You should preserve that somewhere- that's the best piece of advice on real-world engineering I've ever heard. (I'm a consultant myself, and an ex-telco engineer.)
It's a keyboard shortcut. On another note- I use Open Office as well, but this new interface for MS Office is actually pretty great- it only took me an hour of fiddling to like it much better than the old (and to determine they didn't gut the keyboard shortcuts).
Just IMO, natch.
These officers should go to Jail. Period. There is no excuse for abuse of authority, brutality and sadism (which was pretty clearly demonstrated), and crap like this makes it twenty times harder for good cops- how many civilians are going to help out a wounded cop when the first thing through thier mind is 'maybe he had it coming- maybe he tried to fuck over the wrong guy'? How can you ask people to respect the authority of the police when crap like this is all they see? See, believe it or not (and I know even a few cops who forget this, but not damn many), it's the publics basic core respect for law enforcement that allows cops to function- without that, cops are just armed targets. Sure theyve got the guns, but so does everyone else who wants to have 'em, and there's a lot more private citizens than there will ever be officers...without the publics respect, police officers have zero chance of actually doing anything of substance, and it would be a good thing to remind those who forget it (like these choads, and a few others). Anyhow, My.02$
(Hey, while not as outright batshit insane as the timecube guy, this at least sounds vaugely plausible for about a minute...or about 55 seconds logner than the average attention span...)
And of course, all that's needed for probable cause is for Bush, Cheney or whatever faceless functionary is the guy of the day to decidde you must be, right? Whataver happened to judicial oversight and checks and balances?
This is exactly the problem- no one is watching the watchers, and that's The recipe for fascism, which was what the whole structure of constitutional law was set up to prevent. Whatever happened to the spirirt of patriotism and courage that gave our country such strength? Did we give it up for comforting lies and "bread and circuses"?
The thing everyone needs to remember is this- The state is inherently the enemy of the people. It always has been and it always will be, with the exception of brief periods of time when people overturn it and create a new state- which will then, sooner or later become exactly like the old one, only better at screwing the populace. If you trust the state, you are complicit in your own subjugation. Questioning authority is not a crime- it's a moral obligation.
Aw, screw it- I'm gonna go slink off to my criminal enclave with all the rest of the fools who believe in freedom...
Polls found that that same 53% of americans were in favor of lobotomies and coprophagia, as long as they were referred to as "Adjustive surgery", and "a yummy new ice cream flavor brought to you by the justice department", respectively.
(C'mon, is it really news that slightly over half the population are either moronic mouth breathers or closet facists? I think not. It's next to impossible to underestimate the stupidity and malice of the chronically and willfully ignorant).
A massive jello-like object was reported in downtown Houston today, reportedly devouring eveything in it's path and growing exponentially. When asked for comment, scientists at Nasa's Johnson Space Center had this to say:
"Hey, doesn't that look like that little booger-looking thing Johnson said he found in the Stardust Capsule?"
Totally off-topic, but I like your Sig. On thing though: what with longer life spans and all, shouldn't it be: "I have seen the future, and it is incontinent"?
You're right about many of your points- either they're mountain out of molehill type events, or they're so heavily canted one way or the other to favor whichever side has the axe to grind at that given time- part of what I wanted to point out though, was that both sides are doing it, and buying into either form of media based brain scrubbery is a very bad idea.
Of course, that's part of the overall strategy being employed- to polarize an issue until it seems vital to take a vociferous stand for or against, by picking whichever side seems to be a hair closer to you (and I do mean seems, as it appears to me that not a single politician I've seen lately has the interests of anybody but his own small band of priveleged cronies at heart).It's sad to see that it makes even the most reasonable people fall prey to the artificial Left/Right split (and I include myself in that, as I'm just as guilty as anyone else on occasion), but it's heartening to see that even still, civil and intelligent discourse can overcome. Thanks much.
Side note- the article I linked to on re-enlistment was specifcally because I realised you weren't referring to recruitment but to retention- it's still down to it's worst levels in several decades, as with the pressure on, the Army is resorting to mismanaging the resources it has in order to meet the challenges set for it. A personal example of this is my own brother, recently decorated with a Bronze star, and a life-long true believer in the military (and this war, in fact) whose recent reply when asked if he would re-up was "Fuck no, I'm going home until someone learns how to use us (the Army) in a way that works."
I'm quite capable of reading, and the example you used was excellent, in that it contains the kernel of the issue- most of those who object to the current use of this spying object not necessarily because said spying is being used to supress disent, but because it can be used to supress disent, and the general feeling is that simply trusting that it won't be is rather ignorant.
Also, as far as the founding fathers not facing this kind of threat, you would be desperately mistaken- not only did the British engage in many forms of terrorist activites, and encourage many of the tribes working with them to do so as well- the founding fathers themselves engaged in acts that were very much of the same stripe, and made mention of exactly the kind of situation we're facing- specifically to warn about sacrificing liberty because of fear
.
No, I'm not going to quote Franklin, considering everyone has heard it, but I should point out that you have basically failed to think about the implications of the power in question- the power to spy without cause or oversight. Sure, for the moment it might only be used for good, but the potnetial for evil use, and the lack of ability to know when it is being misused makes it a powert we should under no circumstances grant to a government, especially considering the sorry state of american politics at this time.
One more by patrick Henry:"Guard with jealous attention the public liberty. Suspect everyone who approaches that jewel. Unfortunately, nothing will preserve it but downright force. Whenever you give up that force, you are ruined."
Fair enough, though automatically distrusting a source (an error I realise most of us, including myself, are prone to) is not neccessarily a good way to filter information.
However, just to let you know the claim that army re-enlistment is at an all time high is unfounded, a link you might trust more: Fox News on Re-enlistment- A different spin, but the same numbers.
As for the first one (the Rove investigation)Fox take on Leak Probes-Yes, I realise they barely touch it, though they do acknowledge (near the end of the article)the widely-reported statement of the special prosecutor(Fitzgerald)that the investigation would be ongoing and focus on the office of Karl Rove.
Really, man- the tactic of burying a story and then using the cry of "It's the liberal media making a big deal of nothing!!" will only work for so long. (Or not at all, in the case of those who bother to look around a little).
And for the record, the Dems suck bigtime, too- the only diffference being that they're not (currently) in a position to demolish the constitution as the Repubs seem to be striving to.
Isn't it high time we quit relying on 30 second sound bites and special interest influenced media to decide the political future of this country?
Two quotes from Alexander Hamilton that relate:
If it be asked, What is the most sacred duty and the greatest source of our security in a Republic? The answer would be, An inviolable respect for the Constitution and Laws -- the first growing out of the last... A sacred respect for the constitutional law is the vital principle, the sustaining energy of a free government
And,
I have thought it my duty to exhibit things as they are, not as they ought to be.
I guess it just goes to show that there was a time when decent men sought political power- I just think it's been a long time gone...
Quote: "Whether he went AWOL is immaterial... until morons like yourself compare it favorably against those that actually WENT to Vietnam. Now the radical Right is trying to tarnish Rep. Murtha's Vietnam medals.... that he received while Bush was protecting Texas from Oklahoma"
In his defense, though, those Okies are pretty crafty...
Quote:"The ACLU should pick a better battle, because the "spying" on citizens issue goes back as far as biblical times and was used by kings and other powers-to-be to prevent overthrows."
Which of course is exactly why the Founding Fathers, who explicitly defend the rights of men to overthrow any government which fails to serve the people, created both the constitution and the bill of rights- to protect the ability of the citizen to in fact overthrow a government which abused or disdained the rights of individuals.
Two quotes form founding fathers to ponder: First, Patrick Henry: "The Constitution is not an instrument for the government to restrain the people, it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government -- lest it come to dominate our lives and interests."
Next, Thomas Jefferson: "What country before ever existed a century & half without a rebellion? & what country can preserve its liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms. The remedy is to set them right as to facts, pardon & pacify them. What signify a few lives lost in a century or two? The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots & tyrants. It is its natural manure."
Quote:The ACLU should pick a better battle, because the "spying" on citizens issue goes back as far as biblical times and was used by kings and other powers-to-be to prevent overthrows.
Which of course is exactly why the Founding Fathers, who explicitly defend the rights of men to overthrow any government which fails to serve the people, created both the constitution and the bill of rights- to protect the ability of the citizen to in fact overthrow a government which abused or disdained the rights of individuals.
Two quotes form founding fathers to ponder:
First, Patrick Henry: "The Constitution is not an instrument for the government to restrain the people, it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government -- lest it come to dominate our lives and interests."
Next, Thomas Jefferson: "What country before ever existed a century & half without a rebellion? & what country can preserve its liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms. The remedy is to set them right as to facts, pardon & pacify them. What signify a few lives lost in a century or two? The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots & tyrants. It is its natural manure."
Man, read a little or something-Jeez...
Hell yes- the ability of free men to defend themselves is one of the best ways to insure a self-reliant and self-aware populace.
Consider- if people were allowed more freedom to act in a self-determined way (including defence of self and others)would things like school shootings , etc be less common? I would think so. And before you go there, let me remind you that there are already harsh penalties for mis-using the same.
Attributed to Thomas Jefferson: "When governments fear the people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government."
Sorry- reposting this as myself because posting it anonymously seemed...well, cowardly.
The biggest failure of the current (and probably last eight or so- maybe more) administration of the US is the failure to understand the most basic precepts of the constitution.
Namely, that the rights of the individual are paramount, and that trust should be placed foremost in the individual and only ceded to the state grudgingly and in a limited fashion.
In other words, Bush, his cronies, and most of the last centuries administrations have seemed to operate on the theory that they inherently know more than the average joe. Point of fact, they have done everything possible to keep it that way, from denying transparency due to "national security" and "official secrets" (which of course are known by the enemy 99% of the time and are almost never secrets to anyone but the general public) to rigging the educational system to produce a general lack of critical thinking and self-determination skills. (Read the writings of our first secretary of education on the need to produce "not enteprenuers, but workers") This is in direct contrast to the ideas of the founding fathers, who implied a great trust in the individual coupled with a grave distrust of goverments, secrets, and those who would accumulate personal power at the expense of the public.
To put it another way- Instead of the state being the servant of the people, these fools have begun to believe the state is the master of the people- and it seems it may be just about time to rudely disabuse them of the notion.
I just hope enough people wake up in time to do so, or the process will be long, bloody, and painful.
Then again, didn't someone once say "the tree of liberty must occasionally be watered with the blood of patriots"?
Oh, yeah, one more thing: Science has proven that all politicians are addicted to sucking dirty goat cock.
Just sayin'.
I am now going to begin every phone conversation with:
"I am a radical Islamic movement of one, and I hereby declare Jihad on Richard Cheney's testicles!!!",
And end it wiht the observation: "Science has now proved that all politicians, whether democrat or republican, are hopelessly addicted to sucking filthy goat cock!"
(I'm betting it won't be half as funny when I'm being tortured at gitmo, but still, it's funny enough to be almost worth it...)
Slashdot Mirror
Damn- I just realised my sig probably made that sound sarcastic- sorry about that. (I am however too lazy to change it...)
You should preserve that somewhere- that's the best piece of advice on real-world engineering I've ever heard.
(I'm a consultant myself, and an ex-telco engineer.)
It's a keyboard shortcut. On another note- I use Open Office as well, but this new interface for MS Office is actually pretty great- it only took me an hour of fiddling to like it much better than the old (and to determine they didn't gut the keyboard shortcuts). Just IMO, natch.
These officers should go to Jail. .02$
Period.
There is no excuse for abuse of authority, brutality and sadism (which was pretty clearly demonstrated), and crap like this makes it twenty times harder for good cops- how many civilians are going to help out a wounded cop when the first thing through thier mind is 'maybe he had it coming- maybe he tried to fuck over the wrong guy'? How can you ask people to respect the authority of the police when crap like this is all they see?
See, believe it or not (and I know even a few cops who forget this, but not damn many), it's the publics basic core respect for law enforcement that allows cops to function- without that, cops are just armed targets. Sure theyve got the guns, but so does everyone else who wants to have 'em, and there's a lot more private citizens than there will ever be officers...without the publics respect, police officers have zero chance of actually doing anything of substance, and it would be a good thing to remind those who forget it (like these choads, and a few others).
Anyhow,
My
"if you shout "tyranny" now, what words will you use when it gets worse?
If it gets worse, it will be because no one shouted "tyranny" now- and it will be far too late for words.
Excellently reasoned post, though, and very perceptive on how people commit evil acts.
Sorry about the title...I was having a senior moment.
Or have we just found the new wookie defense?
(Hey, while not as outright batshit insane as the timecube guy, this at least sounds vaugely plausible for about a minute...or about 55 seconds logner than the average attention span...)
And of course, all that's needed for probable cause is for Bush, Cheney or whatever faceless functionary is the guy of the day to decidde you must be, right? Whataver happened to judicial oversight and checks and balances? This is exactly the problem- no one is watching the watchers, and that's The recipe for fascism, which was what the whole structure of constitutional law was set up to prevent. Whatever happened to the spirirt of patriotism and courage that gave our country such strength? Did we give it up for comforting lies and "bread and circuses"? The thing everyone needs to remember is this- The state is inherently the enemy of the people. It always has been and it always will be, with the exception of brief periods of time when people overturn it and create a new state- which will then, sooner or later become exactly like the old one, only better at screwing the populace. If you trust the state, you are complicit in your own subjugation. Questioning authority is not a crime- it's a moral obligation. Aw, screw it- I'm gonna go slink off to my criminal enclave with all the rest of the fools who believe in freedom...
Polls found that that same 53% of americans were in favor of lobotomies and coprophagia, as long as they were referred to as "Adjustive surgery", and "a yummy new ice cream flavor brought to you by the justice department", respectively. (C'mon, is it really news that slightly over half the population are either moronic mouth breathers or closet facists? I think not. It's next to impossible to underestimate the stupidity and malice of the chronically and willfully ignorant).
A massive jello-like object was reported in downtown Houston today, reportedly devouring eveything in it's path and growing exponentially. When asked for comment, scientists at Nasa's Johnson Space Center had this to say:
"Hey, doesn't that look like that little booger-looking thing Johnson said he found in the Stardust Capsule?"
Totally off-topic, but I like your Sig. On thing though: what with longer life spans and all, shouldn't it be: "I have seen the future, and it is incontinent"?
Oh yeah- makes sense. I had temporarily forgtotten that funny no longer gets you karma.
And that was pretty damn funny
Could somebody meta-moderate this, please? This is a great comment, but I'm pretty sure it's more +5, Funny Than +5, Insightful.
Unless of course Meringuoid really works for CERN or somesuch, in which case, well...thanks for the heads-up I guess...
I love this idea, but the temptation to use (555)867-5309 is just wayyyy too much...
You're right about many of your points- either they're mountain out of molehill type events, or they're so heavily canted one way or the other to favor whichever side has the axe to grind at that given time- part of what I wanted to point out though, was that both sides are doing it, and buying into either form of media based brain scrubbery is a very bad idea.
Of course, that's part of the overall strategy being employed- to polarize an issue until it seems vital to take a vociferous stand for or against, by picking whichever side seems to be a hair closer to you (and I do mean seems, as it appears to me that not a single politician I've seen lately has the interests of anybody but his own small band of priveleged cronies at heart).It's sad to see that it makes even the most reasonable people fall prey to the artificial Left/Right split (and I include myself in that, as I'm just as guilty as anyone else on occasion), but it's heartening to see that even still, civil and intelligent discourse can overcome. Thanks much.
Side note- the article I linked to on re-enlistment was specifcally because I realised you weren't referring to recruitment but to retention- it's still down to it's worst levels in several decades, as with the pressure on, the Army is resorting to mismanaging the resources it has in order to meet the challenges set for it. A personal example of this is my own brother, recently decorated with a Bronze star, and a life-long true believer in the military (and this war, in fact) whose recent reply when asked if he would re-up was "Fuck no, I'm going home until someone learns how to use us (the Army) in a way that works."I'm quite capable of reading, and the example you used was excellent, in that it contains the kernel of the issue- most of those who object to the current use of this spying object not necessarily because said spying is being used to supress disent, but because it can be used to supress disent, and the general feeling is that simply trusting that it won't be is rather ignorant.
Also, as far as the founding fathers not facing this kind of threat, you would be desperately mistaken- not only did the British engage in many forms of terrorist activites, and encourage many of the tribes working with them to do so as well- the founding fathers themselves engaged in acts that were very much of the same stripe, and made mention of exactly the kind of situation we're facing- specifically to warn about sacrificing liberty because of fear
.No, I'm not going to quote Franklin, considering everyone has heard it, but I should point out that you have basically failed to think about the implications of the power in question- the power to spy without cause or oversight. Sure, for the moment it might only be used for good, but the potnetial for evil use, and the lack of ability to know when it is being misused makes it a powert we should under no circumstances grant to a government, especially considering the sorry state of american politics at this time.
One more by patrick Henry:"Guard with jealous attention the public liberty. Suspect everyone who approaches that jewel. Unfortunately, nothing will preserve it but downright force. Whenever you give up that force, you are ruined."
Fair enough, though automatically distrusting a source (an error I realise most of us, including myself, are prone to) is not neccessarily a good way to filter information.
However, just to let you know the claim that army re-enlistment is at an all time high is unfounded, a link you might trust more: Fox News on Re-enlistment- A different spin, but the same numbers.
As for the first one (the Rove investigation)Fox take on Leak Probes-Yes, I realise they barely touch it, though they do acknowledge (near the end of the article)the widely-reported statement of the special prosecutor(Fitzgerald)that the investigation would be ongoing and focus on the office of Karl Rove.
Really, man- the tactic of burying a story and then using the cry of "It's the liberal media making a big deal of nothing!!" will only work for so long. (Or not at all, in the case of those who bother to look around a little).
And for the record, the Dems suck bigtime, too- the only diffference being that they're not (currently) in a position to demolish the constitution as the Repubs seem to be striving to.
Isn't it high time we quit relying on 30 second sound bites and special interest influenced media to decide the political future of this country?
Two quotes from Alexander Hamilton that relate:
If it be asked, What is the most sacred duty and the greatest source of our security in a Republic? The answer would be, An inviolable respect for the Constitution and Laws -- the first growing out of the last... A sacred respect for the constitutional law is the vital principle, the sustaining energy of a free government
And,
I have thought it my duty to exhibit things as they are, not as they ought to be.
I guess it just goes to show that there was a time when decent men sought political power- I just think it's been a long time gone...
Quote: "Whether he went AWOL is immaterial... until morons like yourself compare it favorably against those that actually WENT to Vietnam. Now the radical Right is trying to tarnish Rep. Murtha's Vietnam medals.... that he received while Bush was protecting Texas from Oklahoma"
In his defense, though, those Okies are pretty crafty...
(All joking aside- great refutation...)
God, I wish I had mod points- that is the truest thing I've heard today.
(Ignore the beeping- it's till going off from reading the last several posts...)
Never has my signature been more appropriate...
Just for starters, you might want to look at these for two of your claims.
Rove Investigation Still ongoing
Army Recruitment Crisis
(I'd stop to refute more, but the constant beeping has given me a headache...)
Quote:"The ACLU should pick a better battle, because the "spying" on citizens issue goes back as far as biblical times and was used by kings and other powers-to-be to prevent overthrows."
Which of course is exactly why the Founding Fathers, who explicitly defend the rights of men to overthrow any government which fails to serve the people, created both the constitution and the bill of rights- to protect the ability of the citizen to in fact overthrow a government which abused or disdained the rights of individuals.
Two quotes form founding fathers to ponder: First, Patrick Henry: "The Constitution is not an instrument for the government to restrain the people, it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government -- lest it come to dominate our lives and interests."
Next, Thomas Jefferson: "What country before ever existed a century & half without a rebellion? & what country can preserve its liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms. The remedy is to set them right as to facts, pardon & pacify them. What signify a few lives lost in a century or two? The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots & tyrants. It is its natural manure."
Man, read a little or something-Jeez...
Quote:The ACLU should pick a better battle, because the "spying" on citizens issue goes back as far as biblical times and was used by kings and other powers-to-be to prevent overthrows. Which of course is exactly why the Founding Fathers, who explicitly defend the rights of men to overthrow any government which fails to serve the people, created both the constitution and the bill of rights- to protect the ability of the citizen to in fact overthrow a government which abused or disdained the rights of individuals. Two quotes form founding fathers to ponder: First, Patrick Henry: "The Constitution is not an instrument for the government to restrain the people, it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government -- lest it come to dominate our lives and interests." Next, Thomas Jefferson: "What country before ever existed a century & half without a rebellion? & what country can preserve its liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms. The remedy is to set them right as to facts, pardon & pacify them. What signify a few lives lost in a century or two? The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots & tyrants. It is its natural manure." Man, read a little or something-Jeez...
Hell yes- the ability of free men to defend themselves is one of the best ways to insure a self-reliant and self-aware populace. Consider- if people were allowed more freedom to act in a self-determined way (including defence of self and others)would things like school shootings , etc be less common? I would think so. And before you go there, let me remind you that there are already harsh penalties for mis-using the same. Attributed to Thomas Jefferson: "When governments fear the people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government."
Sorry- reposting this as myself because posting it anonymously seemed...well, cowardly. The biggest failure of the current (and probably last eight or so- maybe more) administration of the US is the failure to understand the most basic precepts of the constitution. Namely, that the rights of the individual are paramount, and that trust should be placed foremost in the individual and only ceded to the state grudgingly and in a limited fashion. In other words, Bush, his cronies, and most of the last centuries administrations have seemed to operate on the theory that they inherently know more than the average joe. Point of fact, they have done everything possible to keep it that way, from denying transparency due to "national security" and "official secrets" (which of course are known by the enemy 99% of the time and are almost never secrets to anyone but the general public) to rigging the educational system to produce a general lack of critical thinking and self-determination skills. (Read the writings of our first secretary of education on the need to produce "not enteprenuers, but workers") This is in direct contrast to the ideas of the founding fathers, who implied a great trust in the individual coupled with a grave distrust of goverments, secrets, and those who would accumulate personal power at the expense of the public. To put it another way- Instead of the state being the servant of the people, these fools have begun to believe the state is the master of the people- and it seems it may be just about time to rudely disabuse them of the notion. I just hope enough people wake up in time to do so, or the process will be long, bloody, and painful. Then again, didn't someone once say "the tree of liberty must occasionally be watered with the blood of patriots"? Oh, yeah, one more thing: Science has proven that all politicians are addicted to sucking dirty goat cock. Just sayin'.
I am now going to begin every phone conversation with: "I am a radical Islamic movement of one, and I hereby declare Jihad on Richard Cheney's testicles!!!", And end it wiht the observation: "Science has now proved that all politicians, whether democrat or republican, are hopelessly addicted to sucking filthy goat cock!" (I'm betting it won't be half as funny when I'm being tortured at gitmo, but still, it's funny enough to be almost worth it...)