Let me break it to you: you are clueless and ignorant. Have you ever terraformed anything? Ever built a spacecraft? A habitat? A Dyson motor? A emDrive? Hell, ever built a shed? How about any of the other myriad of Space Nutter miracle technology they find on websites? Reading wikipedia pages about Dyson whatsits is not "informing" yourself. They are written by Space Nutters just like you, and they are thought experiments, not real things.
At least I know I am clueless and ignorant. What I hate about Space Nutters is how they spout off about things they know nothing about an pretend their "research" is anything else than reading Space Nutter websites. It is the arrogance of the worst sort. Typical of coders in the tech industry who think because they earn a six figure income building websites they "know" more than everyone else.
You belong with the flat earthers because they are anti-science just like you. You are a SCIFI fan. That is OK (I am one too), but I don't mix scifi with reality. I know real science and engineering is hard. It isn't just software.
There you go: the old Space Nutter argument "since one thing happened everything must be possible". You forgot "since we were able to go to the New World we can go anywhere", and "people like you once said people couldn't fly past the speed of sound".
"I am going on a limb to say that the challenges to get a craft in Venus' atmosphere (call it a city, a probe, a station, w/e) isn't technological right now."
Typical Space Nutter response. Then GO DO IT. Go demonstrate it. Build a small container that imitates Venus and put a "craft" in there and see how far you get. You can't even do that ON EARTH. Yet you guys always say "there is nothing stopping us". Right. I guess the "other people" who are actually working on space exploration are too lazy or something.
"Real research" is not reading Space Nutter blogs about nonsense like O'Neill Space Stations and Dyson widgets. I knew you were a coder. Only software people think like you do.
Did you build those cities and countries? I am asking YOU the Space Nutters to go build it. Go try to terraform SOMETHING. A little place in the desert, covered by a dome. Make it self-sustaining. Let us know if that works.
What qualifies me is that I have a basic education in science and engineering. I am not a genius, but a normal person who can separate reality from scifi.
Yes. I am much better informed than Space Nutters because I have a basic education. Not a great education, but a basic one. I know that things like moving Venus to another orbit using Dyson motors is space nutter fantasy.
Did you build Phoenix? I am asking YOU (Mr. Space Nutter) to do it. Go and build a small dome in the desert and try to terraform it using all the methods you have described in your Space Nutter fantasy websites. Come back and let us know how it turned out. Once you do that, you can do it in Spaaaaaaaaaaace!
Oh so a Dyson Motor is just a concept? How come Space Nutters never get around to building these concepts? I mean, they are revolutionary! Don't you want to live on Mars/Venus?
No I am not asking if "we can do that". I am asking you SPACE NUTTERS to go "do it". You will quickly learn that even the most "simple task" is hard to do in the real world. Build a small dome in the desert (not big, try 10 meter by 10 meter). Try to terraform it with your terraform machinery or Dyson whatzits or emDrives or whatever. Then report back how well you did. After that you can work on moving Venus to another orbit or whatever your Space Nutter websites want NASA to do.
No, the difference between people like you and me (and normal people) is that we can separate fantasy from reality. You guys just read websites and think "that sounds doable", or "that is reality". The difference between you and PEOPLE WHO ACTUALLY WORK ON SPACE TECHNOLOGY don't sit around thinking "why don't we just colonize Venus? We have the technology!" You Space Nutters do a disservice to all people who work hard every day to build real technology, which you sit back and read websites and wonder why the "morons at NASA" aren't out mining asteroids and fulfilling your Space Nutter fantasies. Time to grow up. Take a patch of land in the desert. Build a dome over it and make the atmosphere like Mars. Try to "terraform" it with your magical terraforming machines and Dyson motors. Let us know when you are done.
You are right: because one thing is possible ALL things are possible! My mistake. Say, have you guys terraformed that patch of desert yet? Made it livable? I can't wait to visit it soon.
Great. So it should be really easy for you to simulate building a miniature levitating city here on Earth in a container that simulates Venus. Even a 3 meter square one. Let us know when you are done.
Yeah, I need to read some more websites about Dyson Sphere, emDrives, mining asteroids, space factories, O'neill stations in order to be educated. While I do that, you try to terraform a small patch of land in the desert and make it livable. We will report back in a year and see how we get on ok?
Let me ask you a simple question: when you say "yes, it can be terraformed", where do you have proof of that? Have you ever terraformed any patch of land? Forget about an entire planet. Go try to terraform a 1km square of desert first and make it livable. Also, where can I purchase your Dyson Motor so I can start experimenting with it?
That is one thing we agree with: that wiki page WAS just the start. There are tons of websites created by bored website programmers/tech guys who dream of escaping the human race while they watch Star Trek reruns. You guys rehash the same crap over and over again. Floating cities on Venus. Terraforming entire planets. Building cave colonies on Mars. Meanwhile our water sources are becoming increasingly polluted on Earth and the threat of climate change and pollution is real. Why not try to solve these problems instead of fantasizing about leaving it? You aren't going anywhere, you might as well come outside and help.
Then you aren't hanging out in the right forums. Floating Venusian cities are a perfectly plausible idea.
The technical challenges would be WAY easier than a Martian settlement.
Here is a challenge to you Space Nutters: try building a miniature levitating city here on Earth in a container that simulates Venus. Even a 3 meter square one. Let us know when you are done.
But I am educated at the same level as you: you showed me the wikipedia page. So your plan is to terraform Venus and to live on the surface? Why don't you try to terraform some place on Earth first just to try it out? Like take a patch of the harshest desert and try to transform it into something livable. Then we can talk about terraforming another planet. Hint: it will be 1,000,000,000,000x harder than what you did in the desert.
Take slashdot (or hackernews, or various subreddits) for example, entire communities of self-styled technology enthusiasts who went to university, maybe got a CS degree, then they get a job writing HTML and javascript, maybe install Linux on their PC's. Despite having meager tech skills, they consider themselves "experts", and they go online and start talking to others with similar levels of "skill", and eventually you get this concentrated collection of guys who's lack of actual real world knowledge is only matched by their over confidence. Eventually that overconfidence combined with general ignorance overwhelms their ability to reason and think critically about new ideas, and that makes them the perfect marks. They have an unwillingness to admit doubt and at the same time they protect themselves by moderating away dissenting comments so forums like this become feedback loops of bad ideas getting good coverage and voila: more suckers are born. Of course this isn't unique to tech, it just seems to have found a natural home in it.
Bingo. Just because you make six figures building websites doesn't mean you know anything about colonizing space (or anything really).
Slashdot Mirror
" Because you're you that makes you inherently more qualified then every other person that probably has the same fucking credentials as you do. "
Correct. Because I have a basic education in science and engineering I am more qualified to comment on Space Nutter issues than people who do not.
Let me break it to you: you are clueless and ignorant. Have you ever terraformed anything? Ever built a spacecraft? A habitat? A Dyson motor? A emDrive? Hell, ever built a shed? How about any of the other myriad of Space Nutter miracle technology they find on websites? Reading wikipedia pages about Dyson whatsits is not "informing" yourself. They are written by Space Nutters just like you, and they are thought experiments, not real things.
At least I know I am clueless and ignorant. What I hate about Space Nutters is how they spout off about things they know nothing about an pretend their "research" is anything else than reading Space Nutter websites. It is the arrogance of the worst sort. Typical of coders in the tech industry who think because they earn a six figure income building websites they "know" more than everyone else.
You belong with the flat earthers because they are anti-science just like you. You are a SCIFI fan. That is OK (I am one too), but I don't mix scifi with reality. I know real science and engineering is hard. It isn't just software.
There you go: the old Space Nutter argument "since one thing happened everything must be possible". You forgot "since we were able to go to the New World we can go anywhere", and "people like you once said people couldn't fly past the speed of sound".
Piece of cake.
Sums up every Space Nutter post, ever.
"I am going on a limb to say that the challenges to get a craft in Venus' atmosphere (call it a city, a probe, a station, w/e) isn't technological right now."
Typical Space Nutter response. Then GO DO IT. Go demonstrate it. Build a small container that imitates Venus and put a "craft" in there and see how far you get. You can't even do that ON EARTH. Yet you guys always say "there is nothing stopping us". Right. I guess the "other people" who are actually working on space exploration are too lazy or something.
"Real research" is not reading Space Nutter blogs about nonsense like O'Neill Space Stations and Dyson widgets. I knew you were a coder. Only software people think like you do.
Did you build those cities and countries? I am asking YOU the Space Nutters to go build it. Go try to terraform SOMETHING. A little place in the desert, covered by a dome. Make it self-sustaining. Let us know if that works.
What qualifies me is that I have a basic education in science and engineering. I am not a genius, but a normal person who can separate reality from scifi.
Yes. I am much better informed than Space Nutters because I have a basic education. Not a great education, but a basic one. I know that things like moving Venus to another orbit using Dyson motors is space nutter fantasy.
Did you build Phoenix? I am asking YOU (Mr. Space Nutter) to do it. Go and build a small dome in the desert and try to terraform it using all the methods you have described in your Space Nutter fantasy websites. Come back and let us know how it turned out. Once you do that, you can do it in Spaaaaaaaaaaace!
Oh so a Dyson Motor is just a concept? How come Space Nutters never get around to building these concepts? I mean, they are revolutionary! Don't you want to live on Mars/Venus?
No I am not asking if "we can do that". I am asking you SPACE NUTTERS to go "do it". You will quickly learn that even the most "simple task" is hard to do in the real world. Build a small dome in the desert (not big, try 10 meter by 10 meter). Try to terraform it with your terraform machinery or Dyson whatzits or emDrives or whatever. Then report back how well you did. After that you can work on moving Venus to another orbit or whatever your Space Nutter websites want NASA to do.
No, the difference between people like you and me (and normal people) is that we can separate fantasy from reality. You guys just read websites and think "that sounds doable", or "that is reality". The difference between you and PEOPLE WHO ACTUALLY WORK ON SPACE TECHNOLOGY don't sit around thinking "why don't we just colonize Venus? We have the technology!" You Space Nutters do a disservice to all people who work hard every day to build real technology, which you sit back and read websites and wonder why the "morons at NASA" aren't out mining asteroids and fulfilling your Space Nutter fantasies. Time to grow up. Take a patch of land in the desert. Build a dome over it and make the atmosphere like Mars. Try to "terraform" it with your magical terraforming machines and Dyson motors. Let us know when you are done.
You are right: because one thing is possible ALL things are possible! My mistake. Say, have you guys terraformed that patch of desert yet? Made it livable? I can't wait to visit it soon.
Great. So it should be really easy for you to simulate building a miniature levitating city here on Earth in a container that simulates Venus. Even a 3 meter square one. Let us know when you are done.
Yeah, I need to read some more websites about Dyson Sphere, emDrives, mining asteroids, space factories, O'neill stations in order to be educated. While I do that, you try to terraform a small patch of land in the desert and make it livable. We will report back in a year and see how we get on ok?
A Dyson Motor is either a vacuum motor, or a Space Nutter imaginary thought experiment like the Dyson Sphere.
I didn't think of that. That might explain a lot.
Let me ask you a simple question: when you say "yes, it can be terraformed", where do you have proof of that? Have you ever terraformed any patch of land? Forget about an entire planet. Go try to terraform a 1km square of desert first and make it livable. Also, where can I purchase your Dyson Motor so I can start experimenting with it?
That is one thing we agree with: that wiki page WAS just the start. There are tons of websites created by bored website programmers/tech guys who dream of escaping the human race while they watch Star Trek reruns. You guys rehash the same crap over and over again. Floating cities on Venus. Terraforming entire planets. Building cave colonies on Mars. Meanwhile our water sources are becoming increasingly polluted on Earth and the threat of climate change and pollution is real. Why not try to solve these problems instead of fantasizing about leaving it? You aren't going anywhere, you might as well come outside and help.
Then you aren't hanging out in the right forums. Floating Venusian cities are a perfectly plausible idea.
The technical challenges would be WAY easier than a Martian settlement.
Here is a challenge to you Space Nutters: try building a miniature levitating city here on Earth in a container that simulates Venus. Even a 3 meter square one. Let us know when you are done.
But I am educated at the same level as you: you showed me the wikipedia page. So your plan is to terraform Venus and to live on the surface? Why don't you try to terraform some place on Earth first just to try it out? Like take a patch of the harshest desert and try to transform it into something livable. Then we can talk about terraforming another planet. Hint: it will be 1,000,000,000,000x harder than what you did in the desert.
Take slashdot (or hackernews, or various subreddits) for example, entire communities of self-styled technology enthusiasts who went to university, maybe got a CS degree, then they get a job writing HTML and javascript, maybe install Linux on their PC's. Despite having meager tech skills, they consider themselves "experts", and they go online and start talking to others with similar levels of "skill", and eventually you get this concentrated collection of guys who's lack of actual real world knowledge is only matched by their over confidence. Eventually that overconfidence combined with general ignorance overwhelms their ability to reason and think critically about new ideas, and that makes them the perfect marks. They have an unwillingness to admit doubt and at the same time they protect themselves by moderating away dissenting comments so forums like this become feedback loops of bad ideas getting good coverage and voila: more suckers are born. Of course this isn't unique to tech, it just seems to have found a natural home in it.
Bingo. Just because you make six figures building websites doesn't mean you know anything about colonizing space (or anything really).