And how is that any different from a spam folder on Gmail, Yahoo, Hotmail, etc? Or using Adblock? Or any other measure that accomplishes the same thing?
I didn't imply it was different. I ignore both equally. You seemed to be implying that loading every mailbox in the nation with 'tons of shit' was a bad thing. Not if you ignore it.
That's for internet advertising. Google does no print advertising, which loads every mailbox in the nation with tons of shit. Considering the amount of people that use their real names, you don't think they'll sell all that data they collect on you to print advertisers for targeted mailing?
What's a mailbox? I don't have a single bill that shows up in my mailbox. It's all paid online. Anything that shows up in the USPS box just gets chucked into the burn barrel. (Unless it's a package shipped by one of the few companies that charges $1 to ship via USPS from clear across the US--but that's rare.)
To save myself time, I've been thinking about replacing my mailbox with an always-on burn barrel--maybe using a propane barbecue bottle to supply it. Maybe the USPS would finally get the hint. Anything 'important' needs a signature and the mail carrier knocks on the door.
Under no circumstances should you expect to receive any forwarded mail without someone having read it.
This holds for any email on any system. Use PGP.
The number of companies out there that have a 'preferences' page with a space for my public key is astounding. Every single e-mail I get from them is encrypted...er...wait. Welcome back to the real world. Unless it's something that happens automatically (so your mother and grandmother don't have to figure it out) it won't happen.
In other news, a new bill has been introduced that exempts political candidates from using copyrighted works in their political ads. This will join the existing bill that exempts the idiots from telemarketing rules so they can call you whenever the hell they want with a recorded message asking for your vote. (Because I form all my political judgments from 30-second pre-recorded phone calls...)
WTF is this "bias crime" shit? The first amendment protects your right to post GNAA trolls or any damned other dusgusting thing.
Yup. Most people forget that the first amendment isn't there to protect popular speech. If we all agreed and thought something was popular, there'd be no reason to protect it--no one would be trying to get rid of it. It's there to protect unpopular speech--the stuff that needs protecting.
That's not to say you can't personally refuse to do business with someone who holds those beliefs...
Administrators and users who use a shell will just love you for picking longer extensions.:)
Hello, tab completion.
Yeah--because that works *so* well in Microsoft<tab>Microsoft ActiveSync<tab>Microsoft FrontPage<tab>Microsoft Internet Explorer<tab>Microsoft Office<tab>Microsoft Silverlight<tab>Microsoft Visual Studio<tab>Microsoft.NET<tab>Microsoft Windows. Aah--there we go.
Compression comes into handy for dealing with directories full of log files.
Mount your log directories from a Linux Samba server with 'fusecompress'.
File level encryption is useful for volumes where BitLocker can't be used.
So is a Linux Samba server with 'encfs'.
Sparse files are extremely useful.
There are a lot of file systems in Linux that support sparse files... It's actually sorta difficult to find a filesystem that doesn't support it.
As for quotas, unless they have another layer for warning/enforcement, how will places keep users from filling up their home directories?
A Linux Samba server can enforce quotas. You can also be super geeky and store home directories on their own partition--so if they fill up, your mail server doesn't die horribly like Exchange does...
I'm hoping ReFS is up to ZFS with needed features, such as deduplication, encryption, an analog of RAID-Z, the filesystem working with the LVM layer (or even replacing it), and so on. Otherwise, people will just shrug and keep NTFS as their default fs of choice because it has been around for so long.
I shrugged and ditched Windows over a decade ago. Haven't missed NTFS yet.;)
Also, you already know csvtools for linux. If you didn't, your barrier to entry for that is the same, whether you are on windows or linux.
I disagree. I didn't know csvtools for linux. I litterally typed 'apt-cache search csv tool' and found a file called 'csvtool'. I installed it, ran 'man csvtool' and had it figured out in about 10 seconds. You simply can't do that on Windows at the moment. Package management on Windows is pretty much doing a Google search and looking for possible options which you may or may not have to pay big bucks for. Then you manually download the tool, run any one of a number of varied installers (Windows Installer? InstallShield? Old VB6-style installer, Nullsoft Installer? etc... Most of which you have to do lots of digging to automate.) Then you run the tool and start hunting around through usually sub-standard help files until you find the program may or may not do what you need.
Like I say, we teach, and value both. But MS decided with one release that history grads who've been made into IT guys should be able to run the server, and now they're changing their minds. Which is my complaint, not that CLI is particularly bad, only that it's bad relative to the product they've been trying to sell. No more than I would want to have to use a CLI on my PS3 to start games.
I think the root of the problem is that you can't teach what it takes to be a good admin. (Sorta like the BOFH 'Admin Gene') I work with plenty of techs who punch in at 8 and out at 5--they go home and could care less about computers. But I am fortunate enough to work with a select few who pretty much to IT 24/7--not because of a paycheck or the boss telling them to, but because they LOVE what they do. When a new technology or piece of software comes out, they're the ones downloading it at home and playing with it until they know everything about it. That can't be taught. And it usually leads to someone running Linux at home. Consequently those Linux admins have more 'deep' knowledge than their Windows counterparts who just punch the clock and don't really care.
Alas, your assertion that the 1% of linux users are more qualified in anything is, without a single exception in my experience, false. They know nothing about POP3/SMTP, IMAP or how to program particularly, actually the windows guys have a lot of better programmers, because they've worked as programmers in a lot of cases (usually in java these days). But either way, the linux guys come in feeling themselves some how superior because they use linux. Then they get 60's because they don't know the rest of that stuff, but have heard the words before and don't know that they don't really know anything about the technology, and then they get their asses handed to them when we want a serious project done, because they are 'computer guys' and use linux.
I know your story and my story are completely anecdotal, but it's entirely opposite for me. I worked on a team with 15 Windows admins and 5 Linux admins. One Windows admin had the 'IT personality' where he was constantly learning and reading about new stuff, trying new technologies, and playing with stuff to make sure he knew how to break and fix it. 4 of the Linux admins were that way. The 5th I never really interacted with and can't say either way. The 14 other 'Windows admins' knew how to install Windows, IIS and SQL and what steps to perform to do things like connect to an iscsi disk. When there were 'cgi' errors, the Windows admins were clueless. The Linux admins had all dealt with CGI intimately on Linux and were quickly able to diagnose and fix the issue in Windows.
My favorite was dealing with Linux mail servers (Postfix usually) vs Exchange. Someone would have delivery problems and the Linux guys would have an answer in less than 60 seconds. The Windows guy would RDP into the Exchange server, dig through the logs, and find exactly no helpful information on why the message was dropped. (What's a 5.17.33 error in Exchange verses I know what "450 4.7.1 Client host rejected: cannot find your hostname" is in Postfix)
This is university not IT tradeschool college. Those guys, who actually spend 12 months learning linux sysadmining, do in 12 months what we do in 3 hours.
What is it exactly that takes 3 hours in Windows that takes 12 months in Linux? Are you talking about the difference between learning how to point-and-click and calling yourself an 'admin' verses actually learning how to be a good admin regardless of platform?
And our guys are better at it after 3 hours than they were after 12 months. I've trained both, I gave up on the college IT kids. In the US this is probably different, because there's a different gap between tradeschools and Universities than there is here.
I have done all of those things on windows btw (hex dumps, sed, which actually has a windows version, and csv modifying).
I'm not saying it can't be done on Windows--just that it's more difficult. I had to type 'apt-get install csvtool' and wait 4 seconds. In Windows I have to...uh...spend a few hundred on Office? Is there something like csvtool for Windows? Google for a while? Meh. Pass.
Yeah--I know there's a 'sed' for Windows. I'm sure there's a native binary *and* I could install it using (ugh!) cygwin. Pass. I'll use the OS where this type of functionality isn't a afterthought.
Just because you know the linux versions doesn't mean there aren't other ways to accomplish it. Which goes to my 'thinking you're elite because you use Linux, problem. If you don't know what the tools are, you're doomed, if you don't know how to diagnose the problem, you're equally doomed. That applies regardless of OS.
Agreed. The 'elitist' view comes in all three platforms--Mac, Windows, and Linux. But there are differences. Mac elitists are usually because they paid more for the OS and they think anything Steve puts out will always be better than anything else. Windows elitists are usually loaded-to-the-gills
or they'll just keep using the old version indefinitely, and we know how well that's worked with IE6.
What new features does it add: Well, I don't have a GUI, so I don't know. I guess we won't upgrade then.
No one is going to pay hundreds or thousands of dollars in an MCSE course when they can just use the old version.
True.
I know a guy who uses a combination of SAS and Crystal to do business reports. Rather than pay the tens of thousands of dollars to get the new software, he literally fires up a VM of Windows 2000, sets the date back on his clock (to avoid licensing crap) and starts the app--then he sets the clock back to the normal time and generates reports. I asked him what his plan was when Windows 2000 wasn't supported and/or his old software wouldn't talk to newer versions of the database server. He said he wasn't worried about it. (Do you really think SQL 2015 is going to come with libraries for a 15 year old OS?)
So the path to making better software is to make it more obfuscated and less user friendly? Making it easier for those poor dudes is what MS has been doing for 20 years, and why they finally made some inroads into the market.
Or read a different way, the path to having a more powerful, secure, stable, and easy to manage server is to actually have people that know how to admin a server--Windows or Linux.
I run into 'Windows Admins' all the time who only know a few point-and-click things. The moment stuff breaks they are clueless. Every time I run into a Linux admin, they know their shit *and* they know how to properly admin a Windows server. (Or if they haven't touched Windows in years or decades, they will be frustrated but they can figure out the problem because they grok *how* shit works because Linux doesn't abstract them from it.)
This is not a bash on truly good Windows admins--there are lots out there, but they cost a lot, just like good Linux admins. Microsoft has simply created a market for low-cost morons who can call themselves 'admins', but they really aren't. I have several friends who are 'web designers' because they bought Microsoft Front Page. There isn't a chance in hell they could design a 'Web 2.0' style site. HTML5 is just a confusing bunch of characters ending with a number to them.
If Microsoft's change eliminates the short-bus admins, good. I can spend less time going in a fixing their crappy mistakes when companies realize their mistake and scream for help, and I can start working on 'fun' projects to help automate and reduce monotony for other employees.
20 years old today have no clue how to use a command line unless they are from the 1% of users that have a linux desktop at home.
And that 1% are probably more qualified to admin a Linux or Windows server than the remaining 99% who only know point-and-click. They probably also know a lot more about 'advanced' things like how TCP/IP works, they understand a lot of the protocols like POP3/SMTP/IMAP, HTTP, or even understand how to debug a program that's crashing, etc...
These are kids in physics, math, biochem, and they didn't know how to make a directory without a GUI. Admittedly, that's why we're teaching them the CLI stuff. But they won't use it.
I had an IT colleague a few years back trying to work with a CSV file that had some strange embedded UNICODE characters in it. Excel was having problems reading the data. After several hours of dorking around with Excel, Notepad, and a few other GUI tools the file was handed to me--I used tools that aren't available on Windows (hexdump, sed, csvtool) and stripped the characters out, transformed the file to their requirements, and handed it back to him in about 4 minutes. I spent another 15 minutes automating the process of grabbing this automated CSV dump from a Windows app, doing the stripping and conversion, and then e-mailing the results. He wasted *hours* because he--apparently like your students--didn't think the CLI was valuable and GUI tools would solve his problem.
This person now has something like 30 minutes free *every day* where he can work on stuff that will earn the company money instead of dorking around with Windows failures.
The traditional approach was to remote into each one and make those changes through IIS Admin in the GUI. Now Microsoft wants you to push the change to all 100 servers at once with Powershell.
Yeah--the PowerShell route was pretty obvious when they completely hosed the IIS GUI in Windows 2008. It's a combination of a bad cheap hosting platform web control panel and adding so many different clicks that learning PowerShell seems easy by comparison.
I'm thinking of things more like hardware. In order to configure a Dialogic card on a server you need to use the GUI. You cannot configure the card, run the testing utilities, etc without the GUI
I configured my Digium card on *Linux* without a GUI. It was real easy: I plugged the card in. Things were autodetected and worked automatically. If I wanted to change the numbering or port usage on the card, I edited a text file--but it wasn't necessary.
Think more of things like backup software with a GUI interface, or antivirus.
The new Windows 2008 backup pretty much requires the following settings: where to back up, when to back up
Everything gets backed up.
AntiVirus shouldn't need to be configured either--it's been ages since you've had to exclude the Exchange 'm' drive. Why exclude anything else--that's just where the virus writers will strike next. Maybe you need to configure a few things like when to run a full system scan--but most AV products are web-based now. Symantec uses a bloated Java and Apache-based abomination and CA uses something similar except it's almost completely unusable due to bad design and totally useless due to shitty reports. (It's so bad they offered free remote install and config when a client purchased it)
Easy enough fix for every fscking application developer on the planet. Tweak your requirements list:
* SQL Server
* 9 TB memory so you can run SQL comfortably
* IIS
* AntiVirus
* The Windows GUI installed
* Office if you like editing stuff using Word
* Every single version of the.NET framework and all their security patches (hahaha, have fun rebooting)
* An internet connection to our licensing service that will occasionally lock you out even though you paid a huge wad of cache for our app
In other words, the GUI is optional but every program in the Windows ecosystem will require it.
Please no, programs can actually be quite complicated. They aren't like web servers which you configure and leave running. Making them GUI-less will just complicate things and make it much harder to use. There's a reason we use GUI's now a days - it's better for some stuff.
How easy is it to deploy SharePoint automatically? How easy is it to automate the configuration and setup of new SharePoint servers? There are a few tools in the Windows world to automate clicks on various GUI elements...
In Linux, I can deploy complex database sites with a few lines of code in a fab file, or maybe a preseeded dpkg, or maybe bash scripts, or maybe a GET request with a few parameters to generate a config file for the specific server, or I can easily image the server and blow it to all the boxes I need, or...
I'll take the CLI way. Yeah--it might be a bit more painful to edit a TEXT file to configure a service instead of clicking the mouse--but if all you know is the security of point-and-click, maybe you shouldn't be a server admin...
Please name one scenario where point and click is a better way to configure your server than something like a text file or a scriptable CLI.
Yeah--it's pretty much Dr. Claw and his cat trying to wreak havoc on the world using an ineptly trained group of henchmen. Last time I checked they were pretty ineffectual thanks to Penny and Brain.
Blind hatred aside, what makes you think they are?
Really makes you wonder how in the world MS is posting record profits, when they're apparently paying everyone and their mother to use their products.
Wasn't there something during 2011 about Nokia and a burning oil platform--and just when everyone got excited and thought they were going to say 'Android', they said 'Microsoft'. Then their stock tanked. Then it came out that Microsoft paid them billions to continue standing on that burning platform?
XEROX...Windows Server 2003
The U.S.' LARGEST STOCK EXCHANGE...Windows Server 2003
FUJIFILM GROUP...Windows Server 2003
HILTON HOTELS...Windows Server 2003
MEDITERRANEAN SHIPPING COMPANY...Windows Server 2003
SWISS INTERNATIONAL AIRLINES...Windows Server 2003
UNILEVER...Windows Server 2003
MOTOROLA...Windows Server 2003 & SQLServer 2005
NISSAN...Uses Windows Server 2003...and Exchange Server 2003
TOYOTA MOTOR SALES...using Windows Server 2003
DELL COMPUTER...Windows Server 2003
HSBC...Windows Server 2003
RAYOVAC Chose Windows Server 2003
CONTINENTAL AIRLINES...Windows Server 2008
7 ELEVEN STORES...Windows Server 2003
STATE OF ILLINOIS GOVERNMENT...Windows Server 2003
REGAL ENTERTAINMENT GROUP...Switching to Windows Server 2003 + Windows "Embedded"
CARNIVAL CRUISE LINES...Manages 1,000 shipboard &Windows Server 2003 & Server (every boat needs an anchor, right?
STARBUCKS...Windows Server 2003 Active Directory
RADIOSHACK...Windows Server 2003
TOMMY HILFIGER...Windows Server 2003
NcSOFT...Windows Server 2003
TDC...Windows Server 2003
GAMEWORKS...using Windows Server 2003M
SHOP DIRECT...intends to migrate no less than 350 servers from Windows Server 2003 to Windows Server 2008 R2
It gives me such a warm feeling to see that 'SHOP DIRECT' has finally saved enough to upgrade 350 of their servers. Give them another decade on their remaining Windows 2003 boxes and they might be able to save enough to finish the project...
And 'bravo' to the two other companies that could finally afford to upgrade to Windows 2008 by firing a bunch of IT staff to pay for licenses to upgrade to Windows 2008 (which is already 4 years out of date).
For everyone else who is stuck on Windows 2003 because of costs or the fact that 15 year old corporate applications won't run under anything but IE6 and Windows XP--well, you're going to have to pay to re-write the apps anyways, you might as well consider re-writing them as a web-based app that can run from a much cheaper Linux-based server. If you still feel the need to get screwed by licensing fees, you can always purchase support from Red Hat, Canonical, etc... Or just send me a dump truck filled with cash...
Between a custom HOSTS file, & using "filtering" DNS servers (that specialize in blocking out malicious script & malware serving domains + phishing/spamming ones)?
Can you please tell me how to modify my HOSTS file to block your stupid use of the bold tag? Fsck.
We're one, dental office, 9 employees and struggling not to lay anyone off.
It doesn't help that Patterson Eaglesoft and Dentrix both were saying "Stay Away" when it came to Windows Vista and higher. Patterson *just* released their new version of Eaglesoft which *finally* has been approved to run on Windows Vista/7 and Windows 2008 Server. (Of course this is several years after they promised a web-based version would be available...)
Slashdot Mirror
And how is that any different from a spam folder on Gmail, Yahoo, Hotmail, etc? Or using Adblock? Or any other measure that accomplishes the same thing?
I didn't imply it was different. I ignore both equally. You seemed to be implying that loading every mailbox in the nation with 'tons of shit' was a bad thing. Not if you ignore it.
That's for internet advertising. Google does no print advertising, which loads every mailbox in the nation with tons of shit. Considering the amount of people that use their real names, you don't think they'll sell all that data they collect on you to print advertisers for targeted mailing?
What's a mailbox? I don't have a single bill that shows up in my mailbox. It's all paid online. Anything that shows up in the USPS box just gets chucked into the burn barrel. (Unless it's a package shipped by one of the few companies that charges $1 to ship via USPS from clear across the US--but that's rare.)
To save myself time, I've been thinking about replacing my mailbox with an always-on burn barrel--maybe using a propane barbecue bottle to supply it. Maybe the USPS would finally get the hint. Anything 'important' needs a signature and the mail carrier knocks on the door.
This holds for any email on any system. Use PGP.
The number of companies out there that have a 'preferences' page with a space for my public key is astounding. Every single e-mail I get from them is encrypted...er...wait. Welcome back to the real world. Unless it's something that happens automatically (so your mother and grandmother don't have to figure it out) it won't happen.
Seriously--how many times can they show the same stupid clip of the screen being moved up?
And when I go to another country, my name and it's pronunciation doesn't change--so why it he saying 'zeddee net'? It's fscking 'zeedee net'.
when I need to fsck, I just call my girlfriend
Why? Do you not know how to use the command line?
In other news, a new bill has been introduced that exempts political candidates from using copyrighted works in their political ads. This will join the existing bill that exempts the idiots from telemarketing rules so they can call you whenever the hell they want with a recorded message asking for your vote. (Because I form all my political judgments from 30-second pre-recorded phone calls...)
Coincidence? Or does this remind you of a scheduled event per the Mayan Calendar anyone?
Hmm...let me check my Mayan calendar...
...hmm...Thursday I have that office party....and next Sunday is your mother's birthday....
uh...nope--no scheduled giant plasma cloud.
WTF is this "bias crime" shit? The first amendment protects your right to post GNAA trolls or any damned other dusgusting thing.
Yup. Most people forget that the first amendment isn't there to protect popular speech. If we all agreed and thought something was popular, there'd be no reason to protect it--no one would be trying to get rid of it. It's there to protect unpopular speech--the stuff that needs protecting.
That's not to say you can't personally refuse to do business with someone who holds those beliefs...
Hello, tab completion.
Yeah--because that works *so* well in Microsoft<tab>Microsoft ActiveSync<tab>Microsoft FrontPage<tab>Microsoft Internet Explorer<tab>Microsoft Office<tab>Microsoft Silverlight<tab>Microsoft Visual Studio<tab>Microsoft.NET<tab>Microsoft Windows. Aah--there we go.
Some of those features are actually useful:
Compression comes into handy for dealing with directories full of log files.
Mount your log directories from a Linux Samba server with 'fusecompress'.
File level encryption is useful for volumes where BitLocker can't be used.
So is a Linux Samba server with 'encfs'.
Sparse files are extremely useful.
There are a lot of file systems in Linux that support sparse files... It's actually sorta difficult to find a filesystem that doesn't support it.
As for quotas, unless they have another layer for warning/enforcement, how will places keep users from filling up their home directories?
A Linux Samba server can enforce quotas. You can also be super geeky and store home directories on their own partition--so if they fill up, your mail server doesn't die horribly like Exchange does...
I'm hoping ReFS is up to ZFS with needed features, such as deduplication, encryption, an analog of RAID-Z, the filesystem working with the LVM layer (or even replacing it), and so on. Otherwise, people will just shrug and keep NTFS as their default fs of choice because it has been around for so long.
I shrugged and ditched Windows over a decade ago. Haven't missed NTFS yet. ;)
Also, you already know csvtools for linux. If you didn't, your barrier to entry for that is the same, whether you are on windows or linux.
I disagree. I didn't know csvtools for linux. I litterally typed 'apt-cache search csv tool' and found a file called 'csvtool'. I installed it, ran 'man csvtool' and had it figured out in about 10 seconds. You simply can't do that on Windows at the moment. Package management on Windows is pretty much doing a Google search and looking for possible options which you may or may not have to pay big bucks for. Then you manually download the tool, run any one of a number of varied installers (Windows Installer? InstallShield? Old VB6-style installer, Nullsoft Installer? etc... Most of which you have to do lots of digging to automate.) Then you run the tool and start hunting around through usually sub-standard help files until you find the program may or may not do what you need.
Like I say, we teach, and value both. But MS decided with one release that history grads who've been made into IT guys should be able to run the server, and now they're changing their minds. Which is my complaint, not that CLI is particularly bad, only that it's bad relative to the product they've been trying to sell. No more than I would want to have to use a CLI on my PS3 to start games.
I think the root of the problem is that you can't teach what it takes to be a good admin. (Sorta like the BOFH 'Admin Gene') I work with plenty of techs who punch in at 8 and out at 5--they go home and could care less about computers. But I am fortunate enough to work with a select few who pretty much to IT 24/7--not because of a paycheck or the boss telling them to, but because they LOVE what they do. When a new technology or piece of software comes out, they're the ones downloading it at home and playing with it until they know everything about it. That can't be taught. And it usually leads to someone running Linux at home. Consequently those Linux admins have more 'deep' knowledge than their Windows counterparts who just punch the clock and don't really care.
Alas, your assertion that the 1% of linux users are more qualified in anything is, without a single exception in my experience, false. They know nothing about POP3/SMTP, IMAP or how to program particularly, actually the windows guys have a lot of better programmers, because they've worked as programmers in a lot of cases (usually in java these days). But either way, the linux guys come in feeling themselves some how superior because they use linux. Then they get 60's because they don't know the rest of that stuff, but have heard the words before and don't know that they don't really know anything about the technology, and then they get their asses handed to them when we want a serious project done, because they are 'computer guys' and use linux.
I know your story and my story are completely anecdotal, but it's entirely opposite for me. I worked on a team with 15 Windows admins and 5 Linux admins. One Windows admin had the 'IT personality' where he was constantly learning and reading about new stuff, trying new technologies, and playing with stuff to make sure he knew how to break and fix it. 4 of the Linux admins were that way. The 5th I never really interacted with and can't say either way. The 14 other 'Windows admins' knew how to install Windows, IIS and SQL and what steps to perform to do things like connect to an iscsi disk. When there were 'cgi' errors, the Windows admins were clueless. The Linux admins had all dealt with CGI intimately on Linux and were quickly able to diagnose and fix the issue in Windows.
My favorite was dealing with Linux mail servers (Postfix usually) vs Exchange. Someone would have delivery problems and the Linux guys would have an answer in less than 60 seconds. The Windows guy would RDP into the Exchange server, dig through the logs, and find exactly no helpful information on why the message was dropped. (What's a 5.17.33 error in Exchange verses I know what "450 4.7.1 Client host rejected: cannot find your hostname" is in Postfix)
This is university not IT tradeschool college. Those guys, who actually spend 12 months learning linux sysadmining, do in 12 months what we do in 3 hours.
What is it exactly that takes 3 hours in Windows that takes 12 months in Linux? Are you talking about the difference between learning how to point-and-click and calling yourself an 'admin' verses actually learning how to be a good admin regardless of platform?
And our guys are better at it after 3 hours than they were after 12 months. I've trained both, I gave up on the college IT kids. In the US this is probably different, because there's a different gap between tradeschools and Universities than there is here.
I have done all of those things on windows btw (hex dumps, sed, which actually has a windows version, and csv modifying).
I'm not saying it can't be done on Windows--just that it's more difficult. I had to type 'apt-get install csvtool' and wait 4 seconds. In Windows I have to...uh...spend a few hundred on Office? Is there something like csvtool for Windows? Google for a while? Meh. Pass.
Yeah--I know there's a 'sed' for Windows. I'm sure there's a native binary *and* I could install it using (ugh!) cygwin. Pass. I'll use the OS where this type of functionality isn't a afterthought.
Just because you know the linux versions doesn't mean there aren't other ways to accomplish it. Which goes to my 'thinking you're elite because you use Linux, problem. If you don't know what the tools are, you're doomed, if you don't know how to diagnose the problem, you're equally doomed. That applies regardless of OS.
Agreed. The 'elitist' view comes in all three platforms--Mac, Windows, and Linux. But there are differences. Mac elitists are usually because they paid more for the OS and they think anything Steve puts out will always be better than anything else. Windows elitists are usually loaded-to-the-gills
or they'll just keep using the old version indefinitely, and we know how well that's worked with IE6.
What new features does it add: Well, I don't have a GUI, so I don't know. I guess we won't upgrade then.
No one is going to pay hundreds or thousands of dollars in an MCSE course when they can just use the old version.
True.
I know a guy who uses a combination of SAS and Crystal to do business reports. Rather than pay the tens of thousands of dollars to get the new software, he literally fires up a VM of Windows 2000, sets the date back on his clock (to avoid licensing crap) and starts the app--then he sets the clock back to the normal time and generates reports. I asked him what his plan was when Windows 2000 wasn't supported and/or his old software wouldn't talk to newer versions of the database server. He said he wasn't worried about it. (Do you really think SQL 2015 is going to come with libraries for a 15 year old OS?)
So the path to making better software is to make it more obfuscated and less user friendly? Making it easier for those poor dudes is what MS has been doing for 20 years, and why they finally made some inroads into the market.
Or read a different way, the path to having a more powerful, secure, stable, and easy to manage server is to actually have people that know how to admin a server--Windows or Linux.
I run into 'Windows Admins' all the time who only know a few point-and-click things. The moment stuff breaks they are clueless. Every time I run into a Linux admin, they know their shit *and* they know how to properly admin a Windows server. (Or if they haven't touched Windows in years or decades, they will be frustrated but they can figure out the problem because they grok *how* shit works because Linux doesn't abstract them from it.)
This is not a bash on truly good Windows admins--there are lots out there, but they cost a lot, just like good Linux admins. Microsoft has simply created a market for low-cost morons who can call themselves 'admins', but they really aren't. I have several friends who are 'web designers' because they bought Microsoft Front Page. There isn't a chance in hell they could design a 'Web 2.0' style site. HTML5 is just a confusing bunch of characters ending with a number to them.
If Microsoft's change eliminates the short-bus admins, good. I can spend less time going in a fixing their crappy mistakes when companies realize their mistake and scream for help, and I can start working on 'fun' projects to help automate and reduce monotony for other employees.
20 years old today have no clue how to use a command line unless they are from the 1% of users that have a linux desktop at home.
And that 1% are probably more qualified to admin a Linux or Windows server than the remaining 99% who only know point-and-click. They probably also know a lot more about 'advanced' things like how TCP/IP works, they understand a lot of the protocols like POP3/SMTP/IMAP, HTTP, or even understand how to debug a program that's crashing, etc...
These are kids in physics, math, biochem, and they didn't know how to make a directory without a GUI. Admittedly, that's why we're teaching them the CLI stuff. But they won't use it.
I had an IT colleague a few years back trying to work with a CSV file that had some strange embedded UNICODE characters in it. Excel was having problems reading the data. After several hours of dorking around with Excel, Notepad, and a few other GUI tools the file was handed to me--I used tools that aren't available on Windows (hexdump, sed, csvtool) and stripped the characters out, transformed the file to their requirements, and handed it back to him in about 4 minutes. I spent another 15 minutes automating the process of grabbing this automated CSV dump from a Windows app, doing the stripping and conversion, and then e-mailing the results. He wasted *hours* because he--apparently like your students--didn't think the CLI was valuable and GUI tools would solve his problem.
This person now has something like 30 minutes free *every day* where he can work on stuff that will earn the company money instead of dorking around with Windows failures.
The traditional approach was to remote into each one and make those changes through IIS Admin in the GUI. Now Microsoft wants you to push the change to all 100 servers at once with Powershell.
Yeah--the PowerShell route was pretty obvious when they completely hosed the IIS GUI in Windows 2008. It's a combination of a bad cheap hosting platform web control panel and adding so many different clicks that learning PowerShell seems easy by comparison.
I'm thinking of things more like hardware. In order to configure a Dialogic card on a server you need to use the GUI. You cannot configure the card, run the testing utilities, etc without the GUI
I configured my Digium card on *Linux* without a GUI. It was real easy: I plugged the card in. Things were autodetected and worked automatically. If I wanted to change the numbering or port usage on the card, I edited a text file--but it wasn't necessary.
Think more of things like backup software with a GUI interface, or antivirus.
The new Windows 2008 backup pretty much requires the following settings: where to back up, when to back up
Everything gets backed up.
AntiVirus shouldn't need to be configured either--it's been ages since you've had to exclude the Exchange 'm' drive. Why exclude anything else--that's just where the virus writers will strike next. Maybe you need to configure a few things like when to run a full system scan--but most AV products are web-based now. Symantec uses a bloated Java and Apache-based abomination and CA uses something similar except it's almost completely unusable due to bad design and totally useless due to shitty reports. (It's so bad they offered free remote install and config when a client purchased it)
The summary says a GUI will be optional.
Easy enough fix for every fscking application developer on the planet. Tweak your requirements list: .NET framework and all their security patches (hahaha, have fun rebooting)
* SQL Server
* 9 TB memory so you can run SQL comfortably
* IIS
* AntiVirus
* The Windows GUI installed
* Office if you like editing stuff using Word
* Every single version of the
* An internet connection to our licensing service that will occasionally lock you out even though you paid a huge wad of cache for our app
In other words, the GUI is optional but every program in the Windows ecosystem will require it.
Please no, programs can actually be quite complicated. They aren't like web servers which you configure and leave running. Making them GUI-less will just complicate things and make it much harder to use. There's a reason we use GUI's now a days - it's better for some stuff.
How easy is it to deploy SharePoint automatically? How easy is it to automate the configuration and setup of new SharePoint servers? There are a few tools in the Windows world to automate clicks on various GUI elements...
In Linux, I can deploy complex database sites with a few lines of code in a fab file, or maybe a preseeded dpkg, or maybe bash scripts, or maybe a GET request with a few parameters to generate a config file for the specific server, or I can easily image the server and blow it to all the boxes I need, or...
I'll take the CLI way. Yeah--it might be a bit more painful to edit a TEXT file to configure a service instead of clicking the mouse--but if all you know is the security of point-and-click, maybe you shouldn't be a server admin...
Please name one scenario where point and click is a better way to configure your server than something like a text file or a scriptable CLI.
If your home linux desktop isn't behind a NATing firewall, then your home setup is not correct.
My NAT / Firewall box *is* Linux you insensitive clod.
Do you know how MAD works?
Yeah--it's pretty much Dr. Claw and his cat trying to wreak havoc on the world using an ineptly trained group of henchmen. Last time I checked they were pretty ineffectual thanks to Penny and Brain.
Blind hatred aside, what makes you think they are? Really makes you wonder how in the world MS is posting record profits, when they're apparently paying everyone and their mother to use their products.
Wasn't there something during 2011 about Nokia and a burning oil platform--and just when everyone got excited and thought they were going to say 'Android', they said 'Microsoft'. Then their stock tanked. Then it came out that Microsoft paid them billions to continue standing on that burning platform?
XEROX...Windows Server 2003
The U.S.' LARGEST STOCK EXCHANGE...Windows Server 2003
FUJIFILM GROUP...Windows Server 2003
HILTON HOTELS...Windows Server 2003
MEDITERRANEAN SHIPPING COMPANY...Windows Server 2003
SWISS INTERNATIONAL AIRLINES...Windows Server 2003
UNILEVER...Windows Server 2003
MOTOROLA...Windows Server 2003 & SQLServer 2005
NISSAN...Uses Windows Server 2003...and Exchange Server 2003
TOYOTA MOTOR SALES...using Windows Server 2003
DELL COMPUTER...Windows Server 2003
HSBC...Windows Server 2003
RAYOVAC Chose Windows Server 2003
CONTINENTAL AIRLINES...Windows Server 2008
7 ELEVEN STORES...Windows Server 2003
STATE OF ILLINOIS GOVERNMENT...Windows Server 2003
REGAL ENTERTAINMENT GROUP...Switching to Windows Server 2003 + Windows "Embedded"
CARNIVAL CRUISE LINES...Manages 1,000 shipboard &Windows Server 2003 & Server (every boat needs an anchor, right?
STARBUCKS...Windows Server 2003 Active Directory
RADIOSHACK...Windows Server 2003
TOMMY HILFIGER...Windows Server 2003
NcSOFT...Windows Server 2003
TDC...Windows Server 2003
GAMEWORKS...using Windows Server 2003M
SHOP DIRECT...intends to migrate no less than 350 servers from Windows Server 2003 to Windows Server 2008 R2
It gives me such a warm feeling to see that 'SHOP DIRECT' has finally saved enough to upgrade 350 of their servers. Give them another decade on their remaining Windows 2003 boxes and they might be able to save enough to finish the project...
And 'bravo' to the two other companies that could finally afford to upgrade to Windows 2008 by firing a bunch of IT staff to pay for licenses to upgrade to Windows 2008 (which is already 4 years out of date).
For everyone else who is stuck on Windows 2003 because of costs or the fact that 15 year old corporate applications won't run under anything but IE6 and Windows XP--well, you're going to have to pay to re-write the apps anyways, you might as well consider re-writing them as a web-based app that can run from a much cheaper Linux-based server. If you still feel the need to get screwed by licensing fees, you can always purchase support from Red Hat, Canonical, etc... Or just send me a dump truck filled with cash...
Between a custom HOSTS file, & using "filtering" DNS servers (that specialize in blocking out malicious script & malware serving domains + phishing/spamming ones)?
Can you please tell me how to modify my HOSTS file to block your stupid use of the bold tag? Fsck.
We're one, dental office, 9 employees and struggling not to lay anyone off.
It doesn't help that Patterson Eaglesoft and Dentrix both were saying "Stay Away" when it came to Windows Vista and higher. Patterson *just* released their new version of Eaglesoft which *finally* has been approved to run on Windows Vista/7 and Windows 2008 Server. (Of course this is several years after they promised a web-based version would be available...)