So because you have this elitest view about the superiority of different programming languages that nothing of worth can accrue from VB? I didn't think I was being elitist. It'd be wrong to assume that VB could solve all your problems, same with Java. However, there is no arguing that Java is a more powerful language and can be used to create more complicated programs. Yes, you should use the right tool for the job. I think my analogy between playing a recorder and playing a saxophone holds.
Maybe that's why I get paid to provide advice and you don't. I'm an Engineer, I get paid to DO. There is no reason to be mean...it only detracts from the discussion.
All I'm saying is that the act of programming is not expressive, just like building a wall isn't expressive. You should visit New England sometime...we have some great stone walls.
You can use more than one kind of brick, and you can put them together in different ways and still get a wall. Creative? Not really. Maybe we shouldn't be using so many analogies, that might be clouding the issue. A wall certainly serves a different sort of purpose than a computer program or a sonnet. The amount of intellect, analysis, and work to build a wall differs from writing a bit of enterprise software. (What about The Great Wall?) I'm not arguing that every piece of code is masterpiece...likewise, not every piece of music is a masterpiece. Just b/c it's not a masterpiece doesn't make a piece of music or a piece of code not part of an artform.
I'm not knocking what they have created, Creative? Not really. You're being imprecise.
I create: a watercolor, a joke, a movie, a web site, a computer program, a journal entry. I am creative.
Visual Basic (and was that VB or VBScript?) is such a base form of programming. VB is to Java(or C or any OOP Language) as fingerpaint is to watercolor.
I don't think anyone is trying to say they are a Bach or a Van Gogh. However, people get offended (and rightly) when you knock something that they have created. There is usually more than one way to code a piece of software...how do you account for the way a programmer picks and chooses his or her way?
Programming (a subset of Engineering) is a creative, intuitive process. It's also analytical. Analysis does not rob the art from science.
Everyone's shouting about what's art and what's not art. My life is my art, dammit. There is a spectrum, a gradient...it's not black & white, eh? I think whenever the creator is given a choice..that's art. While the worker on the assembly line is manufacturing a car is not an artist. The guy who designed the '57 DesSoto most definitely is.
(most) People don't start out painting the Mona Lisa. Someone blaring "Hot Cross Buns" on a recorder might be the next Coltrane (or O. Coleman). Scratching on a notepad prepares you for painting portraits. Likewise, "Hello, World!" is the road down which every programmer travels to create beautiful, expressive code.
I agree that Bach or Van Gogh, programming is not. It is art.
BNW in a nutshell: A highly classist society. The workers are spawned from test tubes...there might be a breeder class as well (or is that Dune?). One guy breaks free of his position and becomes a farmer...he's a spectacle. Um...someone help me out. It's been a while for me.
We live in a classist society, the gap between the rich and poor is growing. While the American Dream is a great thing, and still mesmerizes immigrants, it will become increasingly difficult to jump that gap from rags to riches. Genetically engineered offspring presents many moral and ethical dilemmas. One of them being, who get's the lucky gene bath? Will it be only those kids whose families can afford it or will all people be able to benefit from gene therapy? For example, childhood innoculation. While most children in industrial nations get shots up the ying-yang (no pun intended), dangerous childhood diseases are still a big fear in third world countries.
Even though the good doctor has the "key" to unlocking the human genome, that doesn't mean that he gets to decide what gets done with the information. Applied Materials makes the machines that makes (or just tests?) the chips that Intel, AMD, Motorola, etc. manufacture. This doesn't give AMAT the upper hand in chip design.
Joe Q. Authur would probably not be able to earn a living, but can Joe Q. Authur earn a living now? Lots of 'zine writers charge only to re-coup printing costs, and only hope to earn a few extra dollars for their efforts. While King's model might not work for big name authors, it will probably (and might already) be viable for unknown writers to score some dollars to pay for an internet account. People who are into the 'zine scene tend to be considerate on compensating an author (most 'zines are a buck or two).
The publishing industry does provide other services than killing trees...editing & publicity namely, albeit the publishing portion is the most expensive and hardest to come by. I don't think the publishing industry is going to go away, it's services might morph a bit, though.
I think it's unfortunate that music would only be available as MP3s. It is my understanding that the quality of an MP3 recording varies widely depending on the way it was digitally compressed. True, this signal does not fade over time, but GIGO. Maybe audiophiles are a shrinking minority and the decrease in demand will price turntables out of the hand of most consumers (alas). However, I don't see that happening just yet...many current bands are still releasing material on vinyl. (specifically: shellac) TGL
Columbine illustrates the extreme scenario of students that are ostracized lash back at their "oppressors". Sure, I've know a lot of jocks that can't think for themselves, but the same is true for nerds/outcasts. Do you really think all those Marilyn Manson, Korn, or Insane Clown Posse fans are any different than a bunch of rabid football fans?
Slashdot Mirror
Sure, the system comes with a one-button mouse. However, there are third-party USB three-button mouses available. Try MacWarehouse.
TGL
The boys at LinuxPPC have those G4's all figured out.
I've got LinuxPPC on my iMac..it's good stuff.
TGL
I didn't think I was being elitist. It'd be wrong to assume that VB could solve all your problems, same with Java. However, there is no arguing that Java is a more powerful language and can be used to create more complicated programs. Yes, you should use the right tool for the job. I think my analogy between playing a recorder and playing a saxophone holds.
Maybe that's why I get paid to provide advice and you don't.
I'm an Engineer, I get paid to DO. There is no reason to be mean...it only detracts from the discussion.
All I'm saying is that the act of programming is not expressive, just like building a wall isn't expressive.
You should visit New England sometime...we have some great stone walls.
You can use more than one kind of brick, and you can put them together in different ways and still get a wall. Creative? Not really.
Maybe we shouldn't be using so many analogies, that might be clouding the issue. A wall certainly serves a different sort of purpose than a computer program or a sonnet. The amount of intellect, analysis, and work to build a wall differs from writing a bit of enterprise software. (What about The Great Wall?) I'm not arguing that every piece of code is masterpiece...likewise, not every piece of music is a masterpiece. Just b/c it's not a masterpiece doesn't make a piece of music or a piece of code not part of an artform.
I'm not knocking what they have created,
Creative? Not really.
You're being imprecise.
I create: a watercolor, a joke, a movie, a web site, a computer program, a journal entry. I am creative.
TGL
I don't think anyone is trying to say they are a Bach or a Van Gogh. However, people get offended (and rightly) when you knock something that they have created. There is usually more than one way to code a piece of software...how do you account for the way a programmer picks and chooses his or her way?
Programming (a subset of Engineering) is a creative, intuitive process. It's also analytical. Analysis does not rob the art from science.
Everyone's shouting about what's art and what's not art. My life is my art, dammit. There is a spectrum, a gradient...it's not black & white, eh? I think whenever the creator is given a choice..that's art. While the worker on the assembly line is manufacturing a car is not an artist. The guy who designed the '57 DesSoto most definitely is.
(most) People don't start out painting the Mona Lisa. Someone blaring "Hot Cross Buns" on a recorder might be the next Coltrane (or O. Coleman). Scratching on a notepad prepares you for painting portraits. Likewise, "Hello, World!" is the road down which every programmer travels to create beautiful, expressive code.
I agree that Bach or Van Gogh, programming is not. It is art.
TGL
My snide remark:
The simple answer is to turn your machine (PDA, cell phone, beeper, etc.) off.
I like my hammer as much as the next guy...I don't use it in restaurants though.
TGL
I'd add that since the mid-50's the differences between "government mandated" and "free enterprise" has become less and less.
BNW in a nutshell:
A highly classist society. The workers are spawned from test tubes...there might be a breeder class as well (or is that Dune?). One guy breaks free of his position and becomes a farmer...he's a spectacle. Um...someone help me out. It's been a while for me.
We live in a classist society, the gap between the rich and poor is growing. While the American Dream is a great thing, and still mesmerizes immigrants, it will become increasingly difficult to jump that gap from rags to riches. Genetically engineered offspring presents many moral and ethical dilemmas. One of them being, who get's the lucky gene bath? Will it be only those kids whose families can afford it or will all people be able to benefit from gene therapy? For example, childhood innoculation. While most children in industrial nations get shots up the ying-yang (no pun intended), dangerous childhood diseases are still a big fear in third world countries.
TGL
Brave New World by Huxley sums up the fears fairly well. Orwell had a few notable thoughts on this subject as well.
Even though the good doctor has the "key" to unlocking the human genome, that doesn't mean that he gets to decide what gets done with the information. Applied Materials makes the machines that makes (or just tests?) the chips that Intel, AMD, Motorola, etc. manufacture. This doesn't give AMAT the upper hand in chip design.
Should I be getting a "genetics counselor" ?
TGL
Joe Q. Authur would probably not be able to earn a living, but can Joe Q. Authur earn a living now? Lots of 'zine writers charge only to re-coup printing costs, and only hope to earn a few extra dollars for their efforts. While King's model might not work for big name authors, it will probably (and might already) be viable for unknown writers to score some dollars to pay for an internet account. People who are into the 'zine scene tend to be considerate on compensating an author (most 'zines are a buck or two).
The publishing industry does provide other services than killing trees...editing & publicity namely, albeit the publishing portion is the most expensive and hardest to come by. I don't think the publishing industry is going to go away, it's services might morph a bit, though.
TGL
I think it's unfortunate that music would only be available as MP3s. It is my understanding that the quality of an MP3 recording varies widely depending on the way it was digitally compressed. True, this signal does not fade over time, but GIGO. Maybe audiophiles are a shrinking minority and the decrease in demand will price turntables out of the hand of most consumers (alas). However, I don't see that happening just yet...many current bands are still releasing material on vinyl. (specifically: shellac) TGL
Very short lifeforms.
(Off Topic) Is the Alpha chip still the fastest? After 5-6 years now? Or does the G4 now claim the title. (Apple debate ensues)
I definitely agree the a graphics intensive site should provide alternate text or if it uses frames provides a no frames version. However, isn't a pixel worth a thousand words? If the web is supposed to supplant television as the dominate media, shouldn't it be at least as visual? TGL
"natural antipathy"?
Sorry Prof. Sociology, but that's a load of crap.
Columbine illustrates the extreme scenario of students that are ostracized lash back at their "oppressors". Sure, I've know a lot of jocks that can't think for themselves, but the same is true for nerds/outcasts. Do you really think all those Marilyn Manson, Korn, or Insane Clown Posse fans are any different than a bunch of rabid football fans?
Everyone's marching to the beat of a drummer.
TGL