on the shelf ? well they sure as fuck didnt grow arms or legs and put themselves there. they didnt get to the store by magic.
"Most jobs people have simply dont matter, they dont improve the world in any way, they dont improve you as a person, and no one cares if you are good at it. Why not be a teacher? Even a construction worker matters more than some guy in an office working in a cubical."
your a fucking boneified idiot. that person in the cubicle could be making sure grandma gets here social security check, so she can buy her food and medication, so she can live. you think YOU matter ? to whom ? your lonely right hand ? get a grip on reality man not everyone is like you, not everyone wants to work at a non-profit. not everyone is work obsessed.
and whoever the hell modded that shit up needs to be shot in the back of the head and left to rot.
"This is why I hate the corperate world and the corperate attitude"
sure you do when it suits your intrest. do me a favor, dont go out to eat. (all waitress's dont matter, neither do the cooks or the owner) dont go see any movies (actors, grip's, random people dont matter) dont buy any CD's (musicians and studio techs dont matter) dont EAT (farmers, grocers and truckers dont matter) dont DRIVE (truckers and oil rig workers dont matter) and dont go to any hospitals no matter what (its most likely owned by some greedy corporate company)..... i think MAYBE your getting the idea.
Re:Do a job you actually WANT to do then.
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"college and get degrees until you figure out some things you actually are good at."
yeah go and dig yourself into an insurmountable debt then take a job your good at. not something you love, because that wont pay you nearly enough to pay of the debt from school.
not everyone wants to save the world. not everyone should. most people just want to be happy and not be bothered by stupid shit. like management and bad drivers.
Re:Jobs dont have to be enjoyable.
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Working Hard?
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"Life is about the little moments."
amen to that. words so true are rarely spoken on/.
Re:Jobs dont have to be enjoyable.
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i agree with alot of what you said.
but "People should make their job their lifes work, their meaning of living, and put 100% of themselves into their job, if each person were to do this they'd not only do a better job at work, but they wouldnt complain or care if the job isnt "Enjoyable" "
thats a crock of shit. most people only complain if something actually is wrong, and if something you are seriously dedicated to is fucked up then its your responsability to complain so the people who control it fix it. and i hate to break you the news but working in a shitty enviroment will take whatever joy you have out of you. it will make you miserable, and you can try and bury your anger and displeasure all you want. it doesnt change the fact that your angry or unhappy. you just aren't has vocal about it.
go ahead dedicate your whole life to something. then when your 65 you will notice that your life was worthless because you are alone, and you have never experienced anything but your job.
people who work non-stop are afraid to live life. they take shelter and comfort from their job. but they have no life, no real desires..... nothing.
i know many people like this. and they are the sadest bunch i have ever known.
and i wasnt stating the whole "derivative" thing as fact, simply speculating. and im going to continue to speculate since way to many people are playing "head in the sand, fingers in ears" games and denying the very real possibility that SCO will win.
i didnt say anybody besides IBM had any agreement with SCO. but SCO has filed claims that they own *ALL* derivative works. anything they can convince a court was built based on or with their IP. its that simple.
that all depends on what exactly you mean by "if they win".
if they win all of their claims then they will retain the rights to all derivative works. and if SCO code is indeed in Linux then they can claim linux is derivative.
doesnt mean its right.
doesnt mean i think it will happen
it does however remain a possibility. and thats all i was trying to point out in response to the parent.
A) most people dont like/use solid supported backup solutions for severs. let alone PRODUCTION servers.
B) oracle 9i for mac osx is a "half assed port" to mac osX yet somehow that doesnt matter but netinfo (something that is severly outdated.) being a "half assed port" to Linux does matter ???
C) Linux's stuff is a subset of mac os X ?
are you on medication ? or are you just some flag flyin moron ? seriously i wanna know.
i have a Linux box running oracle 9i at work. works fine. not as fast as the mysql and postgresql servers we run, but oracle is an ENTERPRISE class database, meant to run on ENTERPRISE hardware with ENTERPRISE support. no Xserve shitbox is "ENTERPRISE" in any fucking way imaginable by any admin/developer not coming from vb land.
next off exactly how are Linux's network sevices a strict "subset" of mac osX's ? half the shit on OSX was originally developed by Linux users FOR LINUX !
now if you "know what veritas is" why in the fuck did you say "and Veritas isn't a network service, it's a freaking filesystem" ??? i would consider a backup and recovery utility a network service since it is administered and executed over a network. and it is not a filesystem.
perhaps you should go back to microsoft land. your idiocy might be tolerated their. I'm glad you think POSIX's foundation is rotting, would lead me to ask why most systems (including mac OSX) are built on or conform to it ?
you need to stop watching elen on the switch commercial, pull your head out of your ass and pay attention.
oh and another thing. oracle on Linux is not amatuer hour, especially since it is supported. and on OSX its still just somebodies wet dream
so AGAIN i challange you or one of your to show me something useful from an Xserve system that a Linux system cannot due. (we are talking server side here. and not "my personal webpage" cruft either.)
"Imagine the trauma is SCO wins: not only will all that derivative work belong to them "
ALL derivative work will belong to them. that'd be BSD, OSX, Solaris, AIX etc... not just Linux. and Believe me they wouldnt hesitate to sue the hell out of everyone if they win this suit.
point is their lawyers arent as good as IBM's. IBM can just buy them. and they still haven't proven that they have a damn leg to stand on.
and IBM is getting just as much shit about its AIX license as the whole linux thing......
the thing i find amusing in this is simple.... SCO claims linus doesnt "verify" his code. and exactly how the hell is he supposed to due that ? call up SCO and ask if is theirs ? wait for MONTHS for them to get back to him just so he can hear..... "that code is ours we commited it yesterday. have a nice day." ? its not like their is some mythical place where all proprietary source code is kept so us OSS developers can double check that the code being sent to us isnt already patented/trademarked/copyrighted. and if there was we would get sued more, because companies could just say "he has access to code xyz. his product Can't be better than ours !! he mustv'e stolent the code !!! (TM SCO)"
actually veritas is the leading backup and recovery utility on anything enterprise class.
oracle 9i is only availible in a development edition. hence it does not come with a license and is not *legally* supposed to be used in a production enviroment. and is not supported by them since its still in beta.
" I'll give you Coldfusion; " -- point ? give me time and i'll give you whatever you want on a linux system. but you cannot purchase it to run on a Xserver/macosX enviroment. and that is the point. i never said "would never in a million years be available" i said it IS NOT available.
some people just dont understand..... adding and removing the same hardware or at least the same type of hardware shouldnt cause a problem. but adding newer hardware will be. with any OS.
in most laptops that is true, and it is also true that apple has the advantage of having mostly their own hardware to worry about..... but if you switch to a newer video card (or switch to another brand?) in a standard mac box you still have to download and install the driver, same as any other OS.
unless it is using a generic, crippled driver. such as the "ati" driver for linux.
okay , i would first point you to my reply to another post in this thread since it has a list of things linux does/has available such as....
oracle, ASP, veritas, coldfusion etc....
secondly what in the hell does X11 have to do with a server side env. ? most servers run headless and very few of them run remote X stuff due to the bandwidth and resource requirements.
but since you insist what exactly can a Xserve do that a Linux server cannot ?
Slashdot Mirror
" But those error reports often come from application crashes that don't take down the system. And most of the one's I've seen are from non-MS applications. It's kind of like how Konqueror or some other KDE app will crash and pop the segmentation fault box."
well thats microsofts fault for allowing so many userland hooks into the damn kernel. i have been using Linux, *BSD, and even Solaris for years and at no point have i ever had an application crash a system. i once had an nvidia driver lockup (well X and the v-terms stopped working) a Linux system. but its a device driver,(shitty one at that) not an application.
I'll agree with the idea that scre .... err bugs are normal. some types of bugs are even acceptable. but when you keep having major bugs of the same variety over and over and over again then you are doing something wrong.
... err making a profit down pat, no argument there. but who's to say how they make a profit is morally or legally legit ? last i checked they got slapped by the DoJ, that (regardless of punishment) says something.
microsoft might have raping
secondly my car came with a 5 year bumper to bumper warranty. i didnt pay extra for it. but last i check MS didnt even offer up 5 years of free updates/upgrades. if you buy (as in spend money on) anything you are entitled to a warranty, most states and countries have laws regulating warranties on physical items.... but not software, the upgrade/patch cycle is to much of a cash cow for that.
and coming from a coder/sysadmin bugs are somebodies fault, cause somebody missed something. its simple logic man, some tire company made faulty tires about 2 years ago, [namely they blew out at high speeds (65mph+).] that was somebodies fault, same has microsoft's latest exploit, cisco's etc... difference ? the tire company got sued big time. software makers ? nothing yet, but you can bet your ass that in the next 10 years that will change, it will get to the point that software makers/distributers are held accountable. (hopefully)
my point was more to the effect of if they hold americans to that standard they should hold indians to the same standard, OR hold americans to a lower standard. for instance why should a python programmer here need 5+ years experience but they would hire an indian straight from a bootcamp (cert classes in bulk) ? why not lower the american standards and pay someone who didnt go to college 20 - 30k/year to code python ? (and even though the indian himself might make 10k per year, he will still COST identical to the american, due to things like training, management re-location or travel etc...)
believe me coming from somebody on the inside of this industry it is not the "money saver" that forbes and the like would have you think it is.
either pay them equal pay to what americans make, or pay the americans to do the "white collar" work and offshore things like document imaging and the like.
but to be blunt there really is no clean cut solution.
so let me make sure i have this straight.
.....
... which means dick to us since we dont touch microsoft products.) so perhaps it is the american companies who set the standards to high ? ...... and if it is why the hell should the middle class americans suffer ?
There is a remarkably arrogant attitude here in the US that we Americans are born with a soverign right to get paid more than someone with equivilant skills in other countries
right
IBM needs programmers. They can hire one American, or three people in another country.
yeah. that thought process enforces the prior attitude. i have a problem with IBM (or any other AMERICAN company who makes 75% of its income from AMERICANS and AMERICAN bussiness) paying some inferior indian tech $350 a month to take my job, complaning that noone is buying there products and saying i make to much because.....
A) IBM, mcdonalds etc... set the standard cost of living in this country. I am powerless to change it.
B) If i dont make X amount i cannot spend X amount. hence removing a large amount of "luxury" goods from the list of things i buy, and driving stocks down, causing more layoffs etc...
C) If IBM or Sun or whomever keeps outsourcing their labor where are they going to get customers ? and indian who makes $350 per month cannot afford a $2000 PC. and the americans are now unemployed.
its funny to me that you people dont acknowledge the simple truth about the trend of outsourcing. they are doing it because it is cheaper, meaning the top 1% get richer and everyone else gets to be dirt poor, and yes we will all end up being dirt poor because as i stated before, the american is unemployed and the indian who makes $350/month cannot afford "luxury" items.
so yay for bringing down the middle class, something that communism tried to do and was ridiculed for half a century for it.
and lastly as i have stated several hundred times, indian labor is not as effecient as american labor. its a proven statistic that americans are the most effecient workers on the planet. will that change ? who the hell knows. but i work for an outsourcing company that has offices in india and america and i can tell you that it takes 5 indians to do the work of the average american, especially if that work has something to do with free thought or problem solving.
***NOTE: not all indians are bad at problem solving. but the ones who make dirt for pay are.
oh and one other thing, american companies have ridiculous standards as far as hiring americans, but indians arent typically held to those standards. (ie we just hired to japanese speaking techs where i work, they were required to have 2 years in a production unix/linux enviroment and 5 years networking experience. the indians that do the same job on the night shift ? no experience. but they do have MCSE's
so what major companies are selling any *BSD on their servers , with support ?
didnt think so. Linux is the closest thing out there for a enterprise level OS on intel.
so lemme see here .....
behind door # 1> we have a gov't so corrupt and nasty that it makes the us gov't look like sweden.
behind door # 2> coutries that are by an large always at war, and still aren't caught up to the rest of the world as far as technology/quality of life
behind door # 3> a country that would still be identicle to ethiopia if not for having a mass-population, being located in asia, and being able to offer up semi-literate people for cheap labor.
YAY !!! where do i sign up.
and flame me all you want i have been to india and parts of eastern europe. and i work for an outsourcing company that has offices in india, so i know exactly how "good" indians are at our jobs.
and after all of the fields are sent offshore ?
and exactly why is it management never gets offshored ?
you really need to take a look out the window sometime.
Teachers have the most important job in the world! ?
not really. you can live without teachers.
i hate to break you the news but working in a shitty enviroment will take whatever joy you have out of you.
The enviornment doesnt matter, all that matters is the results!
so you have never had a job have you ? give it a few years in a shitty enviroment and tell me that.
i know many people like this. and they are the sadest bunch i have ever known.
The problem isnt that people dont live life, the problem is because people dont live life like you, you cannot understand or accept it. Having alot of money and buying alot of toys is pointless.
so when did i advocate being greedy ? i never said a damn thing about being greedy. you seem to think that the best way to live life is being a work-whore, i disagree, and YOU DONT UNDERSTAND that. its simple, to me working constantly to help people who by and large wont help themselves is fucking retarded. i want to enjoy life, you know travel, do things that i want to do when i want to do them and how i want to do them, working in a field you love wont change the fact that your not doing it on your own terms. sombody else is telling you what to do.
go ahead dedicate your whole life to something. then when your 65 you will notice that your life was worthless because you are alone, and you have never experienced anything but your job.
So what? I can have a million dollars and still be alone, then my life was ALOT more worthless than if I dedicated myself completely to my work. Look you have absolutely no control over who you'll meet in life, none at all, so why bother focusing on who you'll meet between now and age 65?
actually going out and doing things dramatically effects who you will meet. having a million dollars and being alone is just as fucking pointless as working your whole life and being alone. i'm glad you accept that your life is going to be lonely and pointless. congratulations!
this is the most condesending and retarded thing i have read in a long long time ......
..... i think MAYBE your getting the idea.
you assume that people can just quit. no strings attached and no problems what so ever. you couldnt be that stupid ! some people can't quit because of bills, some can't quit because of sick children, or a pregnant wife, there are millions of reasons as to why someone works the job they do, and for you to say that they dont matter is the most high-horse obnocsious shit you could say.
his brothers job does matter. your ass eats dont you ? you go shopping ? you like the things you want to actually be on the shelf ? well they sure as fuck didnt grow arms or legs and put themselves there. they didnt get to the store by magic.
"Most jobs people have simply dont matter, they dont improve the world in any way, they dont improve you as a person, and no one cares if you are good at it. Why not be a teacher? Even a construction worker matters more than some guy in an office working in a cubical."
your a fucking boneified idiot. that person in the cubicle could be making sure grandma gets here social security check, so she can buy her food and medication, so she can live. you think YOU matter ? to whom ? your lonely right hand ? get a grip on reality man not everyone is like you, not everyone wants to work at a non-profit. not everyone is work obsessed.
and whoever the hell modded that shit up needs to be shot in the back of the head and left to rot.
"This is why I hate the corperate world and the corperate attitude"
sure you do when it suits your intrest. do me a favor, dont go out to eat. (all waitress's dont matter, neither do the cooks or the owner) dont go see any movies (actors, grip's, random people dont matter) dont buy any CD's (musicians and studio techs dont matter) dont EAT (farmers, grocers and truckers dont matter) dont DRIVE (truckers and oil rig workers dont matter) and dont go to any hospitals no matter what (its most likely owned by some greedy corporate company)
"college and get degrees until you figure out some things you actually are good at."
yeah go and dig yourself into an insurmountable debt then take a job your good at. not something you love, because that wont pay you nearly enough to pay of the debt from school.
not everyone wants to save the world. not everyone should. most people just want to be happy and not be bothered by stupid shit. like management and bad drivers.
"Life is about the little moments."
/.
amen to that. words so true are rarely spoken on
i agree with alot of what you said.
..... nothing.
but "People should make their job their lifes work, their meaning of living, and put 100% of themselves into their job, if each person were to do this they'd not only do a better job at work, but they wouldnt complain or care if the job isnt "Enjoyable" "
thats a crock of shit. most people only complain if something actually is wrong, and if something you are seriously dedicated to is fucked up then its your responsability to complain so the people who control it fix it. and i hate to break you the news but working in a shitty enviroment will take whatever joy you have out of you. it will make you miserable, and you can try and bury your anger and displeasure all you want. it doesnt change the fact that your angry or unhappy. you just aren't has vocal about it.
go ahead dedicate your whole life to something. then when your 65 you will notice that your life was worthless because you are alone, and you have never experienced anything but your job.
people who work non-stop are afraid to live life. they take shelter and comfort from their job. but they have no life, no real desires
i know many people like this. and they are the sadest bunch i have ever known.
right. and i have been saying that from day 1.
and i wasnt stating the whole "derivative" thing as fact, simply speculating.
and im going to continue to speculate since way to many people are playing "head in the sand, fingers in ears" games and denying the very real possibility that SCO will win.
i dont want them to. but they very well might.
amen to that.
although i am a huge linux fan, anything that says it compares "enterprize OS's" and doesnt include solaris, AIX, et all is begging to be laughed at.
especially if they include windows.
oh and of course they didnt test anything on an enterprize class system either.
but hey.... its has CLUSTER ! support !!!
yeah and ?
i didnt say anybody besides IBM had any agreement with SCO. but SCO has filed claims that they own *ALL* derivative works. anything they can convince a court was built based on or with their IP. its that simple.
so what your saying is that angelina jolie wasnt hot in hackers ???????
that all depends on what exactly you mean by "if they win".
if they win all of their claims then they will retain the rights to all derivative works. and if SCO code is indeed in Linux then they can claim linux is derivative.
doesnt mean its right.
doesnt mean i think it will happen
it does however remain a possibility. and thats all i was trying to point out in response to the parent.
okay so lemme get this straight.
A) most people dont like/use solid supported backup solutions for severs. let alone PRODUCTION servers.
B) oracle 9i for mac osx is a "half assed port" to mac osX yet somehow that doesnt matter but netinfo (something that is severly outdated.) being a "half assed port" to Linux does matter ???
C) Linux's stuff is a subset of mac os X ?
are you on medication ? or are you just some flag flyin moron ? seriously i wanna know.
i have a Linux box running oracle 9i at work. works fine. not as fast as the mysql and postgresql servers we run, but oracle is an ENTERPRISE class database, meant to run on ENTERPRISE hardware with ENTERPRISE support. no Xserve shitbox is "ENTERPRISE" in any fucking way imaginable by any admin/developer not coming from vb land.
next off exactly how are Linux's network sevices a strict "subset" of mac osX's ? half the shit on OSX was originally developed by Linux users FOR LINUX !
now if you "know what veritas is" why in the fuck did you say "and Veritas isn't a network service, it's a freaking filesystem" ??? i would consider a backup and recovery utility a network service since it is administered and executed over a network. and it is not a filesystem.
perhaps you should go back to microsoft land. your idiocy might be tolerated their. I'm glad you think POSIX's foundation is rotting, would lead me to ask why most systems (including mac OSX) are built on or conform to it ?
you need to stop watching elen on the switch commercial, pull your head out of your ass and pay attention.
oh and another thing. oracle on Linux is not amatuer hour, especially since it is supported. and on OSX its still just somebodies wet dream
so AGAIN i challange you or one of your to show me something useful from an Xserve system that a Linux system cannot due. (we are talking server side here. and not "my personal webpage" cruft either.)
"Imagine the trauma is SCO wins: not only will all that derivative work belong to them "
... not just Linux. and Believe me they wouldnt hesitate to sue the hell out of everyone if they win this suit.
ALL derivative work will belong to them. that'd be BSD, OSX, Solaris, AIX etc
point is their lawyers arent as good as IBM's. IBM can just buy them. and they still haven't proven that they have a damn leg to stand on.
AIX = proprietary.
......
.... SCO claims linus doesnt "verify" his code. and exactly how the hell is he supposed to due that ? call up SCO and ask if is theirs ? wait for MONTHS for them to get back to him just so he can hear ..... "that code is ours we commited it yesterday. have a nice day." ? its not like their is some mythical place where all proprietary source code is kept so us OSS developers can double check that the code being sent to us isnt already patented/trademarked/copyrighted. and if there was we would get sued more, because companies could just say "he has access to code xyz. his product Can't be better than ours !! he mustv'e stolent the code !!! (TM SCO)"
and IBM is getting just as much shit about its AIX license as the whole linux thing
the thing i find amusing in this is simple
actually veritas is the leading backup and recovery utility on anything enterprise class.
oracle 9i is only availible in a development edition. hence it does not come with a license and is not *legally* supposed to be used in a production enviroment. and is not supported by them since its still in beta.
" I'll give you Coldfusion; " -- point ? give me time and i'll give you whatever you want on a linux system. but you cannot purchase it to run on a Xserver/macosX enviroment. and that is the point. i never said "would never in a million years be available" i said it IS NOT available.
netinfo for linux you say ?
http://www.linux.org/apps/AppId_6570.html ?
come AGAIN ?
which is exactly the point.
..... adding and removing the same hardware or at least the same type of hardware shouldnt cause a problem. but adding newer hardware will be. with any OS.
mod parent up.
some people just dont understand
in most laptops that is true, and it is also true that apple has the advantage of having mostly their own hardware to worry about ..... but if you switch to a newer video card (or switch to another brand?) in a standard mac box you still have to download and install the driver, same as any other OS.
unless it is using a generic, crippled driver. such as the "ati" driver for linux.
okay , i would first point you to my reply to another post in this thread since it has a list of things linux does/has available such as .... ....
oracle, ASP, veritas, coldfusion etc
secondly what in the hell does X11 have to do with a server side env. ? most servers run headless and very few of them run remote X stuff due to the bandwidth and resource requirements.
but since you insist what exactly can a Xserve do that a Linux server cannot ?