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Well, when you're a small country (and your citizenry is relatively sane), it's a lot easier to force that kind of change. Then again, your dollar coin is called a "loonie", so don't get too smug.

Canada does not have "ridiculous" gun laws. I own six personally. To get a gun you have to go on course, nowadays they call is the "Firearms safety course" it teaches you basic gun safety for all long guns, at the end you write a test, you pass the test - you can buy guns with your new license. The license is renewable without further testing. You want handguns, you stay a little longer in the course for the "Prohibited" weapons part, you write a second test, now you can own handguns.

To go Hunting, you need to go on a hunting course, it's called "Hunter Safety" and among other things teaches you about different types of wildlife, how to tell them apart from other wildlife, how to protect yourself and how to avoid shooting other people. You pass the course, you get a license. Pretty simple.

Since we do not allow concealed weapons here in Canada, in order to use your handgun you have to have a range membership and transport is only allowed between your place of residence and the range. That isn't that bad. Up here we use long guns primarily for hunting, and there are no further travel restrictions on those except they have to have trigger locks and be out of sight at all times while travelling. It's not that big of a deal really.

What people get into a hff about is the new "Registration" for guns. It's a little stupid, you have to pay the gov't $25CDN to buy/register/transfer a gun to your name. They then send you a little paper with the serial number (if it's a serialed gun) and make/model/calibre. You haver to carry this paper at all times in case the feds (not the provincials) decide to stop you and question your ownership... Again, not that bad.

Now, if you have over 15 guns the RCMP (feds) can show up at your door at any time and ask to inspect the gun store and ammo store and make sure you are doing things correctly. Again, I own six, I do not find this fifteen limit "surprise raid" thing an issue.

I don't like the feds knowing about each gun I own, but it's not that big of a deal, I use them for hunting, not for causing some armed rebellion.

If anyone has issues about the information I provided, I can provide links if I have to. But anyone who lives in Canada and actually knows the law, and is affected by it knows what I wrote to be true.

Anything you need to know can be found here or here. As for freedom of religion, your issues about "Hate Crimes" are blown way out of proporation. The issue you are referring to is basic civil righs and equality for all. Gay bashing is not a sport, and the churches have this issue with it. I myself have no problems with gay marriage - Canada is founded on freedoms for all, not just freedoms for the church - if the church wants to do something, fine - don't let it infringe on another minority's rights. The issue is the heads of church basically defaming the gay population which is against the law and the rights of gays are held in the same light as say, the rights of jewish people, or arabs not to be defamed or whatever by any other group.

In Canada we protect the rights of everyone, even if some groups like it or not. Seriously, do you think being a Christian gives you the right to bash gays? If you do, you have some predjudices that need to be worked on buddy.

That is, at best, woefully delinquent reading of the links you cite.

For a truthful comparison of firearm killings between Canada and the US, look here. In particular, check out this summary:

Firearm homicide rates in the United States are 8.1 times higher than in Canada.


> I've done all the hard math...

Maybe, but Garbage In, Garbage Out.

"Based on the fact that concealed carry tends to drop crime rates"

Ahhh, I see. That explains why the rest of the world envies the low US crime rates.

It would be an absolute nightmare (even more than it already is) for the US to have pot illegal and for Canada to have it legal.

In the socio- and anthropological fields it is pretty much accepted that the United States is a Third World country that basically won the lottery. I won't provide statistics...

I will. For one statistic at least. Take a look at the figures in this 1995 Government of Canada Study on homicide and firearms homicide by nation.

We have Firearms Homicide rates / 100,000 pop of

Japan: 0.06
Britain: 0.14
United States: 6.4

A 107 time higher chance of dying to a gun is a good reason, if you're a Japanese citizen, to abstain from moving to the United States, I should think.

A firearm in the hands (or closet) of a lawful, responsible person is no threat to you, if you do not break into his home or otherwise attack him.

You make a number of assumptions that the weapons are properly stored, and that the owner is a mature, responsible, well-balanced person without any violent tendencies. Even then, guns can be stolen. The presence of guns in a house may pose a significant risk to the inhabitants of that household though. Most women who are murdered by their spouse are killed by guns. Another unfortunate side effect you ignore is the threat guns in the house pose to children. Some statistics from the American Acandemy of Pediatrics suggest that:

* In 1997 there were 32,436 firearm-related deaths, of which 4,223 of the victims were children and adolescents younger than 20 years of age.
* Handguns continue to account for the majority of deaths and injuries from firearms in the United States.
* In 1997, 85 percent of all homicides and 63 percent of all suicides for adolescents 15 through 19 years of age were committed with a firearm.
* The United States has the highest rates of firearm-related deaths (including homicide, suicide and unintentional deaths) among industrialized countries. The overall rate of firearm-related deaths for US children younger than 15 years of age is nearly 12 times greater than that found for 25 other industrialized countries, and the rate of firearm-related homicide is nearly 16 times higher than that in all the other countries combined.
* In 1994, the mean medical cost per gunshot injury was approximately $17,000, with the 134,445 gunshot injuries in the United States in 1994 producing $2.3 billion in lifetime medical costs, of which $1.1 billion (49 percent) was paid by US taxpayers.
* 1997, 306 children and adolescents younger than 20 years killed by firearms died as a result of unintentional firearm-related injuries.
* 10 children die each day from gunfire in America, approximately one every 2 1/2 hours. That is the equivalent of a classroom of children every two days.
* In 1998, nearly three times as many children under 10 died from gunfire as the number of law enforcement officers killed in the line of duty.

So, how about some facts to back up your rhetoric?

I don't know about stat's, but here is the law in canada:

a) You cannot, under any circumstances, own an automatic weapon, a handgun with smaller then 105mm barrel, or several other weapons (effectively only police/military can have automatic or "assault" weapons

b) In order to have any kind of handgun or "restricted weapon" ( (a) is not a restricted weapon, it's totally off limits), you have to heave a special license, AND special permission based on your need for such a weapon (eg, security guards, etc). In canada you do not have the right to carry a handgun or concealed weapon.

c) In order to own any non-restricted weapon (essentially a shotgun/rifle), you need a firearms license. I don't know the specifics, but it involves regirstration and a course.

For full info, see http://www.cfc-ccaf.gc.ca/en/owners_users/guide/de fault.asp

Personally i support gun control. If you live in the middle of nowhere, you have a legitimate reason to own A HUNTING RIFLE. Otherwise, what could you possibly need a gun for? IMHO, gun control isn't about taking away guns so much as making sure that the people who have them are responsible. The reason there are so few non-Palestinian-related (that's a whole nother issue) gun deaths in Israel is that everyone, and i mean EVERYONE there learns to safely use guns. They are a way of life.

Bloody hell! There aren't neighbourhoods in Australia that are really considered 'unsafe'... there are not nice ones, there are ones where crime is higher, but there's NOTHING like South Central LA or countless other extremely dangerous areas like in the US.

Why?

Because Australia has tough gun laws, therefore, while the bad areas are not nice, generally any type of violence that there may be is limited to beatings and knife attacks etc... which you're MUCH more likely to survive than a gun attack.

But... what about the OTHER statistic with damn guns? What about the ACCIDENTS?

Lets have a look at some statistics shall we. (All from here 1990-95 study)

Country | Accidents with Firearms per 100,000
Canada 63
Australia 18
New Zealand 4
USA 1,441!

Oooh, yeah, guns are good.

Or what about some actual crime figures, if the ridiculous number of firearm accidents doesn't matter?:
Country | Homicides per 100,000
Canada 2.2
Australia 1.8
New Zealand 2.6
USA 9.8!

That's over 400% more than Canada, and you share a border!

WHEN are people going to realise that having f&*king guns does not make you safer! It DOESN'T, look at the number of damn accidents! These are the kids who accidently kill a friend with dad's gun, the scared homeowner at night who shoots their kid coming in late because they thought they were a burgular... If they had no gun, THESE THINGS WOULDN'T HAPPEN.

And putting them on a plain... yeah top f&*king idea... just great, I really want this f*&king gun culture in an enclosed space where tensions tend to get high at the best of times... yes please.

First off, just because you can handle it doesn't mean anyone should. If this was so I'd be allowed to drive at 200 km/h since I've never hit another vehicle even though I've just been through the (statistically) most dangerous driving period of a person's life. Not to mention I passed a test far more difficult than my parents ever had to do.

Second, statistics show America is amazingly unsafe with firearms.

Here's an excerpt, focusing on my home country that does have strong firearm legislation vs. the USA, the only first world country I know of with such lax firearm control. Stats will be listed per 100,000 as Canada/America

Suicide rate with a firearm: 3.6/7.1
Suicide rate without a firearm: 12.9/12
Homicide rate with a firearm: 0.67/6.4
Homicide rate without a firearm: 2.2/9.3

Now, here's the kicker. While the stats clearly prove that Canadians are about 10x more likely to use a firearm improperly, and therefore we obviously don't have as good a gun use education system as yours, our country is still safer without weapons. Unless you are suicidal, Canada is the safest country on this side of this hemisphere for you to live in, and I account a lot of that to gun control.

On one last note, you will notice that the without guns stats are very similar for Canada and the US. This should tell one that without guns the offences commited with firearms would disappear, not change to another type of offence.

Hope this helps clear things up, and don't forget to leave your murder weapons behind before you visit this pristine country (and note that we were able to defend it from America despite our gun control legislation still being in effect at that time!).

Flamebait, huh? Yeah, right.
To the moderator who took me down a point (and who moderated up the idiot above me): get your facts straight.

From a Canadian Department of Justice-funded report on use of firearms in Canada and the US:

Another recent case, this time in Louisiana, also provides some insight into the manner in which armed self-defence is viewed in the United States. On October 17, 1992, Rodney Peairs fatally shot Yoshihiro Hattori, a Japanese high school exchange student who mistakenly approached Peairs' door while searching for a Halloween party (73 Texas Law Review 1041). Peairs' wife opened the door and, frightened by the approaching Japanese student, called out to her husband to get his gun. Rodney Peairs retrieved his .44 Magnum, pointed the gun at Hattori, and shouted, "Freeze" (36 William & Mary Law Review 1). Apparently, not understanding the order, Hattori continued toward the door and was fatally shot.

The case sparked an international furor when the jury acquitted Peairs of manslaughter, concluding that he "acted reasonably as a frightened homeowner" using "deadly force to protect himself from an intruder (36 Wm. & Mary L. Rev. 1). It is noteworthy, however, that a Louisiana civil court subsequently awarded Hattori's parents a sizable cash award for damages, ruling that the shooting was not justified (95 0144 (La.App. 1 Cir. 10/6/95), 662 So.2d 509).

Quite frankly, the moderation on this thread disgusts me. I thought people here were a little more reasonable and able to think for themselves, but it'd seem we have the same proportion of raving gun nuts as any other section of the US population.

I wrote a very long post and then deleted the lot because it just doesn't matter. *I* won't convince anyone. I just think that having anyone around me having a gun is a tremendously bad idea. I have a deep suspicion of the type of person who carrys a penknife around let alone some sort of border line freak with a firearm.

What ever else you cannot deny that your average american gunowner has a tendancy towards trigger happiness.

C