"You just spelled it out for those of us who CAN'T see this. Be should *NOT* go OSS because: Linux would just STEAL all the best parts of BeOS. Open Source Software... Open Source Thievery!"
If they were to GPL it, then any changes made would have to include source code releases. Also they could fold any GPL'd part of any Linux Distro right into their OS without fear of conflicting licenses either. This would be a win-win situation, as both projects would have a much larger base of code to use/examine.
I could take the low road and say that we don't know for certain *how*much* GPL code is bein held captive in Be and what-not, especially with recent news suggesting that as well as mistakenly leaving GPL'd code in their libraries they have been accused of this before. The do, however seem to be a straight up company and I'm going to give them the benefit of the doubt until they prove themselves otherwise. Just pointing this out to show that you shouldn't go pointing fingers and yelling theif until you have something to back that claim up.
Think about this for a second. With Windows, you still have the ability to dial into any ISP you want to(unless you installed AOL5, DOH!) Now, if AOL could get ahold of an operating system with good multimedia capabilities, and put that out with their service preinstalled (hard-wired in) on a CD, as a replacement for windows, I think people would go nuts over it. Include popular file format viewers/editors, a decent media player that never tells your browser to go get a frigging plugin, and I have a feeling people would be burning their Windows CD's like bra's.
Aol obviously wouldn't want to use Linux/BSD for something like this, someone might get ahold of their source and make something really *useful* out of it. Figure out how to dial into another ISP with it, etc. Perhaps in a few we'll see specialized BeOS released for Time/Warner cable, so that people will only need to install their S/W to get online, fast easy, and crippled so that they'll never be able to break TOS by running servers or unlimiting their bandwidth (like I've seen cracks out there purport to do for Windows).
Now this is all just conjecture, but since we're starting rumors I thought I'd add in a little ammo for the FUD engines:D
Could it be claimed that simply by releasing this as a binary file they are encrypting the contents of a copyrighted work (the source code?) Would this then lead any developers who took on such a project down the same road of misery that the DeCSS author(s) now face?
I'm not sure either way, but I thought it should be mentioned. Let me know if I'm on crack, please.
Also as for the EULA, even if a court upheld it's validity (and assuming we still have the right to RE it otherwise,) would the someone who say, got the file be under those constraints, as he never signed any agreement? And would the resulting product be legal if the person who originally redistributed it did so in violation of the EULA?
Disclaimer:This comment may cause migraines or drowsiness.
Perhaps this story on CNET may do some good raising awareness about how bad some of this filtering S/W is. I also noticed this quote;
"It's not just indecency that AOL is trying to keep away from children," says Susan Wishnetsky, a Chicago librarian.
For the/.ers who are trying to prevent filtering S/W from being placed in libraries, it would be a good thing to bring up this quote...especially if your elected reps are Democrats I suppose.
Of course CNET had better watch out, as they describe a method of overcoming the filtering S/W, and also exposing some of the sites that are on the Cyberpatrol Blacklist.
"Children who share an AOL account with their parents could rattle off their parents' favorite sites at the dinner table. This would surely lead to a heart-warming discussion of family values."
What really gets me is the fact that they're essentially using the same arguments that we (the/. readers) have been echoing in the posts about the censorware against us (as the opening paragraph of the second article states)...
The Justice Department's reasoning is simple: If products like Cyberpatrol and Surfwatch are so badly flawed that they don't block what they should, then the judge in the case should uphold a federal law making it a crime to post erotica online instead.
Now the ACLU is in a position where they actually have to *defend* one of the industries (see the mattel articles in YRO) that they have very recently been trying to defend the people of this nation against[censorware]. What I don't get is why it either has to be censorware or censorship? IMO neither is acceptable under the first ammendment to the constitution.
What is happening isn't the stifling of childrens voices, BTW. This has absolutely nothing to do with children, regardless of what the acronym in the bill stands for. This is about someone getting mailed a naughty pic, or catching their husband with his browser history all full of porno links, and wanting to lash out at someone. Maybe some people *do* actually care about their children, but they're being drawn into this by the arguments of the above. If children are being drawn into porno sites, finding some reward there and then returning then their parents aren't paying enough attention to them. Enough said.
I don' know of any good solutions, other than strongly advocating that parents actually *be* parents, and not think for a second that if we as a nation pass *any* law it will make their kids more safe. It will only lead them into more danger as we sit back and let the Internet be their trusted babysitter (remember there are a lot of places totally unaffected by this law). Anyone from Adbusters want to take this up?
as usual I may be full of <censored>, feel free and point that out to me:)
This Link is from a car company that sells plans for some pretty strange looking economy cars. However I'm betting that the same principles could be used to put your very own Mach5 together, providing you have a bit of patience, some cad prowess and a decent donor car.
(disclaimer-this passage in the text worries me, maybe why I haven't made my GF's geo into a DeLorean yet;-)) "But despite the strength-to-weight advantage of newer materials, nothing matches the original polyester-resin/glass-cloth/urethane-foam composite for quickly producing a tough, lightweight product at rock-bottom costs."
More like: <conspiracytheory> The folks who work in factories or live in countries where this is a problem will continue to suffer the negative effects of polution, having a higher rate of birth defects and a lower intelligence than previous generations. The brighter ones will leave to live in an area where they can benefit from the newly found cheap labor and still be safe from said pollution's effects. </conspiracytheory>
You should do the same favor for your marketing that those "helpful" slashdot readers did for Taco. Simply put in their business email addresses to a few of those "password" sites that the mp3 sites make you go to, and a few months down the road they might not be arguing too much with you.
In fact, I bet if you asked the good Cmdr, he might be able to tell you some of the mo-betta ones to put them on:-)
One of the things that makes linux so much more appealing to many folks is the fact that it *does* encourage a "do-it-yourself" attitude. While you're probably right that it will take quite a while for a newbie to figure out how to do this stuff, by providing a roadmap and letting people *try*, they are encouraging that folks learn something. I'm thinking of doing this, and while I may be months doing it, I have a feeling that I'll come out a lot more knowledgeable about my system and about Linux/Unix in general, even if at the end I *don't* have something that kicks ass, let alone boots up.
Why would letting people loose on their own machines in their own time trying to learn something new scare you?
Not to mention that the program (game, whatever) you're developing wouldn't be getting exposure to other distros, meaning that there may be problems setting something up on, say, a debian system that would be unforseen if everyone was encouraged to have a machine that got imaged with the latest, say redhat release with the program preinstalled...
Try the elian sid for a decent place to discuss this further. If you see any more discussion on this you can point the participants over here...that way the normal stories won't be overcrowded with completely offtopic discussion, the logged in posters won't lose karma or feel they have to AC post, and above all else, the discussion stays in one place instead of being spread out all over the place.
While I agree that -1 is probably a little harsh, I don't think the moderators would care to much either way if it's in it's own forum. Stick something in your.sig letting them know where to find ?sid=elian and everyone should be a lot happier.
more ontopic They said in the article... ''You should understand what is meant by "running make with a parameter of LDFLAGS=-static"''
Anyone care to explain that one to me? I think I can handle about everything else in the minimum user requirements:-)
The unix version is pretty nice also. Real good at getting files un.zipped, and once I aliased "pkunzip" to "pkzip25 --extract" it felt pretty much just like the old DOS version as well:)
I can back you up on the getting upset over silly things part. I had to explain to a user for 10 minutes what exactly the "you are entering an insecure area" box meant, and that noone was going to remotely bamboozle her computer. These are folks who may not know the address to yahoo.com, yet they know that they don't want their name anywhere in their email address. The same folks who call up and need to have their browser history cleared because the wife is home in ten minutes...Anything that sounds like a privacy invasion is bound to get them riled up, especially this.
That is, only if it gets picked up by the mainstream press, because joe-aol-keyword=jugs isn't going to read/. to find it out.
unrelated note, Palp, I was going to check-see if you worked for the same ISP I do but couldn't...may wanna check your permissions on your page.
The post he was replying to got hidden, in part because your threshold is either set at 0 or 1...anywho the infamous Trollmastah comes in at a -1. If you reset your threshold to -1 and hit change the conversation will be quite a bit different...
"They've all either got appropriately licensed software or else are too big for Unisys to bother, and they don't want to alienate even the (small?) fraction of customers still using non-PNG-supporting browsers (3.x or earlier)," Roelofs wrote in an email interview.
(In regards as to why some companies haven't switched to png's yet) What Properly licensed software means is that the maker of the actual graphics editor paid a licensing fee to unisys, so that you wouldn't have to.
JASC's page in reference to this says that you are pretty much free and clear to use.gifs on a web page. There may be problems however if you are using their S/W to "run your web server"(Anyone out there know what this means exactly?). In any even the first three paragraphs imply that the licensing for using the gifs on your website is already covered by JASC (Of course they're careful to say a *registered* copy (-:).
Anyway (the lazy method), go ahead and right click any topic icon at the top of the main page, assuming you're using a graphical browser...click save image(picture) as... and there they are.gifs in all there glory...I would think it would be trivial to do.
Now the really big thing, from what I gather is that the.gifs are O.K. as long as they were made with an image program which paid an lzw licensing fee or something like that (correct me if I'm wrong here guys). So while it might not be exactly the brightest torch of solidarity to have the gifs on the website, they whould breathe easier if they were made using, say photoshop. Any word on whether the gimp's handling of gifs is covered here?
What can a person do about repeatedly receiving calls from a fax machine? My phone number used to belong to a pawn shop and in between annoying calls from people wanting me to buy their gold/firearms I would get a fax machine which apparently did not want to give up the first time I hung up on it...would repeat call every 5 minutes for a half-hour each day for about a month.
I was thinking about setting up the computer to receive those faxes then posting them online to shame the asshole behind the sending machine to stop trying to fax me. Then I got lazy and started using the other line for phone calls, plugged the fax line into the computer and left it.
Of course this phone line keeps getting calls for an "Adrian", which neither of me/my roomate knows, which the caller cannot/will not discuss with us. And they don't believe that Adrian is not there.
"Then they take 3com driver code by Donald Becker. Becker nails them, and ends up dropping the complaint and selling them a BSD licenced network card driver for six figures."
It wouldn't be the first time something has happened to NIC drivers he's written. While trying to set up my Netgear 10/100 card I stumbled across some mailing list articles that shed light on the fact that Netgear was including his Linux drivers on disk without the GPL or any mention of him. I forget exactly how that issue was resolved, only that the newer version seems to be alright. However if he really was able to sell thefolks at BE a bsd licensed version of some drivers for 6 figures then more power to him. Here is great way for open source programmers to make money. It's only a shame that it takes catching someone doing something wrong in the process...
He's saying that the Tux shop probably wasn't licensed to rent "brosnan" gear, so they intentionally misspelled it. Kind of like there are hostess Ding-Dongs, but the store brand or off-brand has something that sounds similar but not enough to get them sued (king-dons?)...
"I totally agree that discussions about the stock market in general do not belong on Slashdot."
That is true, however the topic icon for this story is the almighty buck, I'm betting that everyone who really has a problem with their blood pressure whenever they open up Slapdash and see stock/IPO news can go into their preferences and fix it so they don't. Slashdot is made up of more than one type of nerd, and a lot of them have stock options and/or can afford to buy stock or are simply concerned for no good reason. I would go as far as to say that I think a majority of the "money" articles do not deserve to make the front page, I would prefer to see more YRO stories and science, etc. But then again there are those who whinge on every YRO story that we don't need to hear about every lawsuit either...
Taco, go have a beer on us or something, and get back to your conspiracy:-) It's been boring since we all started browsing at +1 by default:^)
dialpad also `...didn't netscape 6 preview feature something called net to phone? I think any one of these would provide true anonyminity(sp?) which is a concern if you're calling a large corporation for anything (note I am *not advocating prank calling;-)).
This raises another important point. If you're calling a call-center, chances are they have advanced natl. caller ID features. What assurances does Pinkerton provide that they don't have *your* name on a file someplace?
.. I could sit there and "unsubscribe" to the spam all day and still would get more..
DON'T DO THAT!!!!! Sorry for the shouting...but dude, when you click on the link and give them your email address so they can "unsubscribe" you, you've just verified for them that it is indeed a working email address. Why send you more crap if you don't want it? To be petty maybe, or to sell lists of 'verified' good email addresses...
In answer to your 2nd point, the spammers don't care much whether you give them business. 1 reply out of 1000 emails is probably good.
As for starting your second account, it's all good until someone decides to send you and everyone they know a forwarded joke. You know the ones, they have approximately 1k of headers that consist of everyone's email addresses at the top, with at least 3 lines saying "forwarded message attached". So now you have all these email addresses and someone else she sent it to is going to forward it and not be decent enough to trim and....And those "you got a special offer from %s" messages that they like to send you, as soon as you click on the link you get mail for life.
Slashdot Mirror
"You just spelled it out for those of us who CAN'T see this. Be should *NOT* go OSS because: Linux would just STEAL all the best parts of BeOS. Open Source Software... Open Source Thievery!"
If they were to GPL it, then any changes made would have to include source code releases. Also they could fold any GPL'd part of any Linux Distro right into their OS without fear of conflicting licenses either. This would be a win-win situation, as both projects would have a much larger base of code to use/examine.
I could take the low road and say that we don't know for certain *how*much* GPL code is bein held captive in Be and what-not, especially with recent news suggesting that as well as mistakenly leaving GPL'd code in their libraries they have been accused of this before. The do, however seem to be a straight up company and I'm going to give them the benefit of the doubt until they prove themselves otherwise. Just pointing this out to show that you shouldn't go pointing fingers and yelling theif until you have something to back that claim up.
Think about this for a second. With Windows, you still have the ability to dial into any ISP you want to(unless you installed AOL5, DOH!) Now, if AOL could get ahold of an operating system with good multimedia capabilities, and put that out with their service preinstalled (hard-wired in) on a CD, as a replacement for windows, I think people would go nuts over it. Include popular file format viewers/editors, a decent media player that never tells your browser to go get a frigging plugin, and I have a feeling people would be burning their Windows CD's like bra's.
:D
Aol obviously wouldn't want to use Linux/BSD for something like this, someone might get ahold of their source and make something really *useful* out of it. Figure out how to dial into another ISP with it, etc. Perhaps in a few we'll see specialized BeOS released for Time/Warner cable, so that people will only need to install their S/W to get online, fast easy, and crippled so that they'll never be able to break TOS by running servers or unlimiting their bandwidth (like I've seen cracks out there purport to do for Windows).
Now this is all just conjecture, but since we're starting rumors I thought I'd add in a little ammo for the FUD engines
"nor attempt in any other manner to obtain the source code."
heh. So now we're not even allowed to ask???
Could it be claimed that simply by releasing this as a binary file they are encrypting the contents of a copyrighted work (the source code?) Would this then lead any developers who took on such a project down the same road of misery that the DeCSS author(s) now face?
I'm not sure either way, but I thought it should be mentioned. Let me know if I'm on crack, please.
Also as for the EULA, even if a court upheld it's validity (and assuming we still have the right to RE it otherwise,) would the someone who say, got the file be under those constraints, as he never signed any agreement? And would the resulting product be legal if the person who originally redistributed it did so in violation of the EULA?
Disclaimer:This comment may cause migraines or drowsiness.
Perhaps this story on CNET may do some good raising awareness about how bad some of this filtering S/W is. I also noticed this quote;
/.ers who are trying to prevent filtering S/W from being placed in libraries, it would be a good thing to bring up this quote...especially if your elected reps are Democrats I suppose.
:)
"It's not just indecency that AOL is trying to keep away from children," says Susan Wishnetsky, a Chicago librarian.
For the
Of course CNET had better watch out, as they describe a method of overcoming the filtering S/W, and also exposing some of the sites that are on the Cyberpatrol Blacklist.
"Children who share an AOL account with their parents could rattle off their parents' favorite sites at the dinner table. This would surely lead to a heart-warming discussion of family values."
That part just made me smile
don't forget
Gopher!
My proxy at work has that service blocked but from the looks of it it ought to work...
What really gets me is the fact that they're essentially using the same arguments that we (the /. readers) have been echoing in the posts about the censorware against us (as the opening paragraph of the second article states)...
:)
The Justice Department's reasoning is simple: If products like Cyberpatrol and Surfwatch are so badly flawed that they don't block what they should, then the judge in the case should uphold a federal law making it a crime to post erotica online instead.
Now the ACLU is in a position where they actually have to *defend* one of the industries (see the mattel articles in YRO) that they have very recently been trying to defend the people of this nation against[censorware]. What I don't get is why it either has to be censorware or censorship? IMO neither is acceptable under the first ammendment to the constitution.
What is happening isn't the stifling of childrens voices, BTW. This has absolutely nothing to do with children, regardless of what the acronym in the bill stands for. This is about someone getting mailed a naughty pic, or catching their husband with his browser history all full of porno links, and wanting to lash out at someone. Maybe some people *do* actually care about their children, but they're being drawn into this by the arguments of the above. If children are being drawn into porno sites, finding some reward there and then returning then their parents aren't paying enough attention to them. Enough said.
I don' know of any good solutions, other than strongly advocating that parents actually *be* parents, and not think for a second that if we as a nation pass *any* law it will make their kids more safe. It will only lead them into more danger as we sit back and let the Internet be their trusted babysitter (remember there are a lot of places totally unaffected by this law). Anyone from Adbusters want to take this up?
as usual I may be full of <censored>, feel free and point that out to me
This Link is from a car company that sells plans for some pretty strange looking economy cars. However I'm betting that the same principles could be used to put your very own Mach5 together, providing you have a bit of patience, some cad prowess and a decent donor car.
(disclaimer-this passage in the text worries me, maybe why I haven't made my GF's geo into a DeLorean yet;-))
"But despite the strength-to-weight advantage of newer materials, nothing matches the original polyester-resin/glass-cloth/urethane-foam composite for quickly producing a tough, lightweight product at rock-bottom costs."
More like:
<conspiracytheory>
The folks who work in factories or live in countries where this is a problem will continue to suffer the negative effects of polution, having a higher rate of birth defects and a lower intelligence than previous generations. The brighter ones will leave to live in an area where they can benefit from the newly found cheap labor and still be safe from said pollution's effects.
</conspiracytheory>
You should do the same favor for your marketing that those "helpful" slashdot readers did for Taco. Simply put in their business email addresses to a few of those "password" sites that the mp3 sites make you go to, and a few months down the road they might not be arguing too much with you.
:-)
In fact, I bet if you asked the good Cmdr, he might be able to tell you some of the mo-betta ones to put them on
One of the things that makes linux so much more appealing to many folks is the fact that it *does* encourage a "do-it-yourself" attitude. While you're probably right that it will take quite a while for a newbie to figure out how to do this stuff, by providing a roadmap and letting people *try*, they are encouraging that folks learn something. I'm thinking of doing this, and while I may be months doing it, I have a feeling that I'll come out a lot more knowledgeable about my system and about Linux/Unix in general, even if at the end I *don't* have something that kicks ass, let alone boots up.
Why would letting people loose on their own machines in their own time trying to learn something new scare you?
Not to mention that the program (game, whatever) you're developing wouldn't be getting exposure to other distros, meaning that there may be problems setting something up on, say, a debian system that would be unforseen if everyone was encouraged to have a machine that got imaged with the latest, say redhat release with the program preinstalled...
Try the elian sid for a decent place to discuss this further. If you see any more discussion on this you can point the participants over here...that way the normal stories won't be overcrowded with completely offtopic discussion, the logged in posters won't lose karma or feel they have to AC post, and above all else, the discussion stays in one place instead of being spread out all over the place.
.sig letting them know where to find ?sid=elian and everyone should be a lot happier.
:-)
While I agree that -1 is probably a little harsh, I don't think the moderators would care to much either way if it's in it's own forum. Stick something in your
more ontopic
They said in the article...
''You should understand what is meant by "running make with a parameter of LDFLAGS=-static"''
Anyone care to explain that one to me? I think I can handle about everything else in the minimum user requirements
The unix version is pretty nice also. Real good at getting files un.zipped, and once I aliased "pkunzip" to "pkzip25 --extract" it felt pretty much just like the old DOS version as well :)
I can back you up on the getting upset over silly things part. I had to explain to a user for 10 minutes what exactly the "you are entering an insecure area" box meant, and that noone was going to remotely bamboozle her computer. These are folks who may not know the address to yahoo.com, yet they know that they don't want their name anywhere in their email address. The same folks who call up and need to have their browser history cleared because the wife is home in ten minutes...Anything that sounds like a privacy invasion is bound to get them riled up, especially this.
/. to find it out.
That is, only if it gets picked up by the mainstream press, because joe-aol-keyword=jugs isn't going to read
unrelated note, Palp, I was going to check-see if you worked for the same ISP I do but couldn't...may wanna check your permissions on your page.
The post he was replying to got hidden, in part because your threshold is either set at 0 or 1...anywho the infamous Trollmastah comes in at a -1. If you reset your threshold to -1 and hit change the conversation will be quite a bit different...
What Properly licensed software means is that the maker of the actual graphics editor paid a licensing fee to unisys, so that you wouldn't have to.
JASC's page in reference to this says that you are pretty much free and clear to use
Anyway (the lazy method), go ahead and right click any topic icon at the top of the main page, assuming you're using a graphical browser...click save image(picture) as... and there they are .gifs in all there glory...I would think it would be trivial to do.
.gifs are O.K. as long as they were made with an image program which paid an lzw licensing fee or something like that (correct me if I'm wrong here guys). So while it might not be exactly the brightest torch of solidarity to have the gifs on the website, they whould breathe easier if they were made using, say photoshop. Any word on whether the gimp's handling of gifs is covered here?
Now the really big thing, from what I gather is that the
What can a person do about repeatedly receiving calls from a fax machine? My phone number used to belong to a pawn shop and in between annoying calls from people wanting me to buy their gold/firearms I would get a fax machine which apparently did not want to give up the first time I hung up on it...would repeat call every 5 minutes for a half-hour each day for about a month.
I was thinking about setting up the computer to receive those faxes then posting them online to shame the asshole behind the sending machine to stop trying to fax me. Then I got lazy and started using the other line for phone calls, plugged the fax line into the computer and left it.
Of course this phone line keeps getting calls for an "Adrian", which neither of me/my roomate knows, which the caller cannot/will not discuss with us. And they don't believe that Adrian is not there.
Any suggestions on either those situations?
"Then they take 3com driver code by Donald Becker. Becker nails them, and ends up dropping the complaint and selling them a BSD licenced network card driver for six figures."
It wouldn't be the first time something has happened to NIC drivers he's written. While trying to set up my Netgear 10/100 card I stumbled across some mailing list articles that shed light on the fact that Netgear was including his Linux drivers on disk without the GPL or any mention of him. I forget exactly how that issue was resolved, only that the newer version seems to be alright. However if he really was able to sell thefolks at BE a bsd licensed version of some drivers for 6 figures then more power to him. Here is great way for open source programmers to make money. It's only a shame that it takes catching someone doing something wrong in the process...
He's saying that the Tux shop probably wasn't licensed to rent "brosnan" gear, so they intentionally misspelled it. Kind of like there are hostess Ding-Dongs, but the store brand or off-brand has something that sounds similar but not enough to get them sued (king-dons?)...
"I totally agree that discussions about the stock market in general do not belong on Slashdot."
That is true, however the topic icon for this story is the almighty buck, I'm betting that everyone who really has a problem with their blood pressure whenever they open up Slapdash and see stock/IPO news can go into their preferences and fix it so they don't. Slashdot is made up of more than one type of nerd, and a lot of them have stock options and/or can afford to buy stock or are simply concerned for no good reason. I would go as far as to say that I think a majority of the "money" articles do not deserve to make the front page, I would prefer to see more YRO stories and science, etc. But then again there are those who whinge on every YRO story that we don't need to hear about every lawsuit either...
Taco, go have a beer on us or something, and get back to your conspiracy:-) It's been boring since we all started browsing at +1 by default:^)
dialpad also `...didn't netscape 6 preview feature something called net to phone? I think any one of these would provide true anonyminity(sp?) which is a concern if you're calling a large corporation for anything (note I am *not advocating prank calling ;-)).
This raises another important point. If you're calling a call-center, chances are they have advanced natl. caller ID features. What assurances does Pinkerton provide that they don't have *your* name on a file someplace?
.. I could sit there and "unsubscribe" to the spam all day and still would get more..
DON'T DO THAT!!!!! Sorry for the shouting...but dude, when you click on the link and give them your email address so they can "unsubscribe" you, you've just verified for them that it is indeed a working email address. Why send you more crap if you don't want it? To be petty maybe, or to sell lists of 'verified' good email addresses...
In answer to your 2nd point, the spammers don't care much whether you give them business. 1 reply out of 1000 emails is probably good.
As for starting your second account, it's all good until someone decides to send you and everyone they know a forwarded joke. You know the ones, they have approximately 1k of headers that consist of everyone's email addresses at the top, with at least 3 lines saying "forwarded message attached". So now you have all these email addresses and someone else she sent it to is going to forward it and not be decent enough to trim and....And those "you got a special offer from %s" messages that they like to send you, as soon as you click on the link you get mail for life.