Slashdot Mirror

The team I used to work for 3 years ago wanted a web gui layer framework similar to this back then.. and i remember Echo 1.x was one of the first ones we prototyped. Then there also was millstone http://www.millstone.org/ And i think echo was also featured on slashdot http://developers.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=03/0 9/09/2337216
Echo 2.x seems to have now added support for ajax.. a demo is available here: http://demo.nextapp.com/Demo/app ..and it runs smoother than the ajax controls found on flickr atleast. In the end it seemed that the world wasnt ready for this... and higher management didnt like the risk associated with trying something completely new.

Java given you a lot more freedoms than closed MS environment, so stick to it if possible.

In Java space there are many frameworks to choose from. One should at least look into Millstone, Echo and Tapestry as well as JSF. My personal favourite is Millstone as it provides a really clean and efficient development model. I takes some time to get into it, but it really pays back to do so in large projects.

Echo has a wonderful model of writing web user interfaces. My company IT Mill Ltd is the author of an Open Source lisenced (LGPL) Millstone User Interface Library that is very similar (in model) to Echo. In my (biased of course) opinion Millstone provides developers with better UI components and more flexibility.

Main difference is that Millstone UI components are not dependant on Web, but has been (as prototypes) shown to work also in Swing. When doing Web-development, Millstone provides flexibility of using XSL stylesheets (in addition to CSS) for themeing, which makes customization of Millstone UI easy and flexible.

See the the online demo. If you have any questions, please join our just opened discussion forum.

BTW: In addition of being an Open Source project, commercial support is provided (by us) and currently Millstone is used (has been for 3 years) in very large commercial applications.

Echo has a wonderful model of writing web user interfaces. My company IT Mill Ltd is the author of an Open Source lisenced (LGPL) Millstone User Interface Library that is very similar (in model) to Echo. In my (biased of course) opinion Millstone provides developers with better UI components and more flexibility.

Main difference is that Millstone UI components are not dependant on Web, but has been (as prototypes) shown to work also in Swing. When doing Web-development, Millstone provides flexibility of using XSL stylesheets (in addition to CSS) for themeing, which makes customization of Millstone UI easy and flexible.

See the the online demo. If you have any questions, please join our just opened discussion forum.

BTW: In addition of being an Open Source project, commercial support is provided (by us) and currently Millstone is used (has been for 3 years) in very large commercial applications.

Echo has a wonderful model of writing web user interfaces. My company IT Mill Ltd is the author of an Open Source lisenced (LGPL) Millstone User Interface Library that is very similar (in model) to Echo. In my (biased of course) opinion Millstone provides developers with better UI components and more flexibility.

Main difference is that Millstone UI components are not dependant on Web, but has been (as prototypes) shown to work also in Swing. When doing Web-development, Millstone provides flexibility of using XSL stylesheets (in addition to CSS) for themeing, which makes customization of Millstone UI easy and flexible.

See the the online demo. If you have any questions, please join our just opened discussion forum.

BTW: In addition of being an Open Source project, commercial support is provided (by us) and currently Millstone is used (has been for 3 years) in very large commercial applications.

I too would have liked to see a structure built around the different specializations that framworks have been built to address... well, ordered the book anyway :)

As other pet projects have been mentioned here, I submit also mine as an example of a specialized framework, Millstone (www.millstone.org), don't know if it perhaps got mention in the book under the "along with mentioning more briefly a lot of others." -heading ;) (Thanks to parent for the listing!).

Miq

Yes, options are always good.

Echo seems interesting, and there is also Millstone, which is truly terminal independent, whereas Echo seems to be browser only.

Fundamentally the two platforms seem to be very similar, just take a look at the HelloWorld examples: HelloWorld with Echo, HelloWorld with Millstone.

The important thing about a platform like this is the default component library, and at least Millstone has a versatile and strong component set that's also as small as possible. Take a look at their feature demo that showcases the basic components. The feature demo itself runs on Millstone.

Yes, options are always good.

Echo seems interesting, and there is also Millstone, which is truly terminal independent, whereas Echo seems to be browser only.

Fundamentally the two platforms seem to be very similar, just take a look at the HelloWorld examples: HelloWorld with Echo, HelloWorld with Millstone.

The important thing about a platform like this is the default component library, and at least Millstone has a versatile and strong component set that's also as small as possible. Take a look at their feature demo that showcases the basic components. The feature demo itself runs on Millstone.

Yes, options are always good.

Echo seems interesting, and there is also Millstone, which is truly terminal independent, whereas Echo seems to be browser only.

Fundamentally the two platforms seem to be very similar, just take a look at the HelloWorld examples: HelloWorld with Echo, HelloWorld with Millstone.

The important thing about a platform like this is the default component library, and at least Millstone has a versatile and strong component set that's also as small as possible. Take a look at their feature demo that showcases the basic components. The feature demo itself runs on Millstone.

Another similar framework you might want to take a look is Millstone. Main fundamental difference is that Millstone provides themes through usage of XSL. Some of the UI-components look really nice in the default theme (demo can be found here).

Another similar framework you might want to take a look is Millstone. Main fundamental difference is that Millstone provides themes through usage of XSL. Some of the UI-components look really nice in the default theme (demo can be found here).

In fact we created adapter prototypes for WAP, J2PE and J2ME (MIDP) on HP Bazaar Spring Camp (Helsinki, 2002). We tested the adapters with Nokia 6310i prototype and Nokia 9210 as well as Prototype HP Jordana PDA with HP JVM and MIDP environment (Thanks for HP and Nokia for their help!).

The MP3 jukebox example application as well as simple examples like calc were tested. Calc worked out of the box as expected (no recompilation was required), but player UI was just too big for phone screen. Simple solution was to add new window to player and put the control panel to it (the frame with all the buttons). This added just 2 or 3 lines of code to the application. The result was a server-side jukebok that could be controlled with WEB interface as well as mobile phones. J2ME adapter used a little midlet that interpreted UIDL directly and used native Nokia widgets. J2PE was similar, but used AWT.

In fact we created adapter prototypes for WAP, J2PE and J2ME (MIDP) on HP Bazaar Spring Camp (Helsinki, 2002). We tested the adapters with Nokia 6310i prototype and Nokia 9210 as well as Prototype HP Jordana PDA with HP JVM and MIDP environment (Thanks for HP and Nokia for their help!).

The MP3 jukebox example application as well as simple examples like calc were tested. Calc worked out of the box as expected (no recompilation was required), but player UI was just too big for phone screen. Simple solution was to add new window to player and put the control panel to it (the frame with all the buttons). This added just 2 or 3 lines of code to the application. The result was a server-side jukebok that could be controlled with WEB interface as well as mobile phones. J2ME adapter used a little midlet that interpreted UIDL directly and used native Nokia widgets. J2PE was similar, but used AWT.

In fact we created adapter prototypes for WAP, J2PE and J2ME (MIDP) on HP Bazaar Spring Camp (Helsinki, 2002). We tested the adapters with Nokia 6310i prototype and Nokia 9210 as well as Prototype HP Jordana PDA with HP JVM and MIDP environment (Thanks for HP and Nokia for their help!).

The MP3 jukebox example application as well as simple examples like calc were tested. Calc worked out of the box as expected (no recompilation was required), but player UI was just too big for phone screen. Simple solution was to add new window to player and put the control panel to it (the frame with all the buttons). This added just 2 or 3 lines of code to the application. The result was a server-side jukebok that could be controlled with WEB interface as well as mobile phones. J2ME adapter used a little midlet that interpreted UIDL directly and used native Nokia widgets. J2PE was similar, but used AWT.

The default theme can be tested with feature browser and screenshots of some other themes are available here.

The default theme can be tested with feature browser and screenshots of some other themes are available here.

First a disclaimer: I am one of the head developers of Millstone and CEO of the company behind it.

I see that the difference in the nunber of features between Echo and Millstone is huge -- in favour of Millstone. I think that this can be most easily demonstrated by just going through Millstone feature online demo (also available for download) and Echo Test application. Some of the most obvious differences are: extensive data binding, server side events, tree component and xsl-theme support.

Still Echo is very nice framework and provides good competition for Millstone. I hope that the both frameworks gain popularity.

Base Library does not depend on cookies, but the Web Adapter uses cookies for session support. Adding support for URL re-encoding to avoid cookies might be added in future.

There is an extensive features demonstration online, where the UI components can be tested and configured on fly. This is the fastest way to get a good overview of Millstone capabilities.

You know, not all Millstones are not bad. For example, there is the Official Beverage of IT Mill ltd., which is quite good :)

Note: The Millstone-the-UI-library lives in http://www.millstone.org, millstone.com is about something completely different.