> You can run older non-flattened and even non-ribbon interface versions of Microsoft Office on Windows 8 fine.
He's right. As an experiment I ran Office 2000 on Win8, worked fine.
I disagree, though, that the Desktop is "pretty close except for the lack of a Start menu". It wasn't just that. Common things were in a different place, weren't grouped together properly and/or needed a memorized cabalistic gesture to make available. As many have said, Win8 lacks greatly in "conveyance". It's not apparent what are clickable objects and what are unclickable labels. These issues did not all go away with 8.1, nor does Classic Shell fix anything except the addition of a walking menu (which must be configured by the user).
But you can slog through all of this and maybe get work done, but why would you? We're told repeatedly that Windows 8 is better internally than 7, faster stronger better etc etc. And I'm sure that's true -- but the differences to the user, if any, are subtle, and aren't really enough motivation to deal with all the other issues. Especially for users without sysadmin experience.
ACPI driver? ACPI does not need a manufacturer-specific driver. You probably mean ACPI WMI driver?
It's possible. I would get an "ACPI error" popup every few minutes. Other than looking around on the ASUS website, I didn't spend much time diagnosing it as I'd already decided to abandon the OS. The error went away when I did a system restore back to Win7.
Just so you know, this "average joe" mostly uses his PC to manage a bunch of Linux sessions and Adobe content creation tools. The big difference between 8 and all the Windows before it is that 8 is primarily geared towards content consumption -- mindless scraping and poking at garish tiles -- and is a poor fit for content creation. Yes, it's possible to twist Win8 all around and make it useful to developers, but it's not necessary, as Win7 already fulfills that niche.
Well, hang on, I don't see a lot of geeks on Slashdot saying that people should just love Windows 8. I mean, there are a few, but I think that at least some of them are anonymous cowards trying to do damage control for Microsoft. The majority of responders of Windows 8 related threads appear to revile the OS. I agree, the average joe doesn't want something new and different that they have to figure out. The average joe is not a geek, and doesn't research OS settings for fun. But I believe the average joe and the geek who actually uses computers rather than just playing with them, would find some grounds for agreement. The OS should not get in the way of what you're trying to do. Windows 8 does.
It's not a matter of not fathoming it. It's a matter of not caring. Why should I pay money to "upgrade" to an operating system that's a pain to use? How does staying with the OS that works, so that I can get my work done, being lazy? I'm not paid to learn operating systems, I'm paid to do work for which I need an OS that does not get in the way. Windows 8 gets in the way. Of course there are solutions, but there is no benefit to implementing them. At best, after a lot of work and configuring of third party tools, on a desktop or non-touchscreen laptop, Windows 8 is sorta like Windows 7, only stupider. It's far easier to hit F9, do a system restore, and get Windows 7 back.
Actually, the ACPI driver for my Asus laptop would work with 8.0, but would error out with 8.1. There didn't appear to be a driver on the manufacturer's website that would work. I did not mention it previously because it was not really important, as I had decided that 8.1 was a loser before I realized I had driver problems.
Windows 8/8.1 under the hood is better than Windows 7 under the hood.
Under the hood, don't care. The things for which I use a PC are about as far away as one can get from doing OS benchmarks. The only reason I'm not still using XP is because I needed to allocate more than 4 gigs of memory. 7 is fine. There's nothing in 8 that warrants having to screw with it.
8.1 allows you to boot directly to desktop, disable the hot corners, go directly to all apps when you press Winkey and use your wallpaper as the background for the start screen. No third party software needed.
And sticking with Windows 7 means I don't have to google how to boot directly to desktop or disable hot corners, and I have a real start menu that I don't have to download, install,and configure myself, and I don't ever, ever have to look at that stupid start screen. Bonus.
I understand, for OS junkies, making 8 behave is a challenge. I just want to get my work done. That is, after all, what PCs are for. The OS is not an application. The OS loads applications.
Ok, so, I'll tell you what -- if Microsoft makes a version that works exactly like 7 right out of the box, with no registry changes or chasing after obscure check boxes, but is "better under the hood", I might consider it. I upgraded 8.0 to 8.1 on a laptop, and it looked and behaved exactly like 8.0. The only difference was the fake start button that takes you to that stupid start screen. At that point, it was time to do a system restore to 7. And 7 is where I'll stay. There's no reason to upgrade, really, and a lot of reasons not to.
Right. Windows 8 is for people who haven't yet figured out the cabalistic hand gestures necessary to invoke Windows Marketplace and do the free upgrade. It's really the same OS.
Right. Because "enterprise" hasn't stuck with XP and all the little warts and moles that it has brought with it for nearly 14 years now... They'll jump ship ASAP because Win7 just won't suit.... Yeah... You keep thinking that.
As short as your post is it's lacking everything but "This is teh year of Linuxxx!!!!!11111!!!!onehunderedeleven!!HERP!!!"
I'm sorry I'm not parsing this. Some companies are starting to migrate to 7, some are sticking with XP, but I don't know any companies that aren't actually doing Win8 development that have plans to upgrade to Win8. In fact, what I'm seeing is execs driving Apple on the desktop, in the briefcase and in the pocket. My company is over 30% Apple and growing, partly because the execs like the interface and partly due to the perception that Microsoft is currently rudderless and may not have an enterprise-suitable desktop again for years. With 8.1 they've decided to double down, and the next release it looks like they're doubling down again, as if we're somehow going to just get used to having a big blotchy GUI on KVM machines and stop complaining about it.
I know I know, you always buy Microsoft because of Office. That's not really true anymore either. Enterprise analytics tools, which are more important to execs than Excel, are available on ipad, and just starting to become available on Android, and aren't really supported on Microsoft tablets, except to the extent you can slog through your work using touch equivalents for the motions of a three button mouse, because there is no market for Metro support.
I just came back from a conference that used to be all Microsoft. This year all the presentations used Mac/Airport, and the great majority of attendees were also on macs or ipads. The whole week I saw one Surface.
Enterprise will leverage XP and 7 for as long as practical, but they're going to look for other solutions. But I think the linux-on-the-desktop crew will continue to be disappointed, unless Android counts. The point really is that Microsoft's choices are already affecting enterprise business, in ways that will slowly become apparent. Businesses are losing confidence in Microsoft being able to offer a viable business solution. There's no scrabbling to replace currently working solutions, but there is a push towards looking at non-Microsoft solutions going forward. It doesn't mean we're approaching "the year of Linux", that ship has sailed. What it means is that we're approaching the year of not-Microsoft, whatever that turns out to be.
I have no love for Win 8's UI. But Classic Shell to the rescue. My current system has the best of both worlds. Win 7 UI, Win 8 OS under the hood (which does have some nice improvements).
We found an easier solution. Press F9 on boot, choose system recovery. After about 40 minutes, we have Windows 7 UI, and Windows 7 OS under the hood. Don't have to mess around with the Windows Marketplace, we don't have to worry about third party tools to make the OS usable, ain't no "hot corners" or "charms bars" and it doesn't go full screen at random frakking times. The Windows 8 Pro box goes back on the shelf until some future update where perhaps Microsoft gets their collective head out of their collective ass.
Have we not been repeatedly assured by the UN and the US government that our bestie friend China is a paragon of environmental awareness? Don't all the charts show China with a lower carbon footprint than Switzerland? Surely the pollution must be the US's own being recirculated. After being partially cleansed by the pristine skies of China, of course./sarcasm
I'm pretty sure Al Gore said at one time that China was on the cutting edge of environmental awareness. With a little time, I could probably find the sound bite.
But... but.. then companies wouldn't make as much MONEY. The whole idea of outsourcing to China (or nearly anywhere, really) is that you can leverage slave wages and a total lack of pollution standards. Without those factors, the business model breaks down.
> "So the strength of a password does not come from what it is, and in particular does not come from its length. The password length has no direct relation to password security. What makes a password strong is its randomness;"
When you get to 99, you've probably exceeded the system's old password memory and can start over with 01. Or put the number in front of the string. And then in the middle.
> The downside of that is really nasty passwords, with changes of case, numbers and symbols end up written on Post-it notes and stuck on the fronts of computers.
Or under keyboards. And that's the natural outcome of unreasonable password expiration schedules.
One place I worked, all passwords were kept on the mainframe (racf, I think) and had to be combinations of cap and lower case letters, numbers and at least one special character, rotated on the first of every month, could never be reused, and could not be written down on pain of termination.
Someone discovered empirically that "Pas(2 digit month)/(2 digit year) met all the criteria, so thereafter we all used Pas11/98, Pas12/98, Pas01/99 and so forth. Very easy to remember, met all the criteria, and wouldn't repeat for a long time. To my knowledge, they're still doing it.
That's what we need on Google Maps, a rat overlay. It'd look like the traffic overlay, except red would indicate a significant likelihood of being eaten.
Slashdot Mirror
But this generation wouldn't get it.
> You can run older non-flattened and even non-ribbon interface versions of Microsoft Office on Windows 8 fine.
He's right. As an experiment I ran Office 2000 on Win8, worked fine.
I disagree, though, that the Desktop is "pretty close except for the lack of a Start menu". It wasn't just that. Common things were in a different place, weren't grouped together properly and/or needed a memorized cabalistic gesture to make available. As many have said, Win8 lacks greatly in "conveyance". It's not apparent what are clickable objects and what are unclickable labels. These issues did not all go away with 8.1, nor does Classic Shell fix anything except the addition of a walking menu (which must be configured by the user).
But you can slog through all of this and maybe get work done, but why would you? We're told repeatedly that Windows 8 is better internally than 7, faster stronger better etc etc. And I'm sure that's true -- but the differences to the user, if any, are subtle, and aren't really enough motivation to deal with all the other issues. Especially for users without sysadmin experience.
ACPI driver? ACPI does not need a manufacturer-specific driver. You probably mean ACPI WMI driver?
It's possible. I would get an "ACPI error" popup every few minutes. Other than looking around on the ASUS website, I didn't spend much time diagnosing it as I'd already decided to abandon the OS. The error went away when I did a system restore back to Win7.
We also heard the same thing from people like me about WinME, Windows Vista, and Win8. And we were right.
Just so you know, this "average joe" mostly uses his PC to manage a bunch of Linux sessions and Adobe content creation tools. The big difference between 8 and all the Windows before it is that 8 is primarily geared towards content consumption -- mindless scraping and poking at garish tiles -- and is a poor fit for content creation. Yes, it's possible to twist Win8 all around and make it useful to developers, but it's not necessary, as Win7 already fulfills that niche.
Well, hang on, I don't see a lot of geeks on Slashdot saying that people should just love Windows 8. I mean, there are a few, but I think that at least some of them are anonymous cowards trying to do damage control for Microsoft. The majority of responders of Windows 8 related threads appear to revile the OS. I agree, the average joe doesn't want something new and different that they have to figure out. The average joe is not a geek, and doesn't research OS settings for fun. But I believe the average joe and the geek who actually uses computers rather than just playing with them, would find some grounds for agreement. The OS should not get in the way of what you're trying to do. Windows 8 does.
It's not a matter of not fathoming it. It's a matter of not caring. Why should I pay money to "upgrade" to an operating system that's a pain to use? How does staying with the OS that works, so that I can get my work done, being lazy? I'm not paid to learn operating systems, I'm paid to do work for which I need an OS that does not get in the way. Windows 8 gets in the way. Of course there are solutions, but there is no benefit to implementing them. At best, after a lot of work and configuring of third party tools, on a desktop or non-touchscreen laptop, Windows 8 is sorta like Windows 7, only stupider. It's far easier to hit F9, do a system restore, and get Windows 7 back.
Actually, the ACPI driver for my Asus laptop would work with 8.0, but would error out with 8.1. There didn't appear to be a driver on the manufacturer's website that would work. I did not mention it previously because it was not really important, as I had decided that 8.1 was a loser before I realized I had driver problems.
The OS is not an application. The OS loads applications.
which is why it boots to a screen which is simply a grid of application icons, simple.
Which is not what the user wants. Simple.
Windows 8/8.1 under the hood is better than Windows 7 under the hood.
Under the hood, don't care. The things for which I use a PC are about as far away as one can get from doing OS benchmarks. The only reason I'm not still using XP is because I needed to allocate more than 4 gigs of memory. 7 is fine. There's nothing in 8 that warrants having to screw with it.
8.1 allows you to boot directly to desktop, disable the hot corners, go directly to all apps when you press Winkey and use your wallpaper as the background for the start screen. No third party software needed.
And sticking with Windows 7 means I don't have to google how to boot directly to desktop or disable hot corners, and I have a real start menu that I don't have to download, install,and configure myself, and I don't ever, ever have to look at that stupid start screen. Bonus.
I understand, for OS junkies, making 8 behave is a challenge. I just want to get my work done. That is, after all, what PCs are for. The OS is not an application. The OS loads applications.
Ok, so, I'll tell you what -- if Microsoft makes a version that works exactly like 7 right out of the box, with no registry changes or chasing after obscure check boxes, but is "better under the hood", I might consider it. I upgraded 8.0 to 8.1 on a laptop, and it looked and behaved exactly like 8.0. The only difference was the fake start button that takes you to that stupid start screen. At that point, it was time to do a system restore to 7. And 7 is where I'll stay. There's no reason to upgrade, really, and a lot of reasons not to.
Aren't windows 8 and 8.1 the same thing?
Right. Windows 8 is for people who haven't yet figured out the cabalistic hand gestures necessary to invoke Windows Marketplace and do the free upgrade. It's really the same OS.
Right. Because "enterprise" hasn't stuck with XP and all the little warts and moles that it has brought with it for nearly 14 years now... They'll jump ship ASAP because Win7 just won't suit.... Yeah... You keep thinking that.
As short as your post is it's lacking everything but "This is teh year of Linuxxx!!!!!11111!!!!onehunderedeleven!!HERP!!!"
I'm sorry I'm not parsing this. Some companies are starting to migrate to 7, some are sticking with XP, but I don't know any companies that aren't actually doing Win8 development that have plans to upgrade to Win8. In fact, what I'm seeing is execs driving Apple on the desktop, in the briefcase and in the pocket. My company is over 30% Apple and growing, partly because the execs like the interface and partly due to the perception that Microsoft is currently rudderless and may not have an enterprise-suitable desktop again for years. With 8.1 they've decided to double down, and the next release it looks like they're doubling down again, as if we're somehow going to just get used to having a big blotchy GUI on KVM machines and stop complaining about it.
I know I know, you always buy Microsoft because of Office. That's not really true anymore either. Enterprise analytics tools, which are more important to execs than Excel, are available on ipad, and just starting to become available on Android, and aren't really supported on Microsoft tablets, except to the extent you can slog through your work using touch equivalents for the motions of a three button mouse, because there is no market for Metro support.
I just came back from a conference that used to be all Microsoft. This year all the presentations used Mac/Airport, and the great majority of attendees were also on macs or ipads. The whole week I saw one Surface.
Enterprise will leverage XP and 7 for as long as practical, but they're going to look for other solutions. But I think the linux-on-the-desktop crew will continue to be disappointed, unless Android counts. The point really is that Microsoft's choices are already affecting enterprise business, in ways that will slowly become apparent. Businesses are losing confidence in Microsoft being able to offer a viable business solution. There's no scrabbling to replace currently working solutions, but there is a push towards looking at non-Microsoft solutions going forward. It doesn't mean we're approaching "the year of Linux", that ship has sailed. What it means is that we're approaching the year of not-Microsoft, whatever that turns out to be.
I have no love for Win 8's UI. But Classic Shell to the rescue. My current system has the best of both worlds. Win 7 UI, Win 8 OS under the hood (which does have some nice improvements).
We found an easier solution. Press F9 on boot, choose system recovery. After about 40 minutes, we have Windows 7 UI, and Windows 7 OS under the hood. Don't have to mess around with the Windows Marketplace, we don't have to worry about third party tools to make the OS usable, ain't no "hot corners" or "charms bars" and it doesn't go full screen at random frakking times. The Windows 8 Pro box goes back on the shelf until some future update where perhaps Microsoft gets their collective head out of their collective ass.
"When Cars Go Driverless, What Happens To the Honking?"
Honking will be automatic, of course.
I would blame public schools, but that's too easy a target.
Have we not been repeatedly assured by the UN and the US government that our bestie friend China is a paragon of environmental awareness? Don't all the charts show China with a lower carbon footprint than Switzerland? Surely the pollution must be the US's own being recirculated. After being partially cleansed by the pristine skies of China, of course. /sarcasm
I'm pretty sure Al Gore said at one time that China was on the cutting edge of environmental awareness. With a little time, I could probably find the sound bite.
There's this concept called "low hanging fruit". Google "china" and "ecological disaster".
But ... but.. then companies wouldn't make as much MONEY. The whole idea of outsourcing to China (or nearly anywhere, really) is that you can leverage slave wages and a total lack of pollution standards. Without those factors, the business model breaks down.
That's brilliant. By the time they would have gotten to "ham[...]" they will have broken into enough accounts to retire, and won't bother with yours.
> "So the strength of a password does not come from what it is, and in particular does not come from its length. The password length has no direct relation to password security. What makes a password strong is its randomness;"
This string would make a good password.
Pas_wd01, Pas_wd02, Pas_wd03...
When you get to 99, you've probably exceeded the system's old password memory and can start over with 01. Or put the number in front of the string. And then in the middle.
> The downside of that is really nasty passwords, with changes of case, numbers and symbols end up written on Post-it notes and stuck on the fronts of computers.
Or under keyboards. And that's the natural outcome of unreasonable password expiration schedules.
One place I worked, all passwords were kept on the mainframe (racf, I think) and had to be combinations of cap and lower case letters, numbers and at least one special character, rotated on the first of every month, could never be reused, and could not be written down on pain of termination.
Someone discovered empirically that "Pas(2 digit month)/(2 digit year) met all the criteria, so thereafter we all used Pas11/98, Pas12/98, Pas01/99 and so forth. Very easy to remember, met all the criteria, and wouldn't repeat for a long time. To my knowledge, they're still doing it.
As someone once said, life finds a way.
That's what we need on Google Maps, a rat overlay. It'd look like the traffic overlay, except red would indicate a significant likelihood of being eaten.
Just kidding.
Browse master! Thank you! That's what it was. You know, he probably ended up being a decent MCSE later, having had his share of beating himself up.