Yeah, that could work. Though I believe pressure inside the ISS cabin is even less than 1 atm, so it'll probably have to be somewhere around 5 meters or so to work.
You do realize that you can only suck liquid up about 10 meters from the ground, right? Even if you had a vacuum pump, atmospheric pressure can only push liquid up the straw so far.
Actually, they were drinking by-products of the Space Shuttle fuel cells. The hydrogen and oxygen in those fuel cells didn't necessarily come from water, and even if the reactants did come from water, can we really call it recycled water/pee if it was broken down and then reconstituted at the molecular level? It would be the same if you took a part a house brick by brick and rebuilt it somewhere else. I don't think I'd say I was living in a recycled house.
In addition to the funding problem, I've also seen examples of government mandated waste. A lot of the NASA contracts require that main contractor subcontract the work out to small disadvantaged businesses (SDBs). A lot of these SDBs are just middlemen getting a piece of the money.
Ex: Everything that flies into space must be space-rated, including the pens, pencils, markers, etc. If they want to use a Sharpie, they can't just go out to Target and get it, they have to get it from one of these SDBs. Guess what they do to "space-rate" the Sharpies. They buy it from Target/Walmart/Staples, etc, mark up the price ten-fold, and then sell it to the contractor.
Those smaller space companies out there like SpaceX and Interorbital are really making launches cheap by cutting out the middlemen who mark things up. If NASA could do that too, then we'd be getting to the moon much sooner.
We're kind of in a Catch-22 right now though. We're all against government waste, but many people argue in support of the things that are the cause of this waste. I can see how people want to support these smaller businesses. What they don't realize, though, is how this is causing those problems further up the line. This is really a trade off between trying to stimulate the economy and trying to reduce waste so that we can get there much more quickly and efficiently.
Oh, don't get me started on Sheila Jackson Lee. I hate her (and her staff) with a passion.
She's one of those showboat politicians who goes to events, gets up on stage to get her picture taken with someone important, and leaves. I also had to deal with her staff to invite her to an event, and boy are they rude...
I really wish I was in her district so that I could vote against her. Well, better than that is being in Nick Lampson's district. Go NASA all the way!
Actually, it will just reduce the dust problem by about half (maybe more, depending on how the suits are docked). The back half of the suit (backpack, etc) still enters the cabin before they doff their suits.
So while half to most of the dust problem has been eliminated, they are looking at things like static electricity to *almost* eliminate the rest of the dust. (Wish I had official sources, most of this info I learned from going to lectures as a JSC co-op).
Well, I don't think you get a realistic test driving it on the streets of, say, LA, Houston, or any city/town.
My guess is that we just haven't had much development in these areas that closely resemble the moonscape. It's not that they were looking for uninhabited places (or maybe they were), but that nobody really wanted to live in these areas (desert, etc).
At least this caught your attention. How much of the real science done in space did you actually pay attention to? This game is being done during his free time up there, and I'm pretty sure the chess board was part of his "personal items manifest", so he wasn't wasting mass by displacing some science experiment.
If you think it's a waste to allow any personal items brought up at all, think about it if you were stranded on an island. Wouldn't you want to have some personal items with you? At least he brought something intellectually stimulating, instead of something like porn.
I've got more to say, see above under "Re: NASA Getting Desperate for PR" for the rest of my commentary.
Regarding the PR stunt, yes, it is one because it's try to draw lot's of attention, but so is every outreach program run by any kind of organization.
Part of NASA's mission, to quote Michael Griffin, is that "NASA is in the inspiration business." (http://www.spaceref.com/news/viewsr.html?pid=29218) That in itself is PR.
Space exploration needs to be on the forefront of science, along with things like the LHC, etc. Our country is on a decline on the science, technology, and innovation front. Our government has let it go by the wayside (see http://www.spaceref.com/news/viewsr.html?pid=29133 specifically for the space program), and too much of Generation Y is ignoring science, going into "soft" fields (preaching to the choir).
Like I said, NASA needs to inspire more young children to get into science and technology. If what it takes is a "PR stunt" like this, then so be it. Sure, NASA benefits from it, but the real beneficiaries, if it works out right, are the children, and by extension, future society.
Actually, I don't think I'm the center of the universe, I'm advocating for the poor souls whose suffering you are causing because of your arrogance and lack of consideration.
When I was little and first heard about the growing level atmospheric CO2, I thought "Great, now all the trees have more CO2 to breathe." Didn't occur to me that we didn't have enough trees to convert the CO2.
If that's where the island was put originally, and it's been experiencing the tsunamis constantly (compared to the age of the Earth), yes, the island should still take the fall for the ones behind it.
For humans: It's not the fault of the people behind you that you're living on a tsunami-prone island. If you don't like the environment, then move. Don't let other people suffer because you're stuck up and think that you're the center of the universe.
explain how making earthquake-proof buildings will lead to making the earthquake worse for everyone else?
Ok, imagine I live on an island that's prone to tsunamis, and you live on an island behind me that's protected by my island. Are you really ok with me putting up the barrier so that now, you have to deal with the tsunami's?
I don't see how this argument is retarded, because this is exactly what's happening.
The only ones who would be affected would be anyone who's behind that island, who has been using it to break their Tsunamis in the past.
Like your parent said, it'd be like pumping the water into your (backdoor) neighbor's house. Nature built the islands the way they are, and the ones on the front lines are just screwed. It's understandable that we want to protect whatever home we're on, but by doing this, you are dumping the problem onto the next guy.
It may be true that this specific mission seems a bit suicidal, but what else are you going to do with it? Nothing? The rover was meant to run until it died, and this seems like as good a cause to die for as any.
The rover isn't just going on a boring 2 year long road trip, it's also exploring the rocks and terrain along the way. Even if it doesn't reach its destination, the trek will still be of scientific value.
don't give them too many more things to-do but explore
That's what Opportunity is doing. It's will be exploring the crater. Along the way Opportunity will also be studying the soil and terrain it encounters while it's making it's trek to the crater.
I the JPL scientists were planning for Opportunity to explore whatever's available, but they didn't want it to just randomly wander whichever way it wanted to. Instead, they decided to give it an exploration trek. They will be exploring the environment, and at the end of the endeavor, it will end up at Endeavor Crater. The crater was the next thing over, the closest thing of great scientific interest that made a good destination for its continuing mission... To explore strange new worlds. To seek out new life, and new civilizations. To boldly go where no one has gone before.
Same goes for the wiper idea too. Adding any kind of cleaning mechanism adds more weight, and I'm guessing a trade study done on this deemed the estimated extended life to not be worth the added weight (fewer scientific tools).
It's also not a good idea to count on the Martian wind being there either, because what happens if you get unlucky and are in an area of doldrums? The best course of action is to plan for the worst (3 month mission), but have the capability to continue on if you get a good windfall like that.
I'm not familiar with what the difference between a commonwealth and our United States is. Could you explain for me?
I just checked the wiki article, and it said that a commonwealth is a state governed for the common good instead of for the benefit of a specific class. I thought that the United States, when originally founded, was not formed to benefit a specific class. It was a government "for the People." Of course, today, it seems like our administrations favor one class or another, depending on who's in power, but that just naturally happens due to personal selfishness.
Not as a question challenging your point, but I was wondering how is that kind of favoritism prevented in a Commonwealth State?
I was wondering what the laws are on this kind of speculation.
That aside, if the guy paid money for the domain name, the Chicago Olympic campaign should at least pay him back for the cost of the domain name (plus interest?). I don't think it's legit for them to just seize the name from him. I would think this would fall under the same category as eminent domain.
Ahh, so special classes of people have special rights and responsiblities? In other words, all men are not created equal? I think we should all be held to the same stanards, and all have the same rights.
He's not saying that "all men are not created equal," he's saying that all professions are not created equal.
All people are created equal, they just climb at unequal levels into unequal professions, at which point we go into MyLongNickName's argument below.
Slashdot Mirror
The rovers have not yet found the flag left behind by Neil Armstrong on Apollo 11
Yeah, that could work. Though I believe pressure inside the ISS cabin is even less than 1 atm, so it'll probably have to be somewhere around 5 meters or so to work.
You do realize that you can only suck liquid up about 10 meters from the ground, right? Even if you had a vacuum pump, atmospheric pressure can only push liquid up the straw so far.
Actually, they were drinking by-products of the Space Shuttle fuel cells. The hydrogen and oxygen in those fuel cells didn't necessarily come from water, and even if the reactants did come from water, can we really call it recycled water/pee if it was broken down and then reconstituted at the molecular level? It would be the same if you took a part a house brick by brick and rebuilt it somewhere else. I don't think I'd say I was living in a recycled house.
In addition to the funding problem, I've also seen examples of government mandated waste. A lot of the NASA contracts require that main contractor subcontract the work out to small disadvantaged businesses (SDBs). A lot of these SDBs are just middlemen getting a piece of the money.
Ex: Everything that flies into space must be space-rated, including the pens, pencils, markers, etc. If they want to use a Sharpie, they can't just go out to Target and get it, they have to get it from one of these SDBs. Guess what they do to "space-rate" the Sharpies. They buy it from Target/Walmart/Staples, etc, mark up the price ten-fold, and then sell it to the contractor.
Those smaller space companies out there like SpaceX and Interorbital are really making launches cheap by cutting out the middlemen who mark things up. If NASA could do that too, then we'd be getting to the moon much sooner.
We're kind of in a Catch-22 right now though. We're all against government waste, but many people argue in support of the things that are the cause of this waste. I can see how people want to support these smaller businesses. What they don't realize, though, is how this is causing those problems further up the line. This is really a trade off between trying to stimulate the economy and trying to reduce waste so that we can get there much more quickly and efficiently.
Oh, don't get me started on Sheila Jackson Lee. I hate her (and her staff) with a passion.
She's one of those showboat politicians who goes to events, gets up on stage to get her picture taken with someone important, and leaves. I also had to deal with her staff to invite her to an event, and boy are they rude...
I really wish I was in her district so that I could vote against her. Well, better than that is being in Nick Lampson's district. Go NASA all the way!
Actually, it will just reduce the dust problem by about half (maybe more, depending on how the suits are docked). The back half of the suit (backpack, etc) still enters the cabin before they doff their suits.
So while half to most of the dust problem has been eliminated, they are looking at things like static electricity to *almost* eliminate the rest of the dust. (Wish I had official sources, most of this info I learned from going to lectures as a JSC co-op).
Well, I don't think you get a realistic test driving it on the streets of, say, LA, Houston, or any city/town.
My guess is that we just haven't had much development in these areas that closely resemble the moonscape. It's not that they were looking for uninhabited places (or maybe they were), but that nobody really wanted to live in these areas (desert, etc).
At least this caught your attention. How much of the real science done in space did you actually pay attention to? This game is being done during his free time up there, and I'm pretty sure the chess board was part of his "personal items manifest", so he wasn't wasting mass by displacing some science experiment.
If you think it's a waste to allow any personal items brought up at all, think about it if you were stranded on an island. Wouldn't you want to have some personal items with you? At least he brought something intellectually stimulating, instead of something like porn.
I've got more to say, see above under "Re: NASA Getting Desperate for PR" for the rest of my commentary.
If one of the astronauts wants to play chess by mail, that's fine.
They actually did a game over the summer between Mission Control and Chamitoff, which ended with MCC resigning on 8-13: http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/station/expeditions/expedition17/chess_chamitoff.html.
Regarding the PR stunt, yes, it is one because it's try to draw lot's of attention, but so is every outreach program run by any kind of organization.
Part of NASA's mission, to quote Michael Griffin, is that "NASA is in the inspiration business." (http://www.spaceref.com/news/viewsr.html?pid=29218) That in itself is PR.
Space exploration needs to be on the forefront of science, along with things like the LHC, etc. Our country is on a decline on the science, technology, and innovation front. Our government has let it go by the wayside (see http://www.spaceref.com/news/viewsr.html?pid=29133 specifically for the space program), and too much of Generation Y is ignoring science, going into "soft" fields (preaching to the choir).
Like I said, NASA needs to inspire more young children to get into science and technology. If what it takes is a "PR stunt" like this, then so be it. Sure, NASA benefits from it, but the real beneficiaries, if it works out right, are the children, and by extension, future society.
Why should the people on the first island be expected to suffer for the sake of others when there's a way for them to protect themselves?
Agreed. They should be able to protect themselves, but not at the expense of creating a new problem for others.
Actually, I don't think I'm the center of the universe, I'm advocating for the poor souls whose suffering you are causing because of your arrogance and lack of consideration.
Indeed!
When I was little and first heard about the growing level atmospheric CO2, I thought "Great, now all the trees have more CO2 to breathe." Didn't occur to me that we didn't have enough trees to convert the CO2.
Wouldn't it come out to 13/24, taking the time average over a whole year?
If that's where the island was put originally, and it's been experiencing the tsunamis constantly (compared to the age of the Earth), yes, the island should still take the fall for the ones behind it.
For humans: It's not the fault of the people behind you that you're living on a tsunami-prone island. If you don't like the environment, then move. Don't let other people suffer because you're stuck up and think that you're the center of the universe.
explain how making earthquake-proof buildings will lead to making the earthquake worse for everyone else? Ok, imagine I live on an island that's prone to tsunamis, and you live on an island behind me that's protected by my island. Are you really ok with me putting up the barrier so that now, you have to deal with the tsunami's?
I don't see how this argument is retarded, because this is exactly what's happening.
The only ones who would be affected would be anyone who's behind that island, who has been using it to break their Tsunamis in the past.
Like your parent said, it'd be like pumping the water into your (backdoor) neighbor's house. Nature built the islands the way they are, and the ones on the front lines are just screwed. It's understandable that we want to protect whatever home we're on, but by doing this, you are dumping the problem onto the next guy.
It may be true that this specific mission seems a bit suicidal, but what else are you going to do with it? Nothing? The rover was meant to run until it died, and this seems like as good a cause to die for as any.
The rover isn't just going on a boring 2 year long road trip, it's also exploring the rocks and terrain along the way. Even if it doesn't reach its destination, the trek will still be of scientific value.
don't give them too many more things to-do but explore
That's what Opportunity is doing. It's will be exploring the crater. Along the way Opportunity will also be studying the soil and terrain it encounters while it's making it's trek to the crater.
I the JPL scientists were planning for Opportunity to explore whatever's available, but they didn't want it to just randomly wander whichever way it wanted to. Instead, they decided to give it an exploration trek. They will be exploring the environment, and at the end of the endeavor, it will end up at Endeavor Crater. The crater was the next thing over, the closest thing of great scientific interest that made a good destination for its continuing mission...
To explore strange new worlds. To seek out new life, and new civilizations. To boldly go where no one has gone before.
Compressor + storage = weight + power drain
Same goes for the wiper idea too. Adding any kind of cleaning mechanism adds more weight, and I'm guessing a trade study done on this deemed the estimated extended life to not be worth the added weight (fewer scientific tools).
It's also not a good idea to count on the Martian wind being there either, because what happens if you get unlucky and are in an area of doldrums? The best course of action is to plan for the worst (3 month mission), but have the capability to continue on if you get a good windfall like that.
Avast! It's Talk Like A Pirate Day! Today's not Talk Like Yoda Day, that's May 21, ya landlubbers!
Avast! We got a problem with the (insert discrepant part here), Cap'n!
Cap'n pulls out his pistol and shoots the officer.
I'm not familiar with what the difference between a commonwealth and our United States is. Could you explain for me?
I just checked the wiki article, and it said that a commonwealth is a state governed for the common good instead of for the benefit of a specific class. I thought that the United States, when originally founded, was not formed to benefit a specific class. It was a government "for the People." Of course, today, it seems like our administrations favor one class or another, depending on who's in power, but that just naturally happens due to personal selfishness.
Not as a question challenging your point, but I was wondering how is that kind of favoritism prevented in a Commonwealth State?
I was wondering what the laws are on this kind of speculation.
That aside, if the guy paid money for the domain name, the Chicago Olympic campaign should at least pay him back for the cost of the domain name (plus interest?). I don't think it's legit for them to just seize the name from him. I would think this would fall under the same category as eminent domain.
Remember, though, that if you help proliferate piracy, you're helping us reduce global warming.
Ahh, so special classes of people have special rights and responsiblities? In other words, all men are not created equal? I think we should all be held to the same stanards, and all have the same rights.
He's not saying that "all men are not created equal," he's saying that all professions are not created equal.
All people are created equal, they just climb at unequal levels into unequal professions, at which point we go into MyLongNickName's argument below.