Fair enough, but I think based on this, there is some subdivision that is being recognized in the scientific chronology that at least "remotely" corresponds to modern reality.
To follow the PC approach of being blind that there ARE differences (if only morphological) between groups of humans just promotes ignorance. I want to understand how these migration patterns developed. I get the impression these scientists are under a lot of pressure to make sure that everyone was well-mixed 60-100,000 years ago and the differences we see now in everyday life are just the corner cases of this wildly variable population.
However, the striking refutation of this supposition is that you can't dispute that most Africans that live near Africans look like Africans, Asians that live near Asians look like Asians, and Caucasians living near Caucasians look like Caucasians, and all the permutations you can think of in between back in Victorian times.
There's something there that's different, and I refuse to believe the Tower of Babel was the thing that divided homo sapiens into 3+ races! It's still amazing to me how humans today look drastically different than ancestors from just 30,000 years ago. As I've said in a previous post. That's BARELY, pre-historic. Imagine what we'll look like in 3000 AD. My suspicion -- we'll look like the Greys.:)
Exactly, and why in one of my posts the big Max Planck guy (Svante Pääbo in this article) that has been doing a lot of this DNA analysis thinks they are all sub-species of homo sapiens. In one article I read, he basically said he doesn't want to get into the debate about what a species is because it gets complicated. They interbred though he thinks from what I've read and he did one of the big Neanderthal studies and this Denisovans one and compared them to modern humans so I think he has a better idea than most people.
Thanks, so far, you have had the most intriguing insight into this but from what I've read there are still big movers/shakers in the field that think Neandartals/Denisovans did interbreed and also have a significant impact on the the downstream homo sapiens. Do you have any good review papers you can point me to that would summarize the state of the science?
I generally agree with everything you said with one caveat, but as an aside I would be interested in your citations on environment effects on population genotypes if you have them.
My caveat would be that I also know that basically anyone >2 cousins apart (I believe) have about the same DNA matching as a % of total DNA. However, the total % is not a very fair comparison between two closely related populations. The X% difference between your two African populations is probably substantially different between one of those African communities and a comparably sized European population as defined by X% per volume. The cross-correlation is the key.
However, out of my ignorance I would nominally agree that the location relative to the equator is a big factor in skin pigment levels in peoples and that's frankly irrelevant to me. Skin pigment doesn't define the races in my opinion.
I think you're agreeing with my premise. These data are arriving at a scientific delineation of how the Victorian (and we still consider) races formed. That they broadly align with the Victorian view of morphological differences is interesting in my opinion even if the Victorians weighted more the differences rather than the similarities. In all, this is what I find interesting from a temporal perspective because 100-30,000 years ago is not that much beyond recorded history in the global perspective...
Do you think the one on the bottom is being legitimately raped or does it have ways of shutting the whole thing down?
Well, if I was the sort of person that would go to a creationist museum to see these graphics then yes, I would believe her body would shut it down if it was a legitimate rape. However, take a look at the smile on that bottom Tyranny's face? That's no "legitimate" rape!
If you read between the lines in these articles closely you'll see what I'm talking about. They're certainly skirting the subject like you for PC reasons but take a look for yourself. At some point, there were forks or bifurcations in the races and to ignore that is to promote ignorance. I am not suggesting a difference in mental/physical capacities between races or anything that was traditionally associated with this Racial Science. But I don't believe the Tower of Babel was the thing that created the different races of the world. Do you?!
Sorry to respond to myself, but I was more than a little imprecise in what I was referring to with 3 races. According to that Wikipedia article (the truthiest truth on the Internet), I was referring to what UNESCO "gives the examples of the Caucasian, Negroid and Mongoloid race". I suppose I was under the mistaken impression that this was already conventionally understood despite the fact that I acknowledged above, and UNESCO does as well, that they/we "maintain that there are no 'pure races' and that biological variability was as great within any race as between races. [Their statement] argued that there is no scientific basis for believing that there are any innate differences in intellectual, psychological or emotional potential among races." All this may be well and true, but again, there are phenotypic differences in morphology and, for me, I think this would be very satisfying to shove in creationists face over their reasoning for the Biblical Tower of Babel beyond the other arguments.
More precision in how people migrated and divided are wonderful pieces of science in my opinion, and it's amazing to me to see how evolution and diversification occurred on such a recent time-scale (less than 100,000 or even less than 30,000 years).
This probably won't be popular because it's not especially PC, but it's starting to actually appear that the 3 classical types of human as defined by 19th century Racial Science are becoming more scientifically delineated. Or at least things are breaking down broadly in similar ways. After-all, at some point there was a gross separation between Asians, Africans, Europeans, and the rest (that are usually a mix of 1+ of the others).
One of the authors of this study or the others I read was talking about how he believed for a long time that Neandarthals are a sub-species of homo sapiens, while from this un-mixed homo sapiens are more closely related to the original and modern-day Africans, and then this Denisovans are related to more eastern groups including Pacific Islanders, Aboriginal Australian, and (maybe) what was classically related to Mongoloids?
Still homo sapiens from a breeding standpoint but noticeably distinct even if it's 0.1-0.5% of the DNA. Doesn't mean anyone is better than others but we're phenotypically different if only in body morphology.
Actually, you probably have a point because I know a couple bioengineering-related people that probably picked it up after a Ph.D. So, maybe the better distinction is that most 'biologists' won't learn it after a Ph.D. IMO. The people you describe are probably more likely to tinker with a new skill compared to the people I work around who already have the cookbook of experimental techniques they use everyday and don't need/want to devote a lot of time to something new.
1) Almost nobody on/. knows about or will ever see this technique practiced
Almost nobody who knows about patch clamping practices it. It's that hard. "The masses" in this case refers to the 90% of neuroscience labs who don't have a patch clamp apparatus because it's an incredibly difficult technique. Putting an automatic patch clamp machine on every lab bench would be a huge boon to neuroscience.
Neurophysiologist here: patching isn't nearly as hard as it looks and is quite fun. Now-a-days investigators don't even need to build their own amplifiers like in the old days. However, that said, it does take practice and as I like to say, "I've never met anyone who learned how to patch-clamp after getting a Ph.D." Only undergraduates and graduate students have the time and dedication to learn it.
I should also point out there have been automatic patching machines that cater to high-throughput drug discovery on cultures (big pharmas like these). However, the novelty for this paper is that the patching is for live animals.
Another point I should make is that in the last 5 or so years the number of high-profile papers that just (or mostly) rely on patching are becoming exceedingly rare. It still has it's place, but we now know a great deal about the properties of ionic currents and their channel proteins and these properties are conserved across many subsystems. Now people are off working on complementary things...
Apparently strip clubs do well at these events, and CNN quoted some informal poll that suggested Republicans spent 3 times as much on "Adult" entertainment than Democrats at the last two national conventions of each party.
Besides the way Obama's dealt with this Wikileaks issue I otherwise like him
So this bothers you, but his treatment of Thomas Drake doesn't? Or the fact that he considers legal medical marijuana dispensaries in California to be a higher priority target than the investment bankers who crashed the economy in 2008? Or his continued use of unconstitutional warrantless wiretaps? Or that he signed the blatantly unconstitutional 2012 NDAA? Or his unilateral assassination of American citizens abroad?
The chief of the ACLU is "disgusted" with Obama. You should be too.
Fuck the ACLU, but these points you make don't make me happy but aren't deal-breakers. The treatment of Assange is nearly the breaking point as I mentioned. Killing Americans that have clearly called for the destruction of the US and have means to carry it out are fair-game -- Assange has done NOTHING remotely like that. All the rest of your points are the normal collateral from the American military-industrial complex. That doesn't mean it's right but it's entrenched, and don't try to tell me a Republican would be more sympathetic. As I admitted, this is the (FAR) lesser of two evils in my estimate.
As myself an American expat, we both know that at Guantanamo, you don't need a legitimate criminal charge to be extradited there or imprisoned indefinitely by us. Besides the way Obama's dealt with this Wikileaks issue I otherwise like him, but this situation had nearly turned me. But the lesser of two evils you know because a Republican president would have rattled a few more sabers as loudly as they could I think. Consequently, I really believe Congress would have enacted some new law (that retroactively is legal) where foreigners who smear the reputation of the US in some way can be tried for something analogous to treason in the US -- death penalty and all...
Universities start teaching their students languages AFTER they become popular. Java was well established in industry and universities were still teaching Pascal as a first language (an excellent choice), then C. THEN they switched to teaching Java as an intro language. The students who first learned it wouldn't have had an effect on industry for another two to four years after that.
Languages get adopted by individuals, then get used in industry, THEN get taught to students.
As someone that took CS 101 in '98, I should tell you that Java was the language taught Freshman year. I only stuck with CS for about 2-3 semesters (they were electives FYI:) -- but I'm still programming for work and leisure. Anyway, Java may have been "popular" but it was still 1.0-1.1 before Swing came out, and by that, and hindsight, I mean it was a total mess of shit that you couldn't get real work done in.
I still have nightmares about how I spent HOURS trying to figure out that a "deprecated" warning message during compilation wasn't an error and WOULD NOT prevent the code from working. Compile, warning, check code and change, compile, warning, check code, etc. with no actually test. Agghhhhh...
The good news from that experience was that my 1 on 1 exposure with that prof was also where I learned of vi, and I've never had to look for another code editing utility since...
Make sure to check out Nate's histogram under the "Electoral Vote Distribution" on the right about 4 or 5 panels down, which is kind of jaw-dropping IMO. His most probably outcome right now is Obama with about 335 electoral votes(!), which is a huge landslide.
Well, remember McCain saw something like 10+ years of Romney's tax returns during his vice-presidential vetting and decided that Sarah Palin was a better candidate for vice-president. Just think about that for a bit, Palin a better "heartbeat from the president" than Romney 4 yrs ago. What has Romney done since except campaign more for president and now hide his tax returns from public? I've read reports how there's a good chance that he DIDN'T pay taxes particularly in 2009 because of the stockmarket dive and even McCain hasn't seen those tax returns.
I want to know what he's hiding personally, and I think the issue probably will "swiftboat" Romney if he doesn't go ahead and release them ASAP...
Let's see, a few of the best I remember were of course GTA 3, Vice City, San Andreas, I liked Tekken Tag Tournament, Metal Gear Solid, Max Payne, and Virtua Fighter. I remember a few other less popular games but forgot the names. But Vice City is still quite possibly the most memorable GTA.
I wonder how much the salaries are for highly trained scientists in India is compared to the US? I assume relatively a lot for India, but I also suspect they have a lot of highly trained people that work for peanuts compared to USD (a la outsourcing). How much does the actual hardware really cost?
Slashdot Mirror
Fair enough, but I think based on this, there is some subdivision that is being recognized in the scientific chronology that at least "remotely" corresponds to modern reality.
:)
To follow the PC approach of being blind that there ARE differences (if only morphological) between groups of humans just promotes ignorance. I want to understand how these migration patterns developed. I get the impression these scientists are under a lot of pressure to make sure that everyone was well-mixed 60-100,000 years ago and the differences we see now in everyday life are just the corner cases of this wildly variable population.
However, the striking refutation of this supposition is that you can't dispute that most Africans that live near Africans look like Africans, Asians that live near Asians look like Asians, and Caucasians living near Caucasians look like Caucasians, and all the permutations you can think of in between back in Victorian times.
There's something there that's different, and I refuse to believe the Tower of Babel was the thing that divided homo sapiens into 3+ races! It's still amazing to me how humans today look drastically different than ancestors from just 30,000 years ago. As I've said in a previous post. That's BARELY, pre-historic. Imagine what we'll look like in 3000 AD. My suspicion -- we'll look like the Greys.
Exactly, and why in one of my posts the big Max Planck guy (Svante Pääbo in this article) that has been doing a lot of this DNA analysis thinks they are all sub-species of homo sapiens. In one article I read, he basically said he doesn't want to get into the debate about what a species is because it gets complicated. They interbred though he thinks from what I've read and he did one of the big Neanderthal studies and this Denisovans one and compared them to modern humans so I think he has a better idea than most people.
Thanks, so far, you have had the most intriguing insight into this but from what I've read there are still big movers/shakers in the field that think Neandartals/Denisovans did interbreed and also have a significant impact on the the downstream homo sapiens. Do you have any good review papers you can point me to that would summarize the state of the science?
I generally agree with everything you said with one caveat, but as an aside I would be interested in your citations on environment effects on population genotypes if you have them.
My caveat would be that I also know that basically anyone >2 cousins apart (I believe) have about the same DNA matching as a % of total DNA. However, the total % is not a very fair comparison between two closely related populations. The X% difference between your two African populations is probably substantially different between one of those African communities and a comparably sized European population as defined by X% per volume. The cross-correlation is the key.
However, out of my ignorance I would nominally agree that the location relative to the equator is a big factor in skin pigment levels in peoples and that's frankly irrelevant to me. Skin pigment doesn't define the races in my opinion.
I think you're agreeing with my premise. These data are arriving at a scientific delineation of how the Victorian (and we still consider) races formed. That they broadly align with the Victorian view of morphological differences is interesting in my opinion even if the Victorians weighted more the differences rather than the similarities. In all, this is what I find interesting from a temporal perspective because 100-30,000 years ago is not that much beyond recorded history in the global perspective...
Do you think the one on the bottom is being legitimately raped or does it have ways of shutting the whole thing down?
Well, if I was the sort of person that would go to a creationist museum to see these graphics then yes, I would believe her body would shut it down if it was a legitimate rape. However, take a look at the smile on that bottom Tyranny's face? That's no "legitimate" rape!
If you read between the lines in these articles closely you'll see what I'm talking about. They're certainly skirting the subject like you for PC reasons but take a look for yourself. At some point, there were forks or bifurcations in the races and to ignore that is to promote ignorance. I am not suggesting a difference in mental/physical capacities between races or anything that was traditionally associated with this Racial Science. But I don't believe the Tower of Babel was the thing that created the different races of the world. Do you?!
Sorry to respond to myself, but I was more than a little imprecise in what I was referring to with 3 races. According to that Wikipedia article (the truthiest truth on the Internet), I was referring to what UNESCO "gives the examples of the Caucasian, Negroid and Mongoloid race". I suppose I was under the mistaken impression that this was already conventionally understood despite the fact that I acknowledged above, and UNESCO does as well, that they/we "maintain that there are no 'pure races' and that biological variability was as great within any race as between races. [Their statement] argued that there is no scientific basis for believing that there are any innate differences in intellectual, psychological or emotional potential among races." All this may be well and true, but again, there are phenotypic differences in morphology and, for me, I think this would be very satisfying to shove in creationists face over their reasoning for the Biblical Tower of Babel beyond the other arguments.
More precision in how people migrated and divided are wonderful pieces of science in my opinion, and it's amazing to me to see how evolution and diversification occurred on such a recent time-scale (less than 100,000 or even less than 30,000 years).
Wow!
Lol, I first misread the headline as "interbred with dinosaurs". Well, the creationists at least might think that was possible.
I would almost go to a creationism museum to see the graphics for that. Can you imagine this shooped with a woman's body on the bottom?
This probably won't be popular because it's not especially PC, but it's starting to actually appear that the 3 classical types of human as defined by 19th century Racial Science are becoming more scientifically delineated. Or at least things are breaking down broadly in similar ways. After-all, at some point there was a gross separation between Asians, Africans, Europeans, and the rest (that are usually a mix of 1+ of the others).
One of the authors of this study or the others I read was talking about how he believed for a long time that Neandarthals are a sub-species of homo sapiens, while from this un-mixed homo sapiens are more closely related to the original and modern-day Africans, and then this Denisovans are related to more eastern groups including Pacific Islanders, Aboriginal Australian, and (maybe) what was classically related to Mongoloids?
Still homo sapiens from a breeding standpoint but noticeably distinct even if it's 0.1-0.5% of the DNA. Doesn't mean anyone is better than others but we're phenotypically different if only in body morphology.
Actually, you probably have a point because I know a couple bioengineering-related people that probably picked it up after a Ph.D. So, maybe the better distinction is that most 'biologists' won't learn it after a Ph.D. IMO. The people you describe are probably more likely to tinker with a new skill compared to the people I work around who already have the cookbook of experimental techniques they use everyday and don't need/want to devote a lot of time to something new.
1) Almost nobody on /. knows about or will ever see this technique practiced
Almost nobody who knows about patch clamping practices it. It's that hard. "The masses" in this case refers to the 90% of neuroscience labs who don't have a patch clamp apparatus because it's an incredibly difficult technique. Putting an automatic patch clamp machine on every lab bench would be a huge boon to neuroscience.
Neurophysiologist here: patching isn't nearly as hard as it looks and is quite fun. Now-a-days investigators don't even need to build their own amplifiers like in the old days. However, that said, it does take practice and as I like to say, "I've never met anyone who learned how to patch-clamp after getting a Ph.D." Only undergraduates and graduate students have the time and dedication to learn it.
I should also point out there have been automatic patching machines that cater to high-throughput drug discovery on cultures (big pharmas like these). However, the novelty for this paper is that the patching is for live animals.
Another point I should make is that in the last 5 or so years the number of high-profile papers that just (or mostly) rely on patching are becoming exceedingly rare. It still has it's place, but we now know a great deal about the properties of ionic currents and their channel proteins and these properties are conserved across many subsystems. Now people are off working on complementary things...
Apparently strip clubs do well at these events, and CNN quoted some informal poll that suggested Republicans spent 3 times as much on "Adult" entertainment than Democrats at the last two national conventions of each party.
You may also find this news piece interesting.
+1 to this. I know a person who injured their aim in a car accident and this worked for them.
Professional gamer I take it? Makes me wonder how a new one handed keyboard would help his aim in Quake/Unreal/Rage, etc?
Besides the way Obama's dealt with this Wikileaks issue I otherwise like him
So this bothers you, but his treatment of Thomas Drake doesn't? Or the fact that he considers legal medical marijuana dispensaries in California to be a higher priority target than the investment bankers who crashed the economy in 2008? Or his continued use of unconstitutional warrantless wiretaps? Or that he signed the blatantly unconstitutional 2012 NDAA? Or his unilateral assassination of American citizens abroad?
The chief of the ACLU is "disgusted" with Obama. You should be too.
Fuck the ACLU, but these points you make don't make me happy but aren't deal-breakers. The treatment of Assange is nearly the breaking point as I mentioned. Killing Americans that have clearly called for the destruction of the US and have means to carry it out are fair-game -- Assange has done NOTHING remotely like that. All the rest of your points are the normal collateral from the American military-industrial complex. That doesn't mean it's right but it's entrenched, and don't try to tell me a Republican would be more sympathetic. As I admitted, this is the (FAR) lesser of two evils in my estimate.
As myself an American expat, we both know that at Guantanamo, you don't need a legitimate criminal charge to be extradited there or imprisoned indefinitely by us. Besides the way Obama's dealt with this Wikileaks issue I otherwise like him, but this situation had nearly turned me. But the lesser of two evils you know because a Republican president would have rattled a few more sabers as loudly as they could I think. Consequently, I really believe Congress would have enacted some new law (that retroactively is legal) where foreigners who smear the reputation of the US in some way can be tried for something analogous to treason in the US -- death penalty and all...
Universities start teaching their students languages AFTER they become popular. Java was well established in industry and universities were still teaching Pascal as a first language (an excellent choice), then C. THEN they switched to teaching Java as an intro language. The students who first learned it wouldn't have had an effect on industry for another two to four years after that.
Languages get adopted by individuals, then get used in industry, THEN get taught to students.
As someone that took CS 101 in '98, I should tell you that Java was the language taught Freshman year. I only stuck with CS for about 2-3 semesters (they were electives FYI :) -- but I'm still programming for work and leisure. Anyway, Java may have been "popular" but it was still 1.0-1.1 before Swing came out, and by that, and hindsight, I mean it was a total mess of shit that you couldn't get real work done in.
I still have nightmares about how I spent HOURS trying to figure out that a "deprecated" warning message during compilation wasn't an error and WOULD NOT prevent the code from working. Compile, warning, check code and change, compile, warning, check code, etc. with no actually test. Agghhhhh...
The good news from that experience was that my 1 on 1 exposure with that prof was also where I learned of vi, and I've never had to look for another code editing utility since...
Make sure to check out Nate's histogram under the "Electoral Vote Distribution" on the right about 4 or 5 panels down, which is kind of jaw-dropping IMO. His most probably outcome right now is Obama with about 335 electoral votes(!), which is a huge landslide.
Well, remember McCain saw something like 10+ years of Romney's tax returns during his vice-presidential vetting and decided that Sarah Palin was a better candidate for vice-president. Just think about that for a bit, Palin a better "heartbeat from the president" than Romney 4 yrs ago. What has Romney done since except campaign more for president and now hide his tax returns from public? I've read reports how there's a good chance that he DIDN'T pay taxes particularly in 2009 because of the stockmarket dive and even McCain hasn't seen those tax returns.
I want to know what he's hiding personally, and I think the issue probably will "swiftboat" Romney if he doesn't go ahead and release them ASAP...
Let's see, a few of the best I remember were of course GTA 3, Vice City, San Andreas, I liked Tekken Tag Tournament, Metal Gear Solid, Max Payne, and Virtua Fighter. I remember a few other less popular games but forgot the names. But Vice City is still quite possibly the most memorable GTA.
I wonder how much the salaries are for highly trained scientists in India is compared to the US? I assume relatively a lot for India, but I also suspect they have a lot of highly trained people that work for peanuts compared to USD (a la outsourcing). How much does the actual hardware really cost?
was no compatibility issues.
Apple Marketdroid:There's no compatibility problem between the software/hardware if you buy the latest and greatest hardware. It works like a charm!
Pretty sure Moses did it first!
and it even had rounded corners!
If you look closely at the bottom of the pic it seems that it is signed by Sgt. Nicholson(?) in PCT 30 and lists a cell phone #.
Agree with most of this - but I would also add variable width fonts to the list.
No, the GP is implicitly saying that programmers in the PROPER developer culture use monospaced fonts to keep the indentation levels consistent.