Research the technologies, it takes about 20 minutes, and you'll see that LTE and WiMax are nearly identical. Basically WiMax and LTE have different optimization strategies, but they operate on the same band ranges, the same equipment, etc.
The same band ranges? LTE use the 700MHz band whereas WiMax uses the 2GHz band.
LTE is still far into the future. We are currently testing LTE in some sites here in Sweden and it's quite expensive.....Wimax is a good solution until then, if it's rolled out within 2-3 years.
LTE travels further than WiMax so it doesn't need as many towers. So it should be cheaper. It can also goes through thicker or more dense objects.
LTE is just boring, ordinary consumers will never be able to set up their own private LTE base.
Just like ordinary consumers couldn't set up their own WiFi base in the past but can now, in the future ordinary people will be able to set up LTE base stations if it ever gets much pickup from people. Even geeks should know technology gets easier as tyme goes by.
All LTE will allow me to do is use up my 250MB a month data allowance even faster
So will anything that has higher speeds whether it's a new WiFi standard or LTE. You say as much in your next sentience, "The good news is that WiMax will be updated to support speeds up to 1Gbit". What standard is used shouldn't matter if you're going to exceed your bandwidth.
It's certainly written in typical bureaucrat/lawyer speak but for individuals it's a clear improvement over the current state of affairs.
And guess who's bureaucrats and lawyers were involved. I would think the average or typical person could sit down and think, heck think while walking, that any breach of privacy by any entity would be liable for damages financial or otherwise caused by that breach as well as an amount X paid to those who suffered because of it. The disagreement I see is the amount of X.
Those who would have to follow the law and regulations. That's a problem with regulations, the industry that is regulated writes those regulations. Which then helps cut their competition.
Ideally, it's something decided by the citizens of the local community, with accountability for actions. Saudi Arabia doesn't even pretend to care about personal liberty, they're a theocracy.
Saudi Arabia is still a state and you said "the degree of protection of children that the State is warranted in exercising." A state does not preclude a theocracy.
he philosophical question is the degree of protection of children that the State is warranted in exercising.
What government though? France? Iran? The Vatican? Not every government has the same ideas of what protecting the children means. In Saudi Arabia, they'd rather let girls burn to death when their school catches fire than allow them to flee the burning building without proper clothing.
You would be better off getting people to recycle old electronics than trying and let the rockets remain disposables,
I do, but the way you have it it's either or when it can be both.
because the mass of the computers and other electronics thrown out is probably a hundred times that of the rockets each year.
When I find computers, monitors, and other electronics left out for trash I collect and save it. Now if I have to pay to recycle them I'll end up with a big bill. I've thought of posting what I have on Freecycle so that those who can use things can pick them up. I'm just concerned about whether what I have still works though, and I don't have the equipment to run tests myself.
highly inefficient things like 1970's era solar cells (which cost more fuel to make than they ever put out in energy)
I don't know about the solar PVs from much of the 1970s but I found this, Can Solar Cells Ever Recapture the Energy Invested in their Manufacture?" which says the Energy Return on Energy Invested or EROEI is a few to several years. It cites one study from 1977 that concludes the payback period is 6.4 years. The longest estimate is approximately 86 months whereas the shortest is "0.9 to 1.6 years."
However none of these include the energy used in launches.
Chemical rockets are too expensive, really. You need something cheaper, and I think that anyone who knows anything agrees that space elevators, or some other transformative solution, is required to do it.
I don't know the costs of chemical rocket launches but I agree with the rest of this.
If you look into how organic food is grown, you'll soon realize that organic farms are no less "factory farms" than conventional ones.
That depends on the scale or size of the farm. There's an organic farm in my area that had to put up a fight to prevent an oil pipeline from being built right through the farm. One, though not the only one, reason they fought against the pipeline was because they didn't want heavy machinery to compact the soil and make it hard. Conventional farms would just till the ground to break it up but they didn't even want to do that.
In addition, the organic fertilizers they use are just as damaging to the environment as conventional fertilizers.
Where is your evidence? I'll provide my own now, look at the natural world. Animals eat other animals and plants. What they eliminate, piss and shit, is food for other plants and animals. The same when they die. Wildlife in the world has lasted millions of years without humans and can continue to. According to you the world should be a toxic waste dump, but the only ones that exist were created by humans.
The rest of this is FUD.
Falcon
Oh, and my question, "What organic nutcases?" was never answered. Because most of those in organics are not nutcases. The only one I see is you.
the non-lethal microwave "pain" guns developed by the military run at approx 100,000 watts.
Non-lethal? So if you're tied up or chained in front of one and can't get away while it's turned on you won't die?
The above noted pain gun still, at more than 10,000 times the energy, does not cause DNA damage, it's still only exciting water molocules to create basic heat and pain sensation in nerves responding to it.
And boiling water does not damage DNA? Then why do experts say to place baby bottles in boiling water before feeding babies? What this does is sterilize the bottles thus it damages all the DNA. A webpage from UF says "Microwave oven can sterilize sponges, scrub pads". It says "The results were unambiguous: Two minutes of microwaving on full power mode killed or inactivated more than 99 percent of all the living pathogens in the sponges and pads, although the Bacillus cereus spores required four minutes for total inactivation."
The reactor you're referring to in France is a 3rd generation reactor, the first of its kind.
It is not the first of it's kind. It is a clone of the reactor in Finland.
Subsequent reactors built on the same technology will naturally cost less and not be underbudgeted.
Except it is a subsequent reactor and is still over budget and overdue.
In a previous post you mentioned people should have more "personable responsibility" when it comes to food choices. That is a truly crass and elitist statement,
No, those who want a nanny state are crass and elitist. Only the nanny state has the wisdom to decide what people can and can not do. Now tell me how many capitalists, free market advocates, and businesses have massacred more than 10 million people, massacred or repressed more than 10 million others, or killed tens of millions more people?
And don't say the US hasn't had it's hands on anything like that. Ask the Cherokee about the Trail of Tears President Andrew Jackson forced the Cherokee to march on, in which thousands died, breaking a treaty despite the USSC ruling he was breaking the law. Ask the Sioux how many treaties the US broke with them. Ask them what happened in the Black Hills and at Wounded Knee. Ask the American Indian women who were forcibly sterilized up through the 1970s by the government. Ask the East Timorese about President Ford and Henry Kissinger's support of Indonesia's invasion of the sovereign nation of East Timor and the subsequent massacre of 200,000 East Timorese, on third of the population. Ask about Ford and Kissinger's support for the overthrow of the democratically elected in Chile by General Pinochet after which tens of thousands simply disappeared with thousands more bodies found.
I'm just not willing to get sick over those mistakes.
Then buy pasteurized milk. A free market allows that. But for those who prefer raw milk some governments blocked and made illegal their ability to buy raw milk.
All I ask is that people be allowed to make their own decision as to what risks they are willing to take, without government interference, and what risks they are not willing to take.
It also ignores the numerous new entities that will try to enter the market with substandard milk. Yes, even they will be pushed out by word of mouth, but not until they cause irreparable damage.
Have you ever heard of courts and civil lawsuits?
Have you heard of government approved drugs that have had to be withdrawn?
Do you know the government is the biggest polluter in the US? And that it passes laws allowing it to get away with polluting?
Government is the biggest threat to liberty yet you want government to have power to regulate what people do.
By the same token, at the right dosage virtually everything is safe so saying something is safe is an absurd statement as well. Florine? Some can help prevent cavities, but it can also cause Flourosis, of which there are two types. Dental Fluorosis blackens teeth and Skeletal Fluorosis makes bones brittle. Lithium is toxic yet in low doses it's used as a mood stabilizer in psychiatry.
And no study has ever found that microwave radiation causes mutations in double-helix DNA.
Can you point out where I did say microwaves cause mutations in double-helix DNA? Or did you just make that up to spread fud? Remember to be sure to include a link where I even used "double-helix DNA", that is other than this very post. I doubt you can find one.
Microwaves ovens work by vibrating molecules with unbalanced charges (causing heat), and there are specific frequency ranges that are good at that. Then there's also power levels, directionality, and the inverse square law to consider.
Microwave ovens may work like that but that does not mean microwaves do not alter, mutate, or otherwise damage DNA. Science studies have concluded microwaves don't and microwaves do alter DNA. Even the expert don't agree so to say microwaves do not affect DNA is to ignore science.
Probably the toxic nature of the clove oil makes it unsafe:-)
But I had a bottle that was labeled as being good for toothaches.
And I probably don't need to tell you it tastes awful
Actually I love the taste of clove. I love cooking with it, using it for toothaches, and I even used smoke clove cigarettes. Ah, now that I thought that I'm wishing I could light up one now. I also love the smell of camphor and eucalyptus though others say they smell too much like medicine.
Just because a crop is GM doesn't mean it is sterile, BTW.
Only if GM crops were sterile. Because they aren't superweeds are being created. These superweeds have the same resistance to herbicides as the crops that interbred with wild relatives.
Now, assuming that the fellow reseeds his crop each year (garlic is an annual, after all), one wonders why he is all that worried in any event.
Actually garlic is a perennial, it's just grown as an annual. I have some growing in my garden now and when I pick them I'll keep some of the cloves to plant next year, that's how I started the ones I planted this year. I took a bulb of garlic, broke off the cloves then planted them. Now if I leave some of the garlic in the ground they can grow back next year as well.
It's that tricky rights-of-the-children vs. rights-of-the-parents thing. I think it's pretty clear that more children will get sick from drinking raw milk than pasteurized milk, given that quality control has to vary among dairies.
First, I disagree, but actually it's more than just that. At least for infants. For infants add in mother's milk and formula. As for raw milk, I firmly believe hygiene and how the milk is handled plays a big roll. In a free market when one farmer doesn't exercise care in the handling of milk word will get out the farmer sells bad milk, especially with law suits thrown in.
I'm glad the raw milk economy is alive, my favorite creamery depends on it, but I'd also not give it to my kids unless I was really sure about the conditions it came from. Local isn't sufficient - I've gotten some milk from our local dairy on (rare) occasion that tasted of cow shit.
In part I agree. At least with a local farmer you should be able to see how operations are conducted and if you don't like them you could use another one. I don't have children myself, though I wanted 2 of my own and wanted to adopt 2, but I'm a firm believer in mother's milk and would rather use it as much as I could. Perhaps mix it and raw cows milk as well.
Also, education is far more effective than regulation.
I agree most of the tyme, but not all the tyme. Actually I believe that sometimes regulations are created to reduce or artificially keep low competition. Make staying within regulations expensive then you raise the bar on starting a business in the field being regulated. Some supporters of raw milk believe that's why laws and regulations were passed requiring milk to be pasteurized. Small dairy operators may not be able to afford to pasteurize milk, so they either stop dairy farming or they sell raw milk to someone who buys milk from a bunch of other dairy farms as well and can afford to pasteurize the milk.
Moms who are feeding their very young kids raw milk instead of breast feeding just aren't on my list of 'OK parents'.
I wonder if radiation is the reason teenagers to day are so messed up. Maybe all the cell phone use is what's screwing up their brains. I wonder where I could get a grant to do the research.
No, I don't think so. I doubt cellphones are screwing up teenagers brains, but would like to see studies. Since at least the 1990s prescriptions for teenagers with and without AHDH, attention-deficit hyperactivity disorder, have gone up.
To balance that Huffington Post article, a study by Mayo Clinic researchers found that treatment with prescription stimulants is associated with improved long-term academic success of children with ADHD."
Last time I checked, the laws of physics still reigned supreme, and microwaves will not cause genetic damage to his plants.
You'd better tell all the scientists you know better than they do. They have studies that conclude that microwaves do affect DNA. Then again there are disagreement even between those who research the subject, and with it being like that saying there is no affect is not scientifically accurate.
Almost as crazy as another farmer in the area that was neglecting his cattle and claimed a national defense helicopter contaminated his land causing him to loose his organic farming status.
To be fair, that articles doesn't say whether the farmer did lose organic certification. Now I'm not condoning what he did, I personally hate the abuse, misuse, and neglect of animals, but I wanted to point out that something was missing.
Slashdot Mirror
Research the technologies, it takes about 20 minutes, and you'll see that LTE and WiMax are nearly identical. Basically WiMax and LTE have different optimization strategies, but they operate on the same band ranges, the same equipment, etc.
The same band ranges? LTE use the 700MHz band whereas WiMax uses the 2GHz band.
Falcon
LTE is still far into the future. We are currently testing LTE in some sites here in Sweden and it's quite expensive.....Wimax is a good solution until then, if it's rolled out within 2-3 years.
LTE travels further than WiMax so it doesn't need as many towers. So it should be cheaper. It can also goes through thicker or more dense objects.
Falcon
Even if there were no reliability or speed issues,why would I choose a slower service for about the same price?
You may not have a problem but some of us want mobile broadband.
Falcon
LTE is just boring, ordinary consumers will never be able to set up their own private LTE base.
Just like ordinary consumers couldn't set up their own WiFi base in the past but can now, in the future ordinary people will be able to set up LTE base stations if it ever gets much pickup from people. Even geeks should know technology gets easier as tyme goes by.
All LTE will allow me to do is use up my 250MB a month data allowance even faster
So will anything that has higher speeds whether it's a new WiFi standard or LTE. You say as much in your next sentience, "The good news is that WiMax will be updated to support speeds up to 1Gbit". What standard is used shouldn't matter if you're going to exceed your bandwidth.
Falcon
It's certainly written in typical bureaucrat/lawyer speak but for individuals it's a clear improvement over the current state of affairs.
And guess who's bureaucrats and lawyers were involved. I would think the average or typical person could sit down and think, heck think while walking, that any breach of privacy by any entity would be liable for damages financial or otherwise caused by that breach as well as an amount X paid to those who suffered because of it. The disagreement I see is the amount of X.
Falcon
Guess who wrote or helped write the law...
Those who would have to follow the law and regulations. That's a problem with regulations, the industry that is regulated writes those regulations. Which then helps cut their competition.
Falcon
Ideally, it's something decided by the citizens of the local community, with accountability for actions. Saudi Arabia doesn't even pretend to care about personal liberty, they're a theocracy.
Saudi Arabia is still a state and you said "the degree of protection of children that the State is warranted in exercising." A state does not preclude a theocracy.
Falcon
he philosophical question is the degree of protection of children that the State is warranted in exercising.
What government though? France? Iran? The Vatican? Not every government has the same ideas of what protecting the children means. In Saudi Arabia, they'd rather let girls burn to death when their school catches fire than allow them to flee the burning building without proper clothing.
Falcon
Most preservatives are DNA mutagens too - just gotta balance the cancer risk vs. the salmonella risk (ce'st la vie, right?).
As long as it's the individuals who decide what risks they're willing to take (J'ne oblege moi Francious, darn I don't recall my French).
Falcon
You would be better off getting people to recycle old electronics than trying and let the rockets remain disposables,
I do, but the way you have it it's either or when it can be both.
because the mass of the computers and other electronics thrown out is probably a hundred times that of the rockets each year.
When I find computers, monitors, and other electronics left out for trash I collect and save it. Now if I have to pay to recycle them I'll end up with a big bill. I've thought of posting what I have on Freecycle so that those who can use things can pick them up. I'm just concerned about whether what I have still works though, and I don't have the equipment to run tests myself.
highly inefficient things like 1970's era solar cells (which cost more fuel to make than they ever put out in energy)
I don't know about the solar PVs from much of the 1970s but I found this, Can Solar Cells Ever Recapture the Energy Invested in their Manufacture?" which says the Energy Return on Energy Invested or EROEI is a few to several years. It cites one study from 1977 that concludes the payback period is 6.4 years. The longest estimate is approximately 86 months whereas the shortest is "0.9 to 1.6 years."
However none of these include the energy used in launches.
Chemical rockets are too expensive, really. You need something cheaper, and I think that anyone who knows anything agrees that space elevators, or some other transformative solution, is required to do it.
I don't know the costs of chemical rocket launches but I agree with the rest of this.
Falcon
If you look into how organic food is grown, you'll soon realize that organic farms are no less "factory farms" than conventional ones.
That depends on the scale or size of the farm. There's an organic farm in my area that had to put up a fight to prevent an oil pipeline from being built right through the farm. One, though not the only one, reason they fought against the pipeline was because they didn't want heavy machinery to compact the soil and make it hard. Conventional farms would just till the ground to break it up but they didn't even want to do that.
In addition, the organic fertilizers they use are just as damaging to the environment as conventional fertilizers.
Where is your evidence? I'll provide my own now, look at the natural world. Animals eat other animals and plants. What they eliminate, piss and shit, is food for other plants and animals. The same when they die. Wildlife in the world has lasted millions of years without humans and can continue to. According to you the world should be a toxic waste dump, but the only ones that exist were created by humans.
The rest of this is FUD.
Falcon
Oh, and my question, "What organic nutcases?" was never answered. Because most of those in organics are not nutcases. The only one I see is you.
the non-lethal microwave "pain" guns developed by the military run at approx 100,000 watts.
Non-lethal? So if you're tied up or chained in front of one and can't get away while it's turned on you won't die?
The above noted pain gun still, at more than 10,000 times the energy, does not cause DNA damage, it's still only exciting water molocules to create basic heat and pain sensation in nerves responding to it.
And boiling water does not damage DNA? Then why do experts say to place baby bottles in boiling water before feeding babies? What this does is sterilize the bottles thus it damages all the DNA. A webpage from UF says "Microwave oven can sterilize sponges, scrub pads". It says "The results were unambiguous: Two minutes of microwaving on full power mode killed or inactivated more than 99 percent of all the living pathogens in the sponges and pads, although the Bacillus cereus spores required four minutes for total inactivation."
You don't think the DNA is being damaged?
Falcon
The reactor you're referring to in France is a 3rd generation reactor, the first of its kind.
It is not the first of it's kind. It is a clone of the reactor in Finland.
Subsequent reactors built on the same technology will naturally cost less and not be underbudgeted.
Except it is a subsequent reactor and is still over budget and overdue.
In a previous post you mentioned people should have more "personable responsibility" when it comes to food choices. That is a truly crass and elitist statement,
No, those who want a nanny state are crass and elitist. Only the nanny state has the wisdom to decide what people can and can not do. Now tell me how many capitalists, free market advocates, and businesses have massacred more than 10 million people, massacred or repressed more than 10 million others, or killed tens of millions more people?
And don't say the US hasn't had it's hands on anything like that. Ask the Cherokee about the Trail of Tears President Andrew Jackson forced the Cherokee to march on, in which thousands died, breaking a treaty despite the USSC ruling he was breaking the law. Ask the Sioux how many treaties the US broke with them. Ask them what happened in the Black Hills and at Wounded Knee. Ask the American Indian women who were forcibly sterilized up through the 1970s by the government. Ask the East Timorese about President Ford and Henry Kissinger's support of Indonesia's invasion of the sovereign nation of East Timor and the subsequent massacre of 200,000 East Timorese, on third of the population. Ask about Ford and Kissinger's support for the overthrow of the democratically elected in Chile by General Pinochet after which tens of thousands simply disappeared with thousands more bodies found.
Falcon
I'm just not willing to get sick over those mistakes.
Then buy pasteurized milk. A free market allows that. But for those who prefer raw milk some governments blocked and made illegal their ability to buy raw milk.
All I ask is that people be allowed to make their own decision as to what risks they are willing to take, without government interference, and what risks they are not willing to take.
Falcon
It also ignores the numerous new entities that will try to enter the market with substandard milk. Yes, even they will be pushed out by word of mouth, but not until they cause irreparable damage.
Have you ever heard of courts and civil lawsuits?
Have you heard of government approved drugs that have had to be withdrawn?
Do you know the government is the biggest polluter in the US? And that it passes laws allowing it to get away with polluting?
Government is the biggest threat to liberty yet you want government to have power to regulate what people do.
Falcon
I looked through the studies in the link, and found zero that indicated that double-helix DNA suffers any alteration under microwave radiation.
And can you point out where I said microwaves damage double-helix DNA? Or is this at attempt to divert attention away from or discredit what I posted?
Falcon
so that's an absurd statement.
By the same token, at the right dosage virtually everything is safe so saying something is safe is an absurd statement as well. Florine? Some can help prevent cavities, but it can also cause Flourosis, of which there are two types. Dental Fluorosis blackens teeth and Skeletal Fluorosis makes bones brittle. Lithium is toxic yet in low doses it's used as a mood stabilizer in psychiatry.
Falcon
And no study has ever found that microwave radiation causes mutations in double-helix DNA.
Can you point out where I did say microwaves cause mutations in double-helix DNA? Or did you just make that up to spread fud? Remember to be sure to include a link where I even used "double-helix DNA", that is other than this very post. I doubt you can find one.
Falcon
Microwaves ovens work by vibrating molecules with unbalanced charges (causing heat), and there are specific frequency ranges that are good at that. Then there's also power levels, directionality, and the inverse square law to consider.
Microwave ovens may work like that but that does not mean microwaves do not alter, mutate, or otherwise damage DNA. Science studies have concluded microwaves don't and microwaves do alter DNA. Even the expert don't agree so to say microwaves do not affect DNA is to ignore science.
Falcon
Probably the toxic nature of the clove oil makes it unsafe :-)
But I had a bottle that was labeled as being good for toothaches.
And I probably don't need to tell you it tastes awful
Actually I love the taste of clove. I love cooking with it, using it for toothaches, and I even used smoke clove cigarettes. Ah, now that I thought that I'm wishing I could light up one now. I also love the smell of camphor and eucalyptus though others say they smell too much like medicine.
Falcon
Just because a crop is GM doesn't mean it is sterile, BTW.
Only if GM crops were sterile. Because they aren't superweeds are being created. These superweeds have the same resistance to herbicides as the crops that interbred with wild relatives.
Falcon
Now, assuming that the fellow reseeds his crop each year (garlic is an annual, after all), one wonders why he is all that worried in any event.
Actually garlic is a perennial, it's just grown as an annual. I have some growing in my garden now and when I pick them I'll keep some of the cloves to plant next year, that's how I started the ones I planted this year. I took a bulb of garlic, broke off the cloves then planted them. Now if I leave some of the garlic in the ground they can grow back next year as well.
Falcon
It's that tricky rights-of-the-children vs. rights-of-the-parents thing. I think it's pretty clear that more children will get sick from drinking raw milk than pasteurized milk, given that quality control has to vary among dairies.
First, I disagree, but actually it's more than just that. At least for infants. For infants add in mother's milk and formula. As for raw milk, I firmly believe hygiene and how the milk is handled plays a big roll. In a free market when one farmer doesn't exercise care in the handling of milk word will get out the farmer sells bad milk, especially with law suits thrown in.
I'm glad the raw milk economy is alive, my favorite creamery depends on it, but I'd also not give it to my kids unless I was really sure about the conditions it came from. Local isn't sufficient - I've gotten some milk from our local dairy on (rare) occasion that tasted of cow shit.
In part I agree. At least with a local farmer you should be able to see how operations are conducted and if you don't like them you could use another one. I don't have children myself, though I wanted 2 of my own and wanted to adopt 2, but I'm a firm believer in mother's milk and would rather use it as much as I could. Perhaps mix it and raw cows milk as well.
Oh, as for buying locally, I came across something on this earlier tonight: "Buying Local Isn't Always Better For The Environment". ScienceDaily also had this: Organic Or Local Fruits and Vegetables?" And those aren't the only ones like them I've read. I support buying locally but not when it takes more resources.
Also, education is far more effective than regulation.
I agree most of the tyme, but not all the tyme. Actually I believe that sometimes regulations are created to reduce or artificially keep low competition. Make staying within regulations expensive then you raise the bar on starting a business in the field being regulated. Some supporters of raw milk believe that's why laws and regulations were passed requiring milk to be pasteurized. Small dairy operators may not be able to afford to pasteurize milk, so they either stop dairy farming or they sell raw milk to someone who buys milk from a bunch of other dairy farms as well and can afford to pasteurize the milk.
Moms who are feeding their very young kids raw milk instead of breast feeding just aren't on my list of 'OK parents'.
Here I fully agree.
Falcon
I wonder if radiation is the reason teenagers to day are so messed up. Maybe all the cell phone use is what's screwing up their brains. I wonder where I could get a grant to do the research.
No, I don't think so. I doubt cellphones are screwing up teenagers brains, but would like to see studies. Since at least the 1990s prescriptions for teenagers with and without AHDH, attention-deficit hyperactivity disorder, have gone up.
To balance that Huffington Post article, a study by Mayo Clinic researchers found that treatment with prescription stimulants is associated with improved long-term academic success of children with ADHD."
Last time I checked, the laws of physics still reigned supreme, and microwaves will not cause genetic damage to his plants.
You'd better tell all the scientists you know better than they do. They have studies that conclude that microwaves do affect DNA. Then again there are disagreement even between those who research the subject, and with it being like that saying there is no affect is not scientifically accurate.
Falcon
Almost as crazy as another farmer in the area that was neglecting his cattle and claimed a national defense helicopter contaminated his land causing him to loose his organic farming status.
To be fair, that articles doesn't say whether the farmer did lose organic certification. Now I'm not condoning what he did, I personally hate the abuse, misuse, and neglect of animals, but I wanted to point out that something was missing.
Falcon