Well I understand the concerns about security, but if you have ever used such tools (and you probably might have), you'd find that these are not some "magic" tools that would do all the refactoring work for you.
1. These tools don't make decisions about what to refactor - you tell them what has to be done, they just do it for you.
2. Humans tend to introduce errors in tedious, monotonous situations.
Proficient C++ programmers are paid and valued for the knowledge they bring with themselves, which is not limited to refactoring.
Finally, by analogy, if this tool presents a threat, then so does every IDE, debugger or performance tool. I never heard of anyone losing a job because of a new IDE being introduced. Tools are there for you to use, and help you increase productivity and efficiency.Feeling threatened from them won't get you anywhere.
Oh I absolutely agree with your observations. I am in no way disinclined about the tool having to think and make informed decisions when replacing methods, variables and selection blocks and based upon access modifiers
I was just elaborating on the fact that such a refactoring tool is more than search and replace, as was mentioend.
IMHO, refactoring tools make can be quite useful in tidying up the code, be it yours or written by someone else. However, to categorize them as a glorified search/replace tool is misleading, and undermining their usefulness
Most of the features are simple search and replace operations. Just add some knowledge the compiler would have to the editor and it becomes quite easy to do
hmm... lets examine them then.
Rename
So say you want to rename A::foo() to A::bar(). But foo() is private - so the tool has to look only in the current file, while for protected the file and its children, while the entire project if its public. While its rather easier to limit private and public members, how about protected? What if there is B::foo() as well? what if B::foo() is used in A?
Extract Method
This usually works when you select a piece of code and want to extract it to a method. search and replace? umm yes. How about the method sanctity? Wouldnt the tool need to ensure your extracted method is remains unbroken? what about the variables used in the selected segment? Are they declared within the selection?
Convert Local to Field
A::foo() has "myLocal", and so has A::bar(). Upon refactoring, should "myLocal" be replaced within with the new field in A::bar() as well?
Convert Global to Field Instance
A::Global is made a field. But A::foo() has a local variable Global defined as well. Should the tool do its job silently or inform you about this?
Convert Static Method to Instance Method
ditto
I haven't read the specs of the tool, so I don't really know if it performs all this validation. I sure hope it does, if they want to sell it to anyone else other than mom and pop
If Dell (or any other vendor) started selling such "silent" PCs, a large number of calls would be "My computer does not work!" and the customer support establishing that it works, but just doesn't make any noise indicating it works!
Heck, my granny thought the new fridge was b0rked when it didn make a noise (as opposed to her quaint old one that made "comforting" noises every few minutes)
Sure, input devices is one area that has been under some scrutiny now by a lot of vendors to better devices. Unfortunately, most new devices that come out are re-designs of existing devices (a better style mouse, or keyboard wrist supports, etc), and not any significant change in the devices themselves.
However, given the innovations and improvements in all fields, rather sooner than later we will have some new devices or mechanisms of input (there is talk already of speech-based input devices).
However, I firmly believe for people in sedate, desk jobs like ours, we should exercise in one form or the other. Pick up a sport. Badminton, Squash or even Tennis aren't that easy to start with. America has a significant love for Golf, so that's not a bad option either.
Keep one of the grip-enhancers near you and you can use that whenever you have time during the day (it supinates and stresses upon your wrist and forearm muscles)
If possible, enroll in a gym. You don't have to start lifting monumental weights, but you would at least strain yourself physically, spurting muscle development and tissue regneration
If the gym is not suitable, you can do simple exercises at home - pushups, situps, crunches, chin-ups, etc all help.
All told, I sympathize with you and the work-related ailment/side effect. Science and technology do help, but I believe we all have an onus to look after our bodies as well
Sure there are now more patrons in public libraries courtesy of Internet-connected, free-to-use computers, video games, audio and video CDs and DVDs for hire. Oh there are books in libraries too, but the last few times I've been to the local public libraries, all I noticed was long queues of people waiting for their turn to use the computers.
An interesting side-effect was the libraries having to revisit a lot of their rules - free for all computer usage was changed to members-only usage (though membership is free), members-only usage was then revised to advanced-booking, members-only usage. Maximum number of CD/DVD issued at any time was increased from 2 to 5 (and the rental charges were reduced).
Sure, there has been a revival. But I find most of the revival centers around not the core of the library - books, but electronic/digital content that can be accessed rather cheaply there. So in that context libraries have re-invented themselves too.
There may also be a significant ripple effect - people who are waiting for their turns on computers, etc., are tempted to have a look at the shelves and might even take out the odd book. However, the fact remains that the attention spans have been reducing. Most new entrants to the libraries limit their usage to the digital offerings.
Maybe after a while when these new entrants get used to the feel of bookshelves around them, and the long waits for computer terminals imbibes enough patience to turn pages of a book, a true new revival will happen. Till then, it's a rush to get the latest DVD/CD for a week at rock-bottom prices, or an opportunity to check email for free
Who cares? Live and let live.
probably the first time ever that I got a straightforward, rather sane, mild and agreeable response on/. , instead of the standard troll, calling-me-names, spewing anger and fury-filled response.
Slow news day maybe, but a refreshing change!
Mod the parent up ppl!
Re:Screenshots, anyone? lol!
on
JOE Hits 3.0
·
· Score: 1
you know something's wrong somewhere when screenshots of a character-based interface are asked for:-
Oh I'm sure there are plenty of Joe afficionadoes. But that's not what I'm contending at all. It's a free world (at least most of it), and people are free to have their choices and preferences
Its the bit about investing time and energy into revamping something that only the afficionadoes will use, and admire. The bit that says the project has been open for contribution for over a year with not very many feature updates. And the bit in your post itself that talks about the latest build being buggy
So it is a great editor, it has its following - but where is it going? And for how many ppl?
ah well, at least this would bring some action to an otherwise slow day at/.:-)
*ducks*
Great news, but..
on
JOE Hits 3.0
·
· Score: 4, Insightful
realistically, how many ppl use Joe?
Yes I've used wordstar in past. And Joe as well. But it seems to me the world has moved far far ahead in the last few years. Sure, vi and emacs lovers wouldnt even think of using any other editor, but IMO, for any serious editing purposes there already are a variety of editors available.
So perhaps, this is news for those who get a nostalgic feeling about the good-old-days. Maybe some will even d/l and give it a go, but the very fact that the this is the first major feature improvement even though the SourceForge project has been open for contributors for over a year, speaks volumes about its usage, demand and popularity.
I completely agree to the irregularities, the security problems and the violence incidents that have been reported in the past in indian elections. However, all these problems existed *before* the EVM's were in use, and *none* of these problems are related to either the technology, or the electronic machines itself...so it just goes on to show they have something americans don't !
FYI, the EVM's in India have been used for a while now, though this was indeed the first general election where they were used nation-wide.
The current reports have not mentioned anything changed from the (now) usual process of the use of EVM's, hence it is unlikely at the outset, for anything major to go wrong.
What is the impact of this on psyche of general public who is either not very informed about the technical nitty-gritties or the reasons of failures, and onto the voters on the whole?
Its further rather amazing to know a nation so well versed in technology has failed getting something right, that the world's largest democracy - India, got right (they are undergoing elections present using electronic voting machines)
Also with different counties using different versions (as reported earlier), I wonder what happened to the usual quality assurance checks that would normally be in place for such a critical application....
Welcome to the main page for The Fifth HOPE, sponsored by 2600. Yes, it's our fifth conference in New York City and this one threatens to be the best yet. It all takes place July 9-11, 2004, at the Hotel Pennsylvania in Manhattan
So perhaps thats why they call it The Fifth Hope?
At least The Fifth Hope's website does not say anywhere that its the 10th anniversary...
1. As mentioned in the article, elephants were used to send these machines to the remote areas, and these are not connected to any central server.
2. The counting will be done at the local electoral office where usually representatives from all parties are present to ensure there is no mischief (or inaccuracy), so the machines will be stored in the local municipal/electoral offices, thereby reducing the risk of destruction due to bad weather.
3. Finally, it is incredibly hard to get hold of firearms in India - the gun laws are extremely strict, which acts as a two-edged prong - while it is relatively easy to safeguard anything (couple of armed guards usually suffice); when attacked there is not much to defend with.
(sorry about repost - somehow slashdot assumed i wasn't logged in)
Here is the link [Indian Express] that i was looking for while writing the parent. Excerpt:
According to the EC, places like Ahmedabad, Vadodara, Dohad, Panchmahals, Banaskantha, Sabarkantha, Mehsana, Keda, Anand, Gandhinagar, Patan, Bhavnagar and parts of Rajkot have been the worst-affected by communal violence. The commission will closely watch over the deployment of security forces in these areas.
Because everything in life is not necessary clearly demarcated in black and white, it is necessary to have as many parties/people/people's representatives standing up for being counted in the Indian "general" election.
1. If the people of a constituency are unhappy with all the major parties, they can choose to elect an "independent" candidate - a candidate who does not belong to any political party and contends the election on his own agenda.
2. If enough number of people feel their voices are not being heard, they can nominate and then fruther elect their own (independent) candidate. There have been incidents in the past where candidates belonging to a particular caste, social or economic strata or even sex (not just men or women, there have been several eunuchs who have stood up and contested elections because they felt the state did not treat them right).
3. These independent candidates can then choose to continue standing alone, or as is the usual case, if elected, join another political party but carrying their own agenda and political weight with them. Of course, they also do this simply for money:-)
4. Of course, with more political parties, there is more mayhem. The current BJP government was once "in power" for only 13 days because it failed to prove its majority in the general assembly (that is, it did not have enough elected candidates supporting it)
I don't think having multiple political parties is all good. Yet, I firmly believe it emphasizes the true notion of democracy
That is still a big if. It's funny we are worried about fraud on our e-voting machines. They are worried about fights
You're right there. There are electorates that are prone to violence. Every year the government takes a lot of measures to try and curb these, and although the entire process is relatively peaceful in most of the country, there are incidents of violence, some of which are serious. Before every general elections, the Election Commission identifies certain violence-prone areas and makes efforts to deploy additional security forces to those areas
But these incidents have been happening since a long time, even when there was a manual voting process.
An elephant carrying a voting machine. Even in my wildest dreams I never would have thought of that.
Again, it may be hard for a westerner (for Indians, the term implies not only Americans, but Europeans as well) to believe this, but there are parts of the country that are either very inaccessible, or poorly developed or both. Natural elements play a vital role as well - there are certain parts of the country that are prone to landslides, floods and cloudbursts in the same season and most systems breakdown (at least whatever we have there).
Ultimately, we end up resorting to rather un-natural or the "old" means of conveyance, be it riding elephants.
It may seem amusing or shocking, but using elephants isn't very different than bullock carts (which were and still are used in certain parts of the country).
Or maybe the very mention of elephants reminds you of a zoo and/or brings about images of a oriental land of snake charmers?
Just a joke, lads. In India "Singh" is like "Smith" in the West.
Not true at all. Unlike in the west, or maybe rather more clearly than in the west, the surnames in India provide a fairl idea of the religious beliefs or sect a person belongs to. This may seem bizarre to the western mind of course, but rather than delve into the history behind it, let me just tell you that "Singh" is a very small part of the surnames you'd come across. Ask anyone in UK - they'd have heard of more "Patel"s.
Like I heard on BBC, muslims form a "vast" majority - 120 million of them live in India. Its a big country and with a billion citizens, you ma easily be mislead if you come across only one particular group/clan of people
The article starts off with a diabolically, highlighting the boast of a mysterious hacker who works as NSA. No names are quoted. The whole thing is given a hollywood-esque charm (the hacker known only as "Mudhen" (mud hen? duh!), a charming pseudonym for NSA - Puzzle Palace).
After adding sufficient soundbites to attract reader's attention, besides making one thing is it one of those devious secrets about NSA, it suddenly changes tone and highlights the achievement of NSA "spies". Charming. Other gems:
"army of cryptographers, chaos theorists"
"that may have pulled in the first piece of evidence"
"massive investigation in several countries "
And then finally a quick rundown on TCP/IP.
One could almost mistake it for communistic propaganda, if only it hailed the fatherland (or the motherland) as well...
ps: don't forget, there are no facts or figures mentioned anywhere in it well.
Slashdot Mirror
Well I understand the concerns about security, but if you have ever used such tools (and you probably might have), you'd find that these are not some "magic" tools that would do all the refactoring work for you.
1. These tools don't make decisions about what to refactor - you tell them what has to be done, they just do it for you.
2. Humans tend to introduce errors in tedious, monotonous situations.
Proficient C++ programmers are paid and valued for the knowledge they bring with themselves, which is not limited to refactoring.
Finally, by analogy, if this tool presents a threat, then so does every IDE, debugger or performance tool. I never heard of anyone losing a job because of a new IDE being introduced. Tools are there for you to use, and help you increase productivity and efficiency.Feeling threatened from them won't get you anywhere.
Oh I absolutely agree with your observations. I am in no way disinclined about the tool having to think and make informed decisions when replacing methods, variables and selection blocks and based upon access modifiers
I was just elaborating on the fact that such a refactoring tool is more than search and replace, as was mentioend.
IMHO, refactoring tools make can be quite useful in tidying up the code, be it yours or written by someone else. However, to categorize them as a glorified search/replace tool is misleading, and undermining their usefulness
Most of the features are simple search and replace operations. Just add some knowledge the compiler would have to the editor and it becomes quite easy to do
hmm... lets examine them then.
Rename
So say you want to rename A::foo() to A::bar(). But foo() is private - so the tool has to look only in the current file, while for protected the file and its children, while the entire project if its public. While its rather easier to limit private and public members, how about protected? What if there is B::foo() as well? what if B::foo() is used in A?
Extract Method
This usually works when you select a piece of code and want to extract it to a method. search and replace? umm yes. How about the method sanctity? Wouldnt the tool need to ensure your extracted method is remains unbroken? what about the variables used in the selected segment? Are they declared within the selection?
Convert Local to Field
A::foo() has "myLocal", and so has A::bar(). Upon refactoring, should "myLocal" be replaced within with the new field in A::bar() as well?
Convert Global to Field Instance
A::Global is made a field. But A::foo() has a local variable Global defined as well. Should the tool do its job silently or inform you about this?
Convert Static Method to Instance Method
ditto
I haven't read the specs of the tool, so I don't really know if it performs all this validation. I sure hope it does, if they want to sell it to anyone else other than mom and pop
Just my $0.02
If Dell (or any other vendor) started selling such "silent" PCs, a large number of calls would be "My computer does not work!" and the customer support establishing that it works, but just doesn't make any noise indicating it works!
Heck, my granny thought the new fridge was b0rked when it didn make a noise (as opposed to her quaint old one that made "comforting" noises every few minutes)
Sure, input devices is one area that has been under some scrutiny now by a lot of vendors to better devices. Unfortunately, most new devices that come out are re-designs of existing devices (a better style mouse, or keyboard wrist supports, etc), and not any significant change in the devices themselves.
However, given the innovations and improvements in all fields, rather sooner than later we will have some new devices or mechanisms of input (there is talk already of speech-based input devices).
However, I firmly believe for people in sedate, desk jobs like ours, we should exercise in one form or the other. Pick up a sport. Badminton, Squash or even Tennis aren't that easy to start with. America has a significant love for Golf, so that's not a bad option either.
Keep one of the grip-enhancers near you and you can use that whenever you have time during the day (it supinates and stresses upon your wrist and forearm muscles)
If possible, enroll in a gym. You don't have to start lifting monumental weights, but you would at least strain yourself physically, spurting muscle development and tissue regneration
If the gym is not suitable, you can do simple exercises at home - pushups, situps, crunches, chin-ups, etc all help.
All told, I sympathize with you and the work-related ailment/side effect. Science and technology do help, but I believe we all have an onus to look after our bodies as well
Wouldn't spam be the first place to look at and lockdown? Or am i missing something?
Sure there are now more patrons in public libraries courtesy of Internet-connected, free-to-use computers, video games, audio and video CDs and DVDs for hire. Oh there are books in libraries too, but the last few times I've been to the local public libraries, all I noticed was long queues of people waiting for their turn to use the computers.
An interesting side-effect was the libraries having to revisit a lot of their rules - free for all computer usage was changed to members-only usage (though membership is free), members-only usage was then revised to advanced-booking, members-only usage. Maximum number of CD/DVD issued at any time was increased from 2 to 5 (and the rental charges were reduced).
Sure, there has been a revival. But I find most of the revival centers around not the core of the library - books, but electronic/digital content that can be accessed rather cheaply there. So in that context libraries have re-invented themselves too.
There may also be a significant ripple effect - people who are waiting for their turns on computers, etc., are tempted to have a look at the shelves and might even take out the odd book. However, the fact remains that the attention spans have been reducing. Most new entrants to the libraries limit their usage to the digital offerings.
Maybe after a while when these new entrants get used to the feel of bookshelves around them, and the long waits for computer terminals imbibes enough patience to turn pages of a book, a true new revival will happen. Till then, it's a rush to get the latest DVD/CD for a week at rock-bottom prices, or an opportunity to check email for free
Who cares? Live and let live. probably the first time ever that I got a straightforward, rather sane, mild and agreeable response on /. , instead of the standard troll, calling-me-names, spewing anger and fury-filled response.
Slow news day maybe, but a refreshing change!
Mod the parent up ppl!
you know something's wrong somewhere when screenshots of a character-based interface are asked for :-
ps: no offence intended
Oh I'm sure there are plenty of Joe afficionadoes. But that's not what I'm contending at all. It's a free world (at least most of it), and people are free to have their choices and preferences
Its the bit about investing time and energy into revamping something that only the afficionadoes will use, and admire. The bit that says the project has been open for contribution for over a year with not very many feature updates. And the bit in your post itself that talks about the latest build being buggy
So it is a great editor, it has its following - but where is it going? And for how many ppl?
ah well, at least this would bring some action to an otherwise slow day at /. :-)
*ducks*
realistically, how many ppl use Joe?
Yes I've used wordstar in past. And Joe as well. But it seems to me the world has moved far far ahead in the last few years. Sure, vi and emacs lovers wouldnt even think of using any other editor, but IMO, for any serious editing purposes there already are a variety of editors available.
So perhaps, this is news for those who get a nostalgic feeling about the good-old-days. Maybe some will even d/l and give it a go, but the very fact that the this is the first major feature improvement even though the SourceForge project has been open for contributors for over a year, speaks volumes about its usage, demand and popularity.
I completely agree to the irregularities, the security problems and the violence incidents that have been reported in the past in indian elections. However, all these problems existed *before* the EVM's were in use, and *none* of these problems are related to either the technology, or the electronic machines itself...so it just goes on to show they have something americans don't !
For a moment I thought you said "why buy American voting machines? Indians will do!"....
but only for a moment...
FYI, the EVM's in India have been used for a while now, though this was indeed the first general election where they were used nation-wide.
The current reports have not mentioned anything changed from the (now) usual process of the use of EVM's, hence it is unlikely at the outset, for anything major to go wrong.
What is the impact of this on psyche of general public who is either not very informed about the technical nitty-gritties or the reasons of failures, and onto the voters on the whole?
Its further rather amazing to know a nation so well versed in technology has failed getting something right, that the world's largest democracy - India, got right (they are undergoing elections present using electronic voting machines)
Also with different counties using different versions (as reported earlier), I wonder what happened to the usual quality assurance checks that would normally be in place for such a critical application....
From the home page:
Welcome to the main page for The Fifth HOPE, sponsored by 2600. Yes, it's our fifth conference in New York City and this one threatens to be the best yet. It all takes place July 9-11, 2004, at the Hotel Pennsylvania in Manhattan So perhaps thats why they call it The Fifth Hope?
At least The Fifth Hope's website does not say anywhere that its the 10th anniversary...
What do they do about security?
1. As mentioned in the article, elephants were used to send these machines to the remote areas, and these are not connected to any central server.
2. The counting will be done at the local electoral office where usually representatives from all parties are present to ensure there is no mischief (or inaccuracy), so the machines will be stored in the local municipal/electoral offices, thereby reducing the risk of destruction due to bad weather.
3. Finally, it is incredibly hard to get hold of firearms in India - the gun laws are extremely strict, which acts as a two-edged prong - while it is relatively easy to safeguard anything (couple of armed guards usually suffice); when attacked there is not much to defend with.
(sorry about repost - somehow slashdot assumed i wasn't logged in)
Here is the link [Indian Express] that i was looking for while writing the parent. Excerpt:
According to the EC, places like Ahmedabad, Vadodara, Dohad, Panchmahals, Banaskantha, Sabarkantha, Mehsana, Keda, Anand, Gandhinagar, Patan, Bhavnagar and parts of Rajkot have been the worst-affected by communal violence. The commission will closely watch over the deployment of security forces in these areas.
Because everything in life is not necessary clearly demarcated in black and white, it is necessary to have as many parties/people/people's representatives standing up for being counted in the Indian "general" election.
:-)
1. If the people of a constituency are unhappy with all the major parties, they can choose to elect an "independent" candidate - a candidate who does not belong to any political party and contends the election on his own agenda.
2. If enough number of people feel their voices are not being heard, they can nominate and then fruther elect their own (independent) candidate. There have been incidents in the past where candidates belonging to a particular caste, social or economic strata or even sex (not just men or women, there have been several eunuchs who have stood up and contested elections because they felt the state did not treat them right).
3. These independent candidates can then choose to continue standing alone, or as is the usual case, if elected, join another political party but carrying their own agenda and political weight with them. Of course, they also do this simply for money
4. Of course, with more political parties, there is more mayhem. The current BJP government was once "in power" for only 13 days because it failed to prove its majority in the general assembly (that is, it did not have enough elected candidates supporting it)
I don't think having multiple political parties is all good. Yet, I firmly believe it emphasizes the true notion of democracy
That is still a big if. It's funny we are worried about fraud on our e-voting machines. They are worried about fights
You're right there. There are electorates that are prone to violence. Every year the government takes a lot of measures to try and curb these, and although the entire process is relatively peaceful in most of the country, there are incidents of violence, some of which are serious. Before every general elections, the Election Commission identifies certain violence-prone areas and makes efforts to deploy additional security forces to those areas
But these incidents have been happening since a long time, even when there was a manual voting process.
An elephant carrying a voting machine. Even in my wildest dreams I never would have thought of that. Again, it may be hard for a westerner (for Indians, the term implies not only Americans, but Europeans as well) to believe this, but there are parts of the country that are either very inaccessible, or poorly developed or both. Natural elements play a vital role as well - there are certain parts of the country that are prone to landslides, floods and cloudbursts in the same season and most systems breakdown (at least whatever we have there).
Ultimately, we end up resorting to rather un-natural or the "old" means of conveyance, be it riding elephants.
It may seem amusing or shocking, but using elephants isn't very different than bullock carts (which were and still are used in certain parts of the country).
Or maybe the very mention of elephants reminds you of a zoo and/or brings about images of a oriental land of snake charmers?
Just a joke, lads. In India "Singh" is like "Smith" in the West.
Not true at all. Unlike in the west, or maybe rather more clearly than in the west, the surnames in India provide a fairl idea of the religious beliefs or sect a person belongs to. This may seem bizarre to the western mind of course, but rather than delve into the history behind it, let me just tell you that "Singh" is a very small part of the surnames you'd come across. Ask anyone in UK - they'd have heard of more "Patel"s.
Like I heard on BBC, muslims form a "vast" majority - 120 million of them live in India. Its a big country and with a billion citizens, you ma easily be mislead if you come across only one particular group/clan of people
is that bad? IMO, it's development only advances the core principle (information wants to be free - read that in caps please as the website says).
;-)
Or is that bad those outsourcing heathens in India are doing open source work as well?
The quoted article seems kinda wierd to me.
The article starts off with a diabolically, highlighting the boast of a mysterious hacker who works as NSA. No names are quoted. The whole thing is given a hollywood-esque charm (the hacker known only as "Mudhen" (mud hen? duh!), a charming pseudonym for NSA - Puzzle Palace).
After adding sufficient soundbites to attract reader's attention, besides making one thing is it one of those devious secrets about NSA, it suddenly changes tone and highlights the achievement of NSA "spies". Charming. Other gems:
"army of cryptographers, chaos theorists"
"that may have pulled in the first piece of evidence"
"massive investigation in several countries "
And then finally a quick rundown on TCP/IP.
One could almost mistake it for communistic propaganda, if only it hailed the fatherland (or the motherland) as well...
ps: don't forget, there are no facts or figures mentioned anywhere in it well.