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Of Course, being the fringe, they have alot of other weird things as well.

The way I look at it, when you turn up the sensitivity on the radar, you tend to get more noise along with extra advanced warning.

It comes with the territory.

These typically come from the fringe groups, and so most folks tend to dismiss them out of hand. Examples of this include the Mars Photos, where many have seen examples of people playing fast and loose loose with the results. The primary allegation is that JPL is heavy into the robot missions, and so is heavily biased against actually finding life someplace else, because that would pull funding from JPL into other NON-JPL projects.

Certainly, there are probably different political power centers inside NASA and JPL, etc. I can also see that some folks would have a vigorous reaction against releasing anything that could give the fringe groups more ammunition.

I am personally dismayed by fringe group presentations on TV where the first half almost seems like reasonable possibility, and the second half is someone doing a biblical interprataion of the material. Talk about a taking a large grain salt! And yet, I suppose that somebody sees these shows and takes them seriously. I am reminded that a large chunk of the population is "below average" intelligence, although alot of this depends on educations as well.

All in All, I suspect that with all of the changes at JPL, there has been infighting over the agenda, pig headedness, and simple sillyness that merely gives ammunition to their critics.

Check out the Vinny the Vampire comic strip

The main crackpot behind the Face is Richard C. Hoagland. Rather than see the foundation of his other crackpot ideas torpedoed, he's embraced the new photos as evidence of a conspiracy in NASA, and proof that the face is actually a human-feline hybrid. It's amazing what these charlatans will do to salvage their flimsy positions.

If you're into this stuff, you may want to check out The Enterprise Mission. There's all kinds of fun stuff like this over there--in fact, they have a few articles devoted to the 'glass tubes', faces, and other 'anomolous structures'. Have fun.

--

http://www.enterprisemission.com/empire.htm

There does seem to be some weird politics behind the scene, above and beyond the actual science.

Check out the Vinny the Vampire comic strip

This has been taken to heart by a well known site, famous in fringe circles as one of the more serious sites in the fringe science area:

Clarke Item One: http://www.enterprisemission.com/images/arthur.jpg

Clarke Item Two: http://www.enterprisemission.com/sir.htm

An Explanation?: http://www.enterprisemission.com/can.htm

Take with the usual pinch of salt.

Although I can see the possibility for weird politics inside nasa.

Check out the Vinny the Vampire comic strip

This has been taken to heart by a well known site, famous in fringe circles as one of the more serious sites in the fringe science area:

Clarke Item One: http://www.enterprisemission.com/images/arthur.jpg

Clarke Item Two: http://www.enterprisemission.com/sir.htm

An Explanation?: http://www.enterprisemission.com/can.htm

Take with the usual pinch of salt.

Although I can see the possibility for weird politics inside nasa.

Check out the Vinny the Vampire comic strip

This has been taken to heart by a well known site, famous in fringe circles as one of the more serious sites in the fringe science area:

Clarke Item One: http://www.enterprisemission.com/images/arthur.jpg

Clarke Item Two: http://www.enterprisemission.com/sir.htm

An Explanation?: http://www.enterprisemission.com/can.htm

Take with the usual pinch of salt.

Although I can see the possibility for weird politics inside nasa.

Check out the Vinny the Vampire comic strip

To listeners of the Art Bell show and to readers of Aliens, Aliens, Aliens, reports of artificial constructs on Mars is old hat. Richard Hoagland has been arguing the case for Mars for years. What's sort of interesting are remarks made by Arthur C. Clarke about those "crystal tubes". Add that to former government workers coming forward en masse claiming that the US government has a lot more information on extraterrial life that old videos of "Close Encounters", things are getting pretty interesting for UFOlogists.

To listeners of the Art Bell show and to readers of Aliens, Aliens, Aliens, reports of artificial constructs on Mars is old hat. Richard Hoagland has been arguing the case for Mars for years. What's sort of interesting are remarks made by Arthur C. Clarke about those "crystal tubes". Add that to former government workers coming forward en masse claiming that the US government has a lot more information on extraterrial life that old videos of "Close Encounters", things are getting pretty interesting for UFOlogists.

Is Richard Hoagland's http://www.enterprisemission.com. One page with a few pictures of these Mars structures is http://www.enterprisemission.com/sequel.htm and others are at Glass Tubes, and Cydonia Triangle. Another site with tons of Mars surface feature images is http://barsoom.msss.com/moc_gallery/index.html.

Is Richard Hoagland's http://www.enterprisemission.com. One page with a few pictures of these Mars structures is http://www.enterprisemission.com/sequel.htm and others are at Glass Tubes, and Cydonia Triangle. Another site with tons of Mars surface feature images is http://barsoom.msss.com/moc_gallery/index.html.

Is Richard Hoagland's http://www.enterprisemission.com. One page with a few pictures of these Mars structures is http://www.enterprisemission.com/sequel.htm and others are at Glass Tubes, and Cydonia Triangle. Another site with tons of Mars surface feature images is http://barsoom.msss.com/moc_gallery/index.html.

Is Richard Hoagland's http://www.enterprisemission.com. One page with a few pictures of these Mars structures is http://www.enterprisemission.com/sequel.htm and others are at Glass Tubes, and Cydonia Triangle. Another site with tons of Mars surface feature images is http://barsoom.msss.com/moc_gallery/index.html.

An aquaintence of mine wrote a small program that will search the entire text of the bible and will find any phrase you give it hidden as 'bible code', similar to to the book of the same name which pruports to find all kinds of hidden messages. My aquaintence wrote it as a method of debunking such claims.

The problem with debunking absolutely everything is that there are probably some very genuine mathematical puzzles out there left to us by older civilizations, that may well be 'pooh poohed' and grouped with the rest of the nonsense, and we will have missed learning some interesting information about that civilization or religious context.

Precious truth may have been dilluted with an ocean of gibberish. Finding those gems and getting people to believe you is not going to be easy.
Mike Massee

If NASA was really looking for life or past life on Mars, they would have better and more pictures of the Cydonia region. The shots taken of the face are often at low resolution and bad angles. The rest of the region needs more photographing. It isn't like the rest of Mars is more interesting.

This official web page shows the left side of the face with an eye in the socket:

This unofficial web page shows a study of the latest picture:

Trying to say that past civilizations in the solar system have to be bunk and need not be studied misses the point of exploration in the first place.

- James - [IMAGE]

Ah, kind of like what the Face On Mars Loonies do...

A little seen nugget at The Enterprise Mission begins "Occasionally, something comes across our desks that is so obvious, so undeniable, so conspiratorial, that we just can't help but rub our critics noses in it."

This article links the current NEAR mssion to a View-Master reel from the 1950's. In a nutshell (it goes way deeper) there is a building on Eros, known about for decades, and they are going to check it out!

NEAR has taken a pic of the building already (spot it here) and if you compare it to the reel, you'll be spouting "Yikes" all day.


-Robert Bast
Survive2012

There's good evidence for this according to Richard Hoagland ... Enterprise Mission.

Let's see, for some reason we've lost more than 75% of missions to that planet, rather high failure rate when we've got other hardware functioning beyond pluto already. Two USSR probes lost in one mission with some weird images being sent in the final minutes of the second probes loss as well.

Hoagland thinks the excuses are rather thin at best, also look for his take on Hubble's first 3 years of "blindness" :)

This of course assumes that we've hit the peak of propulsion technology and that no new science or possible loopholes in the universe exist that may indeed make interstellar travel much more feasible within a carbon-based lifeforms lifetime.

We're not exactly all that bright a race yet remember, we still enjoy killing and maiming each other, we've only had high-tech such as electricity (on a wide scale basis) for a couple hundred years at best. We have so much more to learn I'd think.

I do agree though that the possibility off ancient civilizations being much more advanced than we currently think they were is probably part of the answer.

However these ancients are much harder to find than traces of current civilization would be, there are many things around today that would survive nicely in the proper packaging and I'm sure some folks have buried such things already.

And don't forget about the space junk we've sent up, much of it will be in orbit for a long time before coming back to earth, I think the Keo(?) satellite is supposed to spend 50,000 years in orbit before plummeting back to the ground, and it's unpowered and in a lower orbit than our communications satellites parked in geo-stationary orbit 27,000 miles away.

There definitely is a bunch of stuff just in our solar system that seems out of the ordinary, a lot of the stuff seems to be some sort of message or riddle left for future civilizations to discover and interpret.

Of course there are many skeptics who just can't believe any of these anomalous objects throughout our system are real, attempts to get the powers at NASA to release untampered with pictures and other info is sometimes met with resistance or they play dumb and say a malfunction occurred with equipment. Funny how that equipment malfunctions at some weird times too.

Do some research into this stuff, look at it from all sides. A good starting point is Enterprise Mission which is the main site for Hoagland's research.

Hoagland has been right about many things in the past and he approaches the subject scientifically and is only asking the questions that need definitive answers, maybe there's nothing to the face on Mars, but the new info from NASA didn't prove it one way or the other since the new pics from MGS were put through filters before being released, why?

Personally I am somewhere in the middle, I think it is very possible that either another advanced civilization existed in our solar system at some point or an alien race or two have been able to travel through the great expanse of space. Or the anomolies may indeed be natural formations with no secrets laying beneath. I don't try and supply answers, I just know there are questions that need answered.

We're talking about a solar system that's 5 BILLION years old here, the possiblities of life on not only this planet but other bodies in the system during that time are pretty good if as current theories are starting to prove life is the norm rather than the exception where conditions exist to support it.

One more thing, over 75% of our missions to Mars have ended in failure, anyone else find this rather high? Considering that we've sent probes well outside our solar system now that have continued to operate well beyond their expected lifetimes, and we have such a dismal failure rate reaching Mars for some reason. Many of the failures have peculiar circumstances surrounding them as well.

Whut?

[snip]...a real aversion to intelligent discussion of issues.

Now hold on just one second! Personally, I have found many a good conversation going on here at /.
Why, just the other day I had sat down at my Beowulf cluster with a nice toasty pants full of hot grits to discuss relativity with Natalie Portman.
Granted, it can be difficult to hold a conversation with a waif he is not only emaciated and vapid, but petrified, but I tell you, we were solving the mysteries of the UNIVERSE, I say!

/me sits back to watch all my karma fly away...

A crystal city on the back of the moon! Mars Fungus! Frozen Pipes!

Why do these people get all the good drugs?

Carl Sagan and a bunch of others had the idea before you and it's been done: Pioneer 10

Hoagland already mentions this in his physics i think.. Try www.enterprisemission.com

I say we blame Canada!

hmmm... Though, it could be aliens behind it. They're always up to no good. Green little buggers.

Yeah...that probably IS the reason NASA doesn't want to crash Galileo on Europa...they fear retribution! I did a research paper on Europa not too long ago and I have some links about Europa if anyone is interested.

here
here
here
here
here
here
here
here
here
here
here
here
here
here
here
here
here
here
here
here
and here!
sorry if this drags on...some links may not be that great.

cool! the freeze happens the same day as the beginning of the end! wee!