If this is just for browsing and email, I am with you. Although for that job I would use a different device myself... like the eepc
I think I would need gigabit. I'm thinking that with a very small hard drive, only one usb port and no onboard DVD... my ethernet would be very busy. Cable internet is the least of my worries.
If you claimed it was illegal to rip a movie, then I hope you only posted on the USA ONLY section of slashdot. (they should make one so we can continue to believe we ARE the world)
Anyway, the last time I checked, most people on the world lived outside the US, and for most of those it is LEGAL to rip a movie.
In the world I live in you need WIRED or optical networks any time you need reliability or speed(or additional security). You just CANNOT trust wireless anything serious. (maybe no serious work is ever done by any other apple than the ones I've used) Wireless is a market segment, not a tech from last century.
And for speed, wired will ALWAYS beat RF, always!
This does not just apply to computers. I dabble in Sound Reinforcement, and the PRO`s use wireless whenever they HAVE to, wireless is a headache waiting to happen... interference from other devices, broadcasting stations etc, like to play havock at the most inopertune times.
If you have been following the Cell processor, you know it the main core would probubly place between a P3 and an Athlon 1600(and likely closer to the P3). Sure that can run an OS, but using that many transistors to run an OS is not ideal(olpc does this much more efficently).
Where the cell would be nice is in specialty laptops. Used as a secondary processor you would have a laptop powerhouse. As long as you could tack on the inputs and outputs, you would be able to be a PVR recording 20 channels at once, replace huge multimedia consoles or replace a large recording studio--- All on a laptop.
Sure the blackout may be preferred for you, but, your preference is shortsighted. The last time I was in a big power outage during a heatwave was in the north. A guy who had been injured working on high voltage lines(and was disabled) died due to the lack of cooling.
As long as the thermostatic controls apply to all business and home locations within reason, it is a lot less invasive/costly/deadly than rolling blackouts. (now if they would just insulate building better in CA)
It is interesting the responses that I got to the original post. I think most people assumed I am anti virtualization. I use it at home(vmware server) more than many corp's use it in the data center, lol. The original post really meant to emphisize that it was not because people don't want to get along, it is because they fear loosing control, (e.g. at my current employer, once you go on a LPAR you just lost all control, and most access) BUT boy did my (poorly?) picked fax illistration ever distract attention from my main thought.
But, the upside is that I have learned about modern faxing options, that I would have missed otherwise.
I should have mentioned that this was 3+ years ago. Maybe too long ago for me to think it had any relevance to a current conversation about Virtualization. Except for the fact that these occurances(even if dated) are what makes old timers fear virtualization.
I'm sure there is better software out there now, but the version of Rightfax they had was old(even three years ago). And the software was quite intwined with rightfax, and rightfax was very tied to the brooktrout cards they were running.
Why? because that was one of the legacy systems that you are consolidating for the large mortgage company(bank) that you just landed a contract at. They don't want to spend the time changing the elaborate back end they built around Rightfax. They just want the thousands of faxes each day to keep going out and coming in the same as always. (reengineering costs money, and they want to save it. Banks can be REAL cheap - just try to get the money to rewrite a working system. lol Then try to keep your job when the teething pains occur because of the small changes you made. Impact to revenue - BAD BAD BAD)
I worked there at the time, and the guy they brought in did not consolidate as much as they thought he would... but that is what they wanted.
I was aware that ESX can move a running VM, I thought that VMotion was an extra licence, but that could idea be dated.
I was not assuming that everyone would be running ESX. ESX was the only one that I had heard of that allows moving a running VM, but I don't try to track all the virtualization products. (of which x86 is just a portion)
As a youngster I was frusterated by the dinosours as well. Man, were they thick.
On the other hand, there are many places where the Vax or Alpha/VMS servers are older than 15 years. Solid as a rock, and the companies would be morons to pull the plug.
I have done a fair amount of work on OpenVMS with clients, and I don't see any platform that is more stable, and it really is well suited to some tasks. I consider AIX lighter weight than VMS, Linux even lighter... and I would never dream of putting anything mission critical on Windows or OS-X. (In addition, porting some clients OpenVMS code to an OS running on commodity hardware would run in the tens of millions)
(The place I am at now has 18 microvaxes that are being phased out just now - after 25 years. They have run the same code, no changes )
The problem is not that we don't want to work together. It is that you often cede control when you virtualize. And most of us don't love giving up control.
With virtualization in some Corp's, you have to ask for another of the 32 processors, instead of just having the headroom all the time.(work that one through a buricratic organization, it can take months) Say you have a need to add another fax board(or whatever) to the virtualized x86 server, to find that they stuck some mission critical Virtual Environment on the Server and It CAN'T come down for another 2 weeks.
Yep, it saves hardware, but multiplies headaches in some situations. It is no wonder some fear it.
"he did choose the three most popular flavours, I believe". This thread is about Linux on the desktop, so NO he did not pick the three most popular, let alone the three best suited.
But, if you really know what you claim to about Linux you ALREADY know REDHAT is a SERVER OS. You already KNOW that since Linux is the most diversified ecosystem you can find, ANYONE could find distro's that are not appropriate.
You KNOW that Apple supports VERY little hardware, and you HAVE to buy the hardware with the OS... but yet you blame Linux for not flawlessly supporting FAR more hardware than OS-X. It still stands that if you are willing to spend a fraction of the money on hardware that we already do on MAC's, Linux would just work as well!
Claiming I flipflopped is bull, You made up the scenario, or your friend is not informed. There is not Linux Newbie FAQ on the planet that would tell you to pick redhat or debian.(and there seems to be thousands) If I bought Apple TV and could not do everything I want with it, do I claim OS-X is not ready for the desktop? (That is what it runs) Of course not, I am intelligent enough to know that not all implementations of OS-X are appropriate for me.
Yes, I'm sure you have better things to do than troll these posts, I thank you in advance for going and doing them!
The guy knows nothing about tech if he tried installing Red Hat on a home computer.
The guy knows very little if he decided to use Debian as a newbie.
A beginner like him should have bought a Linux compatible computer(try dell). That is what we do when we buy a MAC! THAT is why it just works(we overpay, and have few choices).
Maybe he could have even used a newbie friendly distro... say Mandriva or (cough cough) Linspire.
OK, now I think the Linux distro's you installed were ALL a decade ago.
Hey, even Corel Linux (remember that one) handled USB ports. Now, almost 10 years later I can tell you I have NEVER had to "modify fstab to get my USB mounts working right" or install something that can play mp3's... etc.
Man, the distros I try just work out of the box. In fact, if you want something that "just works", some of the Linux distro's come with every codec you can think of. Files that the average Windows and OS-X user can't play, just come up.
The only thing that the Linux user has to worry about is that a few devices don't work with Linux... but hey, us OS-X users know NOTHING about that, right?
So, it turns out that you are really comparing ION to OS-X not Linux to OS-X. You also seem to mirror the attitudes of the main(only?)ION developer, Valkonen. In fact, he has also recently started writing windows software just like you. By 2004 ION was considered a project to make Linux like a MAC, hmmmm, also Valkonen became really pissed off at the OSS community.... ARE YOU VALKONEN?
Well, I am glad Linux lost another "Linux zealot", the linux camp does not need people like that.
If you think "freedom" or restrictions on it can be segmented into parts of life you are mistaken. A society that accepts restrictions on freedom in one area is much more ready to give it up in another. Maybe that is why the U.S. is slipping into facism?
You realize what you write about Richard Stallman is LIBEL? If he is as bad as you say he is, you just caused yourself a lawsuit that will bankrupt you. I bet he is better than you think he is, and your not as good as you think you are.
This "troll" is making DIRECT point for point rebuttals, staying on topic and providing background for his points. He shows a technical knowledge far superior to the parent.
If you don't agree with the points... prove him wrong. This is not like a fanboi who writes "I used product X for years, but product Y is better and everyone should switch" - now that may be trolling.
10 years in Linux means nothing to me, heck, I have played around in it for that long as well. The fact I started using apple products 22+ years ago is as relevant as your 10 year old Linux experience (It is not relevant). Linux for the desktop is progressing at a much faster pace than any other OS I know of, thus it is the distro's you've done in the last 6 months that count.
I naturally recoil from people who seem to be fanbois, repeat corporate marketing mantras (It just works, etc). OS-X is not near suitable for everyone, yet your post does not even acknowledge market segments.
While the very low value Apple places on the customer makes me want to root for OSS, I still realize that Linux is not for everyone yet - same as Vista or OS-X.
I remember this guy, he has been a big Mac Pusher for at least the last two years. If you have not been using Linux during the last six months, you are out of date.
The other rebuttals will take care of your actual errors.
Is it a pain in the butt? I guess each person would view this differently.
We may have a few too many working PC's in the house (right now 7), so you can always find one that was off anyway, and slip in one of the knoppix cd's/dvd's. (It boots rather quickly)
But even the average person could reboot in knoppix by the time they walk over and sort through all the bills they have to pay and a get drink of water.
And how much of a pain in the butt is identity theft or whatever the "cracker" does with your info? To me, it would be a huge pain.(I don't like fighting with entities like banks and credit rating agencies)
I don't know of anyone who has purchased MS office and uses more than 10% of the total features in the suite. Does that mean most features should not be there? No, someone needs them, just not many. That does not make them useless. For the one percent of people who need them they may be make or break features.
P.S. Yes, I have mod points, but modding you down because we don't see eye to eye would be just wrong. And modding your parent up would also be wrong as I don't agree. (why does it seem that the stories that you could mod properly are also the ones where you just feel you have to reply to as well? lol)
Slashdot Mirror
If this is just for browsing and email, I am with you. Although for that job I would use a different device myself... like the eepc
I think I would need gigabit. I'm thinking that with a very small hard drive, only one usb port and no onboard DVD... my ethernet would be very busy. Cable internet is the least of my worries.
If you claimed it was illegal to rip a movie, then I hope you only posted on the USA ONLY section of slashdot. (they should make one so we can continue to believe we ARE the world)
Anyway, the last time I checked, most people on the world lived outside the US, and for most of those it is LEGAL to rip a movie.
I doubt very much it has an OLED screen. I would bet the backlight is LED.
In case you really care, it is the LED backlight that lasts longer, the LCD screen itself will have the same lifespan either way.
Wow, you are way in the future.
In the world I live in you need WIRED or optical networks any time you need reliability or speed(or additional security). You just CANNOT trust wireless anything serious. (maybe no serious work is ever done by any other apple than the ones I've used) Wireless is a market segment, not a tech from last century.
And for speed, wired will ALWAYS beat RF, always!
This does not just apply to computers. I dabble in Sound Reinforcement, and the PRO`s use wireless whenever they HAVE to, wireless is a headache waiting to happen... interference from other devices, broadcasting stations etc, like to play havock at the most inopertune times.
You are so right, especially since that would open new avenues for add in boards in the PCIx16 slots.
If you have been following the Cell processor, you know it the main core would probubly place between a P3 and an Athlon 1600(and likely closer to the P3).
Sure that can run an OS, but using that many transistors to run an OS is not ideal(olpc does this much more efficently).
Where the cell would be nice is in specialty laptops. Used as a secondary processor you would have a laptop powerhouse.
As long as you could tack on the inputs and outputs, you would be able to be a PVR recording 20 channels at once, replace huge multimedia consoles or replace a large recording studio--- All on a laptop.
Sure the blackout may be preferred for you, but, your preference is shortsighted. The last time I was in a big power outage during a heatwave was in the north. A guy who had been injured working on high voltage lines(and was disabled) died due to the lack of cooling.
As long as the thermostatic controls apply to all business and home locations within reason, it is a lot less invasive/costly/deadly than rolling blackouts. (now if they would just insulate building better in CA)
I have enjoyed reading your posts.
It is interesting the responses that I got to the original post. I think most people assumed I am anti virtualization. I use it at home(vmware server) more than many corp's use it in the data center, lol. The original post really meant to emphisize that it was not because people don't want to get along, it is because they fear loosing control, (e.g. at my current employer, once you go on a LPAR you just lost all control, and most access)
BUT boy did my (poorly?) picked fax illistration ever distract attention from my main thought.
But, the upside is that I have learned about modern faxing options, that I would have missed otherwise.
All the best
Thanks for the reply.
I should have mentioned that this was 3+ years ago. Maybe too long ago for me to think it had any relevance to a current conversation about Virtualization. Except for the fact that these occurances(even if dated) are what makes old timers fear virtualization.
I'm sure there is better software out there now, but the version of Rightfax they had was old(even three years ago). And the software was quite intwined with rightfax, and rightfax was very tied to the brooktrout cards they were running.
lol, the real world often appears silly.
Why? because that was one of the legacy systems that you are consolidating for the large mortgage company(bank) that you just landed a contract at.
They don't want to spend the time changing the elaborate back end they built around Rightfax. They just want the thousands of faxes each day to keep going out and coming in the same as always. (reengineering costs money, and they want to save it. Banks can be REAL cheap - just try to get the money to rewrite a working system. lol Then try to keep your job when the teething pains occur because of the small changes you made. Impact to revenue - BAD BAD BAD)
I worked there at the time, and the guy they brought in did not consolidate as much as they thought he would... but that is what they wanted.
I was aware that ESX can move a running VM, I thought that VMotion was an extra licence, but that could idea be dated. I was not assuming that everyone would be running ESX. ESX was the only one that I had heard of that allows moving a running VM, but I don't try to track all the virtualization products. (of which x86 is just a portion)
As a youngster I was frusterated by the dinosours as well. Man, were they thick.
On the other hand, there are many places where the Vax or Alpha/VMS servers are older than 15 years. Solid as a rock, and the companies would be morons to pull the plug.
I have done a fair amount of work on OpenVMS with clients, and I don't see any platform that is more stable, and it really is well suited to some tasks. I consider AIX lighter weight than VMS, Linux even lighter... and I would never dream of putting anything mission critical on Windows or OS-X. (In addition, porting some clients OpenVMS code to an OS running on commodity hardware would run in the tens of millions)
(The place I am at now has 18 microvaxes that are being phased out just now - after 25 years. They have run the same code, no changes )
The problem is not that we don't want to work together. It is that you often cede control when you virtualize. And most of us don't love giving up control.
With virtualization in some Corp's, you have to ask for another of the 32 processors, instead of just having the headroom all the time.(work that one through a buricratic organization, it can take months)
Say you have a need to add another fax board(or whatever) to the virtualized x86 server, to find that they stuck some mission critical Virtual Environment on the Server and It CAN'T come down for another 2 weeks.
Yep, it saves hardware, but multiplies headaches in some situations. It is no wonder some fear it.
"he did choose the three most popular flavours, I believe". This thread is about Linux on the desktop, so NO he did not pick the three most popular, let alone the three best suited.
But, if you really know what you claim to about Linux you ALREADY know REDHAT is a SERVER OS. You already KNOW that since Linux is the most diversified ecosystem you can find, ANYONE could find distro's that are not appropriate.
You KNOW that Apple supports VERY little hardware, and you HAVE to buy the hardware with the OS... but yet you blame Linux for not flawlessly supporting FAR more hardware than OS-X. It still stands that if you are willing to spend a fraction of the money on hardware that we already do on MAC's, Linux would just work as well!
Claiming I flipflopped is bull, You made up the scenario, or your friend is not informed. There is not Linux Newbie FAQ on the planet that would tell you to pick redhat or debian.(and there seems to be thousands)
If I bought Apple TV and could not do everything I want with it, do I claim OS-X is not ready for the desktop? (That is what it runs) Of course not, I am intelligent enough to know that not all implementations of OS-X are appropriate for me.
Yes, I'm sure you have better things to do than troll these posts, I thank you in advance for going and doing them!
I wanted to say thanks, I have appreciated your well written posts.
BTW, You may not be responding to a mentally whole person when they start to "feel sick" from reading your rebuttals.
The guy knows nothing about tech if he tried installing Red Hat on a home computer.
The guy knows very little if he decided to use Debian as a newbie.
A beginner like him should have bought a Linux compatible computer(try dell). That is what we do when we buy a MAC! THAT is why it just works(we overpay, and have few choices).
Maybe he could have even used a newbie friendly distro... say Mandriva or (cough cough) Linspire.
OK, now I think the Linux distro's you installed were ALL a decade ago.
... etc.
Hey, even Corel Linux (remember that one) handled USB ports. Now, almost 10 years later I can tell you I have NEVER had to "modify fstab to get my USB mounts working right" or install something that can play mp3's
Man, the distros I try just work out of the box. In fact, if you want something that "just works", some of the Linux distro's come with every codec you can think of. Files that the average Windows and OS-X user can't play, just come up.
The only thing that the Linux user has to worry about is that a few devices don't work with Linux... but hey, us OS-X users know NOTHING about that, right?
So, it turns out that you are really comparing ION to OS-X not Linux to OS-X. You also seem to mirror the attitudes of the main(only?)ION developer, Valkonen. In fact, he has also recently started writing windows software just like you. By 2004 ION was considered a project to make Linux like a MAC, hmmmm, also Valkonen became really pissed off at the OSS community.... ARE YOU VALKONEN?
Well, I am glad Linux lost another "Linux zealot", the linux camp does not need people like that.
If you think "freedom" or restrictions on it can be segmented into parts of life you are mistaken. A society that accepts restrictions on freedom in one area is much more ready to give it up in another. Maybe that is why the U.S. is slipping into facism?
You realize what you write about Richard Stallman is LIBEL? If he is as bad as you say he is, you just caused yourself a lawsuit that will bankrupt you. I bet he is better than you think he is, and your not as good as you think you are.
Excuse me?
This "troll" is making DIRECT point for point rebuttals, staying on topic and providing background for his points. He shows a technical knowledge far superior to the parent.
If you don't agree with the points... prove him wrong. This is not like a fanboi who writes "I used product X for years, but product Y is better and everyone should switch" - now that may be trolling.
Well, I am sorry we will not see eye to eye.
10 years in Linux means nothing to me, heck, I have played around in it for that long as well. The fact I started using apple products 22+ years ago is as relevant as your 10 year old Linux experience (It is not relevant). Linux for the desktop is progressing at a much faster pace than any other OS I know of, thus it is the distro's you've done in the last 6 months that count.
I naturally recoil from people who seem to be fanbois, repeat corporate marketing mantras (It just works, etc). OS-X is not near suitable for everyone, yet your post does not even acknowledge market segments.
While the very low value Apple places on the customer makes me want to root for OSS, I still realize that Linux is not for everyone yet - same as Vista or OS-X.
I remember this guy, he has been a big Mac Pusher for at least the last two years. If you have not been using Linux during the last six months, you are out of date.
The other rebuttals will take care of your actual errors.
VMware is open source?
Wow, you need to sell the stock SHORT, then tell all the investors this tidbit of insider info you have, you will be RICH, RICH, RICH!
(Not implying they can't make money of OS, but it won't be as much as they were by a long shot)
Is it a pain in the butt? I guess each person would view this differently.
We may have a few too many working PC's in the house (right now 7), so you can always find one that was off anyway, and slip in one of the knoppix cd's/dvd's. (It boots rather quickly)
But even the average person could reboot in knoppix by the time they walk over and sort through all the bills they have to pay and a get drink of water.
And how much of a pain in the butt is identity theft or whatever the "cracker" does with your info? To me, it would be a huge pain.(I don't like fighting with entities like banks and credit rating agencies)
For more secure browsing and ebanking(at our house), we keep knoppix cd and dvd's beside our computers and boot with that.
I don't know of anyone who has purchased MS office and uses more than 10% of the total features in the suite.
Does that mean most features should not be there? No, someone needs them, just not many. That does not make them useless. For the one percent of people who need them they may be make or break features.
P.S. Yes, I have mod points, but modding you down because we don't see eye to eye would be just wrong. And modding your parent up would also be wrong as I don't agree. (why does it seem that the stories that you could mod properly are also the ones where you just feel you have to reply to as well? lol)