Certain groups are not even replacing their current population. They raise the children they have in such a way that they do not replace themselves either.
Meanwhile other groups are having 4 or more children who mostly survive to reproductive age and who are raised so they are likely to have large numbers of children as well. Not all of them are in poverty- many of them are successful but hold certain religious beliefs.
It is really happening at a very high rate in geologic terms.
Meanwhile in other parts of the planet, disease and famine are strongly selecting for people resistant to disease or who can survive famine.
"Whole foods" sells enteric (sp?) coated "gut" pills so they survive your stomach acid.
Couple years ago I had an illness that seemed to specifically target my gut bugs. I felt vaguely ill after eating and it would go through me not fully digested.
It took me a few weeks to figure it out but after I took the friendly bug pills for a few days the problem cleared up. Actually they almost cleared up completely the first day.
It is an issue for anyone that takes antibiotics- and it applies to female parts as well (yeast infections easier if you don't have friendly bugs).
So we don't make it any easier for them by supporting them in their bad habits. They need some kind of back-pressure to motivate them. They need to have some hope that they can succeed if they try instead of being told it's hopeless because "the man" holds them down.
It's not the man that is holding them down any more- probably has not been for a couple decades. They are holding themselves down and they won't stop as long as we support that delusion.
Wealth is not really limited. Beachfront land is limited. Wealth is created by a capitalist society. That's basic economics. Many of America's "poor" live better than the "rich" people in non-capitalistic societies.
People deserve a chance to recover from their mistakes- they do not deserve to be supported to continue those mistakes.
I voted against Bush- 90% because of Supreme Court issues (didn't make a difference- I'm in a gerrymandered 70% Red district). I don't like the thought of being in a pro-corporate/pro-christian supreme court environment the rest of my life. (for all of christianity's good points- it is usually corrupted when it gets power).
That being said- I am not buying the dem's laying this on Bush for 1 second. At most the man is 5-10% responsible. More likely he is under 5% responsible. I would lay primary responsibility on the mayor, the governor, FEMA, and (this has gotten a lot of heat) the people themselves for not taking enough personal responsibility for their fates.
All that being said- the government effort really only ran about 24 hours slow. With the "katrina got past and all is well- uh oh a levee broke" I can understand the stutterstep a bit.
But someone else said this is our dunkirk and we didn't call for the boats and there I agree. I did what I could as a private citizen but if the government had said, "We need everyone within 100 miles of NO to get their boats and start hauling people out NOW" then I believe people would have responded and filled the gap. It didn't have to be this bad- it was this bad partially because we depended on the government too much.
Yes it's laziness, consumerism, addictions and irresponsible sex most of the time.
People have a right to be lazy, buy things they can't afford, eat fattening food and become obese (get heart disease and diabetes), get addicted to things so they waste 80 bucks a month on cigs and booze, and to have irresponsible sex. It is THEIR RIGHT to be stupid. That's what the country is about- freedom.
The other shoe is that people are RESPONSIBLE for their actions. This is a story as old as civilization- the grasshopper and the ant is not a new parable.
It is your right to give every last dollar you possess and every minute of your time to help everyone you can. If you do that you will see that EVERY person is not worth helping. You won't be able to help everyone. So you will have to decide based on SOME criteria who is going to get your help.
Think man- you destroy some people by helping them. You are killing them with kindness and smothering any hope they have of realizing their potential as human beings. Help those who are truly in need but be prepared to wean them off your help for their own good so you don't ruin them as human beings. Teach them to fish- don't just give them fish the rest of their lives.
You insult humans in poverty enormously when you say they are incapable of escaping it and you doom them and their children to poverty by not expecting higher of them.
Man- I agree with you that things are getting out of hand on the rich end- I think anything over 10x "average" salary for executives is unfair to the employees AND to the shareholders.
The rest I have to disagree. The average "rich to poor" and "poor to rich" is about 3 generations in america. There has been some evidence that it is increasing lately but a poor families still become rich and it is -very- easy for rich families to become poor.
I did -not- say life is easy. My parents divorced and were not high school graduates. Two generations back my grandparents were indians who were too young and got screwed out of the free land that their older brothers and sisters got (dividing our family into poor and rich parts with some bitterness there). Life is -hard-. But we are not under feudalism or a dictatorship.
I was so poor that I had to ride a bicycle to work for 3 years almost 10 miles each way. That can be brutal when it is below freezing or near freezing and raining. I lived on cardboard boxes for furniture at least 4 years of my marriage. I road a bloody moped for 2 years. I was almost 40 before I had my first new car.
My mother never made more than half the average salary- she was -always- poor. She retired with a house and a enough money saved up to take her to maybe 75. And that was despite making some foolish choices- we all make foolish choices because we are human.
It takes either really bad luck (medical usually) or continuous effort (buying things you can't afford, having kids too early/out of wedlock because you couldn't have safe sex or put it off) to be stuck in poverty in this country. It is RIDICULOUSLY easy to get out of poverty. A 30k income takes only 1 - 2 years of sacrifice. A 40k income is the average and that's a million dollars in 25 years.
A large part of the reason people remain poor is because their leaders destroy their hope instead of inspire them and because they have bad habits and refuse to change them.
Got any links? I'd like to read up on this subject a bit more since it is new to me. I'm shocked at the degree of subsidence- I think in terms of a foot a decade!
The number of top jobs is not unlimited. I'm not saying everyone can become rich- or even that everyone can become average (impossible by definition).
I think the imbalances are way too huge and need correction (corporate executives should not be making over 5-10 times what the average worker makes- i.e. about 400,000 bucks a year tops). I agree the wealthy class is getting too powerful at the expense of the middle and lower classes.
My agreement ends there. Many people in poverty are there because of their decisions and could better their life with concerted effort. They responsible for their own fate.
No. They can get a job, go to community college at night.
They can take advantage of the opportunities which numerous people not born in the U.S. can take advantage. People of all colors and nationalities, some who have trouble speaking english, who come to this country with NOTHING who have businesses and own cars and houses 10 years later.
I'mt not saying it's fun to skip movies, cable TV, cell phones, smoke cigarettes, going out drinking and dancing, premarital sex (and unplanned children) for years is easy or fun. But you don't need to spend money on that crap to have fun with other people.
It is not about being smart or lucky for -most- people. SURE some people have truly bad luck. But most put themselves into poverty one small decision at a time and then they blame others.
Again- a very -small- percentage of people are just screwed (and another group just gets every break). But the rest build their own cages one bar at a time.
The bridge thing really irritates me. It is so blatantly wrong for the country. Even the 50 residents didn't want it- they were overridden. To me that says someone else is benefiting from the $175 and logically it has to be related to whoever is going to build the bridge.
I think they need to go back and cancel the bridge NOW and use the money for NO disaster relief.
It is SO irritating that BOTH the democrats AND republicans have been bought by the corporations. Voting almost doesn't' matter any more.
The odds I saw elsewhere were.5% per year. So a 99.5% chance it won't happen each year. SO 100% - 99.5%^15. In the range of 6% to 9% (do the math for the exact number).
I'm betting that whatever they build won't withstand a category 5 hurricane. The hurricane would test every inch of the defenses and they would have to be perfect or the city would flood again.
Another point is that they do not tend to build -ON- the fault line which is equivalent of building below sea level in an area frequently hit by major hurricanes.
Yea but you are kinda arguing around the real point.
To me that point seems to be, "Is it possible in the last 100 years to have made NO a safe place to live or to develop safe emergency shelters."
Well to me... it seems like 600 million dollars (current day) would have thickened a lot of levee's. Galveston basically raised a huge area 10 feet above sea level and it's a lot smaller and poorer than NO.
Now I will grant 20/20 hindsite but I would say if they rebuild NO that they should
1) The highways could have been built so they were not made useless by a flood- that would have helped get relief in and around town faster. Austin, Houston, Dallas have long sections of highway 30' in the air. I think in the future there should be a good road system at least at sea level.
2) Raise any areas marginally below sea level above sea level- this would not be very expensive (bring in 2-5' of dirt or as we do in houston, lower one part of the lot to hold runnoff and use that to raise the rest where the buildings are).
3) Put escape hatches out of the attic and perhaps even design porch roofs and so on to be decks that can be stood on comfortably.
4) Put aside 2-3 five gallon containers of water- I keep one handy at all times (the outside is pretty dusty now).
5) Invest $25 in a solar power recharger for their cell phones (for when power comes back on).
6) Get a gun to protect themselves and make a commitment to protect themselves and their neighbors against thugs.
7) Keep a few days worth of canned goods ready and a week or two of dry goods (rice, pasta) and a few bottles of vitamens.
8) Learn how to make a solar cooker (pretty nifty what you can do with a roll of tin foil and 100 degree sun.
9) Keep a couple poles and a tarp in the attic so they can build a makeshift shelter from the sun and plus capture rain water.
10) Schedule a few days each month to let the mississippi flood and rebuild the delta. It's clearly one of those "pay me now or pay me later" type of things. If they continue doing what they are doing the coast is going to erode -past- NO.
11) Build more levee's internal to the city to reduce the impact of a levee break. SERIOUSLY- this is now officially a major terrorist risk. Who needs a bomb when you can recreate this incident in an under an hour with a backhoe.
Well, Anonymous Coward, it's called a "reasonable conclusion". One can reasonably conclude that a small percentage of the population is PERMANENTLY DISABLED or WIDOWED.
You will note as I was engaging in a reasonable discussion and not a formal debate I'm not providing footnotes and references for every comment I make.
You will also note I said "maybe 2%" which is not the same thing as "exactly 2.73% with a 95% level of confidence."
Such behavior is entirely reasonable given the forum and environment so I defy your cheesy attempt to discount my fairly -reasonable- opinion.
1) I'm donating cash to charity- I've donated cash to charity in the past and I will in the future.
2) I've donated my time to charity now and in the past. I am one of the people currently helping the evacuee's out.
3) Based on past experience, I'll still be helping them in the coming months when the "emotional" types like yourself have "uncomfortably" bailed on them. I have seen so many emotional assholes who ream you up one side and down the other and when push comes to shove they are too busy to actually sustain an ongoing effort. Hell - in some cases they talk a good show and then do nothing at all to begin with.
If a person chooses to have a cell phone, to buy ciggy's and beer, to gamble, to spend money dating and partying and on nice clothes then they are choosing to live from paycheck to paycheck.
If a person chooses to eat unhealthy food they they are responsible when they get obese and develop diabetes.
Of course not- it's a reasonable estimate of the percentage of the population who are widowed or has been disabled by an accident/chronic disease (*not diabetes- see below) through no fault of their own.
I don't believe that you are saying you reasonably believe that the vast majority of poor NO residents were disabled by accidents, chronic fatigue, etc.? If so then you are deluded.
*Don't tell me about diabetes or obesity related diseases- they celebrate eating a terrible diet high in cholestorol and fat. (And that's based on hearing them talk on the radio in the last hour- the exact phrase was something like "we are going to rebuild and get back to drinking and eating that fantastic food that is so high in cholesterol and fat"
I had a hard time believing I was listening to it and immediately snapped to all the folks saying they have diabetes- a disease you can regulate with a proper diet in many cases. This is exactly my point- YOUR choices have CONSEQUENCES. By spending $30 bucks on beer and cigarettes a week you are locking yourself into poverty. By eating an unhealty diet YOU are making yourself sick.
It's just one step removed from the kids who kill their parents asking for mercy because they are orphans.
If you spend your money on gambling, drugs, cigarettes, and partying (and TV's Cell Phones, etc on credit) then YOU are responsible for your own poverty.
To repeat it again- frikkin JANITORS can retire wealthy in this country if they are reasonably frugal.
My mother didn't finish high school. She raised me as a single parent. She made some unwise choices, had bad breaks, and she -still- managed to retire successfully on a secretaries salary.
Out of that background, I didn't get a dime of support from family or the government. I worked hard and went to school at the same time. I save 40% of my income right now- it hurts and sucks. On top of that, I donate money on top of that to charity and donate my time to help the evacuees.
Now- your specific examples are ones that I -do- sympathise with. The -WIDOW- and the -INJURED- by accidents and situations beyond their control.
However, they make up maybe 2% of those involved. The rest are regular people who made bad choices and were not willing to make the relatively minimal effort to get out of poverty.
Racism is mostly a crock perpetuated by democrats and black leaders to maintain their power. I have known too many american blacks and non-US blacks with the right attitude who have not only succeeded but excelled. They have one thing in common and that is a good attitude.
I agree, not everyone who is poor chooses to be poor. But if the vast majority of asians, indians, hispanics, phillipinos, and non-us blacks can repeatedly establish successful lives in the U.S. then I cannot expect less of citizens who were BORN here.
You also speak of the corruption of the wealthy. Sadly, I have to agree with you. It especially applies to places like Louisiana and Chicago but increasely applies at the national level as well. They put their own personal wealth over their fellow citizens. They are succeeding because of this unholy alliance of anti-abortion forces and corporations. Our political classes are being bought by the corporations and the religious forces that would normally counter them are going along.
I agree- no amount of planning can protect people from everything. We have no control over the world and can only play the odds. When those odds don't work out- that is when I and others are willing and glad to help.
I enjoyed building houses for houses for humanity. I enjoy helping many of the evacuees. I enjoy helping people who are making SOME effort to help themselves. However, helping people who are actively destroying their lives and the lives of others is pointless and counter-productive.
The only reason someone lives from paycheck to paycheck is because they choose to live that life.
It may be gambling- it may be drugs- it may have been a lifetime of partying and not saving so they are poor in old age. If you apply yourself, you can easily reach a 40k per year income in the US. There are people (janitors, teachers, etc.) who retired millionaires on a lot less.
The people of NO tolerated corruption and graft. The outcome of such toleration is well hidden until a bridge collapses, or a house burns down because the wiring was substandard, etc.
The people of the US are increasingly tolerating it too. Why else would we be building a $175 MILLION dollar bridge to nowhere in Alaska instead of investing that money wisely or lowering taxes so the money can be used productively.
As much as I will personally help the evacuees from NO, I recognize that they are poor because of the personal choices they made during their lives. A very few may have actually had bad luck after doing the right things but most earned their poverty by decades of poor decisions.
I agree. I hope we will accept the help graciously while being reasonably cautious. I can't fault anyone caught in the disaster for complaining and being upset- but anyone not personally affected needs to be positive and pitch in to help out.
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Then we need a new word. Because there are many atheists who -believe- there is no god. They have "faith" that there is no god.
It's pretty common actually.
OTH, in my experience, People that call themselves agnostics more typically talk about a lack of belief.
Selection is going on.
Certain groups are not even replacing their current population. They raise the children they have in such a way that they do not replace themselves either. Meanwhile other groups are having 4 or more children who mostly survive to reproductive age and who are raised so they are likely to have large numbers of children as well. Not all of them are in poverty- many of them are successful but hold certain religious beliefs.
It is really happening at a very high rate in geologic terms.
Meanwhile in other parts of the planet, disease and famine are strongly selecting for people resistant to disease or who can survive famine.
"Whole foods" sells enteric (sp?) coated "gut" pills so they survive your stomach acid.
Couple years ago I had an illness that seemed to specifically target my gut bugs. I felt vaguely ill after eating and it would go through me not fully digested.
It took me a few weeks to figure it out but after I took the friendly bug pills for a few days the problem cleared up. Actually they almost cleared up completely the first day.
It is an issue for anyone that takes antibiotics- and it applies to female parts as well (yeast infections easier if you don't have friendly bugs).
I agree it is hard.
So we don't make it any easier for them by supporting them in their bad habits. They need some kind of back-pressure to motivate them. They need to have some hope that they can succeed if they try instead of being told it's hopeless because "the man" holds them down.
It's not the man that is holding them down any more- probably has not been for a couple decades. They are holding themselves down and they won't stop as long as we support that delusion.
Wealth is not really limited. Beachfront land is limited. Wealth is created by a capitalist society. That's basic economics. Many of America's "poor" live better than the "rich" people in non-capitalistic societies.
People deserve a chance to recover from their mistakes- they do not deserve to be supported to continue those mistakes.
Man a direct answer to the comment is marked offtopic. "Just proved my point" damn straight.
That is a dynamite link!
I voted against Bush- 90% because of Supreme Court issues (didn't make a difference- I'm in a gerrymandered 70% Red district). I don't like the thought of being in a pro-corporate/pro-christian supreme court environment the rest of my life. (for all of christianity's good points- it is usually corrupted when it gets power).
That being said- I am not buying the dem's laying this on Bush for 1 second. At most the man is 5-10% responsible. More likely he is under 5% responsible. I would lay primary responsibility on the mayor, the governor, FEMA, and (this has gotten a lot of heat) the people themselves for not taking enough personal responsibility for their fates.
All that being said- the government effort really only ran about 24 hours slow. With the "katrina got past and all is well- uh oh a levee broke" I can understand the stutterstep a bit.
But someone else said this is our dunkirk and we didn't call for the boats and there I agree. I did what I could as a private citizen but if the government had said, "We need everyone within 100 miles of NO to get their boats and start hauling people out NOW" then I believe people would have responded and filled the gap. It didn't have to be this bad- it was this bad partially because we depended on the government too much.
Yes it's laziness, consumerism, addictions and irresponsible sex most of the time.
People have a right to be lazy, buy things they can't afford, eat fattening food and become obese (get heart disease and diabetes), get addicted to things so they waste 80 bucks a month on cigs and booze, and to have irresponsible sex. It is THEIR RIGHT to be stupid. That's what the country is about- freedom.
The other shoe is that people are RESPONSIBLE for their actions. This is a story as old as civilization- the grasshopper and the ant is not a new parable.
It is your right to give every last dollar you possess and every minute of your time to help everyone you can. If you do that you will see that EVERY person is not worth helping. You won't be able to help everyone. So you will have to decide based on SOME criteria who is going to get your help.
Think man- you destroy some people by helping them. You are killing them with kindness and smothering any hope they have of realizing their potential as human beings. Help those who are truly in need but be prepared to wean them off your help for their own good so you don't ruin them as human beings. Teach them to fish- don't just give them fish the rest of their lives.
You insult humans in poverty enormously when you say they are incapable of escaping it and you doom them and their children to poverty by not expecting higher of them.
Man- I agree with you that things are getting out of hand on the rich end- I think anything over 10x "average" salary for executives is unfair to the employees AND to the shareholders.
The rest I have to disagree. The average "rich to poor" and "poor to rich" is about 3 generations in america. There has been some evidence that it is increasing lately but a poor families still become rich and it is -very- easy for rich families to become poor.
I did -not- say life is easy. My parents divorced and were not high school graduates. Two generations back my grandparents were indians who were too young and got screwed out of the free land that their older brothers and sisters got (dividing our family into poor and rich parts with some bitterness there). Life is -hard-. But we are not under feudalism or a dictatorship.
I was so poor that I had to ride a bicycle to work for 3 years almost 10 miles each way. That can be brutal when it is below freezing or near freezing and raining. I lived on cardboard boxes for furniture at least 4 years of my marriage. I road a bloody moped for 2 years. I was almost 40 before I had my first new car.
My mother never made more than half the average salary- she was -always- poor. She retired with a house and a enough money saved up to take her to maybe 75. And that was despite making some foolish choices- we all make foolish choices because we are human.
It takes either really bad luck (medical usually) or continuous effort (buying things you can't afford, having kids too early/out of wedlock because you couldn't have safe sex or put it off) to be stuck in poverty in this country. It is RIDICULOUSLY easy to get out of poverty. A 30k income takes only 1 - 2 years of sacrifice. A 40k income is the average and that's a million dollars in 25 years.
A large part of the reason people remain poor is because their leaders destroy their hope instead of inspire them and because they have bad habits and refuse to change them.
Got any links? I'd like to read up on this subject a bit more since it is new to me. I'm shocked at the degree of subsidence- I think in terms of a foot a decade!
The house has to withstand thieves reasonably well or be in a secured area.
The house has to have a high R-Value or heating and cooling costs will be absurd.
The house has to stop noise reasonably well or you are going to have trouble sleeping/etc.
But not an unreasonable idea.
It is dishonest and vile to doom people to poverty by telling they have no chance instead of providing them with hope and a kick in the ass.
I agree with many of your points.
The number of top jobs is not unlimited. I'm not saying everyone can become rich- or even that everyone can become average (impossible by definition).
I think the imbalances are way too huge and need correction (corporate executives should not be making over 5-10 times what the average worker makes- i.e. about 400,000 bucks a year tops). I agree the wealthy class is getting too powerful at the expense of the middle and lower classes.
My agreement ends there. Many people in poverty are there because of their decisions and could better their life with concerted effort. They responsible for their own fate.
No. They can get a job, go to community college at night.
They can take advantage of the opportunities which numerous people not born in the U.S. can take advantage. People of all colors and nationalities, some who have trouble speaking english, who come to this country with NOTHING who have businesses and own cars and houses 10 years later.
I'mt not saying it's fun to skip movies, cable TV, cell phones, smoke cigarettes, going out drinking and dancing, premarital sex (and unplanned children) for years is easy or fun. But you don't need to spend money on that crap to have fun with other people.
It is not about being smart or lucky for -most- people. SURE some people have truly bad luck. But most put themselves into poverty one small decision at a time and then they blame others.
Again- a very -small- percentage of people are just screwed (and another group just gets every break). But the rest build their own cages one bar at a time.
Okay... how many of those trapped in New Orleans worked at the port?
As others have said, with container shipping and pipelines there is a lot less need for workers in the port these days.
The bridge thing really irritates me. It is so blatantly wrong for the country. Even the 50 residents didn't want it- they were overridden. To me that says someone else is benefiting from the $175 and logically it has to be related to whoever is going to build the bridge.
I think they need to go back and cancel the bridge NOW and use the money for NO disaster relief.
It is SO irritating that BOTH the democrats AND republicans have been bought by the corporations. Voting almost doesn't' matter any more.
The odds I saw elsewhere were .5% per year. So a 99.5% chance it won't happen each year. SO 100% - 99.5%^15. In the range of 6% to 9% (do the math for the exact number).
I'm betting that whatever they build won't withstand a category 5 hurricane. The hurricane would test every inch of the defenses and they would have to be perfect or the city would flood again.
Another point is that they do not tend to build -ON- the fault line which is equivalent of building below sea level in an area frequently hit by major hurricanes.
Yea but you are kinda arguing around the real point.
To me that point seems to be, "Is it possible in the last 100 years to have made NO a safe place to live or to develop safe emergency shelters."
Well to me... it seems like 600 million dollars (current day) would have thickened a lot of levee's. Galveston basically raised a huge area 10 feet above sea level and it's a lot smaller and poorer than NO.
Now I will grant 20/20 hindsite but I would say if they rebuild NO that they should
1) The highways could have been built so they were not made useless by a flood- that would have helped get relief in and around town faster. Austin, Houston, Dallas have long sections of highway 30' in the air. I think in the future there should be a good road system at least at sea level.
2) Raise any areas marginally below sea level above sea level- this would not be very expensive (bring in 2-5' of dirt or as we do in houston, lower one part of the lot to hold runnoff and use that to raise the rest where the buildings are).
3) Put escape hatches out of the attic and perhaps even design porch roofs and so on to be decks that can be stood on comfortably.
4) Put aside 2-3 five gallon containers of water- I keep one handy at all times (the outside is pretty dusty now).
5) Invest $25 in a solar power recharger for their cell phones (for when power comes back on).
6) Get a gun to protect themselves and make a commitment to protect themselves and their neighbors against thugs.
7) Keep a few days worth of canned goods ready and a week or two of dry goods (rice, pasta) and a few bottles of vitamens.
8) Learn how to make a solar cooker (pretty nifty what you can do with a roll of tin foil and 100 degree sun.
9) Keep a couple poles and a tarp in the attic so they can build a makeshift shelter from the sun and plus capture rain water.
10) Schedule a few days each month to let the mississippi flood and rebuild the delta. It's clearly one of those "pay me now or pay me later" type of things. If they continue doing what they are doing the coast is going to erode -past- NO.
11) Build more levee's internal to the city to reduce the impact of a levee break. SERIOUSLY- this is now officially a major terrorist risk. Who needs a bomb when you can recreate this incident in an under an hour with a backhoe.
Cheers.
Well, Anonymous Coward, it's called a "reasonable conclusion". One can reasonably conclude that a small percentage of the population is PERMANENTLY DISABLED or WIDOWED.
You will note as I was engaging in a reasonable discussion and not a formal debate I'm not providing footnotes and references for every comment I make.
You will also note I said "maybe 2%" which is not the same thing as "exactly 2.73% with a 95% level of confidence."
Such behavior is entirely reasonable given the forum and environment so I defy your cheesy attempt to discount my fairly -reasonable- opinion.
As I have repeatedly said.
1) I'm donating cash to charity- I've donated cash to charity in the past and I will in the future.
2) I've donated my time to charity now and in the past. I am one of the people currently helping the evacuee's out.
3) Based on past experience, I'll still be helping them in the coming months when the "emotional" types like yourself have "uncomfortably" bailed on them. I have seen so many emotional assholes who ream you up one side and down the other and when push comes to shove they are too busy to actually sustain an ongoing effort. Hell - in some cases they talk a good show and then do nothing at all to begin with.
If a person chooses to have a cell phone, to buy ciggy's and beer, to gamble, to spend money dating and partying and on nice clothes then they are choosing to live from paycheck to paycheck.
If a person chooses to eat unhealthy food they they are responsible when they get obese and develop diabetes.
Cheers.
Of course not- it's a reasonable estimate of the percentage of the population who are widowed or has been disabled by an accident/chronic disease (*not diabetes- see below) through no fault of their own.
I don't believe that you are saying you reasonably believe that the vast majority of poor NO residents were disabled by accidents, chronic fatigue, etc.? If so then you are deluded.
*Don't tell me about diabetes or obesity related diseases- they celebrate eating a terrible diet high in cholestorol and fat. (And that's based on hearing them talk on the radio in the last hour- the exact phrase was something like "we are going to rebuild and get back to drinking and eating that fantastic food that is so high in cholesterol and fat"
I had a hard time believing I was listening to it and immediately snapped to all the folks saying they have diabetes- a disease you can regulate with a proper diet in many cases. This is exactly my point- YOUR choices have CONSEQUENCES. By spending $30 bucks on beer and cigarettes a week you are locking yourself into poverty. By eating an unhealty diet YOU are making yourself sick.
It's just one step removed from the kids who kill their parents asking for mercy because they are orphans.
If you spend your money on gambling, drugs, cigarettes, and partying (and TV's Cell Phones, etc on credit) then YOU are responsible for your own poverty.
To repeat it again- frikkin JANITORS can retire wealthy in this country if they are reasonably frugal.
My mother didn't finish high school. She raised me as a single parent. She made some unwise choices, had bad breaks, and she -still- managed to retire successfully on a secretaries salary.
Out of that background, I didn't get a dime of support from family or the government. I worked hard and went to school at the same time. I save 40% of my income right now- it hurts and sucks. On top of that, I donate money on top of that to charity and donate my time to help the evacuees.
Now- your specific examples are ones that I -do- sympathise with. The -WIDOW- and the -INJURED- by accidents and situations beyond their control.
However, they make up maybe 2% of those involved. The rest are regular people who made bad choices and were not willing to make the relatively minimal effort to get out of poverty.
Racism is mostly a crock perpetuated by democrats and black leaders to maintain their power. I have known too many american blacks and non-US blacks with the right attitude who have not only succeeded but excelled. They have one thing in common and that is a good attitude.
I agree, not everyone who is poor chooses to be poor. But if the vast majority of asians, indians, hispanics, phillipinos, and non-us blacks can repeatedly establish successful lives in the U.S. then I cannot expect less of citizens who were BORN here.
You also speak of the corruption of the wealthy. Sadly, I have to agree with you. It especially applies to places like Louisiana and Chicago but increasely applies at the national level as well. They put their own personal wealth over their fellow citizens. They are succeeding because of this unholy alliance of anti-abortion forces and corporations. Our political classes are being bought by the corporations and the religious forces that would normally counter them are going along.
I agree- no amount of planning can protect people from everything. We have no control over the world and can only play the odds. When those odds don't work out- that is when I and others are willing and glad to help.
I enjoyed building houses for houses for humanity. I enjoy helping many of the evacuees. I enjoy helping people who are making SOME effort to help themselves. However, helping people who are actively destroying their lives and the lives of others is pointless and counter-productive.
The only reason someone lives from paycheck to paycheck is because they choose to live that life.
It may be gambling- it may be drugs- it may have been a lifetime of partying and not saving so they are poor in old age. If you apply yourself, you can easily reach a 40k per year income in the US. There are people (janitors, teachers, etc.) who retired millionaires on a lot less.
The people of NO tolerated corruption and graft. The outcome of such toleration is well hidden until a bridge collapses, or a house burns down because the wiring was substandard, etc.
The people of the US are increasingly tolerating it too. Why else would we be building a $175 MILLION dollar bridge to nowhere in Alaska instead of investing that money wisely or lowering taxes so the money can be used productively.
As much as I will personally help the evacuees from NO, I recognize that they are poor because of the personal choices they made during their lives. A very few may have actually had bad luck after doing the right things but most earned their poverty by decades of poor decisions.
Nope- get the "Great Quality" brand. It's windows home SP2.
I agree. I hope we will accept the help graciously while being reasonably cautious. I can't fault anyone caught in the disaster for complaining and being upset- but anyone not personally affected needs to be positive and pitch in to help out.