Number of names on terrorist watch list at 400,000, agency says
And how many slashdotters are on the lists? A bunch I bet. First those who criticized Bush were put on the lists, and now those criticizing Obama are being added.
I'm betting that the SCOTUS, whenever they get around to hearing such a case, will rule EULAs valid contracts so long as the customer has the ability to get a full refund after viewing the contract.
I'd like that. Even more though I'd like to be able to return a movie DVD and get a refund if the DVD is bad. I bought one movie on DVD but it wouldn't play the whole movie in my player. Once the movie gets to a specific spot, that spot freezes on the screen then after 10 to 15 seconds it jumps ahead. So I took it back to the store and they said all I could do was exchange it for another DVD of the same movie. I took that one home and it does the same thing. Since then I bought two more DVD players and the DVD didn't play right on either of those either.
Didn't psystar purchase the copies? Aren't they covered by First Sale?
In a post above someone said Pystar can't even produce receipts showing they bought OS X. And no, this has nothing to do with the First sale doctrine. If Pystar bought OS X on DVDs they can still sell, or give away, those disks. What they can not do is use the disk to install OS X on non-Apple branded hardware.
And you can only restrict the use of your code, you make close it but you can not close the source you took from someone else.
This is not true. The BSD license allows you the right to redistribute the work as a whole or any part under more restrictive terms, by sublicensing.
Yes it is, If I write and release software with a BSD license you can not take my code and close it or restrict it, only I can. You can only close your code or restrict it.
while Apple can decide how many computers a copy of OSX is installed on, they cannot dictate how many different computers a portable installation of OSX on an external disk can be used on over the course of a day or year.
Pystar isn't doing that though, they aren't selling external drives with OS X installed they are selling PCs with OS X cloned on the internal drive. And someone above said they can't even provide a receipt proving they bought OS X. While I disagree with what Pystar is doing, I wouldn't have a problem if they sold an external drive with OS X installed on it. As long as they provide the OS X DVD and actually bought OS X.
Heck, after talking to Apple tech support I bought a USB flash drive and installed Leopard on it. It was so slow though I then installed it on an external drive, I don't know why but it's faster than the flash drive.
if what Apple says holds, then first sale doctrine is effectively void
No it isn't. If you buy OS X but don't have a Mac you can still sell the OS X disk. The only thing you can not do is install it on non-Apple hardware or make an unauthorized copy. Pystar is doing both.
Is installing drivers or programs or user files by Apple customers not 'modifying' the OS? And they boot it, doesn't it make an unauthorized copy in the RAM?
Both Apple and copyright law allow a copy in RAM. Apple also allows modification of the OS on Apple branded hardware.
First sale doctrine means that Psystar already has the rights the EULA is trying to hoard for apple hardware owners.
All the First sale doctrine says is that the owner has the right to sell the software to someone else, but they either have to hand over all the copies made or they have to delete or destroy those copies. They can not leave the copy they created when they installed it on their computer on the computer.
You're using a strawman argument, and you're completely wrong. The BSD license allows me to take the source, modify it, and give you source code with a restriction that you may not use it in a certain way, for example, I may include a restriction that you may not modify the code or re-publish parts of it.
The BSD is still an open source license. Even the Free Software Foundation says the (modified) BSD is compatible. The only restriction is that the authors of the code used have to be credited. And you can only restrict the use of your code, you make close it but you can not close the source you took from someone else. The source is still open source.
Maybe their argument will be that Section 117 doesn't apply because it's not an owner of a copy but a licensee?
If I recall right clauses saying what was bought was a license not a copy have been found illegal. Autodesk tried using this claim, that they sold licenses not copies of AutoCAD, to prevent resellers from selling AutoCAD on eBay and elsewhere. See Vernor v Autodesk, Inc. The judge ruled Autodesk sold a copy not a license.
That is, if the license of the software says you can't use the software freely, then it's not open source at all.
Yes it can be. BSD licenses allow software to be restricted in it's use but the BSD is still open source, notice I did not capitalize "open" or "source".
Wow, I just always thought DMCA was just broken, not just completely broken.
So does that mean that when I run a CD, the audio decoded an run in my CD player RAM is also an unauthorised copy?
First, the DMCA never should have been passed to begin with, but it's not needed here. All that's needed is that the first copy was unauthorized and was modified without authority therefore any copy made of it is also unauthorized. As TFA says, even Pystar agrees the OS X install DVD that is shipped with their computers is never opened. Instead Pystar created and modified an unauthorized copy then copied the unauthorized modified version. That'd be like me taking Isaac Asimov's "I, Robot", copying and modifying it then bundling the original with a copy of my modified version and selling the bundle.
Falcon
I wonder how long it would be before Asimov's estate sicked lawyers on me like fleas on a dog.
Effective oversight would include making sure people on welfare are actively working to get themselves off of welfare.
As it is if a person on welfare tries to improve their economics they can lose more than they gain. As a college student I had one full tyme job that didn't offer health insurance. I looked into getting my own insurance and the cheapest I found was about a 1/3 of my pay. Someone suggested I go to the health department of the county I lived in and I did. There I was told I made too much money, but I was told that if I quit my job I could get coverage. How stupid is that? Making someone who can otherwise pay his bills quit working just to get health insurance?
Because I am disabled and collect disability now, I was hit while riding my bike after my classes, I get medical assistance which pays most of my expenses, so far all but my prescriptions. But if I could find and work at a part tyme job I will lose my medical assistance. And I doubt the pay would make up for that. At least with my disability income, Supplemental Security Income or SSI, if I could find a job I could do my SSI will be phased out depending on how much I make. I can make up to X amount, I'm not sure how much, and I will still get my SSI. As my pay goes over that SSI is reduced. Medical coverage is not like that though, it's all or nothing.
I'm hoping I can start taking classes again next year but I wonder how I can pay for it and keep the assistance I get now. If I do get back into college I'd like to get an internship as well, and while I'd like to be paid I'd take a nonpaying position just to get experience. But I have to wonder how that will affect my assistance as well.
It's because of math-phobes like you, we still have coal power in this country.
Math-phobes like me? When I was majoring in Computer Engineering I was minoring in Math. And Physics. Why not? All I had to do was take 2 more math classes and 2 more physics classes for the minors.
This is about "selling" the idea of Linux to users of other OSs who really aren't going to accept that, in order to install the equivalent of Office 2007, they are going to have to upgrade to Windows 7 or Snow Leopard.
And how many users of other OSes, OS X and Windows, upgrade their software without upgrading their OS by buying a new computer? I bet few people upgrade software other than games but not the OS or the PC. Stores like Best Buy even offer to install software for people because people don't want to do it themselves.
Anyway - this thread isn't about "expert" distros designed for serious production use (CentOS, Debian) or bleeding-edge showcases (Fedora, Gentoo) - it is about Ubuntu, the highest profile distro, apparently aimed squarely at mainstream use,
And it is. Ubuntu, and distros based on it, is about the easiest Linux distro for most people.
I would still put Bechtel in the category of good operators.
Making excuses? The wiki article contained more unsavory dealings of Bechtel. Such as the Ok Tedi Mine Bechtel constructed in Papua New Guinea which polluted a river. Or supporting a war lord in the Congo, where a lot of people have been driven off their land if not killed to mine for the minerals Bechtel wanted. There were massive cost overruns in Boston's Big Dig project. When the ceiling in a part of the tunnel Bechtel was responsible for collapsed it killed someone.
The "moral justice" meted out by the US federal government is very unevenly distributed
Oh I agree. No trade with or travel to Cuba? But trade with and travel to China and the Soviet Union was legal, both of which were far worse? I was stationed in Germany while in the US Army in 1982. On the post, base, American Express had an ad for travel to Russia. How ironic is that?
it seems unfair to vilify Bechtel for finding itself on the wrong side of that often arbitrary distribution with millions of dollars on the line.
Arbitrary? Perhaps Saddam's gassing was arbitrary but it wasn't arbitrary to have dealings with him. The one thing that could be said in Bechtel's defense was that at that tyme Reagan and his administration supported Saddam, there was nothing Saddam could that was bad, but that does not excuse Bechtel's complicity.
Now I'm not saying I don't like the CDC or NIH, I do but if they're not converted into non-profits then I think the research they do should be open sourced. That data the NCI generated in testing Taxol? Anybody who wanted to could use the data to manufacture Taxol then sell it. With 1 Taxol treatment costing thousands of dollars, when it cost BMS less than a dollar to make 1 dose, there are a bunch of cancer patients who can not afford Taxol. But if the data was open sourced another company could manufacture and sell it for a lot less, in order to compeat BMS would have to lower it's own prices.
The far right is messed up with their trying to shove religion down everyones throat and the far left is messed up trying to protect everyone from themselves.
Only it's not just the left that tries to protect everyone from themselves. The right shares in that. Before he got busted doctor shopping Rush Limbaugh wanted to throw drug users in jail and throw away the keys. He and others on the right don't support what a woman does with her own body either.
in the case of this telco issue, the people organized to put in their own fiber network (a public project is not necessarily a government project) and the government instead of promoting competition though fair trade stopped the people for building the product they wanted. In this case that is not a free market, that is a government regulated market hampering progress.
No, in this case it was a business that delayed the city in laying fiber. Voters approved of a plant to lay fiber after the city asked a company to lay the fiber but refused. The company wanted to sit on it's fat ass doing nothing until voters decided to do what they asked the company to do.
Slashdot Mirror
They don't. It's modern-day McCarthyism, it's just that no one senator has stepped up to bat and get his name attached to this whole racket.
Sen, Ed Kennedy was on the No Fly list.
Falcon
Number of names on terrorist watch list at 400,000, agency says
And how many slashdotters are on the lists? A bunch I bet. First those who criticized Bush were put on the lists, and now those criticizing Obama are being added.
So some of us were put on the lists twice.
Falcon
Courts also ruled that tomatoes are a fruit, my point is courts can be really stupid.
Tomatoes are fruits. Tomatoes themselves contain the seeds for reproduction, therefore they are fruits.
Falcon
I'm betting that the SCOTUS, whenever they get around to hearing such a case, will rule EULAs valid contracts so long as the customer has the ability to get a full refund after viewing the contract.
I'd like that. Even more though I'd like to be able to return a movie DVD and get a refund if the DVD is bad. I bought one movie on DVD but it wouldn't play the whole movie in my player. Once the movie gets to a specific spot, that spot freezes on the screen then after 10 to 15 seconds it jumps ahead. So I took it back to the store and they said all I could do was exchange it for another DVD of the same movie. I took that one home and it does the same thing. Since then I bought two more DVD players and the DVD didn't play right on either of those either.
Falcon
Didn't psystar purchase the copies? Aren't they covered by First Sale?
In a post above someone said Pystar can't even produce receipts showing they bought OS X. And no, this has nothing to do with the First sale doctrine. If Pystar bought OS X on DVDs they can still sell, or give away, those disks. What they can not do is use the disk to install OS X on non-Apple branded hardware.
Falcon
Yea, let's run a business bankrupt because we don't like it's licenses.
If you don't like it's licenses then don't buy it's products, nobody's holding a gun to your head saying you must buy from them.
Falcon
And you can only restrict the use of your code, you make close it but you can not close the source you took from someone else.
This is not true. The BSD license allows you the right to redistribute the work as a whole or any part under more restrictive terms, by sublicensing.
Yes it is, If I write and release software with a BSD license you can not take my code and close it or restrict it, only I can. You can only close your code or restrict it.
Falcon
while Apple can decide how many computers a copy of OSX is installed on, they cannot dictate how many different computers a portable installation of OSX on an external disk can be used on over the course of a day or year.
Pystar isn't doing that though, they aren't selling external drives with OS X installed they are selling PCs with OS X cloned on the internal drive. And someone above said they can't even provide a receipt proving they bought OS X. While I disagree with what Pystar is doing, I wouldn't have a problem if they sold an external drive with OS X installed on it. As long as they provide the OS X DVD and actually bought OS X.
Heck, after talking to Apple tech support I bought a USB flash drive and installed Leopard on it. It was so slow though I then installed it on an external drive, I don't know why but it's faster than the flash drive.
Falcon
if what Apple says holds, then first sale doctrine is effectively void
No it isn't. If you buy OS X but don't have a Mac you can still sell the OS X disk. The only thing you can not do is install it on non-Apple hardware or make an unauthorized copy. Pystar is doing both.
Falcon
Is installing drivers or programs or user files by Apple customers not 'modifying' the OS? And they boot it, doesn't it make an unauthorized copy in the RAM?
Both Apple and copyright law allow a copy in RAM. Apple also allows modification of the OS on Apple branded hardware.
Falcon
First sale doctrine means that Psystar already has the rights the EULA is trying to hoard for apple hardware owners.
All the First sale doctrine says is that the owner has the right to sell the software to someone else, but they either have to hand over all the copies made or they have to delete or destroy those copies. They can not leave the copy they created when they installed it on their computer on the computer.
Falcon
You're using a strawman argument, and you're completely wrong. The BSD license allows me to take the source, modify it, and give you source code with a restriction that you may not use it in a certain way, for example, I may include a restriction that you may not modify the code or re-publish parts of it.
The BSD is still an open source license. Even the Free Software Foundation says the (modified) BSD is compatible. The only restriction is that the authors of the code used have to be credited. And you can only restrict the use of your code, you make close it but you can not close the source you took from someone else. The source is still open source.
Falcon
Seems like Apple hardware owners would be making the same unauthorized copies when they boot their computers.
No, both Apple and copyright law specifically allow copies in RAM.
Falcon
No, what they're clearly saying from their brief is that you're making an additional copy of the program
No, what they're arguing is that Pystar is making an additional unauthorized copy of OS X.
Falcon
Maybe their argument will be that Section 117 doesn't apply because it's not an owner of a copy but a licensee?
If I recall right clauses saying what was bought was a license not a copy have been found illegal. Autodesk tried using this claim, that they sold licenses not copies of AutoCAD, to prevent resellers from selling AutoCAD on eBay and elsewhere. See Vernor v Autodesk, Inc. The judge ruled Autodesk sold a copy not a license.
Falcon
That is, if the license of the software says you can't use the software freely, then it's not open source at all.
Yes it can be. BSD licenses allow software to be restricted in it's use but the BSD is still open source, notice I did not capitalize "open" or "source".
Falcon
Wow, I just always thought DMCA was just broken, not just completely broken.
So does that mean that when I run a CD, the audio decoded an run in my CD player RAM is also an unauthorised copy?
First, the DMCA never should have been passed to begin with, but it's not needed here. All that's needed is that the first copy was unauthorized and was modified without authority therefore any copy made of it is also unauthorized. As TFA says, even Pystar agrees the OS X install DVD that is shipped with their computers is never opened. Instead Pystar created and modified an unauthorized copy then copied the unauthorized modified version. That'd be like me taking Isaac Asimov's "I, Robot", copying and modifying it then bundling the original with a copy of my modified version and selling the bundle.
Falcon
I wonder how long it would be before Asimov's estate sicked lawyers on me like fleas on a dog.
If you put nuclear power in the same CO2 categories as coal-burning plants
I did not, all I said was that mining and refining of the fuel produces CO2 as well as building the plants. Anyone who ignores those ignores science.
Falcon
Effective oversight would include making sure people on welfare are actively working to get themselves off of welfare.
As it is if a person on welfare tries to improve their economics they can lose more than they gain. As a college student I had one full tyme job that didn't offer health insurance. I looked into getting my own insurance and the cheapest I found was about a 1/3 of my pay. Someone suggested I go to the health department of the county I lived in and I did. There I was told I made too much money, but I was told that if I quit my job I could get coverage. How stupid is that? Making someone who can otherwise pay his bills quit working just to get health insurance?
Because I am disabled and collect disability now, I was hit while riding my bike after my classes, I get medical assistance which pays most of my expenses, so far all but my prescriptions. But if I could find and work at a part tyme job I will lose my medical assistance. And I doubt the pay would make up for that. At least with my disability income, Supplemental Security Income or SSI, if I could find a job I could do my SSI will be phased out depending on how much I make. I can make up to X amount, I'm not sure how much, and I will still get my SSI. As my pay goes over that SSI is reduced. Medical coverage is not like that though, it's all or nothing.
I'm hoping I can start taking classes again next year but I wonder how I can pay for it and keep the assistance I get now. If I do get back into college I'd like to get an internship as well, and while I'd like to be paid I'd take a nonpaying position just to get experience. But I have to wonder how that will affect my assistance as well.
Falcon
It's because of math-phobes like you, we still have coal power in this country.
Math-phobes like me? When I was majoring in Computer Engineering I was minoring in Math. And Physics. Why not? All I had to do was take 2 more math classes and 2 more physics classes for the minors.
The rest is just hogwash as well.
Falcon
This is about "selling" the idea of Linux to users of other OSs who really aren't going to accept that, in order to install the equivalent of Office 2007, they are going to have to upgrade to Windows 7 or Snow Leopard.
And how many users of other OSes, OS X and Windows, upgrade their software without upgrading their OS by buying a new computer? I bet few people upgrade software other than games but not the OS or the PC. Stores like Best Buy even offer to install software for people because people don't want to do it themselves.
Anyway - this thread isn't about "expert" distros designed for serious production use (CentOS, Debian) or bleeding-edge showcases (Fedora, Gentoo) - it is about Ubuntu, the highest profile distro, apparently aimed squarely at mainstream use,
And it is. Ubuntu, and distros based on it, is about the easiest Linux distro for most people.
Falcon
I would still put Bechtel in the category of good operators.
Making excuses? The wiki article contained more unsavory dealings of Bechtel. Such as the Ok Tedi Mine Bechtel constructed in Papua New Guinea which polluted a river. Or supporting a war lord in the Congo, where a lot of people have been driven off their land if not killed to mine for the minerals Bechtel wanted. There were massive cost overruns in Boston's Big Dig project. When the ceiling in a part of the tunnel Bechtel was responsible for collapsed it killed someone.
The "moral justice" meted out by the US federal government is very unevenly distributed
Oh I agree. No trade with or travel to Cuba? But trade with and travel to China and the Soviet Union was legal, both of which were far worse? I was stationed in Germany while in the US Army in 1982. On the post, base, American Express had an ad for travel to Russia. How ironic is that?
it seems unfair to vilify Bechtel for finding itself on the wrong side of that often arbitrary distribution with millions of dollars on the line.
Arbitrary? Perhaps Saddam's gassing was arbitrary but it wasn't arbitrary to have dealings with him. The one thing that could be said in Bechtel's defense was that at that tyme Reagan and his administration supported Saddam, there was nothing Saddam could that was bad, but that does not excuse Bechtel's complicity.
Falcon
There was a time when people who needed assistance received help from private organizations, churches
Yea, civil society I think does much better at aiding those who need it. Did government create or fund all the Shriners Hopsitals for Children? No, the Ancient Arabic Order of the Nobles of the Mystic Shrine or Shriners did. Did the government create or fund the St. Jude Children's Research Hospital? No, the comedian and actor Danny Thomas did. On the other hand I admit the government did create the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention as well as the National Institutes of Health. However one of those institutes, the National Institute of Cancer or NCI, spent $183 million dollars researching and developing the cancer drug Taxol. Then for less than a quarter of what it spent, the NCI sold all the data needed to get FDA approval to use it as a cancer therapy to Bristol-Myers Squibb, BMS, for a whooping $43 million. That was in the late 1980s, by 2000 BMS was making almost a billion dollars a year on Taxol.
Now I'm not saying I don't like the CDC or NIH, I do but if they're not converted into non-profits then I think the research they do should be open sourced. That data the NCI generated in testing Taxol? Anybody who wanted to could use the data to manufacture Taxol then sell it. With 1 Taxol treatment costing thousands of dollars, when it cost BMS less than a dollar to make 1 dose, there are a bunch of cancer patients who can not afford Taxol. But if the data was open sourced another company could manufacture and sell it for a lot less, in order to compeat BMS would have to lower it's own prices.
Falcon
The far right is messed up with their trying to shove religion down everyones throat and the far left is messed up trying to protect everyone from themselves.
Only it's not just the left that tries to protect everyone from themselves. The right shares in that. Before he got busted doctor shopping Rush Limbaugh wanted to throw drug users in jail and throw away the keys. He and others on the right don't support what a woman does with her own body either.
Falcon
in the case of this telco issue, the people organized to put in their own fiber network (a public project is not necessarily a government project) and the government instead of promoting competition though fair trade stopped the people for building the product they wanted. In this case that is not a free market, that is a government regulated market hampering progress.
No, in this case it was a business that delayed the city in laying fiber. Voters approved of a plant to lay fiber after the city asked a company to lay the fiber but refused. The company wanted to sit on it's fat ass doing nothing until voters decided to do what they asked the company to do.
Falcon