Domain: breadandbutterscience.com
Stories and comments across the archive that link to breadandbutterscience.com.
Comments · 9
-
Re:Climate trolls consistently misleading
Record storms, droughts, floods, forest fires, and heat waves are costing hundreds of billions and tens of thousands of lives right now.
Record as to compared to what?
30 years?
60 years?
120 years?
1000 years?Here's a good read of _documented_ (i.e, written down, well sourced) weather from all over the world for the last 2000 years. It's quite eye opening.
-
"The xxxx in yyyy years"
Humans remember about thirty years back. Anything that's different today from thirty years ago we feel to be "unnatural". Most processes on earth work over much longer time scales than that - while still being completely natural.
The holocene, our current interglacial, is ~12000 years old. During that time the climate has both been a lot warmer (the Holocene optimum) as well as a lot colder (the Little Ice Age) than now. What we don't really know is how the climate has changed regionally during these thousands of years. We have some insight (the Sahara desert was a lush savannah around 8000 years ago) and there's a lot of research into how the rise and fall of civilizations might be correlated with natural regional climate changes much more than the popular image portrayed by, for example, Jared Diamond.
We do have written records from the last 2000 years (se the linked PDF). It's fascinating read into how heat waves, droughts, extremely cold winters and hot summers etc have affected our forefathers in a way I think we have problems grasping today. If anything, it seems the climate has been unnaturally stable over the last century - even including the famous dustbowl in the US.
-
Re:Nutz
Yes, the concept of "tipping points" validate the report I linked and refute the original post that all climate effects before have been slow and gradual.
It doesn't in itself mean that anyone is screwed though - it just means that humans throughout the Holocene have already lived through major changes due to such perturbations of the climate.
There's also plenty of written records of this - a collection can be found here: http://www.breadandbutterscien...
-
Re:Complete article
Extreme weather in documented history over the last 2000 years:
http://www.breadandbutterscien...
We're not even close to seeing larger deviations than before in recorded history.
-
Re:Why unlikely?
2000 years of global extreme climate events from historical records: http://www.breadandbutterscien...
773 A.D. In 773 A.D., a severe drought struck Shensi (now Shaanxi province) in central China at Sian.
In 773 A.D., there was a great drought in Shensi province in China.
774 A.D. In Scotland, there was a severe famine with a plague.
Winter of 774 / 775 A.D. In the year 675, there was the greatest frost in England.
[This entry was out of chronological order and I believe Short was referencing the year 775 A.D.]775 A.D. In England, there was a drought with excessive heat, after a great frost.
The winter was so hard that the Euxine Sea (Black Sea) was quite frozen over. The ice was 30 foot or
cubits thick. People could walk 50 or 100 leagues (150 to 300 miles, 240 to 480 kilometers) on the ice
from the Danube River to the Euphrates River. On the ice fell 30 cubits deep of snow. When the ice
broke, it appeared like great mountains on the sea, which demolished and carried down whole villages
standing on the shore. This winter was succeeded by so excessive heat during the summer that all springs
dried up.72 [The Danube River probably refers to the Danube Delta in Europe, eastern Romania and south
western Ukraine. The Euphrates River rises in Turkey, passes through Syria, and joins with the Tigris
River in southeastern Iraq to form the Shatt al Arab, which empties into the Persian Gulf.]In the year 775, “Snow fell, and lay 30 Cubits on a Level.”
[In Byzantium], the summer was hot and all the wells dried up.62 [Byzantium at this time included
Turkey, and the western part of the Balkan peninsula.]In 775 A.D. during the period 1-30 August, floods struck Chekiang (now Zhejiang province) on the east
coast of China at Hangchow. -
Re:Nope.
And in the real world, climate has ALWAYS changed. Much more rapidly than the change we've seen over the last 100 years as well.
The Old Egyptian Kingdom fell due to a cold spell that lasted a few decades: http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/ancient/egyptians/apocalypse_egypt_01.shtml
If they had had Internet back then, they would also be screaming alarmists statements and blaming the pyramids for redirecting the jet stream. Instead, they blamed the gods being angry with their way of living. Come to think of it, it's not that different from what some are doing now.
"Weird weather" (that is, fully normal) documented over 2000 years: http://www.breadandbutterscience.com/Weather.pdf
Oh, and to top it off. The Earth has been cooling since the beginning of the Holocene. As far into the present as we're able to measure:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Holocene_Temperature_Variations.png
http://www.nature.com/nclimate/journal/vaop/ncurrent/full/nclimate1589.html -
Re:could be eco terrorism
I've been alive since the Eisenhower administration and I've never seen
Extreme weather events over the last 2000 years. "Happy" reading:
"462 A.D. The Black Sea froze completely"
"An extreme weather event took place in 535-536. The effects were widespread. It caused unseasonable weather, crop failures and famines worldwide."
"680 A.D. In England, there was famine from a drought that lasted for three years."
"In 1063, the River Thames in England was frozen over for thirteen weeks. All the rivers of the continent were frozen, and even south of the Alps, the Po River in northern Italy and many other streams were blocked by ice."
"1113 A.D. In England, it was 'so hot that grain, and some forests of wood, took fire.'"
"In 1125, excessive constant daily rains the whole summer in England. Hence the most terrible famine through the whole nation on man and beast. "
-
Re: Hansen Must Go
Extreme weather events over the last 2000 years: http://www.breadandbutterscience.com/Weather.pdf
Warning - it's no fun reading.
-
Re:This is good
Extreme weather events over 2000 years:
http://www.breadandbutterscience.com/Weather.pdf
Can you pick out the ones caused by cooling and warming, and show how today is different?