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Let me know when you find the median price of a new car. I half-heartedly searched a couple times a few months back and got nothing. I looked again, just now, and found a chart of used car median prices by city from 2012 and something from the Boston Herald that is probably wrong, since it quotes the same number USA Today says is the average.

In a group of 4 cars, a single $90k luxury model can bring the average up to $33k when the three others cost $15k. That's why nobody cites the average home price, but somehow the median car price is impossible to find. You'll notice, if you go searching, that there are a bunch of articles bemoaning how the "median" American can't afford an "average" priced car, but that's a ridiculous comparison. If a person had the "average" wealth of all Americans, s/he would easily be in the top decile, and probably higher.

You should ask this guy a question:

http://grassrootsmotorsports.com/members/Nashco/

He built a Fiero hybrid using a Prius battery pack and an electric S10 motor. He probably has a build log he could link you to.

"On the other hand, it also weighs twice as much as the MG and handles like it, so good luck avoiding an accident that he could."

The Corolla probably handles better. See this article about an autocross race between an 2003 Honda Odyssey, a 60's Porsche 356 and a 60's Jag XKE.

http://grassrootsmotorsports.com/articles/soccer-moms-revenge/

ft

Hell, a stock Honda Odyssey can post comparable times to a Porsche 356 on the track:

http://grassrootsmotorsports.com/articles/soccer-moms-revenge/

Is there really any reason why a family car needs that kind of power?

Sure. Anybody that pretends a '60s British roadster can hold a candle in maneuverability, acceleration, or top speed against a modern-day fuel injected Honda Accord (!) is deluding themselves. No, seriously. Heck, if you really want to blow your mind, consider the fact that a Honda Odyssey - yes, a minivan! - handles objectively "sportier" (i.e. has more grip, more acceleration, more top speed, etc.) than roadsters from the era of vinyl. Of course, it's not as much "fun" to drive a dependable minivan as it is to drive a two-seater with tiny tires and an engine that overheats after ten minutes, but, then again, it's not as much "fun" to listen to digitally reproduced music compared to the nostalgic experience of picking up a piece of vinyl and gently placing it on a record player. Does that help?

I was with you until you said drive in reference to a 60's British sports car. Anyone who has ever been serious about them nows that they are designed not to be driven but to be worked on. The preferred setup is just that - setup on blocks in the back yard with the engine in pieces on the kitchen table. Like minded folks gather around to argue the merits of various mods that will never actually see the road while they drink warm beer in honor of Lucas; who apparently made British refrigerators as well as car electronics. You might take a minute from arguing about how to best tune a 4 carb setup to collectively sneer at those obviously less informed people who drove 1600's and 2002's or 3.0CSi's and clearly didn't know what the real driving experience was - chasing an unfixable electric short until the girlfriend who thought your Spitfire/TR4/Bugeye etc. was cute and fun while you were dating but replaced it with "gasp" "a real car that is reliable" once you were married.

Come to think of it, it really isn't that different from high end audio - except that it is a stereo setup that constantly needs a newer, better cable/tweeter/tube amp and you're rearranging everything for better sound while you argue the merits of unobtainium vs expensium wiring with your audiophile friends. Listening to music is secondary. Except, of course, you're a high end geek so you don't have a girlfriend to ever make you get rid of "all that junk" and buy a nice stereo at Best Buy. Of course, the true audiophile doesn't sneer at the guy who drops 30K in Best Buy to have them setup a home stereo system because you'd never set foot in Best Buy; and if you did you'd be too busy staring at the women with him to notice what he is buying anyway.

I hope this helps as well...

Sure. Anybody that pretends a '60s British roadster can hold a candle in maneuverability, acceleration, or top speed against a modern-day fuel injected Honda Accord (!) is deluding themselves.

No, seriously. Heck, if you really want to blow your mind, consider the fact that a Honda Odyssey - yes, a minivan! - handles objectively "sportier" (i.e. has more grip, more acceleration, more top speed, etc.) than roadsters from the era of vinyl. Of course, it's not as much "fun" to drive a dependable minivan as it is to drive a two-seater with tiny tires and an engine that overheats after ten minutes, but, then again, it's not as much "fun" to listen to digitally reproduced music compared to the nostalgic experience of picking up a piece of vinyl and gently placing it on a record player.

Does that help?

Wow, finally someone who feels the same way about EFI as I do! EFI is a double-or-nothing bet to me...if it works, it works great (although factory ECUs only offer slightly better performance than a carb) but when it dies you're up shit's creek without a paddle ("paddle" meaning "diags tools and ideally an entire set of spares"). You can build a cheap diags system with an old PDA or laptop running OBDII interface software and a custom cable, but the need for a diags system is still an inconvenience.

I'm going to switch my track car to EFI (eventually with a MegaSquirt or similar system), but I'm going to keep my little 4x4 on a carb. Fixing some things on a carb can be a bitch but at least roadside fixes are pretty much always possible and you can usually sputter the car around in a worse case scenario.

I don't know what I'd do without old cars...these bloated overweight nanny cars are so horrible in every way, it's frightening.

I don't know if you've seen this site but I bet you'd like it:

http://grassrootsmotorsports.com/

If you hit members or community and click on my name you can see my cars.

There is no scientific evidence whatsoever for creationism. None, zip, zilch, nada. Supernatural silliness at it's best. I undid my moderation in this discussion to post that.

Want to see some raw uncut creationism? Check this thread out:

http://grassrootsmotorsports.com/board/viewtopic.php?id=30455&p=1

I admit I was fairly pissed when I started it, and became extremely pissed and mentally exhausted as the thread progressed. After that, I realized that many people just don't understand the basic concepts of science, and never will, and there is no hope for them.

I'm a bit late into the car game, I started a couple years ago getting a Dodge Neon to auto-x. I did oil changes and all that stuff, then I got a cold air intake and new exaust... Next thing I know I'm totally replace ing the suspension, swaybars, spring, shocks. I just sold it now a couple guys at work are doing the Grass roots Motor sports $2004 challenge

We are putting a chevy V8 into an 86 RX-7. The thing is sitting in my garrage currently getting taken apart when we get time. But I work for a small programming company, in which most of us are car guys also so it seems to go hand in hand... Up here in ME anyway...

-G

But the modern enthusiast is at best a spectator, while the car buffs of the pas actually got their hands dirty.

Go to your local autocross, for example, and see what the drivers in Prepared and Modified classes have done to their cars. Or go to your newsstand and pick up a copy of Grassroots Motorsports. In the magazine's $2003 challenge, competitors operating on a $2003 budget dropped a V8 into a Miata, with beautiful attention to detail. Another team put a Taurus SHO engine in an econobox... behind the driver.

Rest assured, there are still folks getting their hands dirty.

This reminded me a similar challenge (without the combat and mayhem of course:) The GRM $2002 motorsports challenge

Rules are you buy, build and race a car for under $2002.00. The Challenge consists of a drag race, autocross and a concours competition.