Because a larger userbase translates into greater driver support on part of the hardware manufacturers, which would take a huge burden off the OSS community and allow developers to focus on creating useful applications.
On the software end of things? Never. He's a developer. If he thinks Nvidia is easier to work with, great. But he damn well better support my 9800 well if he expects me to run games that use his engine.
I respect John Carmack, but I am not a picky developer like him. ATIs drivers seem fine to me and the cards perform great.. and thats all the criteria I have.
My experience with ATI and Linux is limited to Gentoo:
Well I have used a Geforce MX 200, Geforce 3, Radeon 8500, Radeon 9500 non-pro, and just bought a Radeon 9800 non-pro (will be flashing with pro BIOS).
The Geforce 3 was a good card, but its the only one that has died on me.
No problems with any of the Radeons, and they sure are fast!
IMO, Nvidia's only good desktop offering right now is the FX 5600 Ultra, which has a value comparable to ATI.
The 5900 has a few more frames than the 9800 in UT2K3, but its image quality with is noticeably inferior to the Radeon.
> It seems as though NVIDIA still has a stronghold in this market, as their card seems to dominate many of the benchmark runs shown here."
Not really. The benchmarks were very close in most of the tests and if you consider what the end of the article says:
At this point in time, various price search engines have the ATi FireGL X1 listed at or around $530. Conversely, the NVIDIA Quadro FX 2000 is listed at no less that $1250 and that's in the 128MB variant, not the 256MB model we tested. So with this in mind, the FireGL X1 price/performance ratio is rather compelling, at less than half the cost of the competing NVIDIA product.
> I'm 19, live upstairs in our house, and I happen to be a real life user of linux.
Yes but you'll get no respect from the 30+ year-olds who think you need back problems and a potbelly in order to be considered a real life user of linux!
I hate BSD zealots much more than Gentoo zealots. (okay, okay.. I use Gentoo myself and I realize thats a huge bias)
But still, at least the Gentoo people are advocating something that has a chance at becomming mainstream. Near as I can tell, BSD will allways have a tiny niche market, especially on the desktop.
There's nothing childish about M$ but if you want to think otherwise, fine. It is a good abreviation and I'll use it whenever I do not feel like typing "Microsoft." (MS is reserved for multiple sclerosis)
Anyway my point was Gaim is a cross platform application that runs on Windows as well as Linux. M$ should not (emphasize should not) feel obligated to compete with it.
Whether they end up doing so (for obvious monopolistic reasons) is a future story, one that I am sure/. will cover when the time comes.
I am not smoking crack, all I did was point out that because Gaim's position in this matter is reasonable (M$ can view the source if it feels like it), then there is at least a chance they will allow Gaim to keep compatibility.
> What I'm getting at here is that gaim is a product that allows you to use MSN messaging without having to pay for Windows.
Oh, of course! MSN Messenger is one of Windows' main selling points...:rolleyes:
Well I happen to use Gaim with Windows at work, because I like it better than MSN Messenger.
Slashdot Mirror
> And before long, you have an OS that is so feature ridden that every week there's a new obnoxious exploit.
I don't agree with your cynical view, but if/when that happens, people like you can turn to BSD, which by that time will be where Linux is today =)
> If not, then why worry?
Because a larger userbase translates into greater driver support on part of the hardware manufacturers, which would take a huge burden off the OSS community and allow developers to focus on creating useful applications.
Oh, well I had read otherwise somewhere but it appears you are correct.
Oh well... perhaps Jazz?
one year ago
its still easy, laid back, etc...
On the software end of things? Never. He's a developer. If he thinks Nvidia is easier to work with, great. But he damn well better support my 9800 well if he expects me to run games that use his engine.
RTFA? There were differences of 25%-60% in several important benchmarks.
I respect John Carmack, but I am not a picky developer like him. ATIs drivers seem fine to me and the cards perform great.. and thats all the criteria I have.
My experience with ATI and Linux is limited to Gentoo:
emerge ati-drivers
Works like a charm...
> What are you basing that conclusion on, cards from 4 years ago?
FYI:
Hardocp
Tomshardware
A relevant forum discussion
Well I have used a Geforce MX 200, Geforce 3, Radeon 8500, Radeon 9500 non-pro, and just bought a Radeon 9800 non-pro (will be flashing with pro BIOS).
The Geforce 3 was a good card, but its the only one that has died on me.
No problems with any of the Radeons, and they sure are fast!
IMO, Nvidia's only good desktop offering right now is the FX 5600 Ultra, which has a value comparable to ATI.
The 5900 has a few more frames than the 9800 in UT2K3, but its image quality with is noticeably inferior to the Radeon.
> It seems as though NVIDIA still has a stronghold in this market, as their card seems to dominate many of the benchmark runs shown here."
...The FireGL looks like a much better value.
Not really. The benchmarks were very close in most of the tests and if you consider what the end of the article says:
At this point in time, various price search engines have the ATi FireGL X1 listed at or around $530. Conversely, the NVIDIA Quadro FX 2000 is listed at no less that $1250 and that's in the 128MB variant, not the 256MB model we tested. So with this in mind, the FireGL X1 price/performance ratio is rather compelling, at less than half the cost of the competing NVIDIA product.
AFAIK, HP supports Mandrake on any computer they bundle it with.
> I'm 19, live upstairs in our house, and I happen to be a real life user of linux.
Yes but you'll get no respect from the 30+ year-olds who think you need back problems and a potbelly in order to be considered a real life user of linux!
Not on purpose, no. I was mostly brainstorming.
:)
I elaborated on this theme in this other post
Criticism welcome
Okay someone help me compare distros to music:
RedHat: Mainstream
SuSE: Classical
Debian: Folk
Slackware: Rock
Mandrake: Country
Gentoo: Techno/Pop
FreeBSD: Heavy Metal
NetBSD: generic drum rythms
OpenBSD: tranquil, stress-relief
SCO: Satanic
> Gentoo is garbage.
Its not garbage, its different. Alternative, if you will. Kind of like in the music industry...
Not everyone has the same needs/tastes in a distribution as you.
> But I love the fact that if you type this sig straight into google, you end up with the first link to Apple's iPod.
You of course realize that is because google displays the most visited sites first...
I hate BSD zealots much more than Gentoo zealots. (okay, okay.. I use Gentoo myself and I realize thats a huge bias)
But still, at least the Gentoo people are advocating something that has a chance at becomming mainstream. Near as I can tell, BSD will allways have a tiny niche market, especially on the desktop.
Linux means two companies: Red Hat and SuSE, and nobody else. There will be no third distribution that will be supported by the large IT vendors.
Thats bullshit.
HP/Compaq bundles Mandrake.
And certifies systems for Redhat, SuSE, Mandrake, and TurboLinux.
If HP isn't considerd a "large IT vendor," who is?
> I'm sure it bothers MS that I'm using their servers and their network without having paid for a copy of windows.
Just like it bothers Time Warner that people use AIM without having subscribed to AOL?
I don't think your point is valid.. MSN messenger and AIM are free clients because they are trying to get exposure to as many users as possible.
Consider:
AIM ---> AOL as an ISP
MSN Messenger ---> MSN as an ISP
Both are natural transitions...
A Linux user with Gaim really shouldn't be showing up on Redmond's potential customer radar.
There's nothing childish about M$ but if you want to think otherwise, fine. It is a good abreviation and I'll use it whenever I do not feel like typing "Microsoft." (MS is reserved for multiple sclerosis)
/. will cover when the time comes.
Anyway my point was Gaim is a cross platform application that runs on Windows as well as Linux. M$ should not (emphasize should not) feel obligated to compete with it.
Whether they end up doing so (for obvious monopolistic reasons) is a future story, one that I am sure
> Ever since I read Hackers by Stephen Levy, I really really lusted after the old hardware
:-\
Well I loved that book, but I can't say I've ever "really really lusted" over a teletype...
> Do you have an old teletype with a 5-bit serial interface sitting around that you've been itching to hook up to the Internet?
No.
I am not smoking crack, all I did was point out that because Gaim's position in this matter is reasonable (M$ can view the source if it feels like it), then there is at least a chance they will allow Gaim to keep compatibility.
:rolleyes:
> What I'm getting at here is that gaim is a product that allows you to use MSN messaging without having to pay for Windows.
Oh, of course! MSN Messenger is one of Windows' main selling points...
Well I happen to use Gaim with Windows at work, because I like it better than MSN Messenger.