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Wow, a lot of people not reading the title to this thread, I can see.

This is a configuration for a $450 Dell machine. Perhaps a $1000 machine would have far better components, but who cares? At that point building it yourself really outpaces anything Dell can do.

>I've got a Dell laptop (Inspiron 2100, 3.4lb, 1", the small one). I've had to send it in for repair 4 times, all of which were my fault (I dropped it).

Dell doesn't sell new laptops for anywhere withing even 2x the $450 price tag on this thread.

>those Tulip based cards having nothing on it.

Those Tulip cards that you think are so cheap can do direct card-to-card switching. Can 3com cards do that? Linux says no... Maybe in windows, but I doubt windows would even support a feature like that.

>This guy doesn't sound like he's in the market for a 15" monitor.

Then he isn't in the sub $500 dollar market at all.

>And, by the way, which $70 Microsoft OS are you putting on this computer?

The OEM one like Dell uses that only costs $50.

>Your prices are totally unrealistic for a single build

I can point you out to a motherboard, right now, that costs $79. It include a 666 Mhz CPU, 8 MB video, Sound, NIC, and 4 usb ports. This is retail. A PC-Chips M787 would be it (and, before you laugh, PC-Chips is one of the number one suppliers for Brand Name computer shops).

Why do people think that you can't buy a monitor for $100, or a video card for $30. Have nVidia and Sony brainwashed you all or something? I just got a cheapo 4 MB AGP video card for $10 a couple of months ago, and passed up a $75 deal on a 20" (used) monitor at the same time because the price was too high. No, these aren't dealer prices, anyone off the street could walk in and buy at these prices, single quantity.

>I'm sure you'll have some smartass reply to this.

Yup, its this:

Cheap, low-cost computer parts like low-end audio, video, and network cards and clearance / small monitors are commodities now, selling for nearly no profit at all.

And, if you don't believe me, I have access to video cards, a business license, I'm _very_ willing to sell them for $30 each, single quantity, retail sale, and I wish you'd said that $100 monitors don't exist earlier -- I just dumped a bunch I wasn't happy with last week.

>You can't buy an entire computer, with monitor and OS for that price.

You sure can buy an entire computer with monitor and OS and many other peripherals for less. I'll stick to the same online company to show it can be done without effort.

Allow me to demonstrate:

- Motherboard with CPU, sound, video, network, USB: $79 (mentioned above by me cause I was too lazy to log in and I tire of seeming like a PCChips pusher)
- 17" Monitor: $125.
- Mouse and Keyboard: $15 (not worth linking -- they're usually cheaper).
- Windows: $86.
- Memory: $42
256 MB.
- Case /w PS: $24.

Total: $356

Let's make it better than the sun box though:

- Hard Drive: $65.
- Floppy Drive: $9.
- CD Burner: $67.

Total: $512 and this does far more than the Sunray.

Savings: Up to $144. More if you don't want to use Windows. Another $124 if I'm right and the $500 sunray doesn't include a display.

And I know you can get that price much, much, much lower if you were to deal with distributors (and if you're talking 50 or more units, you most likely would have to).

>There are no costs involved in administrating a stand alone cpu, and you never have to upgrade.

More video performance is always needed with age, vendors obsolete proprietary old hardware by not providing necessary software upgrades, network standards change, people spill coffee into them, people stuff postit notes in silly places, people destroy the buttons, they stack telephone books on them, stack books to block the fan, stop the fan with pens when its too noisy, open them to "fix" them -- there's way more, but I'm not interested in reliving the pain. :-)

BTW: Speaking as someone who has worked as computer support staff for a college with over 1000 terminals, I can tell you that software is one of the least worries. Computers, even though most parts don't move, do "wear out" -- parts either fail or stupid people beat the crap out of the computers.

>You can't buy an entire computer, with monitor and OS for that price.

You sure can buy an entire computer with monitor and OS and many other peripherals for less. I'll stick to the same online company to show it can be done without effort.

Allow me to demonstrate:

- Motherboard with CPU, sound, video, network, USB: $79 (mentioned above by me cause I was too lazy to log in and I tire of seeming like a PCChips pusher)
- 17" Monitor: $125.
- Mouse and Keyboard: $15 (not worth linking -- they're usually cheaper).
- Windows: $86.
- Memory: $42
256 MB.
- Case /w PS: $24.

Total: $356

Let's make it better than the sun box though:

- Hard Drive: $65.
- Floppy Drive: $9.
- CD Burner: $67.

Total: $512 and this does far more than the Sunray.

Savings: Up to $144. More if you don't want to use Windows. Another $124 if I'm right and the $500 sunray doesn't include a display.

And I know you can get that price much, much, much lower if you were to deal with distributors (and if you're talking 50 or more units, you most likely would have to).

>There are no costs involved in administrating a stand alone cpu, and you never have to upgrade.

More video performance is always needed with age, vendors obsolete proprietary old hardware by not providing necessary software upgrades, network standards change, people spill coffee into them, people stuff postit notes in silly places, people destroy the buttons, they stack telephone books on them, stack books to block the fan, stop the fan with pens when its too noisy, open them to "fix" them -- there's way more, but I'm not interested in reliving the pain. :-)

BTW: Speaking as someone who has worked as computer support staff for a college with over 1000 terminals, I can tell you that software is one of the least worries. Computers, even though most parts don't move, do "wear out" -- parts either fail or stupid people beat the crap out of the computers.

>You can't buy an entire computer, with monitor and OS for that price.

You sure can buy an entire computer with monitor and OS and many other peripherals for less. I'll stick to the same online company to show it can be done without effort.

Allow me to demonstrate:

- Motherboard with CPU, sound, video, network, USB: $79 (mentioned above by me cause I was too lazy to log in and I tire of seeming like a PCChips pusher)
- 17" Monitor: $125.
- Mouse and Keyboard: $15 (not worth linking -- they're usually cheaper).
- Windows: $86.
- Memory: $42
256 MB.
- Case /w PS: $24.

Total: $356

Let's make it better than the sun box though:

- Hard Drive: $65.
- Floppy Drive: $9.
- CD Burner: $67.

Total: $512 and this does far more than the Sunray.

Savings: Up to $144. More if you don't want to use Windows. Another $124 if I'm right and the $500 sunray doesn't include a display.

And I know you can get that price much, much, much lower if you were to deal with distributors (and if you're talking 50 or more units, you most likely would have to).

>There are no costs involved in administrating a stand alone cpu, and you never have to upgrade.

More video performance is always needed with age, vendors obsolete proprietary old hardware by not providing necessary software upgrades, network standards change, people spill coffee into them, people stuff postit notes in silly places, people destroy the buttons, they stack telephone books on them, stack books to block the fan, stop the fan with pens when its too noisy, open them to "fix" them -- there's way more, but I'm not interested in reliving the pain. :-)

BTW: Speaking as someone who has worked as computer support staff for a college with over 1000 terminals, I can tell you that software is one of the least worries. Computers, even though most parts don't move, do "wear out" -- parts either fail or stupid people beat the crap out of the computers.

>You can't buy an entire computer, with monitor and OS for that price.

You sure can buy an entire computer with monitor and OS and many other peripherals for less. I'll stick to the same online company to show it can be done without effort.

Allow me to demonstrate:

- Motherboard with CPU, sound, video, network, USB: $79 (mentioned above by me cause I was too lazy to log in and I tire of seeming like a PCChips pusher)
- 17" Monitor: $125.
- Mouse and Keyboard: $15 (not worth linking -- they're usually cheaper).
- Windows: $86.
- Memory: $42
256 MB.
- Case /w PS: $24.

Total: $356

Let's make it better than the sun box though:

- Hard Drive: $65.
- Floppy Drive: $9.
- CD Burner: $67.

Total: $512 and this does far more than the Sunray.

Savings: Up to $144. More if you don't want to use Windows. Another $124 if I'm right and the $500 sunray doesn't include a display.

And I know you can get that price much, much, much lower if you were to deal with distributors (and if you're talking 50 or more units, you most likely would have to).

>There are no costs involved in administrating a stand alone cpu, and you never have to upgrade.

More video performance is always needed with age, vendors obsolete proprietary old hardware by not providing necessary software upgrades, network standards change, people spill coffee into them, people stuff postit notes in silly places, people destroy the buttons, they stack telephone books on them, stack books to block the fan, stop the fan with pens when its too noisy, open them to "fix" them -- there's way more, but I'm not interested in reliving the pain. :-)

BTW: Speaking as someone who has worked as computer support staff for a college with over 1000 terminals, I can tell you that software is one of the least worries. Computers, even though most parts don't move, do "wear out" -- parts either fail or stupid people beat the crap out of the computers.

>You can't buy an entire computer, with monitor and OS for that price.

You sure can buy an entire computer with monitor and OS and many other peripherals for less. I'll stick to the same online company to show it can be done without effort.

Allow me to demonstrate:

- Motherboard with CPU, sound, video, network, USB: $79 (mentioned above by me cause I was too lazy to log in and I tire of seeming like a PCChips pusher)
- 17" Monitor: $125.
- Mouse and Keyboard: $15 (not worth linking -- they're usually cheaper).
- Windows: $86.
- Memory: $42
256 MB.
- Case /w PS: $24.

Total: $356

Let's make it better than the sun box though:

- Hard Drive: $65.
- Floppy Drive: $9.
- CD Burner: $67.

Total: $512 and this does far more than the Sunray.

Savings: Up to $144. More if you don't want to use Windows. Another $124 if I'm right and the $500 sunray doesn't include a display.

And I know you can get that price much, much, much lower if you were to deal with distributors (and if you're talking 50 or more units, you most likely would have to).

>There are no costs involved in administrating a stand alone cpu, and you never have to upgrade.

More video performance is always needed with age, vendors obsolete proprietary old hardware by not providing necessary software upgrades, network standards change, people spill coffee into them, people stuff postit notes in silly places, people destroy the buttons, they stack telephone books on them, stack books to block the fan, stop the fan with pens when its too noisy, open them to "fix" them -- there's way more, but I'm not interested in reliving the pain. :-)

BTW: Speaking as someone who has worked as computer support staff for a college with over 1000 terminals, I can tell you that software is one of the least worries. Computers, even though most parts don't move, do "wear out" -- parts either fail or stupid people beat the crap out of the computers.

>You can't buy an entire computer, with monitor and OS for that price.

You sure can buy an entire computer with monitor and OS and many other peripherals for less. I'll stick to the same online company to show it can be done without effort.

Allow me to demonstrate:

- Motherboard with CPU, sound, video, network, USB: $79 (mentioned above by me cause I was too lazy to log in and I tire of seeming like a PCChips pusher)
- 17" Monitor: $125.
- Mouse and Keyboard: $15 (not worth linking -- they're usually cheaper).
- Windows: $86.
- Memory: $42
256 MB.
- Case /w PS: $24.

Total: $356

Let's make it better than the sun box though:

- Hard Drive: $65.
- Floppy Drive: $9.
- CD Burner: $67.

Total: $512 and this does far more than the Sunray.

Savings: Up to $144. More if you don't want to use Windows. Another $124 if I'm right and the $500 sunray doesn't include a display.

And I know you can get that price much, much, much lower if you were to deal with distributors (and if you're talking 50 or more units, you most likely would have to).

>There are no costs involved in administrating a stand alone cpu, and you never have to upgrade.

More video performance is always needed with age, vendors obsolete proprietary old hardware by not providing necessary software upgrades, network standards change, people spill coffee into them, people stuff postit notes in silly places, people destroy the buttons, they stack telephone books on them, stack books to block the fan, stop the fan with pens when its too noisy, open them to "fix" them -- there's way more, but I'm not interested in reliving the pain. :-)

BTW: Speaking as someone who has worked as computer support staff for a college with over 1000 terminals, I can tell you that software is one of the least worries. Computers, even though most parts don't move, do "wear out" -- parts either fail or stupid people beat the crap out of the computers.

>You can't buy an entire computer, with monitor and OS for that price.

You sure can buy an entire computer with monitor and OS and many other peripherals for less. I'll stick to the same online company to show it can be done without effort.

Allow me to demonstrate:

- Motherboard with CPU, sound, video, network, USB: $79 (mentioned above by me cause I was too lazy to log in and I tire of seeming like a PCChips pusher)
- 17" Monitor: $125.
- Mouse and Keyboard: $15 (not worth linking -- they're usually cheaper).
- Windows: $86.
- Memory: $42
256 MB.
- Case /w PS: $24.

Total: $356

Let's make it better than the sun box though:

- Hard Drive: $65.
- Floppy Drive: $9.
- CD Burner: $67.

Total: $512 and this does far more than the Sunray.

Savings: Up to $144. More if you don't want to use Windows. Another $124 if I'm right and the $500 sunray doesn't include a display.

And I know you can get that price much, much, much lower if you were to deal with distributors (and if you're talking 50 or more units, you most likely would have to).

>There are no costs involved in administrating a stand alone cpu, and you never have to upgrade.

More video performance is always needed with age, vendors obsolete proprietary old hardware by not providing necessary software upgrades, network standards change, people spill coffee into them, people stuff postit notes in silly places, people destroy the buttons, they stack telephone books on them, stack books to block the fan, stop the fan with pens when its too noisy, open them to "fix" them -- there's way more, but I'm not interested in reliving the pain. :-)

BTW: Speaking as someone who has worked as computer support staff for a college with over 1000 terminals, I can tell you that software is one of the least worries. Computers, even though most parts don't move, do "wear out" -- parts either fail or stupid people beat the crap out of the computers.

>You can't buy an entire computer, with monitor and OS for that price.

You sure can buy an entire computer with monitor and OS and many other peripherals for less. I'll stick to the same online company to show it can be done without effort.

Allow me to demonstrate:

- Motherboard with CPU, sound, video, network, USB: $79 (mentioned above by me cause I was too lazy to log in and I tire of seeming like a PCChips pusher)
- 17" Monitor: $125.
- Mouse and Keyboard: $15 (not worth linking -- they're usually cheaper).
- Windows: $86.
- Memory: $42
256 MB.
- Case /w PS: $24.

Total: $356

Let's make it better than the sun box though:

- Hard Drive: $65.
- Floppy Drive: $9.
- CD Burner: $67.

Total: $512 and this does far more than the Sunray.

Savings: Up to $144. More if you don't want to use Windows. Another $124 if I'm right and the $500 sunray doesn't include a display.

And I know you can get that price much, much, much lower if you were to deal with distributors (and if you're talking 50 or more units, you most likely would have to).

>There are no costs involved in administrating a stand alone cpu, and you never have to upgrade.

More video performance is always needed with age, vendors obsolete proprietary old hardware by not providing necessary software upgrades, network standards change, people spill coffee into them, people stuff postit notes in silly places, people destroy the buttons, they stack telephone books on them, stack books to block the fan, stop the fan with pens when its too noisy, open them to "fix" them -- there's way more, but I'm not interested in reliving the pain. :-)

BTW: Speaking as someone who has worked as computer support staff for a college with over 1000 terminals, I can tell you that software is one of the least worries. Computers, even though most parts don't move, do "wear out" -- parts either fail or stupid people beat the crap out of the computers.

The M787 PCChips motherboard is quite comparable to that $500 slab.

Size: Similar if one were to use a tiny micro-ATX case.
USB Ports: Sunray 4, M787 4 (requires a case with 2 built in, not hard to find).
10/100 bootable ethernet: Included on both.
Input: Similar, however M787 requires an external smartcard reader ($50 investment).
Video Input: Sunray - Yes. M787 - No.
Video Out: Identical.
Onboard Sound: Both have it.
Weight: Could be similar. Depends on selection of case/PS.
Sound Level: Sunray is possibly quieter -- by how much I am not sure (very little if anything).

So, lets add up the figures:

Sunray: $525.
M787 Solution: $75 + $30 (case) + $50 (smartcard reader) + $30 (memory) = $185.

The only difference is the M787 doesn't come with the specialized software to allow "roaming" and has no video input (why does a cubicle worker need that?).

Basically, you're paying $340 for the software on the Sunray (I assume its included).

Sorry to say it, but you'd save money by giving everyone their own separate windows/linux machine on their desk and setting up the traditional file server to share stuff on.

That is, unless you plan to have more than half the staff without computers anyways.