There's a difference between saying "but Dell does it too, that makes it ok!", which I am not doing (conditions in factories like these and the global economics that drive them is something that we need to deal with), but it doesn't mean I can't point out that the article, summary and headline *specifically* demonise Apple without even mentioning that the factory is not actually an "iPad factory" nor an "Apple factory" - it's a factory that makes all manner of consumer goods for countless companies.
I have already seen a "that's why I'll never buy Apple!!" post on here, presumably posted on a computer that was made in a Foxconn plant! Is it a computer? Yes? It was probably made there, or at least part of it was. Foxconn are the Walmart of electrical suppliers for the large scale manufacturing industry.
Yes, but the ones working on Apple products are also paid more than the ones working on any other product, per Apple's requirements. (not that is this excuses them being forced to work overtime, voluntarily or pressured into it etc).
Apple does have a code of conduct for its suppliers, but just how effective it is is up to the individual suppliers. Even if it was all done locally (ie, on US soil) you still face that issue - just look at the slaughterhouses and general fast food industry - the conditions at Foxconn are probably better.
As usual, especially for the Daily Hate Mail, the title is extremely misleading. It's been covered on slashdot before, but describing Foxconn as an iPad factory, or even an Apple factory is like calling Amazon a "Stephen King bookstore".
The article strongly infers that the plant *only* makes Apple stuff.
I also see no mention in the article about Apple's responses to this, with higher wages paid per employee (compared to the same employees in the same factory making Xboxes, PS3s, Nintendo Wiis, Android handsets, televisions, microwaves, etc etc), although they did talk about how little they were earning, and inspections and rules set out in a code of conduct (although, enforcing this is clearly difficult).
So, nothing really to see here - typical of Daily Mail reporting. I'm just amazed they didn't try to work in a "gay, single-parent-mother asylum seeker claiming benefits and lottery money, causing cancer" angle somehow.
Here's a pro-tip for you, I was also a teacher. I have *actually done the job and been paid money for it*, so have some experience to be able to directly comment, as well as my direct family experiences - two siblings, a parent, an aunt and a best friend are all teachers.
The fact that you are writing it off as confirmation bias is just funny.
Teachers aren't "told they're overworked" - no, they're told that they are workshy moaners who only work half days and have huge vacation time and should be thankful. Of all the hilarious things to level at the profession "they're told they're overworked so they believe it!" is one of the most wide of the mark I have ever seen.
Modifying the code of an open-source project hardly qualifies as "in secret".
No, but by that same token, do you think spies creep around on tip toe in trenchcoats and hats?
Doing something ostensibly for one reason while concealing another is nothing new. (Although, I will admit it seems like it would be a very difficult task to build in weaknesses without *someone* spotting what you were doing).
Oh but it makes *all* the difference. It doesn't change the product, but it does show everyone that you didn't actually read TFA, TFS or TFHeadline before rushing in your excitement to post a redundant comment.
It will certainly help to weight your comments on future articles.
I know it's a joke, but... do we like Sony or not here? It's ok to root for sony (ha) when it's slating Apple, but otherwise they're the evil empire?
The reason there's no Blu-Ray drive is that while they work for data (you can add a third party one), there's no way to watch movies because Apple has so far been unwilling to put in the necessary DRM-locked/HDCP-enabled video pathway that is required. Also iTunes videos of course, which still have DRM alas, but it's the lesser of two evils at the moment I think.
I would say that was a win for DRM haters, surely?
So was I - and the story was "Does Mac/Linux Need AV" not "It doesn't" - it was a discussion. It seemed the dissenting opinions were mainly the ones saying "virus protection lies with each OS individually, so why have it on Mac/Linux just to catch Windows threats".
No, this is true but it was designed to make multi-threaded apps more simple to develop. If you're writing for OS X you can assume it's there for you in SL.
Well, the answer will be "yes" - if you are stupid (which is harsh - let's say uninformed) enough to be fooled by the sorts of things that malware gets up to (like "click here for a free system check!" or "check it out, so sexy!!! - natalie-portmans-hot-grits.jpg.exe" then the penetration rate per-platform is going to be broadly similar. You're going to have a portion of your userbase who are susceptible to this, along with another portion who set blanket passwords for all of their activities and set it to "password1".
Windows has the problem that not only does it have to contend with this user problem (which is common to both platforms [win and OS X], and less common on Linux/non-Mac-BSD), but it has also faced the "swiss cheese operating system" problem that they have been trying to fix since malware first came about. OS X at least has the benefit of starting from a better platform (BSD core) than Windows' legacy issues. That's not to say it's immune to threats - the fact that there are security updates for OS X disprove that.
I'm surprised that there hasn't been a more high profile virus or malware outbreak on OS X before now, since even with the smaller marketshare (1 in 5 new computers sold in the US is a Mac, but total install base is still nearer 10%), the "kudos" for "sticking their nose in it" is high.
Not wanting to go for a cheap "FTFY", I'll just say that the reaction of everyone imitating a Mac user's reaction will be yours.
The rest of us actual Mac users carry on as normal, just like the Linux users.
Interestingly, does this count as the 44th malware threat on OS X (based on a cited post from the AV thread yesterday that said there are 43 threats over the life of OS X), or does it count as more than one, since it's a tool kit. Is a swiss army knife one tool or several?:p
You clearly missed the "exaggeration for comic effect" with that comment, but the point still stands - there is a lot of messing with the command line for some estoteric tasks (like, fixing the wireless).
You also suspect wrong, re more flies with honey than vinegar - I am unfailingly polite when asking for help. What, you think I'm a total idiot? It doesn't have much effect on the way I'm treated in return though.
Hilarious. I post on slashdot all the time, and have been called "one of the most disgusting mac fanbois ever to exist".
I haven't used Windows in... well, some time. At least a decade. It depends if you count tech support for relatives.
Your post is *exactly* what my post is all about, and in fact with the other troll reply we are so for 2 for 0 on "douchebag replies" to a post that is critical of the Linux experience, from someone who has personally experienced it.
If you read carefully you'll note that my install went fine - I've done it a few times actually with different versions of Ubuntu, but that anything beyond that steamlined experience becomes very unintuitive very quickly.
My experience with the wireless drivers for my Airport card, for example. Now, I'm sure there's a gui way to install and configure them, but the help, located by a forum search, uses the shell to do so. Fine by me, I use the shell all the time in OS X - it's very handy, but I'm fortunate to have some experience with it. Someone less computer savvy is going to be totally lost.
Or we have the "works fine on the Live CD, then fails to work when installed". Sure, it was nice and smooth but I still can't fathom why it stopped working properly when it was installed vs running off the CD on the same hardware.
And then we get to the main point. My post is not "savaging" Linux, or calling it useless, or "a toy OS that's worthless for any real work" - you know, the sort of criticism I get levelled at my primary OS (OS X) on slashdot all the time, yet when I raise my concerns with an OS that I am seriously trying to get to grips with and be as comfortable using as OS X I get called "an ignorant little Windows user" in the most derisive, derogatory and condescending tone that is possibly to convey in text. Not only is it inaccurate (I haven't personally owned a windows box since Win 2k), you also then laughably go on to dismiss my issues and instead talk about how streamlined the Linux install process is.
My issues with the wireless card are after install, when it's sitting at the desktop having *not installed my wireless drivers correctly during the smooth install process* that were working *perfectly* from the Live CD, and my subsequent attempts to reinstall and tweak them.
This is the attitude I have come to expect from many Linux users when bringing up issues with the OS. It's somehow never Linux's fault, and always that we're "ignorant little Windows users" that really should be kissing your fucking feet for even *daring* to suggest that we're having anything less than a perfect and seamless experience with Linux, and that any problems are of our own making.
It's no wonder so many people say "it's just not worth the hassle". Colour me unsurprised that the marketshare for desktop Linux is so low, if this is how newbies are treated.
You should be fucking ashamed of yourself. You're doing more to hurt Linux adoption than a thousand obscurely named programs. At least you can look up what they do so you can find the one you need. With people like you it's a struggle not to just turn off the computer and say "well, fuck it then, I'm clearly not 1337 enough to just suddenly know everything or have it all work instantly on the first try".
So in what way is that stupid or offensive (also note that this is my second post in the thread), or looking for my ego to be stroked?
I am simply offering a point of view based on my experiences on slashdot over the years.
If you think that the issues concerning the ease of use of Linux, or using descriptive names that only really help power users is "stupid minutia", then congratulations, you are proving my point for me - the one I made initially. Now, I have a thick skin and things just roll off me, but consider how the attitude affects the perception of a new Linux user.
"I'm new to Linux and I am struggling to do [X], I've looked it up and still having issues"
"Piss off sonny, we're not here to stroke your ego, you must be at least *this* elitist to use Linux"
*user goes back to Windows or Mac*
Now, maybe *you* don't care about growing the user base, and in fact maybe you want to keep it small so you can be cool, elite and alternative, but I'm not sure that viewpoint is shared by all. S/N ratio is a little skewed though, in my experience.
iPad and iPad 2 have identical ports - the 30 pin dock connector, and it can be converted to a USB port with the USB connector kit. I'm not sure what you're actually saying with your sentence other than "I just made something up".
Some non-users think "Apple is tracking people!", which is quickly proven to be overblown hype. Apple responds and says "ok, we'll make the log less useful to your phone in the future, oh and we don;t actually collect that data, it's used by the phone for Assisted GPS, oh and furthermore it's not tracking *you* it's logging the location of cell towers and wifi hotspots that I guess could be used to narrow down where you've been but these reports that we are 'tracking your every move' (direct quote) are nonsense".
Non-users don't believe them, but then they already made their mind up that they wouldn't regardless of what Apple said.
Life goes on.
Six months down the line some new "controversy" will arise, like... I don't know, "OS X machines have IPv6 enabled by default, which is broadcasting a globally unique address that can be used to track you!" or some shit.
People on slashdot will misunderstand, or wilfully misinterpret the "scandal" and come out with demonstrably false statements like "they forgot to add a USB port to iPad, and the next iteration has a USB port".
(Seriously, that's one of the funniest things I've ever read. Have you actually ever *seen* an iPad or iPad 2, or actually done any googling? That has made my day.)
The point is that everyone bemoans the lack of penetration of Linux on the desktop, yet when you dare criticise it for some of the reason that this might be the case you get hit with the biggest barrier to adoption: the "butthurt Linux Defender" who tells you to shove your suggestions up your ass and if you don;t like it you can get lost because it's been given to you for free dammit!
No one is forcing me to use Linux, and with the attitude I have come across in some circles there really is no compelling reason for me to keep learning (I have Ubuntu on a Powerbook mainly used to see what this Linux thing is all about) - I can just go back to my OS of choice.
Now, I'd be unfair if I painted every Linux user that way - there's clearly a large number of them who are very helpful and are just as exasperated with the "we know it's impenetrable to do anything more than basic setup" who wrote guides and extensive forum posts - I'd never have got through some of the more basic tasks that were giving me problems during setup (or after some updates that suddenly broke random things tht didn;t seem to be connected to the thing I updated).
Now, Ubuntu have tried to make it a painless as possible for a total newbie to get started, and what do they get? The accusation that they're "dumbing down Linux"
I really want to like Linux, if I can get it running smoothly on my Powerbook it will make an excellent little machine for when I'm not at my desk, but so far it has been hit and miss. It's just too... I won;t say "hard", but I will say "unintuitive" to do some things, and some stuff is just plain weird.
I tried a Kbuntu Live CD to give KDE a try compared to Gnome (was fed up looking at brown! j/k) and the Live CD worked great! The wireless worked just fine (like it did on Gnome), but then when I installed the CD so it would boot from the disc, the wireless stopped working and I have been unable to get it working again when nothing has changed! I was sure it had to do with the proprietary wireless driver for the Airport Express card, but even the cafeful forum instructions from helpful people could not get it going again. Drop back to Gnome: it works again! I'm not really sure why the window manager should have such an effect on something that I thought was handled by something unrelated to it, but there it is.
My experiences with it are that it would be quite easy to learn *if* you had an expert sitting next to you to answer the myriad questions that pop up, or solve that *one* little speedbump that appears in a long chain of stuff that you don't know how to deal with.
As it is, I have kept OS X 10.5 on the machine too, so I can dual boot if I need to take my laptop anywhere - I am just not comfortable with Ubuntu enough not to keep a crutch nearby that I know how to work with quickly and easily if something throws me off - like the wireless problem, or if I want a hardware-accelerated UI (still can't get that to work in KDE or Gnome, and I suspect it *can* work, I'm just missing something obvious).
You can see why it's not "year of Linux on the desktop".
"Yes maam, just load that kernel module dynamically using the following easy command, making sure you have root on your box...."
There's a reason Android has been so successful in the mobile space: abstraction. Sure, have the esoteric stuff down in the core that advanced users can mess with directly, but goodness me, if your GUI level stuff is just as impenetrable then newbies will have a learning curve similar to famous Eve Online one.
This is doubly true for applications - you might get a pass for system setup stuff, maybe, but there's no excuse for "Kdenlive" or "GIMP" or "Qtpfsgui".
My point is that not only are both viewpoints expressed, but that both can get easily modded up to +5. They can't both be right, at least not without hypocrisy (hey, I don;t see a rush of people trying to correct the assertions). It's not solely related to this issue though, or to Apple in general. It happens a lot on slashdot and if no one questions it then the place really is a vacuous echo chamber.
Slashdot Mirror
There's a difference between saying "but Dell does it too, that makes it ok!", which I am not doing (conditions in factories like these and the global economics that drive them is something that we need to deal with), but it doesn't mean I can't point out that the article, summary and headline *specifically* demonise Apple without even mentioning that the factory is not actually an "iPad factory" nor an "Apple factory" - it's a factory that makes all manner of consumer goods for countless companies.
I have already seen a "that's why I'll never buy Apple!!" post on here, presumably posted on a computer that was made in a Foxconn plant! Is it a computer? Yes? It was probably made there, or at least part of it was. Foxconn are the Walmart of electrical suppliers for the large scale manufacturing industry.
You joke, but the cattle that get slaughtered have better protections and laws for their wellbeing.
Working at a US slaughterhouse is not fun - rife with boarderline-illegal and awful practices. It is at least as bad as working at foxconn.
Yes, but the ones working on Apple products are also paid more than the ones working on any other product, per Apple's requirements. (not that is this excuses them being forced to work overtime, voluntarily or pressured into it etc).
Apple does have a code of conduct for its suppliers, but just how effective it is is up to the individual suppliers. Even if it was all done locally (ie, on US soil) you still face that issue - just look at the slaughterhouses and general fast food industry - the conditions at Foxconn are probably better.
As usual, especially for the Daily Hate Mail, the title is extremely misleading. It's been covered on slashdot before, but describing Foxconn as an iPad factory, or even an Apple factory is like calling Amazon a "Stephen King bookstore".
The article strongly infers that the plant *only* makes Apple stuff.
I also see no mention in the article about Apple's responses to this, with higher wages paid per employee (compared to the same employees in the same factory making Xboxes, PS3s, Nintendo Wiis, Android handsets, televisions, microwaves, etc etc), although they did talk about how little they were earning, and inspections and rules set out in a code of conduct (although, enforcing this is clearly difficult).
So, nothing really to see here - typical of Daily Mail reporting. I'm just amazed they didn't try to work in a "gay, single-parent-mother asylum seeker claiming benefits and lottery money, causing cancer" angle somehow.
Yes you can, at least in iTunes.
Preferences > Advanced > uncheck "keep iTunes Media folder organised"
Then it behaves exactly like Winamp if you want to do all the folder and music management yourself.
Here's a pro-tip for you, I was also a teacher. I have *actually done the job and been paid money for it*, so have some experience to be able to directly comment, as well as my direct family experiences - two siblings, a parent, an aunt and a best friend are all teachers.
The fact that you are writing it off as confirmation bias is just funny.
Teachers aren't "told they're overworked" - no, they're told that they are workshy moaners who only work half days and have huge vacation time and should be thankful. Of all the hilarious things to level at the profession "they're told they're overworked so they believe it!" is one of the most wide of the mark I have ever seen.
I hear this his password was his dream for the future: TrumpPalin2012.
Modifying the code of an open-source project hardly qualifies as "in secret".
No, but by that same token, do you think spies creep around on tip toe in trenchcoats and hats?
Doing something ostensibly for one reason while concealing another is nothing new. (Although, I will admit it seems like it would be a very difficult task to build in weaknesses without *someone* spotting what you were doing).
Oh but it makes *all* the difference. It doesn't change the product, but it does show everyone that you didn't actually read TFA, TFS or TFHeadline before rushing in your excitement to post a redundant comment.
It will certainly help to weight your comments on future articles.
I know it's a joke, but... do we like Sony or not here? It's ok to root for sony (ha) when it's slating Apple, but otherwise they're the evil empire?
The reason there's no Blu-Ray drive is that while they work for data (you can add a third party one), there's no way to watch movies because Apple has so far been unwilling to put in the necessary DRM-locked/HDCP-enabled video pathway that is required. Also iTunes videos of course, which still have DRM alas, but it's the lesser of two evils at the moment I think.
I would say that was a win for DRM haters, surely?
The phrase is actually "champing at the bit", but otherwise yes.
So was I - and the story was "Does Mac/Linux Need AV" not "It doesn't" - it was a discussion. It seemed the dissenting opinions were mainly the ones saying "virus protection lies with each OS individually, so why have it on Mac/Linux just to catch Windows threats".
My opinion is "no one is safe", plan accordingly.
No, this is true but it was designed to make multi-threaded apps more simple to develop. If you're writing for OS X you can assume it's there for you in SL.
Well, the answer will be "yes" - if you are stupid (which is harsh - let's say uninformed) enough to be fooled by the sorts of things that malware gets up to (like "click here for a free system check!" or "check it out, so sexy!!! - natalie-portmans-hot-grits.jpg.exe" then the penetration rate per-platform is going to be broadly similar. You're going to have a portion of your userbase who are susceptible to this, along with another portion who set blanket passwords for all of their activities and set it to "password1".
Windows has the problem that not only does it have to contend with this user problem (which is common to both platforms [win and OS X], and less common on Linux/non-Mac-BSD), but it has also faced the "swiss cheese operating system" problem that they have been trying to fix since malware first came about. OS X at least has the benefit of starting from a better platform (BSD core) than Windows' legacy issues. That's not to say it's immune to threats - the fact that there are security updates for OS X disprove that.
I'm surprised that there hasn't been a more high profile virus or malware outbreak on OS X before now, since even with the smaller marketshare (1 in 5 new computers sold in the US is a Mac, but total install base is still nearer 10%), the "kudos" for "sticking their nose in it" is high.
Not wanting to go for a cheap "FTFY", I'll just say that the reaction of everyone imitating a Mac user's reaction will be yours.
The rest of us actual Mac users carry on as normal, just like the Linux users.
Interestingly, does this count as the 44th malware threat on OS X (based on a cited post from the AV thread yesterday that said there are 43 threats over the life of OS X), or does it count as more than one, since it's a tool kit. Is a swiss army knife one tool or several? :p
Despite the obvious satire, the answer is yes, since the system handles GCD for the software running on it :p
You clearly missed the "exaggeration for comic effect" with that comment, but the point still stands - there is a lot of messing with the command line for some estoteric tasks (like, fixing the wireless).
You also suspect wrong, re more flies with honey than vinegar - I am unfailingly polite when asking for help. What, you think I'm a total idiot? It doesn't have much effect on the way I'm treated in return though.
I guess the US military took Seth Meyers' advice and tuned into C-Span between 4 and 5pm....
For further context, my other post in this article, re: Linux issues from personal experience.
http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=2117310&cid=35991006
Of course, if you want me to get back under my *Cupertino* Bridge, then by all means.
Windows user! Ha! The most hilarious assumptions in the course of a "someone dared criticise Linux!" butthurt reply ever.
Hilarious. I post on slashdot all the time, and have been called "one of the most disgusting mac fanbois ever to exist".
I haven't used Windows in... well, some time. At least a decade. It depends if you count tech support for relatives.
Your post is *exactly* what my post is all about, and in fact with the other troll reply we are so for 2 for 0 on "douchebag replies" to a post that is critical of the Linux experience, from someone who has personally experienced it.
If you read carefully you'll note that my install went fine - I've done it a few times actually with different versions of Ubuntu, but that anything beyond that steamlined experience becomes very unintuitive very quickly.
My experience with the wireless drivers for my Airport card, for example. Now, I'm sure there's a gui way to install and configure them, but the help, located by a forum search, uses the shell to do so. Fine by me, I use the shell all the time in OS X - it's very handy, but I'm fortunate to have some experience with it. Someone less computer savvy is going to be totally lost.
Or we have the "works fine on the Live CD, then fails to work when installed". Sure, it was nice and smooth but I still can't fathom why it stopped working properly when it was installed vs running off the CD on the same hardware.
And then we get to the main point. My post is not "savaging" Linux, or calling it useless, or "a toy OS that's worthless for any real work" - you know, the sort of criticism I get levelled at my primary OS (OS X) on slashdot all the time, yet when I raise my concerns with an OS that I am seriously trying to get to grips with and be as comfortable using as OS X I get called "an ignorant little Windows user" in the most derisive, derogatory and condescending tone that is possibly to convey in text. Not only is it inaccurate (I haven't personally owned a windows box since Win 2k), you also then laughably go on to dismiss my issues and instead talk about how streamlined the Linux install process is.
My issues with the wireless card are after install, when it's sitting at the desktop having *not installed my wireless drivers correctly during the smooth install process* that were working *perfectly* from the Live CD, and my subsequent attempts to reinstall and tweak them.
This is the attitude I have come to expect from many Linux users when bringing up issues with the OS. It's somehow never Linux's fault, and always that we're "ignorant little Windows users" that really should be kissing your fucking feet for even *daring* to suggest that we're having anything less than a perfect and seamless experience with Linux, and that any problems are of our own making.
It's no wonder so many people say "it's just not worth the hassle". Colour me unsurprised that the marketshare for desktop Linux is so low, if this is how newbies are treated.
You should be fucking ashamed of yourself. You're doing more to hurt Linux adoption than a thousand obscurely named programs. At least you can look up what they do so you can find the one you need. With people like you it's a struggle not to just turn off the computer and say "well, fuck it then, I'm clearly not 1337 enough to just suddenly know everything or have it all work instantly on the first try".
So in what way is that stupid or offensive (also note that this is my second post in the thread), or looking for my ego to be stroked?
I am simply offering a point of view based on my experiences on slashdot over the years.
If you think that the issues concerning the ease of use of Linux, or using descriptive names that only really help power users is "stupid minutia", then congratulations, you are proving my point for me - the one I made initially. Now, I have a thick skin and things just roll off me, but consider how the attitude affects the perception of a new Linux user.
"I'm new to Linux and I am struggling to do [X], I've looked it up and still having issues"
"Piss off sonny, we're not here to stroke your ego, you must be at least *this* elitist to use Linux"
*user goes back to Windows or Mac*
Now, maybe *you* don't care about growing the user base, and in fact maybe you want to keep it small so you can be cool, elite and alternative, but I'm not sure that viewpoint is shared by all. S/N ratio is a little skewed though, in my experience.
iPad and iPad 2 have identical ports - the 30 pin dock connector, and it can be converted to a USB port with the USB connector kit. I'm not sure what you're actually saying with your sentence other than "I just made something up".
Some non-users think "Apple is tracking people!", which is quickly proven to be overblown hype. Apple responds and says "ok, we'll make the log less useful to your phone in the future, oh and we don;t actually collect that data, it's used by the phone for Assisted GPS, oh and furthermore it's not tracking *you* it's logging the location of cell towers and wifi hotspots that I guess could be used to narrow down where you've been but these reports that we are 'tracking your every move' (direct quote) are nonsense".
Non-users don't believe them, but then they already made their mind up that they wouldn't regardless of what Apple said.
Life goes on.
Six months down the line some new "controversy" will arise, like... I don't know, "OS X machines have IPv6 enabled by default, which is broadcasting a globally unique address that can be used to track you!" or some shit.
People on slashdot will misunderstand, or wilfully misinterpret the "scandal" and come out with demonstrably false statements like "they forgot to add a USB port to iPad, and the next iteration has a USB port".
(Seriously, that's one of the funniest things I've ever read. Have you actually ever *seen* an iPad or iPad 2, or actually done any googling? That has made my day.)
The point is that everyone bemoans the lack of penetration of Linux on the desktop, yet when you dare criticise it for some of the reason that this might be the case you get hit with the biggest barrier to adoption: the "butthurt Linux Defender" who tells you to shove your suggestions up your ass and if you don;t like it you can get lost because it's been given to you for free dammit!
No one is forcing me to use Linux, and with the attitude I have come across in some circles there really is no compelling reason for me to keep learning (I have Ubuntu on a Powerbook mainly used to see what this Linux thing is all about) - I can just go back to my OS of choice.
Now, I'd be unfair if I painted every Linux user that way - there's clearly a large number of them who are very helpful and are just as exasperated with the "we know it's impenetrable to do anything more than basic setup" who wrote guides and extensive forum posts - I'd never have got through some of the more basic tasks
that were giving me problems during setup (or after some updates that suddenly broke random things tht didn;t seem to be connected to the thing I updated).
Now, Ubuntu have tried to make it a painless as possible for a total newbie to get started, and what do they get? The accusation that they're "dumbing down Linux"
I really want to like Linux, if I can get it running smoothly on my Powerbook it will make an excellent little machine for when I'm not at my desk, but so far it has been hit and miss. It's just too... I won;t say "hard", but I will say "unintuitive" to do some things, and some stuff is just plain weird.
I tried a Kbuntu Live CD to give KDE a try compared to Gnome (was fed up looking at brown! j/k) and the Live CD worked great! The wireless worked just fine (like it did on Gnome), but then when I installed the CD so it would boot from the disc, the wireless stopped working and I have been unable to get it working again when nothing has changed! I was sure it had to do with the proprietary wireless driver for the Airport Express card, but even the cafeful forum instructions from helpful people could not get it going again. Drop back to Gnome: it works again! I'm not really sure why the window manager should have such an effect on something that I thought was handled by something unrelated to it, but there it is.
My experiences with it are that it would be quite easy to learn *if* you had an expert sitting next to you to answer the myriad questions that pop up, or solve that *one* little speedbump that appears in a long chain of stuff that you don't know how to deal with.
As it is, I have kept OS X 10.5 on the machine too, so I can dual boot if I need to take my laptop anywhere - I am just not comfortable with Ubuntu enough not to keep a crutch nearby that I know how to work with quickly and easily if something throws me off - like the wireless problem, or if I want a hardware-accelerated UI (still can't get that to work in KDE or Gnome, and I suspect it *can* work, I'm just missing something obvious).
What's pfs, to a casual user?
You can see why it's not "year of Linux on the desktop".
"Yes maam, just load that kernel module dynamically using the following easy command, making sure you have root on your box...."
There's a reason Android has been so successful in the mobile space: abstraction. Sure, have the esoteric stuff down in the core that advanced users can mess with directly, but goodness me, if your GUI level stuff is just as impenetrable then newbies will have a learning curve similar to famous Eve Online one.
This is doubly true for applications - you might get a pass for system setup stuff, maybe, but there's no excuse for "Kdenlive" or "GIMP" or "Qtpfsgui".
My point is that not only are both viewpoints expressed, but that both can get easily modded up to +5. They can't both be right, at least not without hypocrisy (hey, I don;t see a rush of people trying to correct the assertions). It's not solely related to this issue though, or to Apple in general. It happens a lot on slashdot and if no one questions it then the place really is a vacuous echo chamber.