as I said, it was pre 10.3 and, even if it supports all those, Israel and other countries that I've heard have problems are major parts of the computing world. For examply, Intel's first non-US chip factory was in Israel. Not that I love Israel (I'm just an American stuck here), but their computer per capita levels are HIGH (don't remember numbers) and their competency levels among 20-somethings is impressive (I know this teaching basic use and as a technician here.
the point is, this entire mission is filled with doodads that you'll see once the mission enters it's active phase. ALOT of effort went into making it interesting, not just scientific.
This reminds me of an article I once read about win98SE. SE was a stopgap to keep people from getting impatient while major work was done for ME. Whether ME was an improvement on 98SE is debateable, but it still shows how in our computing society and instant fix culture, the fact that nerds and otherwise can't wait an extra year has become such a pain in the big company's backsides that they actually release unfinished products (however well it worked out in that instance).
My problem with OSX is it's lack of support for international application. I was recently in the US, and couldn't send email in Hebrew, because OSX didn't support it. Not only that, but it displayed hebrew webpages as gibberish. Now, I could figure out what to do to log into my webmail account from back home (Jerusalem), but I couldn't tell which form button was 'Clear' and which was 'Send' on the compose page!
We actually paid for a call to mac tech support to get help, and after 20 mins on hold while the tech looked for a fix, nothing. In the end, after 5 hours of attempts, patch downloads etc, we just went to a library, and I had my email answered (in english, lol) within 15 mins (after a 20 min wait for a free machine, but still). There is a way to read the text in OS X, but it involves copy/pasting into a text editor, which wouldn't work for HTML forms, of course. which button was 'clear' and which was 'send'? I found out the hard way 3 times. Now that I read more of your message, I realize you said Hebrew 'might not work'. oops! This seems wierd to me, as a very high percent of israeli homes have computers, and there (used to be) a small but decent mac market here. Strangely, it died a bit after the release of OS X, as I recall. I wonder why...
I also know for a fact that many middle eastern languages have the same problems in OS X, though certainly not all.
That's a major fix Mac will need to make if it ever plans to get popular with businesspeople on an international scale (and on a major level, even on a domestic scale).
ummmmmmmm.... you wouldn't be able to see anything without an EXPENSIVE camera, which adds weight (another $50000 a pound), and so forth.
as for attracting our interest, have you been paying any attention? The Mars Sundial, for one, is very public friendly. there are so many cool things on this mission.
You wouldn't see a thing with a camera. Space is black, remember? the stars would need a HIGH resolution camera. the lens would burn up on entry (ever notice how the shuttle cams turn to static?) and could knock around, causing problems. In short, your idea != good.
well that's simple (the why, not the stupid beetle jokes).
the beagle 2 was attached to the Mars Express craft, on which it piggybacked to mars. We didn't need 2 of that. It was designed to go with Mars Express, so a second rover would have been a complete redesign. Why piggyback? it's cheaper.
as for the testing on the NASA rovers, it was EXTREMELY extensive, far more than any orevious craft ever launched by Earth.
well, it had a CHANCE. Don't be so impatient. whether it's next week or in 3 years or in 20 years, we'll probably know n our lifetimes. You know, once we know there's life, we can't imagine so much anymore. I'd love to know, but I'm not in a hige hurry to lose that.
Well......
I dissagree. NASA is looking for the right spots for future missions. That's what the project scientists are saying anyway, and I tend to believe them.
Isn't it obvious that these stupid 'Martians hate us' jokes are getting old? Isn't it obvious that the moderators are sick of em (hence the lack of 'Funny' classifications)? ENOUGH IS ENOUGH!
JEEZ!
The two mars rovers probably have a better chance of success than the (possibly) failed Beagle 2. Let's consider why:
Beagle 2 was built on a shoestring budget. Many aspects weren't tested to the extent the NASA rovers were. Example: the Beagle 2 parachute was designed in 8 weeks (as I recall; I may be a bit off here) after the original was revealed to be seriously flawed in the late planning stages. because of time constraints, the parachute was not extensively tested. It was similar with the protective balloons. On the other hand, the NASA rovers (which are virtually identical) were tested for years, every aspect tested again and again, as you can see by listening to the wonderful project scientist interviews at http://www.planetary.org/radio/ (a great group of space related radio shows.... gooooooood good stuff). The extensive testing in the NASA Mars Rover missions wasn't cheap, but there is no major flaw that engineers are 'hoping won't screw us up', unlike (possibly) Beagle 2. With enough luck (we need it, because let's face it, Mars is far away), thse 2 missions will do great. And hey, even if one fails, that's why we've got two!
You're right, of course. I noticed that seconds after posting, but couldn't edit my post or post a retraction, due to posting limits on/.
The link I posted was just a quick browse through google, not a real search (was in a hurry).
Anyway, with the right version, Windows does beat every other OS I've heard about in interface and input language in the areas of ease of switching and compatability.
arabic and hebrew are very, very similar:
FATHER:
arabic: ab
hebrew: av (the v in hebrew is the same letter used for b)
Salam, Shallom
et cetera. It continuously shocks me how close our languages are, and how far apart we are as 'peoples'. Ah well.
with XP, not if you have the 'Windows Multilingual User Interface Pack', which works like a charm to change the interface lang without reboot. And guess what? it's free.
>I guess my point is, if Windows does it, then Linux can probably also do it, faster, better, and without crashing as often (there, I think I saved my slashdot reputation).
Maybe, but I'm still waiting for it. I've had a similar problem with a swedish computer that got stuck every 10 secs. The guy had 4 comps, all with various problems, and the thing was that he was too computer illiterate to translate for me. he translates a popup as a 'mistake'... "Did you mean 'error'"? "Yeah! Error! That sounds plausible!"
at the end of the whole thing he paid me (well, I might add), and promptly reversed all the changes I made to fix his system, and it was getting stuck again, and of course he blamed your truly, and I had to do it over again. Fixing foreign computers is a bitch, but at least you had a manageable system. The one I worked on was Win98, which has no multiple interface language support. I learned some swedish that day (which I promptly forgot).
Actually, OS X has many problems. Let me cite you an example: I was recently in the US visiting relatives, and needed to check my email through a web interface that was in hebrew. In OS X, that's a no go. We actually paid for a call to mac tech support to get help, and after 20 mins on hold while the tech looked for a fix, nothing. In the end, after 5 hours of attempts, patch downloads etc, we just went to a library, and I had my email answered (in english, lol) within 15 mins (after a 20 min wait for a free machine, but still). There is a way to read the text in OS X, but it involves copy/pasting into a text editor, which wouldn't work for HTML forms, of course. which button was 'clear' and which was 'send'? I found out the hard way 3 times. Now that I read more of your message, I realize you said Hebrew 'might not work'. oops! This seems wierd to me, as a very high percent of israeli homes have computers, and there (used to be) a small but decent mac market here. Strangely, it died a bit after the release of OS X, as I recall. I wonder why...
I also know for a fact that many middle eastern languages have the same problems in OS X, though certainly not all.
Let's face it. Windows is much better at languages than Mac. Ah well.
As an American in Israel, and a computer tech, I'm asked this a LOT. It's quite simple. Storebought or homemade stickers with the alternate language letters can be applied to any keyboard, and here (in Israel) all keyboards come with the foreign letters printed on the keys in ADDITION to English. In fact the keyboard I'm using to type this has both Hebrew and English. As you can see, multiple keyboards are un-neccessary (not to mention tedious).
Windows XP (pro, at least) has a very simple function to effortlessly switch languages of the GUI and/or text input. Simply open the control panel, go to 'Regional and Language Options', go to the 'Languages' tab, and under 'Text Services and Input Languages', click the 'Details' button. Under 'Installed Services', click 'Add' and select the languages you want available, together with the appropriate keyboard layout (you can just leave that alone if you don't understand it). Now, at the bottom you can click the 'Key Settings...' button and choose the hotkey to switch languages (the default being alt+shift). Now click OK, and again OK. Congratulations! Now, when you hit alt+shift (or whatever you chose) you'll stitch languages, and it'll go from 'left to right' to 'right to left' automatically (though you may need to insert a line break for it to do so... some automatic, eh?)
What I've described so far is applicable to all XP versions, and is similar all the way back to 95 (though easiest in XP and 2k).
Now, as for switching interface language (menus and dialog), this is where it gets sticky. I don't have the 'Windows Multilingual User Interface Pack', but I do have a help file that explains how to use it, and I believe this is an easy product to acquire (I've seen it on many preinstalled systems).
Step 1) Open Regional and Language Options in Control Panel.
Step 2) On the Languages tab, under Language used in menus and dialogs, click the language you want.
This works like a charm, with no restart.
After many problems in pre Win2k OS's, Microsoft finally got it right.
All the steps I've described sound complicated, but are actually very quick and easy.
I'll monitor this thread, so post any questions/comments in reply to this msg and I'll respond asap.
The sundial was justy ADDED to a circular instrument that was gonna be used for calibration... the actual sundial has nothing to do with the calibration. it just occupies the same space. Learn more by listening to the Bill Nye interview at planetary.org/radio
Slashdot Mirror
as I said, it was pre 10.3 and, even if it supports all those, Israel and other countries that I've heard have problems are major parts of the computing world. For examply, Intel's first non-US chip factory was in Israel. Not that I love Israel (I'm just an American stuck here), but their computer per capita levels are HIGH (don't remember numbers) and their competency levels among 20-somethings is impressive (I know this teaching basic use and as a technician here.
IE, Safari and Netscape were all tried. We did use an old comp with OS 9.x and it worked fine...... lol
the point is, this entire mission is filled with doodads that you'll see once the mission enters it's active phase. ALOT of effort went into making it interesting, not just scientific.
This reminds me of an article I once read about win98SE. SE was a stopgap to keep people from getting impatient while major work was done for ME. Whether ME was an improvement on 98SE is debateable, but it still shows how in our computing society and instant fix culture, the fact that nerds and otherwise can't wait an extra year has become such a pain in the big company's backsides that they actually release unfinished products (however well it worked out in that instance).
I should note that that experience was pre 10.3. Not sure if 10, 10.1 or 10.2 because I'm not a mac person.
We actually paid for a call to mac tech support to get help, and after 20 mins on hold while the tech looked for a fix, nothing. In the end, after 5 hours of attempts, patch downloads etc, we just went to a library, and I had my email answered (in english, lol) within 15 mins (after a 20 min wait for a free machine, but still). There is a way to read the text in OS X, but it involves copy/pasting into a text editor, which wouldn't work for HTML forms, of course. which button was 'clear' and which was 'send'? I found out the hard way 3 times. Now that I read more of your message, I realize you said Hebrew 'might not work'. oops! This seems wierd to me, as a very high percent of israeli homes have computers, and there (used to be) a small but decent mac market here. Strangely, it died a bit after the release of OS X, as I recall. I wonder why...
I also know for a fact that many middle eastern languages have the same problems in OS X, though certainly not all.
That's a major fix Mac will need to make if it ever plans to get popular with businesspeople on an international scale (and on a major level, even on a domestic scale).
ummmmmmmm.... you wouldn't be able to see anything without an EXPENSIVE camera, which adds weight (another $50000 a pound), and so forth.
as for attracting our interest, have you been paying any attention? The Mars Sundial, for one, is very public friendly. there are so many cool things on this mission.
You wouldn't see a thing with a camera. Space is black, remember? the stars would need a HIGH resolution camera. the lens would burn up on entry (ever notice how the shuttle cams turn to static?) and could knock around, causing problems. In short, your idea != good.
Looks to be perceived based on the expected location of the craft. Don't hold me to that, though. I think it looked like that 'Celestia' thing.
yes, a 45kg umbrella sized probe certainly can make a mile wide crater *HEAVY SARCASM*
well that's simple (the why, not the stupid beetle jokes).
the beagle 2 was attached to the Mars Express craft, on which it piggybacked to mars. We didn't need 2 of that. It was designed to go with Mars Express, so a second rover would have been a complete redesign. Why piggyback? it's cheaper.
as for the testing on the NASA rovers, it was EXTREMELY extensive, far more than any orevious craft ever launched by Earth.
well, it had a CHANCE. Don't be so impatient. whether it's next week or in 3 years or in 20 years, we'll probably know n our lifetimes. You know, once we know there's life, we can't imagine so much anymore. I'd love to know, but I'm not in a hige hurry to lose that.
Well......
I dissagree. NASA is looking for the right spots for future missions. That's what the project scientists are saying anyway, and I tend to believe them.
Note that's simulated, not an actual transmitted image.
Isn't it obvious that these stupid 'Martians hate us' jokes are getting old? Isn't it obvious that the moderators are sick of em (hence the lack of 'Funny' classifications)? ENOUGH IS ENOUGH!
JEEZ!
The two mars rovers probably have a better chance of success than the (possibly) failed Beagle 2. Let's consider why:
Beagle 2 was built on a shoestring budget. Many aspects weren't tested to the extent the NASA rovers were. Example: the Beagle 2 parachute was designed in 8 weeks (as I recall; I may be a bit off here) after the original was revealed to be seriously flawed in the late planning stages. because of time constraints, the parachute was not extensively tested. It was similar with the protective balloons. On the other hand, the NASA rovers (which are virtually identical) were tested for years, every aspect tested again and again, as you can see by listening to the wonderful project scientist interviews at http://www.planetary.org/radio/ (a great group of space related radio shows.... gooooooood good stuff). The extensive testing in the NASA Mars Rover missions wasn't cheap, but there is no major flaw that engineers are 'hoping won't screw us up', unlike (possibly) Beagle 2. With enough luck (we need it, because let's face it, Mars is far away), thse 2 missions will do great. And hey, even if one fails, that's why we've got two!
well, it was a bit ago. OSX 10.1 or 10.2. Not sure, cuz I'm not a mac person, but the computer owner, my aunt, was.
The link I posted was just a quick browse through google, not a real search (was in a hurry).
Anyway, with the right version, Windows does beat every other OS I've heard about in interface and input language in the areas of ease of switching and compatability.
What about 'em?
arabic and hebrew are very, very similar:
FATHER:
arabic: ab
hebrew: av (the v in hebrew is the same letter used for b)
Salam, Shallom
et cetera. It continuously shocks me how close our languages are, and how far apart we are as 'peoples'. Ah well.
http://www.microsoft.com/windows/Embedded/xp/downl oads/mui/default.asp
Maybe, but I'm still waiting for it. I've had a similar problem with a swedish computer that got stuck every 10 secs. The guy had 4 comps, all with various problems, and the thing was that he was too computer illiterate to translate for me. he translates a popup as a 'mistake'... "Did you mean 'error'"? "Yeah! Error! That sounds plausible!"
at the end of the whole thing he paid me (well, I might add), and promptly reversed all the changes I made to fix his system, and it was getting stuck again, and of course he blamed your truly, and I had to do it over again. Fixing foreign computers is a bitch, but at least you had a manageable system. The one I worked on was Win98, which has no multiple interface language support. I learned some swedish that day (which I promptly forgot).
I also know for a fact that many middle eastern languages have the same problems in OS X, though certainly not all.
Let's face it. Windows is much better at languages than Mac. Ah well.
Windows XP (pro, at least) has a very simple function to effortlessly switch languages of the GUI and/or text input. Simply open the control panel, go to 'Regional and Language Options', go to the 'Languages' tab, and under 'Text Services and Input Languages', click the 'Details' button. Under 'Installed Services', click 'Add' and select the languages you want available, together with the appropriate keyboard layout (you can just leave that alone if you don't understand it). Now, at the bottom you can click the 'Key Settings...' button and choose the hotkey to switch languages (the default being alt+shift). Now click OK, and again OK. Congratulations! Now, when you hit alt+shift (or whatever you chose) you'll stitch languages, and it'll go from 'left to right' to 'right to left' automatically (though you may need to insert a line break for it to do so... some automatic, eh?)
What I've described so far is applicable to all XP versions, and is similar all the way back to 95 (though easiest in XP and 2k).
Now, as for switching interface language (menus and dialog), this is where it gets sticky. I don't have the 'Windows Multilingual User Interface Pack', but I do have a help file that explains how to use it, and I believe this is an easy product to acquire (I've seen it on many preinstalled systems).
Step 1) Open Regional and Language Options in Control Panel.
Step 2) On the Languages tab, under Language used in menus and dialogs, click the language you want.
This works like a charm, with no restart.
After many problems in pre Win2k OS's, Microsoft finally got it right.
All the steps I've described sound complicated, but are actually very quick and easy.
I'll monitor this thread, so post any questions/comments in reply to this msg and I'll respond asap.
--
Naomi
The sundial was justy ADDED to a circular instrument that was gonna be used for calibration... the actual sundial has nothing to do with the calibration. it just occupies the same space. Learn more by listening to the Bill Nye interview at planetary.org/radio
actually, we do! Mars Express will be looking for signs of Beagle 2 in January, if contact is not established.