I'm speaking about normal people who account for most tablet computer sales. Slashdot readers may find the RIM Playbook / Windows Surface / Kindle Fire / other Android tablet to be have a more compelling software library and that will make those tablets a better buy.
I have both iOS and Android devices in my house and the holes in the Android library (for normal users) are slowly being filled, but app quality still lags. For now, I still can't recommend anything other than an iPad to people who ask me what they should get.
What measure of performance are you interested in? Whetstone? Dhrystone? Linpack?
Does anything other than the software library really matter? Assuming it hits the same $200 price point that Google and Amazon have hit, then the iPad wins hands-down.
I ordered a Nexus 7 because, at $200, I'm not risking much. If the iPad Mini comes in at $200, it will easily own the 7" market.
This would make sense if the phone makers and carriers had any history of innovation. The reason Apple was able to totally disrupt the market is because nobody was really trying anything. Now, with Android being wide open, the carriers lock the phones down and pre-load crapware like Blockbuster and Nascar apps.
Carriers want to sell $3 ringtones and $0.25 text messages. In their view (which extends to the end of the current quarter), disrupting their current business is only harmful to their bottom line.
bash is almost as good as powershell, but if free is important (and it is), then it might be better.
Windows 8 Server edition can be configured to run without a GUI, only powershell. I think this is the first version of Windows that didn't force a GUI.
I would too. I think that is actually more than what the price difference would be.
Apple once said that if they made the iPhone in the US, it would $40 more per handset. The problem with building stuff in the US isn't the cost of labor, it's manufacturing flexibility and supply chain issues.
I think he was suggesting that a 7" tablet made in the US would be $299 and was asking if people would be willing to pay that just because it's made in America.
Flash was never suitable for phones because it is a major battery hog. Fixing the problem would mean shifting development from low-bid contractors to people who actually know what they are doing and that's very expensive. Adobe needs to earn money for their shareholders, so they really have no other choice.
IOW, the problem wasn't in the tech world, it was in the business world. Adobe made development decisions on how they would affect next quarter and the result was a product with no long-term future.
I would be careful about feeling too superior in the Linux world (I have a foot in both worlds). One of the first things I used to do when setting up a new Windows machine was installing Cygwin to get a bash shell, then complaining about needing to do that. These days I find myself wishing our Linux server had PowerShell.
On my Ubuntu laptop, I believe I am one of 4 satisfied users of Unity. The big reason is that the 'pinned' tasks in Unity can also be activate with win-#.
Frankly, I don't really get excited about the operating system or window manager these days because any OS from the past decade is more or less the same works well enough for me.
I pin a bunch of stuff. I love that I can then use win-1, win-2, etc... to launch the pinned apps. The Windows 7 UI is one of the most keyboard friendly UI's I've used.
Try starting something cool, build a bit of a following, then have a lawyer contact you with the news that a larger company is interested in acquiring you. Sounds good, right? Maybe not.
So you call up the lawyer and find out that the offer is insultingly small and comes with a catch. If you don't accept it, they are going to start suing you for all the bullshit patents you are violating. You are small, have nothing to fight back with, so what do you do?
Yammer isn't entirely free. It isn't hard to see how the business might be worth considerably more than $30 / user. If their revenues are in the hundred million ballpark, I think it might be a solid buy.
Exactly. Microsoft could build something like this easily. The hard part is signing up companies.
I'm shocked that there are 80,000 companies actively using it though. That seems absurdly high to me, especially since I've never talked to anybody who has anything more flattering than "meh" to say about Yammer.
Who chooses a technology because it doesn't suck? What are the positive qualities of AIR and how do they compare with competing technologies.
Some of the reasons you listed are valid though, especially "made by Adobe" (ie security concerns) and it's "like Flash" (ie not available on important platforms and is inefficient from a power consumption point of view).
I would also rephrase your last complaint to be "it's not a technology that I'm familiar with and I can get the job done on time with something that I already know well".
I was responding to the claim that Windows 8 tablets will succeed where Windows 7 tablets failed because the hardware will be better.
If you are arguing that any current Windows tablet is inferior than an iPad for business use because the user experience on an iPad is superior (even in a corporate setting), I would agree with you.
The Samsung Windows 7 tablet comes with a Core i5 CPU. That's plenty of horsepower for the kinds of things people do on tablets and still nobody is buying them. For a business user, it should be a no-brainer to pick one of these over the iPad, but that isn't happening.
So, if the next generation is going to be significantly different, Metro must have something special and I don't see what that is. Maybe it's marketing? Is it that PC hardware is going to stop feeling cheap and disposable? The ARM tablets will have better battery life, but I would be shocked if they have 75% of the runtime that an iPad has. iOS was designed with low power consumption in mind, Windows was not. Retrofitting low-power may be as difficult as retrofitting security (and to Microsoft's credit, they have made great progress in securing Windows).
I think it really does have to come down to marketing - both to developers and end-users. By creating this confusing split with Windows 8 / Windows RT and the mix of Metro and traditional desktop, it shows they still don't have a clue when it comes to marketing to either developers or consumers.
they may be able to make some inroads in the business market with the higher-end device
What's the problem then with the current generation of Windows 7 tablets? Is Metro really better for business than Aero? I can think of a bunch of compelling reasons for using Windows 7 in a corporation over iOS, but in reality they aren't compelling enough. I don't see how Metro changes the equation.
Cheap hardware will sell the first generation of devices very well. If the software isn't there though, it's pretty tough to sell the next generation of devices. So far, the Android tablet experience hasn't met expectations and I suspect this is why Google decided to sell a reference device.
Without Apple's supply chain, it's going to be very difficult for any Android tablet maker to compete. I think the tablet market could very well end up looking like the phone market where Apple has small market share, but huge profit share.
Doesn't it make sense for them to produce a reference device? At $200 they aren't being very aggressive on pricing so it shouldn't make their partners all that nervous.
We bought our kids an iPod Touch instead of a Nintendo 3DS last Christmas and it was a good decision. The iPod has lots and lots of free and very cheap games and no cartridges to lose or break. Plus the iPod does a lot more. If you want to play Mario, you have to buy Nintendo's hardware, otherwise I think there are much better alternatives out there, especially for children.
Up until that point, we have been spending lots of money on Nintendo stuff. Since then, nothing.
As much as people like to complain about Apple's tightly controlled environment, they are anarchists compared to Nintendo.
Slashdot Mirror
I'm speaking about normal people who account for most tablet computer sales. Slashdot readers may find the RIM Playbook / Windows Surface / Kindle Fire / other Android tablet to be have a more compelling software library and that will make those tablets a better buy.
I have both iOS and Android devices in my house and the holes in the Android library (for normal users) are slowly being filled, but app quality still lags. For now, I still can't recommend anything other than an iPad to people who ask me what they should get.
What measure of performance are you interested in? Whetstone? Dhrystone? Linpack?
Does anything other than the software library really matter? Assuming it hits the same $200 price point that Google and Amazon have hit, then the iPad wins hands-down.
I ordered a Nexus 7 because, at $200, I'm not risking much. If the iPad Mini comes in at $200, it will easily own the 7" market.
This would make sense if the phone makers and carriers had any history of innovation. The reason Apple was able to totally disrupt the market is because nobody was really trying anything. Now, with Android being wide open, the carriers lock the phones down and pre-load crapware like Blockbuster and Nascar apps.
Carriers want to sell $3 ringtones and $0.25 text messages. In their view (which extends to the end of the current quarter), disrupting their current business is only harmful to their bottom line.
x86 tablets have been for sale for 10 years now. Why are the new ones more exciting than the ones already on the market?
bash is almost as good as powershell, but if free is important (and it is), then it might be better.
Windows 8 Server edition can be configured to run without a GUI, only powershell. I think this is the first version of Windows that didn't force a GUI.
I would too. I think that is actually more than what the price difference would be.
Apple once said that if they made the iPhone in the US, it would $40 more per handset. The problem with building stuff in the US isn't the cost of labor, it's manufacturing flexibility and supply chain issues.
I think he was suggesting that a 7" tablet made in the US would be $299 and was asking if people would be willing to pay that just because it's made in America.
Flash was never suitable for phones because it is a major battery hog. Fixing the problem would mean shifting development from low-bid contractors to people who actually know what they are doing and that's very expensive. Adobe needs to earn money for their shareholders, so they really have no other choice.
IOW, the problem wasn't in the tech world, it was in the business world. Adobe made development decisions on how they would affect next quarter and the result was a product with no long-term future.
This is an easy one to answer: because it isn't profitable and it's pretty clear that it will be even less so in the future.
I would be careful about feeling too superior in the Linux world (I have a foot in both worlds). One of the first things I used to do when setting up a new Windows machine was installing Cygwin to get a bash shell, then complaining about needing to do that. These days I find myself wishing our Linux server had PowerShell.
On my Ubuntu laptop, I believe I am one of 4 satisfied users of Unity. The big reason is that the 'pinned' tasks in Unity can also be activate with win-#.
Frankly, I don't really get excited about the operating system or window manager these days because any OS from the past decade is more or less the same works well enough for me.
I pin a bunch of stuff. I love that I can then use win-1, win-2, etc... to launch the pinned apps. The Windows 7 UI is one of the most keyboard friendly UI's I've used.
It can get a lot more depressing than that.
Try starting something cool, build a bit of a following, then have a lawyer contact you with the news that a larger company is interested in acquiring you. Sounds good, right? Maybe not.
So you call up the lawyer and find out that the offer is insultingly small and comes with a catch. If you don't accept it, they are going to start suing you for all the bullshit patents you are violating. You are small, have nothing to fight back with, so what do you do?
Yammer isn't entirely free. It isn't hard to see how the business might be worth considerably more than $30 / user. If their revenues are in the hundred million ballpark, I think it might be a solid buy.
It's $30 per user, right? That doesn't seem that crazy to me. How would you evaluate the value of something like Yammer?
Exactly. Microsoft could build something like this easily. The hard part is signing up companies.
I'm shocked that there are 80,000 companies actively using it though. That seems absurdly high to me, especially since I've never talked to anybody who has anything more flattering than "meh" to say about Yammer.
Who chooses a technology because it doesn't suck? What are the positive qualities of AIR and how do they compare with competing technologies.
Some of the reasons you listed are valid though, especially "made by Adobe" (ie security concerns) and it's "like Flash" (ie not available on important platforms and is inefficient from a power consumption point of view).
I would also rephrase your last complaint to be "it's not a technology that I'm familiar with and I can get the job done on time with something that I already know well".
Do you think Windows 8 will drastically change the landscape?
I was responding to the claim that Windows 8 tablets will succeed where Windows 7 tablets failed because the hardware will be better.
If you are arguing that any current Windows tablet is inferior than an iPad for business use because the user experience on an iPad is superior (even in a corporate setting), I would agree with you.
The Samsung Windows 7 tablet comes with a Core i5 CPU. That's plenty of horsepower for the kinds of things people do on tablets and still nobody is buying them. For a business user, it should be a no-brainer to pick one of these over the iPad, but that isn't happening.
So, if the next generation is going to be significantly different, Metro must have something special and I don't see what that is. Maybe it's marketing? Is it that PC hardware is going to stop feeling cheap and disposable? The ARM tablets will have better battery life, but I would be shocked if they have 75% of the runtime that an iPad has. iOS was designed with low power consumption in mind, Windows was not. Retrofitting low-power may be as difficult as retrofitting security (and to Microsoft's credit, they have made great progress in securing Windows).
I think it really does have to come down to marketing - both to developers and end-users. By creating this confusing split with Windows 8 / Windows RT and the mix of Metro and traditional desktop, it shows they still don't have a clue when it comes to marketing to either developers or consumers.
What's the problem then with the current generation of Windows 7 tablets? Is Metro really better for business than Aero? I can think of a bunch of compelling reasons for using Windows 7 in a corporation over iOS, but in reality they aren't compelling enough. I don't see how Metro changes the equation.
I would go where the profits are.
Cheap hardware will sell the first generation of devices very well. If the software isn't there though, it's pretty tough to sell the next generation of devices. So far, the Android tablet experience hasn't met expectations and I suspect this is why Google decided to sell a reference device.
Without Apple's supply chain, it's going to be very difficult for any Android tablet maker to compete. I think the tablet market could very well end up looking like the phone market where Apple has small market share, but huge profit share.
Doesn't it make sense for them to produce a reference device? At $200 they aren't being very aggressive on pricing so it shouldn't make their partners all that nervous.
We bought our kids an iPod Touch instead of a Nintendo 3DS last Christmas and it was a good decision. The iPod has lots and lots of free and very cheap games and no cartridges to lose or break. Plus the iPod does a lot more. If you want to play Mario, you have to buy Nintendo's hardware, otherwise I think there are much better alternatives out there, especially for children.
Up until that point, we have been spending lots of money on Nintendo stuff. Since then, nothing.
As much as people like to complain about Apple's tightly controlled environment, they are anarchists compared to Nintendo.
Back in March GM suspended production of the Volt and blamed poor sales.
I don't think I would ever buy one a Volt or Leaf. I would consider leasing one though.
I'm guessing analog control use more on-board power.