Just go to OpenBSD Journal and search for the thread called "License audit progress". Then you will find a nice list of programs which had incompatible license with their defined goals. He managed Wietse Wenema to change Tcpwrappers' license, and he is bragging that he even got Xerox to change license. Also, don't make much assumptions about the case from the ports@ mailing list. It doesn't have much info about the emailings about the license which resulted in the pulling of the two programs. Theo is not a saint, and he definitely said some unfortunate things, but so did DJB. Also, as others pointed out, Theo is merely sticking to their goals. I think what we see here is two colliding giants and neither of them is backing off.
I installed Debian back about two years ago. At that time I was already using Linux for about three years so I don't consider myself to be a complete newbie.
I installed many OS-es at that time just for the fun of it. Well, I just got my cble connection.;-) They included Windows NT, Caldera, Slackware, RedHat (6.0 era), Mandrake, Debian, FreeBSD, NetBSD, and OpenBSD. All of them on one machine.
I almost spent more time on Debian than on the rest combined. First, it was not that easy to figure out what I needed to download with Debian. Second, it wiped out a wrong partition. Here is my original bugreport. OK, problems happen. However, I didn't get a reasonable answer in reasonable time. The first question was "Do FreeBSD do something peculiar?" Duh. I expect that the developers of the free Debian project know about other free operating systems. At the time it was too much. Finally Adam Di Carlo get in touch with me, and he definitely did everything to get it right. Hats off for his dedication. But it took a couple of months.
Second, their selection system was really unintiutive. Please keep in mind that it was in mid '99 so it might have changed since then. I read many horror stories about it, and I felt they were not baseless.
There is another reason I am not going to use Debian. Just yesterday I was pondering if I should give it a try again. (I am using RedHat and I am less than happy with them.) So I looked around Debian's homepage to figure out which kernel they officially support. I couldn't really find the info. OK, maybe I am too stupid. I am definitely (and not definately...) not a good searcher. Finally I logged into their ftp server and looked around. It seems that woody is using 2.2.17. Or at least this is the number I have seen in ftp://pub/mirrors/debian/dists/woody/main/source/b ase. At work we start to feel the bite of the 2GB file limit in the 2.2 kernels. The next distro I plan to use should definitely use the 2.4 kernels as default and not only as an quasi unsupported addon.
As I said, I would like to move away from RedHat. I am a guy who mostly works from the command line and use X only for browsing. I am not interested in linuxconf and co. But I definitely interested in a good package system which should be logical to use. Debian's back in '99 was really hard. Better said it was confusing. I also would like to use a system with up to date packages. I am not interested in the bleeding edge, like development kernels, but I didn't read anything about a serious problem with the 2.4 kernels. When will Debian support it? When 2.6 or 3.0 is out? When did they start to officially support 2.2? Why do we have to wait so long for it?
I don't exclude Debian from my choices. But what I have experienced was less that thrilling. Maybe I should take a newer look at Slackware. After all, this was my first Linux from "Using Linux" back in '95.
College will teach many things which seem superfluous at first. Yes, it is possible to learn a programming language at home, but there are things which most people wouldn't bother. These things are taught at university. For example, how many self taught people would learn computer architecture, data structures, etc. at home? Of course there are some, but most of them wouldn't. And then they would create horrible code.
Once I had a Perl script which did something like
for ($x = 0.3; $x != 10.3; $x += 1)...
It didn't stop at 10.3. I quickly figured out that the culprit was the internal representation of $x. None of the uncolleged people at work could figure this out. However, since I learned computer architecture at school, I very early on realized what could be wrong and made a workaround.
So yes, college education is good. They teach you the basics on which you can build on later.
Slashdot Mirror
Will it become the next pokemon card? I am hardly waiting to see when children will trade one grandpa for two grandmas.
Also, will the newlyweds switch grandpa diamonds instead of diamonds?
This is brutal. I can't believe someone came up with such an idea.
Vilmos
> With Linux, stopping and restarting XFree86 is enough...
When I had this problem, I just switched virtual consoles, and it usually repaired the problem.
Vilmos
> I don't see it worth the time and effort to set something like this up.
:-)))
And what if you play a game and there is no way to save the state of it?
Vilmos
Just go to OpenBSD Journal and search for the thread called "License audit progress". Then you will find a nice list of programs which had incompatible license with their defined goals. He managed Wietse Wenema to change Tcpwrappers' license, and he is bragging that he even got Xerox to change license. Also, don't make much assumptions about the case from the ports@ mailing list. It doesn't have much info about the emailings about the license which resulted in the pulling of the two programs. Theo is not a saint, and he definitely said some unfortunate things, but so did DJB. Also, as others pointed out, Theo is merely sticking to their goals. I think what we see here is two colliding giants and neither of them is backing off.
Vilmos
I installed many OS-es at that time just for the fun of it. Well, I just got my cble connection. ;-) They included Windows NT, Caldera, Slackware, RedHat (6.0 era), Mandrake, Debian, FreeBSD, NetBSD, and OpenBSD. All of them on one machine.
I almost spent more time on Debian than on the rest combined. First, it was not that easy to figure out what I needed to download with Debian. Second, it wiped out a wrong partition. Here is my original bugreport. OK, problems happen. However, I didn't get a reasonable answer in reasonable time. The first question was "Do FreeBSD do something peculiar?" Duh. I expect that the developers of the free Debian project know about other free operating systems. At the time it was too much. Finally Adam Di Carlo get in touch with me, and he definitely did everything to get it right. Hats off for his dedication. But it took a couple of months.
Second, their selection system was really unintiutive. Please keep in mind that it was in mid '99 so it might have changed since then. I read many horror stories about it, and I felt they were not baseless.
There is another reason I am not going to use Debian. Just yesterday I was pondering if I should give it a try again. (I am using RedHat and I am less than happy with them.) So I looked around Debian's homepage to figure out which kernel they officially support. I couldn't really find the info. OK, maybe I am too stupid. I am definitely (and not definately...) not a good searcher. Finally I logged into their ftp server and looked around. It seems that woody is using 2.2.17. Or at least this is the number I have seen in ftp://pub/mirrors/debian/dists/woody/main/source/b ase. At work we start to feel the bite of the 2GB file limit in the 2.2 kernels. The next distro I plan to use should definitely use the 2.4 kernels as default and not only as an quasi unsupported addon.
As I said, I would like to move away from RedHat. I am a guy who mostly works from the command line and use X only for browsing. I am not interested in linuxconf and co. But I definitely interested in a good package system which should be logical to use. Debian's back in '99 was really hard. Better said it was confusing. I also would like to use a system with up to date packages. I am not interested in the bleeding edge, like development kernels, but I didn't read anything about a serious problem with the 2.4 kernels. When will Debian support it? When 2.6 or 3.0 is out? When did they start to officially support 2.2? Why do we have to wait so long for it?
I don't exclude Debian from my choices. But what I have experienced was less that thrilling. Maybe I should take a newer look at Slackware. After all, this was my first Linux from "Using Linux" back in '95.
Vilmos
College will teach many things which seem superfluous at first. Yes, it is possible to learn a programming language at home, but there are things which most people wouldn't bother. These things are taught at university. For example, how many self taught people would learn computer architecture, data structures, etc. at home? Of course there are some, but most of them wouldn't. And then they would create horrible code.
...
Once I had a Perl script which did something like
for ($x = 0.3; $x != 10.3; $x += 1)
It didn't stop at 10.3. I quickly figured out that the culprit was the internal representation of $x. None of the uncolleged people at work could figure this out. However, since I learned computer architecture at school, I very early on realized what could be wrong and made a workaround.
So yes, college education is good. They teach you the basics on which you can build on later.
Vilmos