I like Nintendo's approach with the Wii. It's really the same architecture of the Gamecube but with ugpraded specs, much like a PC, so backwards-compatibility is built-in, and a Wii2 would probably just be a faster, more powerful Wii. Microsoft and Sony felt the need to jump architectures and screw up compatibility.
Ironic isn't it that the 360 is a similar architecture to the Wii? I'm Not making that up. The 360 and the Wii should be considered (technically) in the same family. Like cousins or something. Both run on IBM Power PC chips, with ATI GPUs... and though The PS3 could be included also since IBM was a partner in the CELL design (along with Sony, and Toshiba), they would be considered the black sheep since they aren't actually being made by an IBM fabrication plant.
"Wii2 would probably just be a faster, more powerful Wii"
In theory that could happen, but I would doubt it. I'm sure Nintendo will dream up something to enhance useability above 'just more power'.
dude....girls are way more willing to compromise on a guy's looks than guys are on a girl's. A guy with money gets girls, and a girl with looks gets guys. We're the ones who might need convincing that fun beats pretty.
Maybe that's a sign of 'Maturing'. The girls who are "good looking and know it" have an attitude. You can date an attractive woman who's alot more fun. Seriously, would you rather date a 10 who's stuck up, and wants to be worshiped or an 8.5 to a 9 who's 'Got Skillz' ?
You should call this the Blizzard hypothesis, since that's basically their entire business plan.
They didn't invent the RTS game, or the MMORPG, or the dungeon-digger, but they waited and let other companies invent them, then swooped in to perfect the game genres that caught on.
Not only that, they learned early on NOT to be the ones pushing graphical boundries. Since they cater to PC's they want to make their products accessable to as many PC's as possible. That's why even when it was released Starcraft had minimal emphasis on visuals. It exists today as it did then, Locked at 640x480 with 8 bit color. You know what though? I still play it as my prefered RTS.
World of War Craft was the same way, the system specs are really low to allow the maximum number of potential subscribers. The game isn't ugly by any stretch, but they learned that 'Superior Design' beats 'Superior power'.
The Wii is fun. I have young kids. The games are more geared towards them. We all enjoy most of these games.
Though the Wii has had quite a few E rated games at launch, there are a number of "Mature" games around the corner. Godfather, Manhunt 2, No More Heroes and Resident Evil Umbrella chronicals just off the top of my head. I state this not only to head off the enevitable flames to follow that 'Nintendo is teh Kiddie', but also to let you know (as a parent) you may want to set the parental controls on the system if you are concerned with them playing (future) games that may be inappropriate for them.
you can't be talking about the Saturn, with its horrible 3D, or the N64, which had comparable 3D but horrible storage capacity. Which systems are you talking about?
Of that Era The Saturn was a better 2D machine (it's a shame, it could have been a contender), and the PS1 didn't have 'comparable graphics' to the N64 (unless you feel the PS2 had 'comparable graphics' to the X-box). The N64 was much better at 3D modeling.
The rosey colored glasses come on though with the PS1 since we all remember the Pre-rendered CG cut scenes of FFVII (which was allowed by the greater capacity of the CD's) and forget how primitive the actual game was (graphically).
I wouldn't say hardly anyone. All the gamers I know either have one or are looking for one, and HDTVs were one of the hottest selling items this hoilday season. Prices are dropping a LOT, and 32" 720p LCD HDTVs can regularly be found for $500. The prices will only drop, and the install base will only rise in the future.
Why are so many people so shortsighted? HDTV is the future.
HD may be the future, but the issue is it isn't the present. Currently I own an HDTV, and an HD DVD player. I enjoy them immensely, but I am (by having them) in the minority. About 17% of households in the US have 1 or more HDTVs. That means 83% don't, and our adoption rates have been better than either Japan and Europe. Now HD is a niche (albeit growing) market. It will take several more years for it to hit mainstream adoption. DVD only surpassed VHS sales after the players hit the $50 and under price point.
In 5-10 years it may be mainstream, but Nintendo has banked that it won't hit 'critical mass' within the 4-6 year life expectancy of the Wii. I'll bet that the next Nintendo will push HD, but in the interest to cater to the largest possible market they have chosen SD.
Well yeah, because all the consoles in the past have been designed to put out images on an SD television set. Now that there are 2 consoles out there with HD as their focus, the state-of-the-art in terms of graphics is HD resolutions. For a series that has sold out to the eye candy, its pretty hard to imagine them passing up two systems with superior graphical power for the Wii.
The PS2 had a handfull of 720p games and 1 1080i game (GT4) so if they were about pushing the boundries... why didn't they? Others proved higher resolutions were possible. Hell 480p from 480i should have been dirt simple to do by comparison.
its pretty hard to imagine them passing up two systems with superior graphical power for the Wii.
Actually it's pretty easy to imagine. If they wanted superior graphics, FF would never have been on a Sony Platform. There were more powerful systems competing with both the PS1, and the PS2.
Square went where the market was. The same logic that got them on the Sony boat to begin with; was the same logic used to move the Dragon Quest Series off the PS2 and onto the DS. It is the same logic that can be used to move FF to the Wii. They aren't about pushing graphical boundries, they are about pushing units of software.
The FF series from 7 onward have had a pretty huge focus on eye-candy. Its pretty hard for me to imagine the main line of FF games moving to any console that doesn't support HD resolutions from this point onward.
ROFLOL. Sorry, that's been one of my pet peeves for some time now. Check the box again. As pretty as they look none of the FF games (or Kingsdom Hearts) run in progressive scan (at least on the PS2). Some run in 16:9 widescreen, but they are all 480i.
FFXI is 480p on the X-box 360, and if you run Kingdom Hearts "Chain of Memories" through the Gameboy player you can get 480p on that.
The Wii at 480p seems right in line with the focus they've been given in the past.
As prejudiced or narrow-minded as the HD graphics-angle may seem, it should not be easily discounted. IMHO, the difference in graphics moving from SD to HD is on par with the move from 56K to Broadband. Once you've got it, you'll never (want to) go back. Once you've seen HD signals on your HDTV, you want all your media sources to be in HD. Call it eye-candy, but once you've experienced it, you'll want that visual sucrose 24/7.
I agree that I simply can't go back to dialup, but I disagree that the HD vs. SD switch is so profound. I have a Wii running 480p and a 360 running in 720p (Looks better than 1080i IMHO) both over component. Last night I was playing Fight Night Round 3 (on the 360). Very, Very Pretty game. I like it a bit, but I found myself looking at my coffee table and thinking 'If only I could use the Nunchuck and play this like Wii Sports Boxing'... That would improve this alot.
What's Ironic about that is I never had the thought while playing WiiSports boxing 'I wish this was more realistic looking'. The Mii's are cartoony, but the charactures of some of my friends are a very good likeness. So when we box as cartoony as they are I am totally sold that I am fighting them .
Granted I do buy, and enjoy HD content (I even got an HD DVD player), and I don't want to run anything over composite video, but for me it isn't an all or nothing thing, and as such I will gladdy buy the Wii versions of Tiger Woods Golf, or Fight Night over the 'prettier' 360 version since the control offers much greater immersion.
why play the SEGA Genesis version of Golden Axe or Altered Beast when the arcade version was much better.
Personally, I would like both options to be available, but I disagree that Golden Axe for the genesis is the inferior version. I would sacrifice the better graphics and sound of the arcade version for the additional levels, and modes of the genesis one. I consider that a fair trade off. However things like the NES Donkey Kong vs the Arcade Donkey Kong piss me off since you are actually losing content.
If the game required that your saber be mostly pointed at the sensor bar -- not an unreasonable constraint --
Just fYI, The sensor bar has Zero effect on the motion sencing abilities. I have actually played a few frames of Wii Sports Bowling from a different (adacent) room. It worked perfectly fine. The Sensor bar is there as a guide post for the pointer (Think Lighthouse). In theory you don't even need it so long as you have 2 IR sources near the TV (Even candles have been proven to work).
Apparently they won't even be releasing a network play API to 3rd parties for up to a year !!
They already have shared these with developers. Maybe you read a post from 2006 and said they weren't releasing them until 'Next year', but there will be online multiplayer Wii games in calander 2007.
"Yes, most people who buy a new console want better graphics."
I figured they wanted better games. Otherwise, the Dreamcast would have flown off the shelves because for the time those graphics were HAWT.
isn't it possible to want both? you're acting like both can't exist at the same time.
It is possible to have both. It is possible to have neither, and it is possible to have either. You can have a better game without better graphics, and you can have a 'prettier game' that is worse than what followed it.
The point is that graphics is probably pretty low on the consumer requirement scale. If they were then end all be all then Sony would have got it's ass kicked in the PS1 and PS2 eras (or Nintendo's Gameboy for that matter) as there were much more capable machines competing with it.
"Yes, most people who buy a new console want better graphics."
Let's get back to this original assumption. What if the Wii is your first console (as it is for many people)? Nintendo effectively set the bar for what to expect going forward. Now think of that both in terms of graphics and control. Once you grow accustomed to using the pointer it is difficult accept a different (arguably inferior) input method.
Funnily enough, it's the opposite for me. Messing around with a PC to get games to run used to be fun. Nowadays, after having stared at IntelliJ all day, I'm happy if I can just sit on my sofa, push to "on" button on the Wii Remote, and start playing.
I wish there were more retro Zelda titles available (OOT, MM, WW).
Not sure about the UK, but Zelda:LttP made the US virtual Console. Also the 'Zelda Collection' disk for the Gamecube had both NES games, and Both 64 titles. If you got the Zelda Collection and WindWaker (since it IS backwords compatible) that should keep you busy for quite a long time...:)
Not that I disagree with most your points...but to say the Wii looks the same as the PS3 and 360 on normal TVs is just false. The difference is large and very easy to see. Graphics aren't everything..of course, but don't make stuff up.
Try it sometime. It IS an eye opener. Gears of War looks better than anything out there right now running in 720p, and it's not like Gears becomes 'WiiSports' simple if you play it on a regular TV, but the gap seriously narrows.
If you put Gears of War in 480i (as in a standard Def TV) It doesn't look significantly better than RE-Make, or RE4 on the GameCube or Ninja Gaiden on the Original X-box. Yes, it looks hella pretty still, but it still isn't the 'Step up' you see in store displays (running in HD). I think that's what the parent post was getting at.
Honestly, as much as I'm looking forward to Metroid Prime 3, Super Mario Galaxy and Super Smash Bros. Brawl I expect the game that will really define the Wii in 2007 is a game we do not know about and can probably not guess...
Agreed. There is a lot of truth in that. I expect Mario to hold his own against Halo (just as Zelda would) and I also expect MGS4 and FFXIII to not make it this year. I think a game out of left field (like Nintendogs was) has tremendous potential to capture the sales this holiday.
...does Nintendo actually pay attention to other releases when they make dates?
Don't think so. Why else would they release Metroid Prime 2 right next to Halo2 ? That move cost a lot of sales...
Smash Bros is a pretty major Halo competitor in my view.
Smash is great, and I think it should be out Q3 this year (prior to the Christmas period). If they want ANYTHING to go toe to toe with Halo 3 though, it should be Mario Galaxy. Or at the very least it can't be Metroid.
If the excitement were gone, would stores still sell out within days of recieving a shipment?
Within days? I've heard reports of minutes and hours, but I haven't come across a report of Wii's staying stocked on the shelf until even the next day... Do they last on the shelves longer by you?
Slashdot Mirror
Tru.Dat.
Ironic isn't it that the 360 is a similar architecture to the Wii? I'm Not making that up. The 360 and the Wii should be considered (technically) in the same family. Like cousins or something. Both run on IBM Power PC chips, with ATI GPUs... and though The PS3 could be included also since IBM was a partner in the CELL design (along with Sony, and Toshiba), they would be considered the black sheep since they aren't actually being made by an IBM fabrication plant.
"Wii2 would probably just be a faster, more powerful Wii"
In theory that could happen, but I would doubt it. I'm sure Nintendo will dream up something to enhance useability above 'just more power'.
Just wanted to point out that X-box wasn't alone. Every console of the previous generation (including the Dreamcast) supported 480p.
Maybe that's a sign of 'Maturing'. The girls who are "good looking and know it" have an attitude. You can date an attractive woman who's alot more fun. Seriously, would you rather date a 10 who's stuck up, and wants to be worshiped or an 8.5 to a 9 who's 'Got Skillz' ?
Both (hdd and bluray) could be made optional.
But then what would you have? You'd have a 360 with less RAM, a poor controller and an online service that is worse.
But then what would you have? You'd have a 360 with a worse online service, and poor controller.
They didn't invent the RTS game, or the MMORPG, or the dungeon-digger, but they waited and let other companies invent them, then swooped in to perfect the game genres that caught on.
Not only that, they learned early on NOT to be the ones pushing graphical boundries. Since they cater to PC's they want to make their products accessable to as many PC's as possible. That's why even when it was released Starcraft had minimal emphasis on visuals. It exists today as it did then, Locked at 640x480 with 8 bit color. You know what though? I still play it as my prefered RTS.
World of War Craft was the same way, the system specs are really low to allow the maximum number of potential subscribers. The game isn't ugly by any stretch, but they learned that 'Superior Design' beats 'Superior power'.
Though the Wii has had quite a few E rated games at launch, there are a number of "Mature" games around the corner. Godfather, Manhunt 2, No More Heroes and Resident Evil Umbrella chronicals just off the top of my head. I state this not only to head off the enevitable flames to follow that 'Nintendo is teh Kiddie', but also to let you know (as a parent) you may want to set the parental controls on the system if you are concerned with them playing (future) games that may be inappropriate for them.
Of that Era The Saturn was a better 2D machine (it's a shame, it could have been a contender), and the PS1 didn't have 'comparable graphics' to the N64 (unless you feel the PS2 had 'comparable graphics' to the X-box). The N64 was much better at 3D modeling.
The rosey colored glasses come on though with the PS1 since we all remember the Pre-rendered CG cut scenes of FFVII (which was allowed by the greater capacity of the CD's) and forget how primitive the actual game was (graphically).
Why are so many people so shortsighted? HDTV is the future.
HD may be the future, but the issue is it isn't the present. Currently I own an HDTV, and an HD DVD player. I enjoy them immensely, but I am (by having them) in the minority. About 17% of households in the US have 1 or more HDTVs. That means 83% don't, and our adoption rates have been better than either Japan and Europe. Now HD is a niche (albeit growing) market. It will take several more years for it to hit mainstream adoption. DVD only surpassed VHS sales after the players hit the $50 and under price point.
In 5-10 years it may be mainstream, but Nintendo has banked that it won't hit 'critical mass' within the 4-6 year life expectancy of the Wii. I'll bet that the next Nintendo will push HD, but in the interest to cater to the largest possible market they have chosen SD.
The PS2 had a handfull of 720p games and 1 1080i game (GT4) so if they were about pushing the boundries... why didn't they? Others proved higher resolutions were possible. Hell 480p from 480i should have been dirt simple to do by comparison.
its pretty hard to imagine them passing up two systems with superior graphical power for the Wii.
Actually it's pretty easy to imagine. If they wanted superior graphics, FF would never have been on a Sony Platform. There were more powerful systems competing with both the PS1, and the PS2.
Square went where the market was. The same logic that got them on the Sony boat to begin with; was the same logic used to move the Dragon Quest Series off the PS2 and onto the DS. It is the same logic that can be used to move FF to the Wii. They aren't about pushing graphical boundries, they are about pushing units of software.
ROFLOL. Sorry, that's been one of my pet peeves for some time now. Check the box again. As pretty as they look none of the FF games (or Kingsdom Hearts) run in progressive scan (at least on the PS2). Some run in 16:9 widescreen, but they are all 480i.
FFXI is 480p on the X-box 360, and if you run Kingdom Hearts "Chain of Memories" through the Gameboy player you can get 480p on that.
The Wii at 480p seems right in line with the focus they've been given in the past.
Yeah, it would be as crazy/ impossible as them moving Dragon Quest to the DS.
oh, wait.
I agree that I simply can't go back to dialup, but I disagree that the HD vs. SD switch is so profound. I have a Wii running 480p and a 360 running in 720p (Looks better than 1080i IMHO) both over component. Last night I was playing Fight Night Round 3 (on the 360). Very, Very Pretty game. I like it a bit, but I found myself looking at my coffee table and thinking 'If only I could use the Nunchuck and play this like Wii Sports Boxing'... That would improve this alot.
What's Ironic about that is I never had the thought while playing WiiSports boxing 'I wish this was more realistic looking'. The Mii's are cartoony, but the charactures of some of my friends are a very good likeness. So when we box as cartoony as they are I am totally sold that I am fighting them .
Granted I do buy, and enjoy HD content (I even got an HD DVD player), and I don't want to run anything over composite video, but for me it isn't an all or nothing thing, and as such I will gladdy buy the Wii versions of Tiger Woods Golf, or Fight Night over the 'prettier' 360 version since the control offers much greater immersion.
Personally, I would like both options to be available, but I disagree that Golden Axe for the genesis is the inferior version. I would sacrifice the better graphics and sound of the arcade version for the additional levels, and modes of the genesis one. I consider that a fair trade off. However things like the NES Donkey Kong vs the Arcade Donkey Kong piss me off since you are actually losing content.
Just fYI, The sensor bar has Zero effect on the motion sencing abilities. I have actually played a few frames of Wii Sports Bowling from a different (adacent) room. It worked perfectly fine. The Sensor bar is there as a guide post for the pointer (Think Lighthouse). In theory you don't even need it so long as you have 2 IR sources near the TV (Even candles have been proven to work).
They already have shared these with developers. Maybe you read a post from 2006 and said they weren't releasing them until 'Next year', but there will be online multiplayer Wii games in calander 2007.
I figured they wanted better games. Otherwise, the Dreamcast would have flown off the shelves because for the time those graphics were HAWT.
isn't it possible to want both? you're acting like both can't exist at the same time.
It is possible to have both. It is possible to have neither, and it is possible to have either. You can have a better game without better graphics, and you can have a 'prettier game' that is worse than what followed it.
The point is that graphics is probably pretty low on the consumer requirement scale. If they were then end all be all then Sony would have got it's ass kicked in the PS1 and PS2 eras (or Nintendo's Gameboy for that matter) as there were much more capable machines competing with it.
"Yes, most people who buy a new console want better graphics."
Let's get back to this original assumption. What if the Wii is your first console (as it is for many people)? Nintendo effectively set the bar for what to expect going forward. Now think of that both in terms of graphics and control. Once you grow accustomed to using the pointer it is difficult accept a different (arguably inferior) input method.
Ask Sony. The first week the PS3 sold out of stores, then were resold on ebay.
QFT. I'm in the same boat.
Not sure about the UK, but Zelda:LttP made the US virtual Console. Also the 'Zelda Collection' disk for the Gamecube had both NES games, and Both 64 titles. If you got the Zelda Collection and WindWaker (since it IS backwords compatible) that should keep you busy for quite a long time... :)
Try it sometime. It IS an eye opener. Gears of War looks better than anything out there right now running in 720p, and it's not like Gears becomes 'WiiSports' simple if you play it on a regular TV, but the gap seriously narrows.
If you put Gears of War in 480i (as in a standard Def TV) It doesn't look significantly better than RE-Make, or RE4 on the GameCube or Ninja Gaiden on the Original X-box. Yes, it looks hella pretty still, but it still isn't the 'Step up' you see in store displays (running in HD). I think that's what the parent post was getting at.
Agreed. There is a lot of truth in that. I expect Mario to hold his own against Halo (just as Zelda would) and I also expect MGS4 and FFXIII to not make it this year. I think a game out of left field (like Nintendogs was) has tremendous potential to capture the sales this holiday.
Don't think so. Why else would they release Metroid Prime 2 right next to Halo2 ? That move cost a lot of sales...
Smash Bros is a pretty major Halo competitor in my view.
Smash is great, and I think it should be out Q3 this year (prior to the Christmas period). If they want ANYTHING to go toe to toe with Halo 3 though, it should be Mario Galaxy. Or at the very least it can't be Metroid.
Within days? I've heard reports of minutes and hours, but I haven't come across a report of Wii's staying stocked on the shelf until even the next day... Do they last on the shelves longer by you?