If it would save Sun's software from oblivion (or worse) would you pay real money to keep Sun's software developers developing?"
You're not describing a for-profit business but a non-profit organization such as the mozilla foundation, which is fine. Maybe it would even be better were Java run by something like that, it would at least be vendor neutral.
(Personally, I prefer netbeans, but, I bet that most of what I like about Netbeans would be ported to Eclipse, which is fine.)
-Thufir
When their system boots, it still identifies itself as Red Hat and they never even properly customized the system enough to cover up that fact. They (Oracle) just used the open source situation to grab Red Hat's product and try to run away with it. I dislike Oracle and will never use their products again.
Sounds like a lawsuit waiting to happen, there. Basically, they have to repeat the efforts of whitebox linux. Maybe they could form some sort of partnership with whitebox so that they don't have to duplicate that effort?
Seems like it would be easier to cut a deal with Redhat.
-Thufir
Sure it makes no sense for desktop applications, but your argument is *EXACTLY* why it makes sense for web applications.
I've never had a "web server" for a desktop machine... By that I mean a machine with no GUI, no compiler, just an interpreter (for php, python, ruby, whatever your choice is) and a web server...
Having to constantly "recreate" the web server environment on my desktop/laptop machine is a headache which regardless presents no end of incompatibilities.
Sounds like an argument in favor of a virtual machine. Perhaps the JVM or Parrot?
-Thufir
What should happen: you save the file; if you chose to save it to the desktop background it appears there, but because it's not marked executable it will not run when you double-click it. Instead the file contents open in a text editor, or some other fairly boring but safe action.
You've exactly described the bug and the solution.
-Thufir
JRuby has an intrepreter, written in Java.
It also has a Just In Time compiler to JVM bytecode.
It also has a Ahead of Time compiler to JVM bytecode, just like Java.
If it's compiled, does that mean that it would suddenly be appropriate to use generics? I suppose it's more complex than that?
I am aware that Java is generally faster than Ruby. But it ISN'T fast. It is anything but.
The only reason it is even acceptable in a lot of situations today is because the hardware has gotten so much faster.
Err, that's the *point* of Java. It's predicated on hardware getting better and better. If hardware didn't improve there'd be no point in Java for the long term.
Pros do NOT use forums. Forums are slow & inefficient (having to visit sites individually, regularly, unless they provide decent feeds). They're also centralised, which is bad in technical circles when you know stuff can go wrong, and that people can become dictators. Generally speaking, forums tends to be haunted by younger people who grew up thinking the web was the net, and started by people who care more about building a name for their site and advertising revenue than building a functioning discussion community. Also, the moderation on forums tends to either be limited, or heavy-handed.
The rest of us use mailing lists which feed directly into our mail clients (read: not webmail), and let us search/reply/archive at will. That works out very similar to usenet, is more practical now with decent mailing list software, and so it's an obvious transition. We also like IRC which allows real-time, moderated conversation, combined with online logs of those conversations.
Why do you not specifically mention gmane? A nntp client paired with gmane gives, effectively, a usenet type interface with reduced spam.
To be absolutely clear, installation has ZERO to do with technical capabilities and lack of ANSI compliance, which are the sole reasons knowledgeable people dislike MySQL.
Actually, you can't just point upstream if you're distributing it, *you* must offer the source. You can snail mail it, or whatever, but you can't, according to the license, just refer to something upstream.
On the e-mail list there's a particular user who repeatedly points out this defect -- he's shouted down with the adage "gentoo isn't supposed to be easy". Then, there are occasional threads about Sabayon leeching (which it most certainly does).
There's just no interest with Gentoo, or not enough, on making it easy to install. Which is ironic, given that the whole *point* of portage is to make it easy to maintain!
The way it's set up currently, no label can be a subset of any other label. Furthermore, it's currently not possible to POP e-mails with their labels, so it's hypothetical.
However, if one could POP e-mails complete with labels, that really doesn't get one anywhere. A single message can have one, five, ten labels applied to it. If none of those labels are subsets of each other that'd mean up to ten copies of a single message, each copy having a different label. Or, you'd need some seperate system to label the messages.
What'd make more sense would be to put the messages into a RDBMS, and those labels are a good start.
If they're on the open then anyone can buy them. The whole point is to discriminate. The intended market wouldn't normally buy a computer. Hence, the distribution has to be controlled.
If the distribution isn't controlled then they'll end up everywhere but the intended market. Now, you might argue that the benefits of an open market outweigh the negatives, but that's beside the point: these devices are intended for a very specific market.
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There was a Sun / Apple merger rumor years ago.....early 90s?
If Sun are to go, better to Apple than to IBM.
And BSD vs Solaris Vs Linux? Three operating systems by one company? -Thufir
If it would save Sun's software from oblivion (or worse) would you pay real money to keep Sun's software developers developing?"
You're not describing a for-profit business but a non-profit organization such as the mozilla foundation, which is fine. Maybe it would even be better were Java run by something like that, it would at least be vendor neutral. (Personally, I prefer netbeans, but, I bet that most of what I like about Netbeans would be ported to Eclipse, which is fine.) -Thufir
When their system boots, it still identifies itself as Red Hat and they never even properly customized the system enough to cover up that fact. They (Oracle) just used the open source situation to grab Red Hat's product and try to run away with it. I dislike Oracle and will never use their products again.
Sounds like a lawsuit waiting to happen, there. Basically, they have to repeat the efforts of whitebox linux. Maybe they could form some sort of partnership with whitebox so that they don't have to duplicate that effort? Seems like it would be easier to cut a deal with Redhat. -Thufir
But not everyone WANTS to learn how to use apt. Most people want to turn it on, click an icon, and have something install.
Thats absurdity. In the GNOME menu for Ubuntu there's a nice GUI. What's the prob? -Thufir
Sure it makes no sense for desktop applications, but your argument is *EXACTLY* why it makes sense for web applications.
I've never had a "web server" for a desktop machine... By that I mean a machine with no GUI, no compiler, just an interpreter (for php, python, ruby, whatever your choice is) and a web server...
Having to constantly "recreate" the web server environment on my desktop/laptop machine is a headache which regardless presents no end of incompatibilities.
Sounds like an argument in favor of a virtual machine. Perhaps the JVM or Parrot? -Thufir
What should happen: you save the file; if you chose to save it to the desktop background it appears there, but because it's not marked executable it will not run when you double-click it. Instead the file contents open in a text editor, or some other fairly boring but safe action.
You've exactly described the bug and the solution. -Thufir
JRuby has an intrepreter, written in Java. It also has a Just In Time compiler to JVM bytecode. It also has a Ahead of Time compiler to JVM bytecode, just like Java.
If it's compiled, does that mean that it would suddenly be appropriate to use generics? I suppose it's more complex than that?
I am aware that Java is generally faster than Ruby. But it ISN'T fast. It is anything but. The only reason it is even acceptable in a lot of situations today is because the hardware has gotten so much faster.
Err, that's the *point* of Java. It's predicated on hardware getting better and better. If hardware didn't improve there'd be no point in Java for the long term.
Pros do NOT use forums. Forums are slow & inefficient (having to visit sites individually, regularly, unless they provide decent feeds). They're also centralised, which is bad in technical circles when you know stuff can go wrong, and that people can become dictators. Generally speaking, forums tends to be haunted by younger people who grew up thinking the web was the net, and started by people who care more about building a name for their site and advertising revenue than building a functioning discussion community. Also, the moderation on forums tends to either be limited, or heavy-handed.
The rest of us use mailing lists which feed directly into our mail clients (read: not webmail), and let us search/reply/archive at will. That works out very similar to usenet, is more practical now with decent mailing list software, and so it's an obvious transition. We also like IRC which allows real-time, moderated conversation, combined with online logs of those conversations.
Why do you not specifically mention gmane? A nntp client paired with gmane gives, effectively, a usenet type interface with reduced spam.
To be absolutely clear, installation has ZERO to do with technical capabilities and lack of ANSI compliance, which are the sole reasons knowledgeable people dislike MySQL.
if you want ANSI, what's wrong with: http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/5.0/en/ansi-mode.html ? -Thufir
Actually, you can't just point upstream if you're distributing it, *you* must offer the source. You can snail mail it, or whatever, but you can't, according to the license, just refer to something upstream.
who says you have to pay a commercial license? you can *install* the community version for free, you just can't *distribute* it.
by this logic, the BSD license is better than the GPL. Says who?
Exactly. What Samsung does is offer a binary which has root exploit problems, and which only works under specific distros. Really, you have to muck with it. http://permalink.gmane.org/gmane.linux.redhat.fedora.general/290309
The first AI program will a virus -- skynet ;)
-Thufir
On the e-mail list there's a particular user who repeatedly points out this defect -- he's shouted down with the adage "gentoo isn't supposed to be easy". Then, there are occasional threads about Sabayon leeching (which it most certainly does).
There's just no interest with Gentoo, or not enough, on making it easy to install. Which is ironic, given that the whole *point* of portage is to make it easy to maintain!
"You can't judge a language on its own." What about ? -Thufir
Haha - I want a bumper sticker with:
"If your Perl code can be understood by humans without extreme effort, you're just not trying."
The way it's set up currently, no label can be a subset of any other label. Furthermore, it's currently not possible to POP e-mails with their labels, so it's hypothetical.
However, if one could POP e-mails complete with labels, that really doesn't get one anywhere. A single message can have one, five, ten labels applied to it. If none of those labels are subsets of each other that'd mean up to ten copies of a single message, each copy having a different label. Or, you'd need some seperate system to label the messages.
What'd make more sense would be to put the messages into a RDBMS, and those labels are a good start.
-Thufir
If they're on the open then anyone can buy them. The whole point is to discriminate. The intended market wouldn't normally buy a computer. Hence, the distribution has to be controlled.
If the distribution isn't controlled then they'll end up everywhere but the intended market. Now, you might argue that the benefits of an open market outweigh the negatives, but that's beside the point: these devices are intended for a very specific market.
-Thufir