I think that as long as the community is able to keep companies on their toes and incapable of creating too much trouble or confusion in the open source market place then I want them contributing. Even if there intentions are disengenous or self serviing as long as an open source project gets a leg up or another industry standard, piece of hardware or killer app gets implemented as open source we all benefit in the long run.
Keeping companies honest, to use Linus's phrase, is probably akin to herding cats but unless all OSS projects everywhere are ready to "just say no" to any and all help, financial or otherwise, from all corporations I don't see how the community at large, or even just one project, can afford to refuse help from big business.
As for IBM talking up the advantages of avoiding Vendor Lockin; yes it's ironic, but IBM does seem to genuinely want to make a busines case for OSS and in my mind isn't just paying lip service. They can't just go all open and altruistic tomorrow though, they do have shareholders after all. So far I'd say they've been pretty give and take about the whole thing though.
(FWIW Windows won't update randomly installed software either.)
Hell Windows won't always update it's own software. GDI+ vulnerability anyone? I was amazed that the fix for that involved directing you to a website that says look through the list of hundreds of programs that may be vulnerable and decide for yourself if you need to do anything.
It held your hand a bit more then my short description might suggest but it certainly isn't something my Mom would bother with. She'd read for about thirty seconds and then call me.
Actually you can Add programs using Windows Add/Remove Programs, have been able to since NT 4 as far as I know.
The only reason I know though is because you pretty much want to (have to?) use it on a machine running Terminal Services. Using it this way in Terminal Services sets up a multi-user environment for the program where as your typical "setup.exe" did not back then. This is also how you restriceted access to a program to just an Administrator as well.
These days a good installer asks you "Do you want this for you only or all users" or some such and sets up a decent user environment in "Documents and Settings" or "Users".
Most people don't even think about using Add/remove Programs because every program for Windows wants to do it for you. Some installers work well and have a lot of good administration features, some don't. I personally prefer the consistent if not always quite as friendly aprroach that a Linux Distro uses (apt being my favourite!). I would like to see more consistency accross distributions but just comparing Ubuntu to Vista I'd say Synaptic is a much better option then the myriad of interfaces and choices that Windows users deal with whenever they want to install a new program.
If I recall correctly you just need to make sure Eft is completely up to date before dist-upgrading to Fiesty. Apt changed sometime in Edgy so you need to make sure you are using the latest version of Apt before you begin grabbing Feisty packages.
I'm sure a search on the Ubuntu Wiki will turn up more specific details.
Linux needs to mature faster than the jerks coming up with the names
Why? It's grown up nicely with me since 1995. Your whole post is predicated on the idea that the original developers of FOSS just want to make money off it. Usually they don't; they do it for fun, because they love computers, to help out their fellow man, the list goes on and in some cases probably includes making money. But not usually in my experience.
Companies that repackage it all and want to make money may want to spend some time studying branding and marketing but the GNU people aren't trying to sell you anything. They give it to you, no charge, including the blessing to make your own money off it if you choose/can succeed. If you think you can sell GNU software under some fancy name then I will be happy to give your distro a try when it's released. I like to try them all! But you can also be sure I will go back to using my Sarges and Etches and my Drakes and Fawns if your distro ends up sucking, even if you do come up with a clever name.
I would add to this that anyone who has listened to a decent amount of his music will pick up on an underlying theme of child abuse by adults. Look at Tommy, with his crazy Uncle Ernie or Crazy Cousin Kevin.
In my mind Pete Townshend has had do deal with a lot more abuse in his life then he's let on to the public. I think his music, his book and even his "research" were honest attempts at dealing with things in his personal life.
I don't think he went about it the right way and I question the benefit of subjecting oneself to such material but I tend to think he was just stupid about it and honest in his intentions at least.
Just my $.02 and I admit bias as a long time Who fan but in the end I decided I wouldn't judge him too much as I don't really think I have the complete story.
Even though the post kept reading 'WMP' I'm pretty sure the GP is referring to the format chosen by content distributors, not the people listening to the content. In other words "WMV" files were being used by providers a lot until recently, now Flash seems to be the dominant format for distributing/hosting online video.
You know, I see your point and I agree it's not the most interesting issue to talk about with everyone but there is a lot more to the Libertarian stance on Marijuana then "free the weed dude".
It's also about the economy, artificial chemical monopolies formed many decades ago, medicine, the environment and yes, it's also about the personal freedom to take drugs.
If you think partying is all the Libertarians care about when it comes to Cannabis maybe you should look into it a little more. Try googling for Jack Herer sometime.
A) Most malware are Windows based EXE files. They won't run on Linux or Macs (don't get technical and mention wine! although I guess that is a possibility, I just don't see it being setup for easy opening of random EXEs for Grandma).
B) Even if Grandma does run some *nix specific virus, unless her grandchildren did her a grave disservice and have her running as root, the damage done should be minimal. Grandma's home directory might get wiped and in lieu of proper backups that would be horrible for her but there is only a very, very slim chance that Grandma running the virus is enough to escalate priveleges and root the box. Again, possible but unlkely.
So here we have Grandma running a Mac or Linux. Is she exposed to potential malware? Of course! But chances are, even if subjected to it, the damage would most likely be localized and the rest of us wouldn't be stuck with another zombie trying to send pr0n and RX spam to us.
...annoying blinking light even when idle. I cover that with a beer can.
Hmmm, that's not going to work for me then, I use bear bottles, thus my setup is incompatible with this blinking light of which you speak. Oh well, you get what you pay for.
Definately. I find using Xubuntu on older Mac or PC hardware makes even a memory starved, slow disk machine feel quite useful. It comes with a nice mix of lightweight apps too, like AbiWord and Gnumeric instead of OO.org. It's not for Power Users but it's a nice way to treat a friend or family member to a free "surfin'" machine when coupled with something that would otherwise collect dust in the basement.:-)
And I think as more of these types of machines get equipped and put on the web for the crowd that wouldn't have really bought a machine otherwise you'll definately see a dip in overall new OS sales. It's really getting to the point where the latest and greatest just doesn't get you that much, no matter which OS you pick. That's especially true in terms of machines that are basically just used to surf the web.
Geeks need really cool reasons to buy new machines and the average joe consumer buys something new when the old one breaks. When joe meets a geek, he sometimes figures out he still doesn't need new, his friend will fix his PC for him...
Hmm, I see you are correct. My mistake. I guess I was thinking of bygone days. I have been a Debian user since Red Hat EOL'ed 9. I ran RedHat for years before that though. Personally I'm glad they made it as a company and appreciate their business model as a good example of how to make money from Free Software. On the other hand I really don't have a problem with what Oracle is doing. I don't really like Oracle as a company and I don't like their arrogant approach to Linux but they are as entitled to try to succeed using Linux as anyone else is. Assuming they don't violate the various licenses, in spirit and letter, that is. If they think copying the Cent OS technique and maintaining it themselves is the way to go then let them give it a try.
Personally I buy once in a while and download often Debian, Ubuntu and Slackware now and leave the commercial Linux alone. At home or the office...
I dislike MS *and* hate frivolous lawsuits as much as the next/.'er. But in this case I'd say it's more like a customer wanted a BMW, went to the dealer and was sold a Honda with a BMW frame slapped around it. And it wasn't until they got it out on the freeway that they felt/saw the difference.
You could say that people are ignorant, they should research more before they buy and I think that's true in general but not everyone has the time, knowledge, resources or even intelligence to make informed decisions for every purchase they make. And if the market demands PCs be sold like toasters and TVs then the average consumer should be entitled to some protection from deceptive marketing practices. We're assaulted by advertising everywhere we go these days, it's hard enough to sort out as it is. We shouldn't have to spend our time figuring out who's being straight and who's out to nick us anyway they can...
MS and a lot of other software vendors are notorious for low balling system requirements but with Vista they went way overboard. Their whole campaign, with all the different versions, just seemed designed to confuse. They would have been so much better off just doing a low end version and a high end. People would go to Best Buy, look at both and walk out with one or the other. Some folks would "need" the best and some would buy the cheapest thing they could get away with just to shut the kids up. Businesses would be better served and the US DOT would have probably just told their staff to buy the one without the gimmicks.
Regardless of how the suit plays out MS has done a lot more damage then generate hype with their Vista strategery.
Please explain how CentOS exists if RedHat does not "provide free access to downloads of their signature product".
I'm pretty sure it's clear the GP meant in "easy to install ISO form". As is well known and mentioned in other posts RedHat makes all the source, and binaries, available for their products but you have to get the pieces yourself and put them together into something usable. If you want a complete, no fuss package you go with CentOS.
Or I guess you could go with Oracle and download Unbreakable Linux, although they ask you to register to get it and they really do just want to sell you databases and related services. I can't see much of a community developing around UL. If you need a database, like Oracle for whatever reason and have a budget for software and services then I guess Oracle isn't a bad choice.
Regardless, calling someone an idiot for choosing it is pretty ignorant. Despite my lack of interest in it I can think of a few viable reasons for a company to to deploy it...
The problem is that when Left Wing Wackos like Baldwin say inflamatory stuff like suggesting that a congressman ought to be killed and wife and kids raped and beaten on Broadcast TV...
Exagerating a bit here? Can you give me one example of a statement like this from any celebrity? I'm not saying your overall point is or isn't valid but you'll have to do better then this to convince anyone. I don't even think Sean Penn has crossed the line you drew in your comment...
You: Can I speak to Professor Z? Operator: Before you speak to Professor Z you must answer me these questions three! You: Um... Ok. Operator: What is your name? You: Dave. Operator: What is your favorite color? You: Blue. Operator: What is the air speed velocity of a laden swallow? You: African or European swallow? Operator: What? Um, I don't... Please hold while I connect your call.
Slashdot Mirror
I think that as long as the community is able to keep companies on their toes and incapable of creating too much trouble or confusion in the open source market place then I want them contributing. Even if there intentions are disengenous or self serviing as long as an open source project gets a leg up or another industry standard, piece of hardware or killer app gets implemented as open source we all benefit in the long run.
Keeping companies honest, to use Linus's phrase, is probably akin to herding cats but unless all OSS projects everywhere are ready to "just say no" to any and all help, financial or otherwise, from all corporations I don't see how the community at large, or even just one project, can afford to refuse help from big business.
As for IBM talking up the advantages of avoiding Vendor Lockin; yes it's ironic, but IBM does seem to genuinely want to make a busines case for OSS and in my mind isn't just paying lip service. They can't just go all open and altruistic tomorrow though, they do have shareholders after all. So far I'd say they've been pretty give and take about the whole thing though.
(FWIW Windows won't update randomly installed software either.)
Hell Windows won't always update it's own software. GDI+ vulnerability anyone? I was amazed that the fix for that involved directing you
to a website that says look through the list of hundreds of programs that may be vulnerable and decide for yourself if you need to do anything.
It held your hand a bit more then my short description might suggest but it certainly isn't something my Mom would bother with. She'd read for
about thirty seconds and then call me.
Actually you can Add programs using Windows Add/Remove Programs, have been able to since NT 4 as far as I know.
The only reason I know though is because you pretty much want to (have to?) use it on a machine running Terminal
Services. Using it this way in Terminal Services sets up a multi-user environment for the program where as your
typical "setup.exe" did not back then. This is also how you restriceted access to a program to just an Administrator
as well.
These days a good installer asks you "Do you want this for you only or all users" or some such and sets up a decent
user environment in "Documents and Settings" or "Users".
Most people don't even think about using Add/remove Programs because every program for Windows wants to do it for
you. Some installers work well and have a lot of good administration features, some don't. I personally prefer the
consistent if not always quite as friendly aprroach that a Linux Distro uses (apt being my favourite!). I would
like to see more consistency accross distributions but just comparing Ubuntu to Vista I'd say Synaptic is a much
better option then the myriad of interfaces and choices that Windows users deal with whenever they want to install
a new program.
One Dollar! One Dollar Bob!
Yeah, Yeah come on... Oh, wait, what... number of wrong articles?
Ummm... nevermind.
If I recall correctly you just need to make sure Eft is completely up to date before dist-upgrading to Fiesty. Apt changed sometime in Edgy so you need to make sure you are using the latest version of Apt before you begin grabbing Feisty packages.
I'm sure a search on the Ubuntu Wiki will turn up more specific details.
Linux needs to mature faster than the jerks coming up with the names
Why? It's grown up nicely with me since 1995. Your whole post is predicated on the idea that the original developers of FOSS just want to make money off it. Usually they don't; they do it for fun, because they love computers, to help out their fellow man, the list goes on and in some cases probably includes making money. But not usually in my experience.
Companies that repackage it all and want to make money may want to spend some time studying branding and marketing but the GNU people aren't trying to sell you anything. They give it to you, no charge, including the blessing to make your own money off it if you choose/can succeed. If you think you can sell GNU software under some fancy name then I will be happy to give your distro a try when it's released. I like to try them all! But you can also be sure I will go back to using my Sarges and Etches and my Drakes and Fawns if your distro ends up sucking, even if you do come up with a clever name.
Susano! Wake Up! LINNNUUUXXX is ready!
No, but my toaster uses the BSD TCP/IP stack.
Oh well that's OK because so does Microsoft!
I see /. has implemented something similar as well to avoid first posters...
Nothing for you to see here. Please move along.
I would add to this that anyone who has listened to a decent amount of his music will pick up on an underlying theme of child abuse by adults. Look at Tommy, with his crazy Uncle Ernie or Crazy Cousin Kevin.
In my mind Pete Townshend has had do deal with a lot more abuse in his life then he's let on to the public. I think his music, his book and even his "research" were honest attempts at dealing with things in his personal life.
I don't think he went about it the right way and I question the benefit of subjecting oneself to such material but I tend to think he was just stupid about it and honest in his intentions at least.
Just my $.02 and I admit bias as a long time Who fan but in the end I decided I wouldn't judge him too much as I don't really think I have the complete story.
Even though the post kept reading 'WMP' I'm pretty sure the GP is referring to the format chosen by content distributors, not the people listening to the content. In other words "WMV" files were being used by providers a lot until recently, now Flash seems to be the dominant format for distributing/hosting online video.
You know, I see your point and I agree it's not the most interesting issue to talk about with everyone but there is a lot more to the Libertarian stance on Marijuana then "free the weed dude".
It's also about the economy, artificial chemical monopolies formed many decades ago, medicine, the environment and yes, it's also about the personal freedom to take drugs.
If you think partying is all the Libertarians care about when it comes to Cannabis maybe you should look into it a little more. Try googling for Jack Herer sometime.
A) Most malware are Windows based EXE files. They won't run on Linux or Macs (don't get technical and mention wine! although I guess that is a possibility, I just don't see it being setup for easy opening of random EXEs for Grandma).
B) Even if Grandma does run some *nix specific virus, unless her grandchildren did her a grave disservice and have her running as root, the damage done should be minimal. Grandma's home directory might get wiped and in lieu of proper backups that would be horrible for her but there is only a very, very slim chance that Grandma running the virus is enough to escalate priveleges and root the box. Again, possible but unlkely.
So here we have Grandma running a Mac or Linux. Is she exposed to potential malware? Of course! But chances are, even if subjected to it, the damage would most likely be localized and the rest of us wouldn't be stuck with another zombie trying to send pr0n and RX spam to us.
Stephen? Stephen Colbert? Is that you?
...annoying blinking light even when idle. I cover that with a beer can.
Hmmm, that's not going to work for me then, I use bear bottles, thus my setup is incompatible with this blinking light of which you speak. Oh well, you get what you pay for.
But if you develop the AACS standard at least you have job security ;)
Well if your a coder maybe, if you designed the spec? I just hope they gave the poor sucker a few minutes of head start!
Definately. I find using Xubuntu on older Mac or PC hardware makes even a memory starved, slow disk machine feel quite useful. It comes with a nice mix of lightweight apps too, like AbiWord and Gnumeric instead of OO.org. It's not for Power Users but it's a nice way to treat a friend or family member to a free "surfin'" machine when coupled with something that would otherwise collect dust in the basement. :-)
And I think as more of these types of machines get equipped and put on the web for the crowd that wouldn't have really bought a machine otherwise you'll definately see a dip in overall new OS sales. It's really getting to the point where the latest and greatest just doesn't get you that much, no matter which OS you pick. That's especially true in terms of machines that are basically just used to surf the web.
Geeks need really cool reasons to buy new machines and the average joe consumer buys something new when the old one breaks. When joe meets a geek, he sometimes figures out he still doesn't need new, his friend will fix his PC for him...
Hmm, I see you are correct. My mistake. I guess I was thinking of bygone days. I have been a Debian user since Red Hat EOL'ed 9. I ran RedHat for years before that though. Personally I'm glad they made it as a company and appreciate their business model as a good example of how to make money from Free Software. On the other hand I really don't have a problem with what Oracle is doing. I don't really like Oracle as a company and I don't like their arrogant approach to Linux but they are as entitled to try to succeed using Linux as anyone else is. Assuming they don't violate the various licenses, in spirit and letter, that is. If they think copying the Cent OS technique and maintaining it themselves is the way to go then let them give it a try.
Personally I buy once in a while and download often Debian, Ubuntu and Slackware now and leave the commercial Linux alone. At home or the office...
I dislike MS *and* hate frivolous lawsuits as much as the next /.'er. But in this case I'd say it's more like a customer wanted a BMW, went to the dealer and was sold a Honda with a BMW frame slapped around it. And it wasn't until they got it out on the freeway that they felt/saw the difference.
You could say that people are ignorant, they should research more before they buy and I think that's true in general but not everyone has the time, knowledge, resources or even intelligence to make informed decisions for every purchase they make. And if the market demands PCs be sold like toasters and TVs then the average consumer should be entitled to some protection from deceptive marketing practices. We're assaulted by advertising everywhere we go these days, it's hard enough to sort out as it is. We shouldn't have to spend our time figuring out who's being straight and who's out to nick us anyway they can...
MS and a lot of other software vendors are notorious for low balling system requirements but with Vista they went way overboard. Their whole campaign, with all the different versions, just seemed designed to confuse. They would have been so much better off just doing a low end version and a high end. People would go to Best Buy, look at both and walk out with one or the other. Some folks would "need" the best and some would buy the cheapest thing they could get away with just to shut the kids up. Businesses would be better served and the US DOT would have probably just told their staff to buy the one without the gimmicks.
Regardless of how the suit plays out MS has done a lot more damage then generate hype with their Vista strategery.
Please explain how CentOS exists if RedHat does not "provide free access to downloads of their signature product".
I'm pretty sure it's clear the GP meant in "easy to install ISO form". As is well known and mentioned in other posts RedHat makes all the source, and binaries, available for their products but you have to get the pieces yourself and put them together into something usable. If you want a complete, no fuss package you go with CentOS.
Or I guess you could go with Oracle and download Unbreakable Linux, although they ask you to register to get it and they really do just want to sell you databases and related services. I can't see much of a community developing around UL. If you need a database, like Oracle for whatever reason and have a budget for software and services then I guess Oracle isn't a bad choice.
Regardless, calling someone an idiot for choosing it is pretty ignorant. Despite my lack of interest in it I can think of a few viable reasons for a company to to deploy it...
Nothing to say really, it just didn't seem like a complete discussion of Wikipedia without a mention of Mr. Colbert.
The problem is that when Left Wing Wackos like Baldwin say inflamatory stuff like suggesting that a congressman ought to be killed and wife and kids raped and beaten on Broadcast TV ...
Exagerating a bit here? Can you give me one example of a statement like this from any celebrity? I'm not saying your overall point is or isn't valid but you'll have to do better then this to convince anyone. I don't even think Sean Penn has crossed the line you drew in your comment...
*Most* likely scenario:
You: Can I speak to Professor Z?
Operator: Before you speak to Professor Z you must answer me these questions three!
You: Um... Ok.
Operator: What is your name?
You: Dave.
Operator: What is your favorite color?
You: Blue.
Operator: What is the air speed velocity of a laden swallow?
You: African or European swallow?
Operator: What? Um, I don't... Please hold while I connect your call.
Not to mention with the advent of the Firehose I get to be a part of the
selection process now as well.
Sounds like the ignorance of your lawyers ended up costing you a lot of money. Next time you should get a second opinion.