God, the next one who did not even RTFS. This is not about files and app names, it is about searching menu entries of the currently focused application.
For instance, unity was designed so that you don't have to browse an entire menu of programs. Which is fine, except that they went and messed with the old menu system, so instead of having the old hierarchical menu to fall back on, your only option now is to make a few clicks and end up with a single menu containing every installed application, with only alphabetical sorting to help you organize it.
Incorrect. In 11.10 it goes like this (and I agree it could do with a few less clicks, but the old hierarchical organization is still there): Super (Windows/Command) key or click to open Dash | hit Tab to go to File Lens, or click it | click Filter Results, it seems there is no keyboard shortcut for that. Now you will see, on the right, a bunch of buttons that are identical to the old menu categories. BTW, the on/off state of Filter Results will be remembered for the next time.
The argument that they present for why the HUD is great is exactly the reason why it is a poor replacement for menus.
How good, then, that the HUD does not replace the menus. The search is an additional option. In the future, the menu item tree will be migrated to the HUD as well, but it will stay visible according to http://www.markshuttleworth.com/archives/939
KDE has had a search function like this for years.
No it hasn't. This HUD idea is not about searching for applications, but for searching for menu items in the currently focused application, from the same location you use to search for everything else.
But regarding the launching of programs...
Take a simple example of opening a console. We know it is called a console or terminal, or rxvt, or xterm, etc.. however a new user may not think of a term window, they may think "I need a command window" however, typing command windows does not display terminals.
Seems to be quite easily solved by tagging. In Ubuntu's Unity, for example search for "com..." already shows the Terminal launch icon.
Ill admit that this example can be handled with a lot of research using users who have never used linux before and asking them to type stuff.
I believe that the number of reasonable tags is limited, and can be found by normal user testing, which Canonical is currently doing for the new feature. (see link further down)
Personally, I have gone over to using a panel with the most common apps on it and the search for stuff I use less often. However, I still use the menu from time to time to look up stuff that I just can't remember the name of.
And even for the menus this is actually about, all three options are available: the toolbar for pinning (if the toolkit allows), the conventional menu tree in the application (for now, to be migrated to the HUD in the future, but still visible), and now the menu item search.
Our thinking is inspired by many works of science, art and entertainment; from Minority Report to Modern Warfare and Jeff Raskin’s Humane Interface. We hope others will join us and accelerate the shift from pointy-clicky interfaces to natural and efficient ones.
For now, you use the application's menues like always, which is still available. The search is just an option. In the future, the menues as such will disappear, but their tree structure will be visible in the HUD instead, so you can go and hunt there. www.markshuttleworth.com/archives/939
The alternative is to watch the video, RTFA, or go to Shuttleworth's blog: www.markshuttleworth.com/archives/939 before complaining about something you know nothing about.
Right now, the menus are still available as ever, and the search feature is an option you may use or not. In the future, the menu as we know it shall disappear, but the tree of the menu commands will still be visible, it will just be integrated into the HUD.
It's not targeted at beginners as such, where did you get that from? Shuttleworth inhis blog post (seems down right now):
This work grows out of observations of new and established / sophisticated users making extensive use of the broader set of capabilities in their applications. We noticed that both groups of users spent a lot of time, relatively speaking, navigating the menus of their applications, either to learn about the capabilities of the app, or to take a specific action. (...) The results so far are rather interesting: power users say things like “every GUI app now feels as powerful as VIM”. EMACS users just grunt and nevermind . Another comment was “it works so well that the rare occasions when it can’t read my mind are annoying!”. We’re doing a lot of user testing on heavy multitaskers, developers and all-day-at-the-workstation personas for Unity in 12.04, polishing off loose ends in the experience that frustrated some in this audience in 11.04-10. If that describes you, the results should be delightful. And the HUD should be particularly empowering.
Even casual users find typing faster than mousing. So while there are modes of interaction where it’s nice to sit back and drive around with the mouse, we observe people staying more engaged and more focused on their task when they can keep their hands on the keyboard all the time. Hotkeys are a sort of mental gymnastics, the HUD is a continuation of mental flow
Because (1) one of 12.04's targets is to fix, complete, and polish Unity to make it workable for an LTS, and (2) because this feature replaces nothing, it is an additional offer which you can use or not (see the blog post by Shuttleworth for details)
You misunderstood how it is to be implemented, or TFA was wrong. Unfortunately Shuttleworth's blog post. returns only a blank page for me right now. For the current search feature, no app modifications are required, except for apps using certain toolkits, like LibreOffice:
The image is showing Inkscape, but of course it works everywhere the global menu works. No app modifications are needed to get this level of experience.
In the future, they want to include a view of the menu tree, and it seems Ubuntu will try to get support ino the toolkits:
We’ll make sure it’s easy for developers working in any toolkit to take advantage of this and give their users a better experience. And we’ll promote the apps which do it best – it makes apps easier to use, it saves time and screen real-estate for users, and it creates a better impression of the free software platform when it’s done well.
In Ubuntu 11.10, if you open the Unity Dash and type "present" (or even just "pres") into the Search box, it shows the launch icon for LibreOfffice Impress. The system does not work perfectly yet, but there is no fundamental reason why additional tags could not be added.
Again, I don't think that this analysis of meanings, interesting as it may be, has anything to do with the original complaint at least as I understood it, in which user the_B0fh stated that "she wants flash to run on her tablet" would have been more appropriate than "she wants to consume content which requires Flash". And dictionary definitions aside, I maintain that "she" most likely does not care about running flash as such, but just wants to watch/interact with/enjoy the art/content/whatever which is available to her only via flash. And the original phrasing conveyed this better than the_B0fh's alternatives.
Definition of CONSUME transitive verb 1: to do away with completely : destroy (fire consumed several buildings) 2 a: to spend wastefully : squander 2 b: use up (writing consumed much of his time) 3 a: to eat or drink especially in great quantity (consumed several bags of pretzels) 3 b: to enjoy avidly : devour (mysteries, which she consumes for fun — E. R. Lipson) 4: to engage fully : engross (consumed with curiosity) 5: to utilize as a customer (consume goods and services)
intransitive verb 1: to waste or burn away: perish 2: to utilize economic goods
But be that as it may, the original complainer didn't seem to be annoyed by the term "consumed", but by the "content which requires flash" construction; else his alternative suggestions would probably have been along the lines of "wants to watch content which requires Flash".
It's the correct, if maybe overprecise, phrasing because she is not interested in using flash as such, but in the content which happens to be only available through flash.
The only problem with Debian is the current influx of Ewebuntards (not saying you're one of them) flooding the lists and forums with stupidity and "demands". Suddenly it's a right to swear and be downright offensive while demanding (...)
Funny. I think this is the result of Ubuntu's Code of Conduct preventing education of the more obnoxious people on the Ubuntu users mailing list. While requiring contributers to be friendly to newbs was a good idea originally and probably contributed to a generally good atmosphere on the users list, when I left there had developed a subset of people who were endlessly demanding, annoying, stupid, and offensive, with no way left to reign them in. Every time you told them that it's enough now, some well-meaning guy showed up and scolded you for violating the CoC or for perceived elitism. I saw many knowledgeable people leave the list because of this. It made me think back to my own newb days on Debian, and how instructive it was long-term to occasionally be treated harshly when I had not thought things through, in stead of being endlessly pampered.
I wonder if people had to put up with the same elitist bullshit after the car become affordable to masses... or even the printed book.
But a line *was* drawn in the sand for the car - the driver's license. And in developed countries we try to give *everyone* the knowledge required to used a printed book.
I'm not saying that Mint is bad, and more power to you. My only gripe is with the "it's number 1 because more people clicked its page on distrowatch" claims. It's weird though how tastes differ, to me it looks as if they've thrown the various themes (icons, gtk,...) together will-nilly. Each theme is a good choice in itself for its type, but I see no coherent overall design. Doesn't mean anything though.
You are right of course, and I know it's not a metric. But if Mint's popularity was even remotely comparable to Ubuntu, I would expect more than $3.41 even if a very small percentage uses Banshee to buy. I mean, Banshee claims $9,215 overall raised for the GNOME Foundation. http://banshee.fm/about/revenue/
What if they ended up becoming popular and actually making decent money?
According to the Ubuntu hate stories of recent months and the idiotic "Distrowatch ranking proves it" arguments, Mint is now the most popular distro and has more users than Ubuntu. Well, I guess this amount shows what a load of BS this was from the start.
Even if true, larger new user adoption is very much not the same as "Mint routed Ubuntu". And, I'm repeating myself, the only thing Distrowatch numbers are good for is to count the number of times Distrowatch visitors looked at a Distrowatch page for a specific distro. Which is not much at all. I mean, I have used Linux on the desktop since 95 or so (1.3.78 was the first kernel I ran), exclusively a year later, and have ever since. Slackware, SuSE, Debian, RedHat, Debian, Gentoo, Debian, Ubuntu. I have not once clicked a Distrowatch link that added to the numbers. Neither have the ca. 10 people I long-term supported in their migrations to Linux distros over the years, most of which have stayed Linux users to this day.
Slashdot Mirror
God, the next one who did not even RTFS. This is not about files and app names, it is about searching menu entries of the currently focused application.
For instance, unity was designed so that you don't have to browse an entire menu of programs. Which is fine, except that they went and messed with the old menu system, so instead of having the old hierarchical menu to fall back on, your only option now is to make a few clicks and end up with a single menu containing every installed application, with only alphabetical sorting to help you organize it.
Incorrect. In 11.10 it goes like this (and I agree it could do with a few less clicks, but the old hierarchical organization is still there):
Super (Windows/Command) key or click to open Dash | hit Tab to go to File Lens, or click it | click Filter Results, it seems there is no keyboard shortcut for that. Now you will see, on the right, a bunch of buttons that are identical to the old menu categories. BTW, the on/off state of Filter Results will be remembered for the next time.
If you could chill the Ubuntu hate for a second, you could see that this not replace the visible menu tree, but adds an additional option.
The argument that they present for why the HUD is great is exactly the reason why it is a poor replacement for menus.
How good, then, that the HUD does not replace the menus. The search is an additional option. In the future, the menu item tree will be migrated to the HUD as well, but it will stay visible according to http://www.markshuttleworth.com/archives/939
KDE has had a search function like this for years.
No it hasn't. This HUD idea is not about searching for applications, but for searching for menu items in the currently focused application, from the same location you use to search for everything else.
But regarding the launching of programs ...
Take a simple example of opening a console. We know it is called a console or terminal, or rxvt, or xterm, etc.. however a new user may not think of a term window, they may think "I need a command window" however, typing command windows does not display terminals.
Seems to be quite easily solved by tagging. In Ubuntu's Unity, for example search for "com..." already shows the Terminal launch icon.
Ill admit that this example can be handled with a lot of research using users who have never used linux before and asking them to type stuff.
I believe that the number of reasonable tags is limited, and can be found by normal user testing, which Canonical is currently doing for the new feature. (see link further down)
Personally, I have gone over to using a panel with the most common apps on it and the search for stuff I use less often. However, I still use the menu from time to time to look up stuff that I just can't remember the name of.
And even for the menus this is actually about, all three options are available: the toolbar for pinning (if the toolkit allows), the conventional menu tree in the application (for now, to be migrated to the HUD in the future, but still visible), and now the menu item search.
Shuttleworth blog post: http://www.markshuttleworth.com/archives/939
Sounds like someboby just read The Humane Interface! (which I totally recommend)
Mark Shuttleworth's blog post about HUD:
Our thinking is inspired by many works of science, art and entertainment; from Minority Report to Modern Warfare and Jeff Raskin’s Humane Interface. We hope others will join us and accelerate the shift from pointy-clicky interfaces to natural and efficient ones.
For now, you use the application's menues like always, which is still available. The search is just an option. In the future, the menues as such will disappear, but their tree structure will be visible in the HUD instead, so you can go and hunt there. www.markshuttleworth.com/archives/939
The Windows Button search box does NOT search the menus of the currently focused application, and that's exactly what Ubuntu's idea is about.
The alternative is to watch the video, RTFA, or go to Shuttleworth's blog: www.markshuttleworth.com/archives/939 before complaining about something you know nothing about.
Right now, the menus are still available as ever, and the search feature is an option you may use or not. In the future, the menu as we know it shall disappear, but the tree of the menu commands will still be visible, it will just be integrated into the HUD.
It's not targeted at beginners as such, where did you get that from? Shuttleworth inhis blog post (seems down right now):
This work grows out of observations of new and established / sophisticated users making extensive use of the broader set of capabilities in their applications. We noticed that both groups of users spent a lot of time, relatively speaking, navigating the menus of their applications, either to learn about the capabilities of the app, or to take a specific action.
(...)
The results so far are rather interesting: power users say things like “every GUI app now feels as powerful as VIM”. EMACS users just grunt and nevermind . Another comment was “it works so well that the rare occasions when it can’t read my mind are annoying!”. We’re doing a lot of user testing on heavy multitaskers, developers and all-day-at-the-workstation personas for Unity in 12.04, polishing off loose ends in the experience that frustrated some in this audience in 11.04-10. If that describes you, the results should be delightful. And the HUD should be particularly empowering.
Even casual users find typing faster than mousing. So while there are modes of interaction where it’s nice to sit back and drive around with the mouse, we observe people staying more engaged and more focused on their task when they can keep their hands on the keyboard all the time. Hotkeys are a sort of mental gymnastics, the HUD is a continuation of mental flow
Because (1) one of 12.04's targets is to fix, complete, and polish Unity to make it workable for an LTS, and (2) because this feature replaces nothing, it is an additional offer which you can use or not (see the blog post by Shuttleworth for details)
You misunderstood how it is to be implemented, or TFA was wrong. Unfortunately Shuttleworth's blog post. returns only a blank page for me right now. For the current search feature, no app modifications are required, except for apps using certain toolkits, like LibreOffice:
The image is showing Inkscape, but of course it works everywhere the global menu works. No app modifications are needed to get this level of experience.
In the future, they want to include a view of the menu tree, and it seems Ubuntu will try to get support ino the toolkits:
We’ll make sure it’s easy for developers working in any toolkit to take advantage of this and give their users a better experience. And we’ll promote the apps which do it best – it makes apps easier to use, it saves time and screen real-estate for users, and it creates a better impression of the free software platform when it’s done well.
In Ubuntu 11.10, if you open the Unity Dash and type "present" (or even just "pres") into the Search box, it shows the launch icon for LibreOfffice Impress. The system does not work perfectly yet, but there is no fundamental reason why additional tags could not be added.
Thanks for the link, now I remember
Again, I don't think that this analysis of meanings, interesting as it may be, has anything to do with the original complaint at least as I understood it, in which user the_B0fh stated that "she wants flash to run on her tablet" would have been more appropriate than "she wants to consume content which requires Flash". And dictionary definitions aside, I maintain that "she" most likely does not care about running flash as such, but just wants to watch/interact with/enjoy the art/content/whatever which is available to her only via flash. And the original phrasing conveyed this better than the_B0fh's alternatives.
You don't? Merriam-Webster sees it differently:
Definition of CONSUME
transitive verb
1: to do away with completely : destroy (fire consumed several buildings)
2 a: to spend wastefully : squander
2 b: use up (writing consumed much of his time)
3 a: to eat or drink especially in great quantity (consumed several bags of pretzels)
3 b: to enjoy avidly : devour (mysteries, which she consumes for fun — E. R. Lipson)
4: to engage fully : engross (consumed with curiosity)
5: to utilize as a customer (consume goods and services)
intransitive verb
1: to waste or burn away: perish
2: to utilize economic goods
But be that as it may, the original complainer didn't seem to be annoyed by the term "consumed", but by the "content which requires flash" construction; else his alternative suggestions would probably have been along the lines of "wants to watch content which requires Flash".
It's the correct, if maybe overprecise, phrasing because she is not interested in using flash as such, but in the content which happens to be only available through flash.
The only problem with Debian is the current influx of Ewebuntards (not saying you're one of them) flooding the lists and forums with stupidity and "demands". Suddenly it's a right to swear and be downright offensive while demanding (...)
Funny. I think this is the result of Ubuntu's Code of Conduct preventing education of the more obnoxious people on the Ubuntu users mailing list. While requiring contributers to be friendly to newbs was a good idea originally and probably contributed to a generally good atmosphere on the users list, when I left there had developed a subset of people who were endlessly demanding, annoying, stupid, and offensive, with no way left to reign them in. Every time you told them that it's enough now, some well-meaning guy showed up and scolded you for violating the CoC or for perceived elitism. I saw many knowledgeable people leave the list because of this. It made me think back to my own newb days on Debian, and how instructive it was long-term to occasionally be treated harshly when I had not thought things through, in stead of being endlessly pampered.
I wonder if people had to put up with the same elitist bullshit after the car become affordable to masses... or even the printed book.
But a line *was* drawn in the sand for the car - the driver's license. And in developed countries we try to give *everyone* the knowledge required to used a printed book.
Suicide doesn't matter to insurance companies. If you do an suicide, they're not going to pay anything anyway.
Seems to be a very good reason for suicide to matter for insurance companies.
I'm not saying that Mint is bad, and more power to you. My only gripe is with the "it's number 1 because more people clicked its page on distrowatch" claims. It's weird though how tastes differ, to me it looks as if they've thrown the various themes (icons, gtk, ...) together will-nilly. Each theme is a good choice in itself for its type, but I see no coherent overall design. Doesn't mean anything though.
You are right of course, and I know it's not a metric. But if Mint's popularity was even remotely comparable to Ubuntu, I would expect more than $3.41 even if a very small percentage uses Banshee to buy. I mean, Banshee claims $9,215 overall raised for the GNOME Foundation. http://banshee.fm/about/revenue/
What if they ended up becoming popular and actually making decent money?
According to the Ubuntu hate stories of recent months and the idiotic "Distrowatch ranking proves it" arguments, Mint is now the most popular distro and has more users than Ubuntu. Well, I guess this amount shows what a load of BS this was from the start.
I suppose the first technology they're going to work on is how to get a constant stream of electricity out there?
Apparently it will come as a surprise to you, but we have had large ships traveling the oceans for quite a while, which even have electricity.
Even if true, larger new user adoption is very much not the same as "Mint routed Ubuntu". And, I'm repeating myself, the only thing Distrowatch numbers are good for is to count the number of times Distrowatch visitors looked at a Distrowatch page for a specific distro. Which is not much at all. I mean, I have used Linux on the desktop since 95 or so (1.3.78 was the first kernel I ran), exclusively a year later, and have ever since. Slackware, SuSE, Debian, RedHat, Debian, Gentoo, Debian, Ubuntu. I have not once clicked a Distrowatch link that added to the numbers. Neither have the ca. 10 people I long-term supported in their migrations to Linux distros over the years, most of which have stayed Linux users to this day.