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DVD CCA Preliminary Injunction Hearing Rescheduled
This came into my mailbox from drwiii this morning: 'The judge had a scheduling conflict this Friday, so he had to reschedule the Preliminary Injunction hearing for next Tues. PLEASE NOTE: The Preliminary Injunction Hearing is NOW set for Tuesday, January 18, 2000 at 13:30 (PST) at Santa Clara County Superior Court (Dept. 2).'
Lets use the extra time to build an air tight case...
"the difference between myself and a madman is that I am not mad" -Salvadore Dali
Well, I'm very interested, so keep us posted. Also about the Lorenzo case.- -------------
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UNIX isn't dead, it just smells funny...
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UNIX isn't dead, it just sme
the cynic in me wonders if the dvd group may try to arrange for no supporters to show up.
so has anyone confirmed this with the court?
Trollers', meet the Trollers'
They're the modern Slashdot family
From the town of Flamebait
We're a post right out of Natalie
Let's ride the Karma down with MEEPT
With the Postmastah at Llamas' feet
When you're with the Trollers'
Have a Moderate-it-down time
A minus-two time
You'll have Hot Grits time.
.
Trollmastah
.
I find it incredible that you guys spend your time hanging around on /. just so you can get a first post in. Its the most incredible waste of time I've ever seen. I have met some pathetic specimen's of human beings in my time, but you guys are in a class of your own. Still, if it amuses your puny little brain, who am I to spoil your fun?
"Some smegger's filled in this 'Have You Got A Good Memory?' quiz!"
Maybe my memory just isn't what it used to be, or maybe I'm just out of the loop from being on vacation, but with no links to help me out, I wasn't sure what legal action was taking place here.
But, after searching slashdot a little, now I'm pretty confident that we're talking about DeCSS and that stupid encryption scheme that protects the DVDs that we've already bought from being watched... Hrm. (I'm not too worried about them getting copied, don't have an extra 4.5GB lying around right now, or enough time to encode one properly, but someday I'm sure it will be commonplace.)
So, now that I know what we're talking about... "Fair use". 'Nuff said.
---
pb Reply or e-mail; don't vaguely moderate.
pb Reply or e-mail; don't vaguely moderate.
The subject says it all.
I and other are too far away to give any "on-site" support, but would like to help out if we can.
Aside from joining the EFF (done), what if anything can those of us too far away to attend the hearing do to help out?
The Future of Human Evolution: Autonomy
Hopefully the conflict did not arise from a tee time with the Plaintiffs and their lobbyists ;) "Whaddya say there judge? $1000 a hole? Boy, and our Willie over there has a wicked slice too. Wink wink, nudge nudge, knowhatImean knowhatImean?" m0ng00se
Is madness a syptom of genius or vice-versa?
I find it incredibly amazing that you actually pay attention to losers like myself instead of doing something productive. But, if it gets you off, who am I to stop you.
Fucking idiotic moron, it takes like 2 seconds to post a first post...
816 area code is a Kansas City, Missouri, area code. The above is a troll.
816 area code is a Kansas City, Missouri number. The DVD CCA is in California. Its not cool to post people's phone numbers in a public forum, especially to harass someone.
-Neal
--Neal
--Neal
Go IETF!
I only pay attention because I find it fascinating. I really would like to know what you get out of it. I mean, if its that good, perhaps we should all be doing it.
Oh, and calling me a "fucking idiotic moron" proves my point. If your intention was to annoy me it didn't work. I'm afraid I just laughed at you.
"Some smegger's filled in this 'Have You Got A Good Memory?' quiz!"
OK, offtopic and a troll it may be, but that was, undeniably, one of the funniest posts I have ever seen on /.--even the moderators have to admit that.
And that's why I'm asking anyone with moderator points who reads this post to please moderate the parent comment up to give it at least a 'Funny' tag, because it is. The song parodies take a lot more creativity than the standard
print "$RANDOM_TROLL\n" while( 1 );
and the fake newpaper articles fare.
My two cents' worth. Moderate this as off-topic, I don't care, but I had to say this.
Call me slow, but I just now realized that most of the moderators here, supposedly my fellow geeks, have no sense of humor. /.
/. troll songbook. then get together and record it sung in rounds.
Actually this is considerably more amusing, inventive and damn clever than 98% of stuff you see on
Maybe we need to start a
EZ
-'Press Ctrl-Alt-Del to log in..'
"Oops, I always forget the purpose of competition is to divide people into winners and losers." - Hobbes
If the above was a troll, then you are a steenking carp. You're sure not a walleye. Look into what is meant by the term 'troll.'
Oh, wait! Not what the clueless think 'troll' means. (Clue: dragging a trolling lure along that patch of weeds with a ten horse outboard....)
I don't know if I would call it rude. Inconvenient, certainly. The court may have had an emergency crop up. A scheduled hearing may have run long, etc. In any event, court's tend to try to manage their schedule as to not cause injury to anybody. In this case, a delay in the hearing only serves to preserve the status quo. The fact that the court is willing to delay the hearing means to me that the court doesn't view the DVD CCA as making out a strong case of irreparable harm. Good news in my book.
Those bastards! Now I have a dilemma: Should I skip the first day of spring semester and try to convince my instructors not to drop me from the courses?
Also, I had wanted to go to the hearing because I forgot my jacket in someone's car during the TRO. Whomever gave me a ride to the Habana, do you have my dark blue jacket? Email me: ryanrs at altavista dot net.
Ryan
someone finally took the time to research the number! i've been posting it for weeks.. *sigh* i love you.. *sniffle* whoever you are.. :)
i live in overland park and i used to work for that horrid ferris wheel for chickens known as (816) 246 6160.. :)
I realize I am entering the fray a bit late here, but how can /. be held accountable for a link posted by a person? It clearly states all comments are owned by the poster.It is not as if the supposed "illegal" propietary information is being stored or served from the /. site itself. I wonder if there is any precedence in the case(s) the COS brought/brings/will bring against those who post their also supposed propietary information, specifically, if any of those with links to this informaiton have been prosecuted. And if so, what are the results?
Going on means going far
Going on means going far
Going far means returning
Any chance a, preferably Live, Video Feed could be arranged from the proceedings? If /.-readers signed up ahead of time, you could even casually throw into the proceedings that they are currently being followed by a gazillion or so people. :-)
A Beowulf of nerds.
I like that.
Only speaking for USA judges (all levels), they really do not give a crap about anybody elses schedule or life, only their own. Expect more of this pontif-like behaviour to follow.
For those of you that want the government to be involved in every aspect of our lives, this is just a taste of what to expect in that world.
Eve Fairbanks says I drive a hybrid!LOL
Of course, I'm not sure what the legal ruling will be on this, I think the main problem is that this is not a case of reverse engineering but involves some proprietary code, and thus is the difference between Bleem! and Virtual GameStation. I think if it had been true reverse engineering, the case wouldn't stand up in court, but because it involved looking at patented materials, it may be a problem. I still don't think Slashdot can be held accountable though, all they did was provide an open forum for people to express themselves on an issue.
All the creatures will die, And all the things will be broken. That's the law of samurai. (Jubai, 1605)
More time to prepare, eh? Remember the courtroom demo of disabling IE in Win98 during the MS case? How about a courtroom demo of a DVD copy--without use of an encryption crack? That prove that the issue of pirating should be out of the discussion...
I'm pretty sure, it isn't the IP of a Kentucky Fried Chicken...
... maybe the judge is actually on our side.
Say no to software patents.
Looks to me like the IP address is for a firewall at Weil, Gotshal, & Manges (sounds like a law firm to me) whose service is provided by PSInet.
As I recall, it was originally scheduled for a Friday Afternoon. Now it is mid-day on a Tuesday. I might have been able to bugger off early on a Friday afternoon and show up. Tuesday mid-day is right out.
How many other working stiffs (who aren't DVD CCA Lawyers) can afford to take the afternoon off to show up like that? Perhaps this was a move to lessen the number of people who show up to refute the DVD CCA's arguments?
Stupid people will be persecuted to the fullest extent allowed by law.
Your use of the of the phrase "copyright theft" and the word "theft" in this context is confusing. Consider alternatives such as "making unauthorized copies of" or "sharing".
Copying information or art is very different from stealing physical goods, so the word "theft" is inappropriate for use when referring to copying or copyright infringement. If I steal your bong, you can't use it to smoke anymore. But if I make a photocopy of few pages in a book you own a copy of - or a make a MP3 of a song you own a copy of, you can still read that book and listen to that song. Using the words like theft and steal is almost as confusing as using the word piracy to talk about copyright infringement. If you mean copyright infringement, say copyright infringement. These other words serve only to color or mislead. See http://www.fsf.org/philoso phy/words-to-avoid.html#Piracy for details.
...who wrote this great mirror list?
Say no to software patents.
This case demonstrates that freedom AFTER speech is not protected. Many of the defendants in this case are being forced to spend substantial sums just to defend their constitutionally protected right of free speech.
Since it has been demonstrated that when you say something to which a powerful group objects, you may be held accountable for your speech, I offer the following quote and attribution;
"All those companies that have major amounts of content can't afford to have some moron hacker post something because he thinks it's cool."
Claude Stern, Partner, Litigation and Intellectual Property Groups with Fenwick & West
cstern@fenwick.com
650.858.7183
Fax: 650.494.1417
Current Address: 2121 BELLVIEW DR, PALO ALTO, CA 94303-3404
Birthyear: 1955
Gender: MALE
Telephone Number: 650-813-9272
Wife: Andrea M (Gilbert) Stern
Son: Joshua Solomon Stern
Son: Jacob Stern
Parents: Edith and Arthur Stern of Beverly Hills
Inlaws: Joan and Richard Gilbert of San Francisco
Graduated: University of California, Hastings College of the Law
www.fenwick.com
Netname: NET-FENWICK4 Netblock: 206.184.222.0 - 206.184.222.255
Netname: NET-FENWICK3 Netblock: 209.24.246.0 - 209.24.247.255
Netname: NET-FENWICK2 Netblock: 209.24.245.0 - 209.24.245.255
Netname: NET-FENWICK5 Netblock: 206.86.169.0 - 206.86.169.255
Netname: NET-FENWICK Netblock: 206.184.184.0 - 206.184.185.255
/. posters don't seem to understand the difficulties with bit-for-bit copying of DVDs. It can't be done with consumer hardware and without CSS. A consumer DVD drive will not read all of the sectors physically present on a DVD without doing part of the CSS dance.
I've heard speculation that equipment is available to read and write these sectors without a CSS hack, but I'm still skeptical. Perhaps professional equipment exists to do this, but I don't see the need or for it to exist. If it does, it's likely custom engineered hardware that would not be available to the defense without out them building it themselves. People speculate that the firmware could be reprogrammed on consumer DVD drives to skip the CSS steps, but I've yet to see anyone claim to be able to do that. On the write side, DVD disks are mass produced, not written in drives.
Notwithstanding the cost and difficulty of obtaining the requisite hardware, demonstrating the means and ability to pirate DVDs is not really where this case needs to go.
The demo which is needed is to show a non-infringing use such as playing a legally purchased DVD on a laptop running Linux.
I have discovered a truly marvelous sig, unfortunately the sig limit is too small to contain i
We all know that the encryption algorithm on DVD's doesn't prevent piracy. But can we prove it to the judge?
Consider:
(1) Can we copy DVD information from a DVD disk onto a harddrive? Preferably under Win98? (Yes, I hate Win98 with a passion too. But we're trying to make a point here!)
(2) Can we remove the DVD disk.
(3) Can we play the copied, still encrypted movie off the harddrive with some Win98 DVD player software?
(4) Can we politely ask the opposition to explain what purpose their encryption serves since it obviously does not prevent copying while clearly preventing fair use...
ah, so.
Accordingly, the sale of copying equipment, like the sale of other articles of commerce, does not constitute contributory infringement if the product is widely used for legitimate, unobjectionable purposes. Indeed, it need merely be capable of substantial noninfringing uses. Theoretically, since DeCSS has a substantial non-infringing use (allowing linux users access to DVD content), it is not an infringement. Interestingly, this argument was derived from patent (not copyright) law.
CNN Headline News just had a blurb (6:25PM ET 1/11) covering "DVD pirating". They displayed
one of the Linux DVD pages while talking about pirating and deCSS. I'd think that page-owner has a good libel (slander?) case against CNN for defamation of character. Heck, at the time, Linux DVD was the only thing readable on the screen, so the whole Linux name is degraded. They'll probably loop around and show it again at 6:55PM ET. Maybe they'll put up the transcript on their webpage.
main(O){10<putchar((O--,102-((O&4)*16| (31&60>>5*(O&3)))))&&main(2+O);}
main(O){10<putchar((O--,102-((O&4)*16| (31&60>>5*(O&3)))))&&main(2+ O);}
LN2 is cool!
This is just a quick note to say that the DeCSS utility is listed in the NoNags software archive (in the Multimedia section) - automatically mirrored on hundreds of servers around the world. I tripped over it the other day. I don't know if this info helps. (For all I know they were listed as one of the sites in the original nasty-gram.)
> Does anyone know what the judge will be doing
> then? Or what the precedents are?
On 10/04/98 the San Jose Mercury News ran a front-page article which described exactly how our Superior Court judges *were* spending their Fridays. Search their database at www.sjmercury.com for "superior court AND judges AND golf". The full article will cost you, but the headline "JUDGE'S FRIDAY: WORK AN HOUR, OFF TO THE LINKS" pretty much sums it up.
As for precedents, never expect anything to happen on time in the legal system. If it does, that's a bonus.
David Wagner is going to be an expert witness in the DeCSS case. Here's his deposition: http://www.eff.org/pub/Intellectual_property/DVD/2 0000107-pi-motion-wagnerdec.html #31 is pretty amusing... Cracking DVD would be an excellent homework assignment *grin*
they dont really have a case do they ?
so whats the big deal ?
Um, dude? Get a dose of realism, here. Judges are the product of the best in our society...otherwise we wouldn't trust them with the abilitity to literally judge others. If they want to take Fridays off for leisure activity, that's fine by me. They do more work during the rest of the week (and in their career before they became judges) than most fast-food workers or tech-support drones do in a month of Sundays.
This is slightly off-topic.
Anyhow, people keep saying you can copy DVDs without cracking the encryption. A lot of people refer to this link:
http://opendvd.org/rickletter.html
Yet, to my knowledge, *nobody* has actually done this. If anybody has actually successfully copied a DVD, I'd like to hear about it, because there seem to be a lot of misconceptions on this issue.
Of course, whether or not DVDs could have been directly copied without DeCSS is irrelevant to the legality of this case; the defendants are well within their rights regardless.
what's the difference, really, in hanging around trying to get a first post in, and hanging around and trying to crack some DVD format so you can make free copies? Really, it's the same thing...too much time on your hands, and very little in the way of life. And shame on you for feeding the trolls that you so despise...attention is their only weapon, and you're giving it to them. Shame.
This is very off topic - I appologise but I figured that the people reading this group would be the ones ho could help me out.
I have a creative labs DVD kit (drive and dxr3 card).
Is it possible for me to make (and play) my own AC3 sound files?
"DNA is God's contribution to the Open Source movement"
My apologies if someone has already pointed this out.
There is a discussion on DeCSS on CNN at this URL
http://community.cnn.com/cgi-bin /WebX?13@@.ee71559
The idea of sending a petition around, especially if you could "scan" in your signature (not just a .sig file) and send one in with the petition is a particularly good one.
I would like to start to organize a group that would be willing to prepare petitions to take to trade shows, geek events, ect. and come up with some show of support that demonstrates just how many people are really interested.
Thanks for the link. The various documents posted on the parent site provide what appears to be an air-tight defense. The EFF lawyers have done an marvelous job with this.
CSS is dead.
I have discovered a truly marvelous sig, unfortunately the sig limit is too small to contain i
The CCA's case is not about piracy or copyright infringement or even free speech. It is about trade secrets. Read this.
h /docs/dvd011000.htm
http://www.mercurycenter.com/svtech/news/indept
>begin quote
The Electronic Frontier Foundation assumed last year that it would be fighting the DVD industry under the new federal copyright law, which it considers too broad and an undue burden on free speech rights on the Internet. But the industry did not go that route.
``We were figuring on becoming involved in this case, but were anticipating that it would be under the (digital copyright act),'' said EFF attorney Robin Gross. ``When it was for trade secrets (theft), it was a big surprise to us.''
Added Eblen Moglen, a Columbia University law professor who is advising EFF, ``I think they wish to avoid litigating the DMCA question right now. They wanted the maximum bang for the minimum buck -- if they can get a California state court judgment, they can race from court to court to enforce it.''
Kressler, the DVD industry's lawyer, will not discuss why the suit did not attack the Web
sites under the new copyright law. ``I wouldn't rule out the possibility there are other
causes of action, but obviously we felt the trade secrets action is for us a very strong
one,'' he said.
To Kressler, the case boils down to a simple analogy: If someone steals the formula to
Coca Cola, and three other people get the formula and post it on the Internet, they can be
shut down through an injunction for knowingly disseminating a trade secret. He maintains
the Web site operators knew -- or ``should have known'' -- they were posting protected
DVD technology.