a) SVG has nothing to do with text quality --- current fonts are scalable, but they are rendered by highly optimzed renderers like Freetype to apply font-specific hinting.
Resolution you idiot. Why do you think fonts need to be anti alaised.
b) OS X doesn't use vectors. Most things (widgets, etc) are still bitmaps.
When did i say OSX used vectors? I said Linux needs to use vectors to beat OSX which of course does not.
OS X doesn't render vectors via hardware. If you look at the tech docs, Quartz 2D is all CPU. OpenGL is merely used for transparency and window-level effects like genie.
We arent debating OSX here, we are talking about how to improve Linux so that its better than OSX.
An all-SVG UI wouldn't necessarily be bad, it would just not be terribly useful. First, UIs are already pretty scalable. For example, I was looking through the code for the Plastik KDE theme the other day. Most of the drawing logic is completely scalable. I was able to rip out of a lot of the hard constants and make them read via a configuration file. You change a few constants, and suddenly scollbars and spinners are wider, *and* properly rendered. All the buttons and tabs are aleady scalable, because Qt is a font-sensitive UI, and changing font-sizes can drastically affect the size of widgets.
Why should a theme creator have to create 30 different versions of their theme for different resolutions? Why should I have to run in a low resolution just because your theme does not support my high res monitor?
However, you still have to care about pixels. Resolutions are still not high enough where you can ignore them. Plastik (and other themes, presumably) still has special cases to handle small pixel shifts (think of a limited case of hinting). Even on my high res screen (133 dpi) a small shift of one pixel on a scrollbar is easily visible as a glitch.
Resolutions are high enough, I dont know what resolution you are running in, maybe you run in 800x600 or something, but my laptop goes well above that and currently on my laptop pixels look like shit compared to SVG.
2) SVG should not be used for the entire UI, that's overkill, but for many areas it makes life a lot easier. For instance, icons in SVG make them infinitely scalable, so that people can resize their screens or their icons to whatever they find comfortable with no loss of quality. (Think handicapped.) Also, no more need for Small and Large versions of icons. Just have one icon, and the system scales it to whatever size is needed.
Yeah just like having more than 64 megs of ram is overkill, I mean who could ever use more than 64 megs of ram?
Just like the 3dfx Voodoo 3 was overkill, I mean who would ever need a new video card after this?
I mean the 1ghz pentium, its definately overkill, who would ever need more than 400mhz Pentium 2?
I think what Linux needs is overkill if its to compete with the other OS's which are more modern. OSX and Longhorn will be overkill, but people want overkill and if you are to compete with overkill then you must overkill the overkillers.
Personally I want an SVG interface, I like the idea of not having to set my resolution, I like the idea of having perfect quality text, I like the eye candy of OSX, and if i have the video card to do this with absolutely no hit to speed, why shouldnt it be done? If I dont like it I'll turn it off and I'll still have a faster system which uses less ram than a pixel based GUI.
Please go into details on why SVG for the entire interface would be bad. Just because you won't use it is not a good enough reason, you need facts not opinion.
SVG is a new way to render without pixels, it requires less ram but more of a CPU hit, since our CPUs arent actually being used its a fair trade off for resolution indepedance, speed, and special effects.
It could allow Linux to compete with or even surpass OSX and Longhorn.
If we can all see this why cant they?
I dont know what their goal is with SVG, but do I really care if SVG is a Kpart if its not truely a part of KDE or X?
Everyone here please check out http://cairographics.org/
CairoGraphics is a project working on making the entire interface SVG, and allowing my state of the art graphics card to render that interface, this means speed. I don't want a cheap software rendered SVG hack which wastes CPU resources, I want it to be done right, why do we have all these SVG projects when they could just merge into one project?
The KDE team needs to do more than just adapt SVG as a plugin, they need to render the whole interface via SVG.
Maybe cairographics could be used as the backend, and KDE's UI, Icons, Widgets etc could be completely resolution indepedent and rendered via SVG.
These functions are:
1. Reload Earthstation5
2. Shutdown Earthstation5
3. Delete a File
All of these functions are necessary to perform when upgrading software.
You dont need "delete", you can just overwrite pre-existing files to upgrade.
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a) SVG has nothing to do with text quality --- current fonts are scalable, but they are rendered by highly optimzed renderers like Freetype to apply font-specific hinting. Resolution you idiot. Why do you think fonts need to be anti alaised. b) OS X doesn't use vectors. Most things (widgets, etc) are still bitmaps. When did i say OSX used vectors? I said Linux needs to use vectors to beat OSX which of course does not. OS X doesn't render vectors via hardware. If you look at the tech docs, Quartz 2D is all CPU. OpenGL is merely used for transparency and window-level effects like genie. We arent debating OSX here, we are talking about how to improve Linux so that its better than OSX. An all-SVG UI wouldn't necessarily be bad, it would just not be terribly useful. First, UIs are already pretty scalable. For example, I was looking through the code for the Plastik KDE theme the other day. Most of the drawing logic is completely scalable. I was able to rip out of a lot of the hard constants and make them read via a configuration file. You change a few constants, and suddenly scollbars and spinners are wider, *and* properly rendered. All the buttons and tabs are aleady scalable, because Qt is a font-sensitive UI, and changing font-sizes can drastically affect the size of widgets. Why should a theme creator have to create 30 different versions of their theme for different resolutions? Why should I have to run in a low resolution just because your theme does not support my high res monitor? However, you still have to care about pixels. Resolutions are still not high enough where you can ignore them. Plastik (and other themes, presumably) still has special cases to handle small pixel shifts (think of a limited case of hinting). Even on my high res screen (133 dpi) a small shift of one pixel on a scrollbar is easily visible as a glitch. Resolutions are high enough, I dont know what resolution you are running in, maybe you run in 800x600 or something, but my laptop goes well above that and currently on my laptop pixels look like shit compared to SVG.
Thats what CairoGraphics is for, its supposed to fix that problem.
Did any of you people think there might actually be Russians who come to this place? You bunch of racists! Tone it down with the jokes.
Lets be realistic.
2) SVG should not be used for the entire UI, that's overkill, but for many areas it makes life a lot easier. For instance, icons in SVG make them infinitely scalable, so that people can resize their screens or their icons to whatever they find comfortable with no loss of quality. (Think handicapped.) Also, no more need for Small and Large versions of icons. Just have one icon, and the system scales it to whatever size is needed. Yeah just like having more than 64 megs of ram is overkill, I mean who could ever use more than 64 megs of ram? Just like the 3dfx Voodoo 3 was overkill, I mean who would ever need a new video card after this? I mean the 1ghz pentium, its definately overkill, who would ever need more than 400mhz Pentium 2? I think what Linux needs is overkill if its to compete with the other OS's which are more modern. OSX and Longhorn will be overkill, but people want overkill and if you are to compete with overkill then you must overkill the overkillers. Personally I want an SVG interface, I like the idea of not having to set my resolution, I like the idea of having perfect quality text, I like the eye candy of OSX, and if i have the video card to do this with absolutely no hit to speed, why shouldnt it be done? If I dont like it I'll turn it off and I'll still have a faster system which uses less ram than a pixel based GUI. Please go into details on why SVG for the entire interface would be bad. Just because you won't use it is not a good enough reason, you need facts not opinion.
SVG is a new way to render without pixels, it requires less ram but more of a CPU hit, since our CPUs arent actually being used its a fair trade off for resolution indepedance, speed, and special effects. It could allow Linux to compete with or even surpass OSX and Longhorn.
You should be modded up because you actually have a point, the Gnome developers are the ones doing all the cutting edge stuff. Like storage http://www.gnome.org/~seth/storage/ And also they are actually attempting to use SVG to render the entire interface including widgets, not just icons. http://developers.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=03/0 2/03/129215&mode=thread&tid=152&tid=106&tid=13 1
http://librsvg.sourceforge.net/
What I dont understand is why we need 100 different SVG projects when we could get more accomplished if we all worked on cairographics.
If we can all see this why cant they? I dont know what their goal is with SVG, but do I really care if SVG is a Kpart if its not truely a part of KDE or X? Everyone here please check out http://cairographics.org/ CairoGraphics is a project working on making the entire interface SVG, and allowing my state of the art graphics card to render that interface, this means speed. I don't want a cheap software rendered SVG hack which wastes CPU resources, I want it to be done right, why do we have all these SVG projects when they could just merge into one project?
The KDE team needs to do more than just adapt SVG as a plugin, they need to render the whole interface via SVG. Maybe cairographics could be used as the backend, and KDE's UI, Icons, Widgets etc could be completely resolution indepedent and rendered via SVG.
What are you talking about pipingguy? Stop smoking the bong for a moment and think with your big brain.
Lets make them switch back to Linux with a boycott!
Overwrite the file, install a new file and ignore the old files, but why delete?
These functions are: 1. Reload Earthstation5 2. Shutdown Earthstation5 3. Delete a File All of these functions are necessary to perform when upgrading software. You dont need "delete", you can just overwrite pre-existing files to upgrade.