One that Cameron didn't even ask for: Reform over the freedom of movement.
Lots of other changes that people want and would ask for, but that seems to be the trigger for a lot of the Leave votes, particularly outside of the South East.
No, which is one reason people opted to leave. Politicians have been ignoring the average UK citizen for too long and people took the chance to protest in an effective manner.
Nobody vote in 1975 to join an organisation that looks like the current eu. The promised vote on the Lisbon treaty never occurred either.
Your proposal on recall is unworkable. See also: 4 million votes got 1 mp from Ukip into parliaments; 1.5 million votes got 56 MPs representing the SNP.
Recall all you like, the system prevents fair representation. Given a straight binary choice the country voted to leave the EU. Given 56 SNP members of parliament the House would never have made that decision, even if recalled and a new election held
Your support for the EU is explained by your evident stupidity.
Cameron didnt ask to pay less or get bigger benefits. Cameron said the club rules didn't suit the uk but a few reforms would make membership tenable.
He got fuck all. The British people decided membership was no longer tenable.
If the EU wanted to avoid the instability and uncertainty that has caused they should have tried fucking listening and reforming instead of pushing their previous superstate. Failed superstate.
Yeah, we used the resources of an empire to stop the Nazis.
In hindsight, I'm glad we did. I'd have no issue with doing it again. Churchill was a great wartime leader and is recognised as such because when Britain goes to war, we have a habit of winning. We were already at war by the time he became PM and with his leadership, we won.
Losing the Empire? Well worth it. We helped most of those countries establish internal rule and gave them enviable stability, it's been a beautiful example of how to give away am empire.
I was referring to child benefit payments, made to families in Poland when a parent works in the uk. Something that Cameron had to beg to avoid and got told no.
There was never a rational basis for those payments and no reasonable objection that other EU leaders could make to halting them. Yet Merkel and the Polish PM and others demanded that they continue.
Well, fuck them, they just cost their countries far far more than the couple of million quid a year those payment come to.
Clearly you've forgotten the years of labour governments imposed on England by the Scottish vote. University fees ring a bell?
The Scots have had the deciding vote on many England only laws, have had a disproportionate influence on uk law, now they're getting upset because they might have to actually function as part of a democracy?
Fuck no. I preferred the proposed option to PR. It meant you could vote for people, not political parties, and you could vote against a cunt you don't want elected rather than a party just dropping in at the top of the list.
Fuck me, you still haven't understood. Things are so shit outside London that the country would rather risk everything for change. Didn't you see the vote results yesterday? Very clearly saying fuck the economy, give us autonomy.
The London media and Westminster political village have ignored the rest of us for too long, don't be getting all surprised that some people might not miss the place if it collapsed under the weight of its own bullshit.
Sorry but I like having space. Filling it up when Spain has better weather and prebuilt cities sat empty feels a terrible waste of our green and pleasant land.
Sure we could all pack 6 deep inside the m25. Why would you think that people want to?
Given that Farage didn't represent the official leave campaign and is not able to dictate or even vote in the Commons in how the budget is allocated I'm not sure why you think his views are relevant.
Conflating 350m per week gross with 8.3m per year net merely shows how little you understand about the whole domain. No wonder you're confused and scared by the result. Come over here, have a hug.
Reaching agreement on trade terms is a very different proposition to having a European superstate imposed on you.
Yes, agreements invariably include a level of compromise. That's very different to handing over full control of the country.
I've been voting for two decades on the sovereignty issue, long before Blair opened the immigration floodgates. Sovereignty is a very real, very valid and clearly very important concern to many Brits.
By all means, if that's the desire and intent of the peoples of Europe then crack on and make it work. We'd love to trade with you, visit, have parties and generally be friends.
I'm sceptical however that this actually is the will of the people. The EU may not survive these changes.
The great thing is that now that the UK has voted out, several other countries are going to follow.
By the time the UK's existing trade agreements with the EU lapse, the EU will be smaller, substantially different, and several of its current members will be delighted to return to strong trade relations with the UK outside of the EU.
1 - London's population is younger than rural areas, and there's a split across age groups 2 - Some of the London boroughs are populated by the super-rich that benefit from cheap labour and economic stability 3 - London's always had a sizeable non-British population 4 - London is a high density living space
That last point needs elaboration. If you live in a city centre, you don't own a car, you use public transport, you have easy access to a massive job market, you don't notice so much when it bulges at the edges and grows up or out.
If you live in a rural town, enjoying open countryside, have to travel to find work, you notice when people start building on that countryside, clog the roads, start taking the few jobs available.
The impact of high immigration is just felt far more outside of London than in.
Slashdot Mirror
I'd rather have free trade, visa-free movement but no automatic right to resettle or work.
It's quite likely that'll end up being negotiated as part of the exit.
One that Cameron didn't even ask for: Reform over the freedom of movement.
Lots of other changes that people want and would ask for, but that seems to be the trigger for a lot of the Leave votes, particularly outside of the South East.
Shrug. The British people don't like the current EU terms of membership. We'll leave. We'll open for trade with the whole world, including the EU.
It'll be great. I'm looking forward to it.
In the meantime I get to laugh and mock the childish tears of those that choose not to understand and don't want to embrace change.
If the house votes to ignore the referendum result it may not exist for much longer.
It wouldn't be civil war but you wouldn't want shares in an insurance company.
No, which is one reason people opted to leave. Politicians have been ignoring the average UK citizen for too long and people took the chance to protest in an effective manner.
Nobody vote in 1975 to join an organisation that looks like the current eu. The promised vote on the Lisbon treaty never occurred either.
Your proposal on recall is unworkable. See also: 4 million votes got 1 mp from Ukip into parliaments; 1.5 million votes got 56 MPs representing the SNP.
Recall all you like, the system prevents fair representation. Given a straight binary choice the country voted to leave the EU. Given 56 SNP members of parliament the House would never have made that decision, even if recalled and a new election held
Bullshit. That was a vote on joining a free trade organisation.
The uk has never before Thursday voted on membership of a European superstate.
Your support for the EU is explained by your evident stupidity.
Cameron didnt ask to pay less or get bigger benefits. Cameron said the club rules didn't suit the uk but a few reforms would make membership tenable.
He got fuck all. The British people decided membership was no longer tenable.
If the EU wanted to avoid the instability and uncertainty that has caused they should have tried fucking listening and reforming instead of pushing their previous superstate. Failed superstate.
Learn to fucking read. Nowhere on that bus does it suggest adding £350m a week to the NHS budget.
Yeah, we used the resources of an empire to stop the Nazis.
In hindsight, I'm glad we did. I'd have no issue with doing it again. Churchill was a great wartime leader and is recognised as such because when Britain goes to war, we have a habit of winning. We were already at war by the time he became PM and with his leadership, we won.
Losing the Empire? Well worth it. We helped most of those countries establish internal rule and gave them enviable stability, it's been a beautiful example of how to give away am empire.
I was referring to child benefit payments, made to families in Poland when a parent works in the uk. Something that Cameron had to beg to avoid and got told no.
There was never a rational basis for those payments and no reasonable objection that other EU leaders could make to halting them. Yet Merkel and the Polish PM and others demanded that they continue.
Well, fuck them, they just cost their countries far far more than the couple of million quid a year those payment come to.
Clearly you've forgotten the years of labour governments imposed on England by the Scottish vote. University fees ring a bell?
The Scots have had the deciding vote on many England only laws, have had a disproportionate influence on uk law, now they're getting upset because they might have to actually function as part of a democracy?
I fear I lack sympathy.
Fuck no. I preferred the proposed option to PR. It meant you could vote for people, not political parties, and you could vote against a cunt you don't want elected rather than a party just dropping in at the top of the list.
PR is terrible.
Fuck me, you still haven't understood. Things are so shit outside London that the country would rather risk everything for change. Didn't you see the vote results yesterday? Very clearly saying fuck the economy, give us autonomy.
The London media and Westminster political village have ignored the rest of us for too long, don't be getting all surprised that some people might not miss the place if it collapsed under the weight of its own bullshit.
Go for it. Not many British people left in London anyway.
Sorry but I like having space. Filling it up when Spain has better weather and prebuilt cities sat empty feels a terrible waste of our green and pleasant land.
Sure we could all pack 6 deep inside the m25. Why would you think that people want to?
Given that Farage didn't represent the official leave campaign and is not able to dictate or even vote in the Commons in how the budget is allocated I'm not sure why you think his views are relevant.
Conflating 350m per week gross with 8.3m per year net merely shows how little you understand about the whole domain. No wonder you're confused and scared by the result. Come over here, have a hug.
Reaching agreement on trade terms is a very different proposition to having a European superstate imposed on you.
Yes, agreements invariably include a level of compromise. That's very different to handing over full control of the country.
I've been voting for two decades on the sovereignty issue, long before Blair opened the immigration floodgates. Sovereignty is a very real, very valid and clearly very important concern to many Brits.
"Someone else has even less space, so we're not full" ?
No.
By all means, if that's the desire and intent of the peoples of Europe then crack on and make it work. We'd love to trade with you, visit, have parties and generally be friends.
I'm sceptical however that this actually is the will of the people. The EU may not survive these changes.
Apologies, only 8.3bn
https://fullfact.org/europe/ou...
http://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/6...
Fuck EU
It's only binding if you don't want national riots that would almost certainly result in immigrants being targeted.
The great thing is that now that the UK has voted out, several other countries are going to follow.
By the time the UK's existing trade agreements with the EU lapse, the EU will be smaller, substantially different, and several of its current members will be delighted to return to strong trade relations with the UK outside of the EU.
There are a number of factors there.
1 - London's population is younger than rural areas, and there's a split across age groups
2 - Some of the London boroughs are populated by the super-rich that benefit from cheap labour and economic stability
3 - London's always had a sizeable non-British population
4 - London is a high density living space
That last point needs elaboration. If you live in a city centre, you don't own a car, you use public transport, you have easy access to a massive job market, you don't notice so much when it bulges at the edges and grows up or out.
If you live in a rural town, enjoying open countryside, have to travel to find work, you notice when people start building on that countryside, clog the roads, start taking the few jobs available.
The impact of high immigration is just felt far more outside of London than in.