Try a more balanced approach- what I'm saying is that a focus on any one aspect is very bad for the way any organization is run, right down to the organization of the human brain. In human brains, we have a word for it: sociopathic. And I have no doubt that if they could find a way to make money doing those things- any good businessman would, because the ethics of profit are overriding of any other consideration. And if they don't- capitalism will take care of the problem because another business that is willing to kick puppies, rape kittens, and kill little girls (assuming that those things are profitable) will stay in business when the company that refuses to sacrifice ethics to profit will find themselves unable to raise money selling shares.
As a conclusive counter-example, check out Johnson & Johnson's credo. Shareholder value is fourth on that list and it's been below other goals for the past 60 years.
And yet, when it comes to cleaning up their mess in India (they bought Union Carbide), they certainly have NOT lived by that credo. In fact, quite the opposite- they managed that crises specifically to minimize shareholder cost.
Sure Polyanna. And the mugger isn't trying to get your wallet either.
The focus on profit means that you can't trust anybody who is publically traded- and the grand majority of the privately owned companies aren't that much better. The only way to fix that is to make corporations significantly less focused on profit- perhaps by only awarding articles of incorporation to businesses that have a non-profit mission statement, since the others really don't deserve governmental support.
With pure paper ballots, and a human count with all parties represented, such arguments don't end in the ballot being thrown out. Heck, the argument never arises in the first place- because any reasonable human being wouldn't notice the spec of graphite for Bush.
This isn't a place to have a device dependant on an operating system at all. It seems to me it would be far better to put it all in firmware on the individual kiosks. The tally box may need an operating system- but it can be a very stripped down one that is designed from the start to *only* do the one job. There is NO need for a tally box to be able to run Word or Excel.
Why was the parent modded off topic? The discussion was about Harry Potter. The Grandparent mentioned the bumper sticker- I was trying to bring it back on topic by mentioning the Malfoys and why the bumper sticker was accurate.
It's funnier the first way, due to the stereotype of Republicans fitting the stereotype of the Malfoys. Both are rich, pretentious, arrogant, and will do anything for profit.
Excuse my french, but what the fuck is this? I've seen jokes like this online and perhaps written one, but on a voting machine? prove it.
Damn hard to PROVE when the machines in question were quickly locked up after the election, and there was NO official investigation into the complaints after Kerry ignored his constituents and conceded the election in Ohio. I heard the report on Air America Radio nearly a year ago now- in among other reports of 14 hour lines when the polls were only open for 12 hours due to misallocation of voting machines, ballots that were cast on paper but never counted, and upper class Republican neighborhoods getting preferential treatment for problems. I believe you could probably find something about it in Randi Rhodes' blog- which is about as useful for proof as Rush Limbaugh's blog.
btw, I do think Diebold's machines are probably corrupt, but your claim is ridiculous.
Why? If the code can be done as a joke, why NOT in a corrupt voting machine? And besides- my claim is only thirdhand knowledge at best- I said that there were reports of such behavior, not that I had seen it myself! I was 2000 miles away at the time!
True, but those reports are from the same people who search for hours for the 'Any' key.
Yep- which kind of says that touch screen VOTING (which is supposed to be available to EVERYBODY in a democracy, not just the smart people) is either not ready for prime time; or worse yet, this one company is very corrupt. I wonder which? My vote is for both.
Regina is a relatively new science fiction writer- this is her first novel, released just this year, self-published through Lulu press. It was originally written as a romance- and thus has a good deal of appeal for the female sex. But I found it equally interesting as science fiction. It's likely to end up the first book of a series; and thus would give you additional purchases in the future. But best of all, it's available cheap ($5.00) as a PDF e-book; which would allow you to give it as a present to people on your list that you won't neccessarily be seeing for Christmas.
Yes, and there is no way for me as a voter to know that the computer is actually programmed with non-biased error free software.
This is funny given the article it's attached to: Apparently North Carolina has figured out how to let the voters know that the computer is actually programmed with non-biased error free software with this law. Diebold hates it because they produce biased, error prone software.
They already have those committees. And the Democrat or Republican always winds up challenging a vote that goes against him if he can find the slightest bit of reason. How the hell is that a productive system?
It's a productive system for what it's supposed to produce- an honest count. It's not designed to produce millions of counts an hour. It's not designed to do things fast. It's designed to do things ACCURATELY.
Actually no- but if they did, providing a list of programmers would be as easy as finding the Ace of Hearts, the Queen of Hearts, and double tapping on one of them (I don't actually remember the details, you can google Easter Egg and Windows CE) in Solitare.
Why do you want to review the inner workings of USB and graphic card drivers?
Because *either* could be hiding places for code that manipulates the vote (USB should be obvious, certainly enough white hats have warned about the security risks of USB keys. Graphics card drivers are less obvious- but given the reports from Ohio during the Presidential election of roving Windows Buttons that would only accept a vote for Bush, is certainly one place among many to look for the code that makes votes for the democratic candidate run away from the finger of the user).
One reference: $SYS$. Any operating system that allows hidden files has WAY too big of a security hole in it to use for voting to begin with. The government is 100% right in saying that an audit of the full source code on a machine is required to make sure it's not hackable (and thus the vote is honest). Closed source is way too hackable to base voting software on it.
In the case of a major free OS like Linux or FreeBSD, that's impossible.
AFAIK- for Linux, for the code to make it into the kernal, it has to go through a review process...is that review process entirely without e-mail, or anonymized in some way that I don't understand?
It is possible that they'll have to pull out of North Carolina as well- or have to tell us the names of every programmer who worked on Windows as well as release the source code.
I wonder if Linspire will offer licenses to replace Windows boxen there?
And I'll just bet that Goto never uses GoTo. Quite a good pun for entry level CS class...except I bet his name is pronounced with an initial short o vowel insetad of the long o vowel and different sylables. (Got-o, rather than Go-To).
Exactly. For those watching (is there anybody left watching this deep in?) we can have faith, but we cannot know. Anything at all. Solipsism is the only place logic alone can take you in the long run. The entire universe is just an illusion- what we experience is a mere shadow of the reality. One can have faith that it all has a purpose, or one can have faith that it is all purposeless- but I find the former to be far more conductive to getting me out of bed in the morning.
Cheapest is not necessarily the worst, nor the costliest the best.
True enough- but doesn't that just mean all the more that you can't budget quality? That you can't put a limit of say, $50,000 a year in a place where to have a two bedroom apartment will cost you $60,000 a year in rent, and be able to hire the most qualified people?
This is a bunch of pretentious bullshit by people whose jobs are on average are as intellectually-demanding as being a plumber.
Despite disagreeing with the rest of this AC's post- this needed to be brought to the surface. I think there's gold here for the guy who can marry the normal technical skills of a plumber with object oriented design. Most OOPs is two-dimensional thinking and ignores proper data flow. OOPs people have a tendency to forget that every time you have to transform the data set to a new format, you lose processing speed. The plumber knows water that takes too many turns slows down the flow. The plumber knows that the distance from the hot water heater- pipe distance, not linear distance- will mean a shower takes longer to warm up. Give me a programmer who understands data flow- and that's where the next big leap in computer programming will come from.
Are you honestly claiming that someone applying for a Unix admin position should not know what "df" is?
No, I'm honestly claiming that someone applying for a Unix admin position deserves either a living wage for the area- or if you don't want to pay a living wage, you should really just take somebody who knows NOTHING of computers at all and pay for them to be trained as a Unix Admin. Those have been the standard two options throughout American history for filling positions: Pay the going rate, or train somebody to do it. Not whine when you can't find somebody to work at slave wages.
I mean, this isn't even an admin-level question. This is more along the lines of "Have you *used* Unix before?"
Then shouldn't the command you're looking for be ls, rm, mv, cp or chmod? Those are the three commands most people know if they've used Unix before- df is not one of the basics. Heck, my *single* unix class in college didn't even cover anything more than basic directory structure and file manipulation commands!
Yes. But I got it on LaidOffLand, a yahoo group (I remember because of the typo- there was a big joke discussion about what language "such as C+++, " was refering to).
I would add that HR automatically filters out anybody that does NOT have a 4 year degree, thereby immediately disqualifying some of the finest candidates.
It's worse than just that, it's a reality disconnect. You see, the c-level bigwhig (who you KNOW will be interviewed by the ITAA to provide more proof for outsourcing and H-1b insourcing) never actually hears about the 1000 other candidates for the job, who were whittled down using the most arbitrary, and sometimes technically incorrect, criteria. And HR took so long to do it that from his perspective, there MUST be an IT person shortage- or else it wouldn't take so long to hire people, right?
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Try a more balanced approach- what I'm saying is that a focus on any one aspect is very bad for the way any organization is run, right down to the organization of the human brain. In human brains, we have a word for it: sociopathic. And I have no doubt that if they could find a way to make money doing those things- any good businessman would, because the ethics of profit are overriding of any other consideration. And if they don't- capitalism will take care of the problem because another business that is willing to kick puppies, rape kittens, and kill little girls (assuming that those things are profitable) will stay in business when the company that refuses to sacrifice ethics to profit will find themselves unable to raise money selling shares.
As a conclusive counter-example, check out Johnson & Johnson's credo. Shareholder value is fourth on that list and it's been below other goals for the past 60 years.
And yet, when it comes to cleaning up their mess in India (they bought Union Carbide), they certainly have NOT lived by that credo. In fact, quite the opposite- they managed that crises specifically to minimize shareholder cost.
Sure Polyanna. And the mugger isn't trying to get your wallet either.
The focus on profit means that you can't trust anybody who is publically traded- and the grand majority of the privately owned companies aren't that much better. The only way to fix that is to make corporations significantly less focused on profit- perhaps by only awarding articles of incorporation to businesses that have a non-profit mission statement, since the others really don't deserve governmental support.
With pure paper ballots, and a human count with all parties represented, such arguments don't end in the ballot being thrown out. Heck, the argument never arises in the first place- because any reasonable human being wouldn't notice the spec of graphite for Bush.
This isn't a place to have a device dependant on an operating system at all. It seems to me it would be far better to put it all in firmware on the individual kiosks. The tally box may need an operating system- but it can be a very stripped down one that is designed from the start to *only* do the one job. There is NO need for a tally box to be able to run Word or Excel.
Why was the parent modded off topic? The discussion was about Harry Potter. The Grandparent mentioned the bumper sticker- I was trying to bring it back on topic by mentioning the Malfoys and why the bumper sticker was accurate.
It's funnier the first way, due to the stereotype of Republicans fitting the stereotype of the Malfoys. Both are rich, pretentious, arrogant, and will do anything for profit.
Excuse my french, but what the fuck is this? I've seen jokes like this online and perhaps written one, but on a voting machine? prove it.
Damn hard to PROVE when the machines in question were quickly locked up after the election, and there was NO official investigation into the complaints after Kerry ignored his constituents and conceded the election in Ohio. I heard the report on Air America Radio nearly a year ago now- in among other reports of 14 hour lines when the polls were only open for 12 hours due to misallocation of voting machines, ballots that were cast on paper but never counted, and upper class Republican neighborhoods getting preferential treatment for problems. I believe you could probably find something about it in Randi Rhodes' blog- which is about as useful for proof as Rush Limbaugh's blog.
btw, I do think Diebold's machines are probably corrupt, but your claim is ridiculous.
Why? If the code can be done as a joke, why NOT in a corrupt voting machine? And besides- my claim is only thirdhand knowledge at best- I said that there were reports of such behavior, not that I had seen it myself! I was 2000 miles away at the time!
True, but those reports are from the same people who search for hours for the 'Any' key.
Yep- which kind of says that touch screen VOTING (which is supposed to be available to EVERYBODY in a democracy, not just the smart people) is either not ready for prime time; or worse yet, this one company is very corrupt. I wonder which? My vote is for both.
http://www.reginapaul.bravehost.com/
Regina is a relatively new science fiction writer- this is her first novel, released just this year, self-published through Lulu press. It was originally written as a romance- and thus has a good deal of appeal for the female sex. But I found it equally interesting as science fiction. It's likely to end up the first book of a series; and thus would give you additional purchases in the future. But best of all, it's available cheap ($5.00) as a PDF e-book; which would allow you to give it as a present to people on your list that you won't neccessarily be seeing for Christmas.
Yes, and there is no way for me as a voter to know that the computer is actually programmed with non-biased error free software.
This is funny given the article it's attached to: Apparently North Carolina has figured out how to let the voters know that the computer is actually programmed with non-biased error free software with this law. Diebold hates it because they produce biased, error prone software.
They already have those committees. And the Democrat or Republican always winds up challenging a vote that goes against him if he can find the slightest bit of reason. How the hell is that a productive system?
It's a productive system for what it's supposed to produce- an honest count. It's not designed to produce millions of counts an hour. It's not designed to do things fast. It's designed to do things ACCURATELY.
Actually no- but if they did, providing a list of programmers would be as easy as finding the Ace of Hearts, the Queen of Hearts, and double tapping on one of them (I don't actually remember the details, you can google Easter Egg and Windows CE) in Solitare.
Why do you want to review the inner workings of USB and graphic card drivers?
Because *either* could be hiding places for code that manipulates the vote (USB should be obvious, certainly enough white hats have warned about the security risks of USB keys. Graphics card drivers are less obvious- but given the reports from Ohio during the Presidential election of roving Windows Buttons that would only accept a vote for Bush, is certainly one place among many to look for the code that makes votes for the democratic candidate run away from the finger of the user).
One reference: $SYS$. Any operating system that allows hidden files has WAY too big of a security hole in it to use for voting to begin with. The government is 100% right in saying that an audit of the full source code on a machine is required to make sure it's not hackable (and thus the vote is honest). Closed source is way too hackable to base voting software on it.
In the case of a major free OS like Linux or FreeBSD, that's impossible.
AFAIK- for Linux, for the code to make it into the kernal, it has to go through a review process...is that review process entirely without e-mail, or anonymized in some way that I don't understand?
Or in fact they're sending that message on purpose- that in a democratic country, a closed source voting system is a direct threat.
It is possible that they'll have to pull out of North Carolina as well- or have to tell us the names of every programmer who worked on Windows as well as release the source code.
I wonder if Linspire will offer licenses to replace Windows boxen there?
And I'll just bet that Goto never uses GoTo. Quite a good pun for entry level CS class...except I bet his name is pronounced with an initial short o vowel insetad of the long o vowel and different sylables. (Got-o, rather than Go-To).
Exactly. For those watching (is there anybody left watching this deep in?) we can have faith, but we cannot know. Anything at all. Solipsism is the only place logic alone can take you in the long run. The entire universe is just an illusion- what we experience is a mere shadow of the reality. One can have faith that it all has a purpose, or one can have faith that it is all purposeless- but I find the former to be far more conductive to getting me out of bed in the morning.
Cheapest is not necessarily the worst, nor the costliest the best.
True enough- but doesn't that just mean all the more that you can't budget quality? That you can't put a limit of say, $50,000 a year in a place where to have a two bedroom apartment will cost you $60,000 a year in rent, and be able to hire the most qualified people?
This is a bunch of pretentious bullshit by people whose jobs are on average are as intellectually-demanding as being a plumber.
Despite disagreeing with the rest of this AC's post- this needed to be brought to the surface. I think there's gold here for the guy who can marry the normal technical skills of a plumber with object oriented design. Most OOPs is two-dimensional thinking and ignores proper data flow. OOPs people have a tendency to forget that every time you have to transform the data set to a new format, you lose processing speed. The plumber knows water that takes too many turns slows down the flow. The plumber knows that the distance from the hot water heater- pipe distance, not linear distance- will mean a shower takes longer to warm up. Give me a programmer who understands data flow- and that's where the next big leap in computer programming will come from.
Are you honestly claiming that someone applying for a Unix admin position should not know what "df" is?
No, I'm honestly claiming that someone applying for a Unix admin position deserves either a living wage for the area- or if you don't want to pay a living wage, you should really just take somebody who knows NOTHING of computers at all and pay for them to be trained as a Unix Admin. Those have been the standard two options throughout American history for filling positions: Pay the going rate, or train somebody to do it. Not whine when you can't find somebody to work at slave wages.
I mean, this isn't even an admin-level question. This is more along the lines of "Have you *used* Unix before?"
Then shouldn't the command you're looking for be ls, rm, mv, cp or chmod? Those are the three commands most people know if they've used Unix before- df is not one of the basics. Heck, my *single* unix class in college didn't even cover anything more than basic directory structure and file manipulation commands!
Yes. But I got it on LaidOffLand, a yahoo group (I remember because of the typo- there was a big joke discussion about what language "such as C+++, " was refering to).
I would add that HR automatically filters out anybody that does NOT have a 4 year degree, thereby immediately disqualifying some of the finest candidates.
It's worse than just that, it's a reality disconnect. You see, the c-level bigwhig (who you KNOW will be interviewed by the ITAA to provide more proof for outsourcing and H-1b insourcing) never actually hears about the 1000 other candidates for the job, who were whittled down using the most arbitrary, and sometimes technically incorrect, criteria. And HR took so long to do it that from his perspective, there MUST be an IT person shortage- or else it wouldn't take so long to hire people, right?