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Sega Dreamcast: $0
According to
this CNN article,
Sega will announce today a $200 rebate on its $200 Dreamcast
console. They'll even throw in a free keyboard. Game consoles have
always played "lose money on the razor, make it on the blades,"
but now, the blades have changed: the catch is a mandatory two
years of their online service at $22/mo. So, exactly how much
ass
do the Dreamcast's
online games
kick?
I implore all of you - DON'T DO THIS!!! Chu Chu Rocket is one of the most addictive games on the planet and is the premiere online game for the Dreamcast.
If you want to save your sanity - DON'T SIGN UP WITH THIS!
You should never take life too seriously - You'll never get out of it alive.
There's a project afoot to port OpenBSD to the Dreamcast. There is a working port of NetBSD to the Hitachi SH3; the Hitachi SH4 in the Dreamcast is backwards compatible with the SH3 - so there's promise there.
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The idea is that Sega will try to make thier bandwidth dedicated to network games. Somehow I feel that it's quite evil to dedicate the entire ISP service to consume bandwidth on games.
You've got a funny idea of evil... I mean, this is not quite on a par with gassing ethnic minorities, is it?
Seriously, I'm not sure I understand your point here. Dedicating an ISP to gaming keeps that bandwidth off other, general purpose ISPs: surely that's a Good Thing? The alternative, gaming on ordinary ISPs means that I end up paying over the odds for my ISP connection, because I only surf the Web a little and get an SMTP feed, while other people are pumping Quake III packets day in and day out for the same price.
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No, but the hardware will run WinCE and Wyse seems to think it's just as good, if not better - so that's a bonus. (Before modding down, turn up/on sarcasam detector and re-read)
You forgot to subtract the price of a similar ISP service without a hardware purchase or contract. Whatever that is - I have free Internet access through work ;)
They'll probably use those magic words oft-read by TV and radio announcers, "This offer void where prohibited."
Editor Emeritus and Senior Writer, TeleRead.org
Doubt you'll see Linux ports of any of them.
can you make an open source Mario Katz?
Pope
It doesn't mean much now, it's built for the future.
What happened to the DC commercials that claimed "it is thinking?" That kind of implies superb AI to me. Huh. I guess not. Or maybe they were referring to the marketing department....
And the other one:
As opposed to the unlimited number of games the DC will let you play online? Even if online gaming really takes off for the Dreamcast, I really can't imagine there being more online games for any one console than for the PC, at least not for the lifespan of the Dreamcast. I love it when reporters swallow press releases whole without even bothering to pause and chew on them first.
Sega does have an interesting approach to overcoming language barriers, though, by allowing players to choose from a menu of common phrases, which are pre-translated for foreign players. On the other hand, that seems like a pretty limited way to build an interactive online community to me.
I'll think keep my keyboard and PC, and stick to EverQuest and Legend of the Red Dragon for the time being, thank you!
This sounds too much like a credit plan for the stupid and those unable to get a loan. Wasn't the old Jaguar catchphrase 'Do the math?'
Sega Dreamcast: Its thinking, so you don't have to.
Does anyone know what the lyrics in the commercial mean? I can't get them out of my head!
> When it began connecting, only to spit out repetitive strings of gibberish and then discoonect, I called tech support.
The software release we were running on our Portmaster-3s (I work for an ISP) around December had some interesting compatibility issues with the Dreamcast...you may want to find out what kind of access concentrators your ISP uses, get a hold of someone in their NOC, and ask them to upgrade their software.
Hmm, I really don't think it even costs them that much. The average cost in the stores is what? $200? I would suspect that the stores bought it for around $140 - $150, the distributor paid around $90 - $100, and that would lead me to believe that the hardware only costs Sega around $50. I could be wrong, if somone else has better info please reply because I'm going off of an educated guess.
Molog
So Linus, what are we doing tonight?
So Linus, what are we going to do tonight?
The same thing we do every night Tux. Try to take over the world!
But I can recall the days when you couldn't buy a telephone. You rented it from the phone company. Now, you own the Dreamcast, Netpliance, whatever, but you pay outrageous fees for the service. Maybe in the future we can get rid of credit cards for purchases. You'll get everything for free, as long as you agree to subscribe to ISP service for two or three years to get it to work. Want a new fridge? No problem, as long as you purchase our service to let your fridge dial up, send us an inventory, so we can ship you replacement eggs & milk and charge your account. Free tv? Sure, as long as you pay $100/month for digital cable & ISP service. You can't install a new toilet unless you first buy the service so it can send vital data to your physician. While we're at it, your toilet-paper roller will sense when you're low & order a new shipment... for a monthly fee, of course. Cars will be free and drive themselves, as long as you pay the monthly fee so it can track your movements, and they can beam advertisements in to force you to watch during the ride. PepsiCo will finally figure out how to burn their logo onto the face of the moon (they actually considered it at one point), and Bill Gates will somehow, in the end, be the guy left holding the bag at the end of every pyramid scheme ever created, thus allowing everyone else to get rich quick, while he descends in the ranks to become just a normal guy. *whew* But I digress, the point of this is that this whole scheme of give away the box, sell the service has got to (hopefully) fail in the end. $22/month doesn't seem like much, but it adds up QUICKLY. Suppose you also want to play Nintendo, Sony, or other games. Then there's the whole issue of people who live in rural areas, where a long-distance call is required to access the service. IMO, this is just another way of taking money from stupid people.
These people looked deep into my soul and assigned me a number based on the order in which I joined.
Actually, you can get a Dreamcast and also one of these free ISPs...people have done it with NetZero. $200 + $0 $520... Can the Sega ISP also be used on the PC? Then it would seem like a much better deal.
It's time for all the PC gaming elitists to wake up the smell the roses. Gaming just isn't about PCs that have to be upgraded every month and first-person shooters. It's about universal, human entertainment, the kind you can only find on consoles. Games like Shenmue, Jet Set Radio, Space Channel 5. Games that are a Gift to the Children of the 21st Century.
Yours,
Yu Suzuki
Yu Suzuki
Deamcast. It's thinking.
I guess it depends whether someone ports Napster to the Dreamcast :)
troc
Troc's dubious podcast and blog: http://www.trocnet.net
In my knowledge, a contract binding consumers to corporations for extended periods of time are illegal in Finland. For example, mobile phone companies cannot create contracts that bind people for two years - legally we have to be able to opt out at any time. This has proven out to be very good for competition, with costs for using mobile phones going down all the time and new interesting services being launched continually.
:(
I wonder how Sega will arrange contracts like this in here. Looking at how many foreign companies handle situations like this, we probably just won't get the online option here at all.
sulka
"Although it is not true that all conservatives are stupid, it is true that most stupid people are conservative."
This is not necessarily such a bad deal for the potential customers. If the customer is a newbie who doesn't already have an internet account, and he wants one that he can be confident will work with his DC with the minimum of hassle, this deal is not so bad. When you assume that the average newbie would consider getting an ISP such as AOL, RCN, or what have you, you're probably talking about 20 dollars a month anyways. Assuming the user does get ISP service
... 24
So to make a fair comparison without taking into consideration the timing of cash flows, it would be approximately 680 (for an outright purcahse + ISP service) compared to 528 (for sega's ISP deal). Furthermore, when you consider the timing of cash flows (which is more realistic), sega's deal is even more favorable. Assuming that DC owner could make do about 1% interest a month on the following cash flows:
0 --- 1 -- 2 -- 3 -- 4 -- 5
200 - 20 - 20 - 20 - 20 - 20 - 20
0 ---- 22 - 22 - 22 - 22 - 22 - 22
This gives us a net present value of about: 625 on the dreamcast had you purchased it and bought service from a third party provider, and 467 had you just bought sega's ISP deal. Of course, changing the ISPs rate and the interest rate will give you different results. None the less, the computation is not exactly clearly against sega's deal. If the user is already subscribed to something like AOL, choosing this deal may, in fact, be beneficial to them...
The bottom line is that you can't just punch in these numbers and get "the answer" for everyone. The value this deal proposes is highly dependant on where the user is coming from.
Sega, the company that brought us ToeJam and Earl -- forever the best game ever made, though only in two-player mode.
Sega got into the market before PSII or Dolphin, but at the cost of technological inferiority. Given that PSII is highly likely to kick Dreamcast's ass, Sega needs to do something -- anything -- to lock in gamers before the PSII is released in the US.
I doubt the plan is good anyway. A lot of people will get the Dreamcast and then get PSII when it comes out. Then they'll be left with $22/mo bills for a year and a half for the priviledge of connecting their unused hardware. That ought to generate a lot of bad feelings towards Sega.
Of course, as Sega is exiting the console business, it's not like it would care a great deal...
Kaa
Kaa
Kaa's Law: In any sufficiently large group of people most are idiots.
My father got a Dreamcast last Channukah. We spent many hours trying to get that box 'o tripe connected to the internet through our local ISP, something they repeatedly trumpeted as perfectly possible. When it began connecting, only to spit out repetitive strings of gibberish and then discoonect, I called tech support. The first time, they plead ignorance. On my second try...
...and then it disconnects.
Laborit:
TS: Yeah, it does that sometimes.
Laborit: So what should I do about it?
TS: Just keep trying to connect.
Laborit: I've tried ten times in a row without success.
TS (perky): Yes, you said that. Just keep trying!
Laborit: This can't be right.
TS: Yes, we have a model right here in the office. It does the same thing.
Laborit: You're telling me I should be satisfied with a product that only works as advertised one time in eleven, at most?
TS (perkier): Just keep trying!
Laborit: I find this unacceptable.
TS (threateningly perky): Keep trying!
Laborit: Are you saying...
TS:PERK PERK PERK!!!
My reaction to the offer: maybe if they paid me twenty-two bucks a month...
****
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Go ahead, blame me... I voted for Nader!
Well, lets see.
I can pay $200 for a Dreamcast.
OR
I can pay $22/month for 24 months.
$200 vs $520... and if you decide that the online gaming isn't worth it, you're pretty much screwed.
-- Dr. Eldarion --
If someone with a PC signs up for the $22/month for 2 years contract($528) they will receive a $200 rebate which, Sega hope, can be put towards a Dreamcast. Or if you prefer, you can pocket it and essentially pay $14/month.
Why should a PC gamer sign up? According to MCV.COM, Sega has been working with PowerPlay to build the network with better access and lower latencies for games.
There are other feature which mainly apply towards DC users such as certain sports titles along with other games featuring online play. As well, for DC owners, Sega is releasing a MP3 player(similar in d esignto Sega's VMU Memory card) with 64MB of ram for less then $100. Of course it's useable only with a DC...While Sega's offering may not be something PC players will take notice of, it's a strong shot off the bow for Sega against their competitors.
-Dean
Any chance, after the addition of a ribbon cable, it will run linux? ;) That seems to be the trend lately.
No sig is worth reading.
... yeah i have a sega saturn and a sega genesis (the last "real" winner they had though i didn't fall for the equally ill-fated 32x and cd products ...) ... i swore i would never buy a sega product ever again after the saturn debacle ... but then again, i don't buy sony products either as every single sony item i have ever bought broke within a year (though the 5th walkman i bought a little over a year ago is still working ... hmm ...) ...
anyway, i'm not sure if this manuever by them is too little too late ... they needed to have the online gaming up at christmas, not this fall sometime which translates into winter or maybe early next year ... there is big market for those gamers who while quite adept at video games are real clueless about PC setup and plus the cost of putting together a high end gaming setup ...
the internet access they provide works - and you don't need them as a provider - i hooked it up to freei.net - so i can surf on the tv for free though it is an exercise in primitivity (heh, that ain't a word ...) ... most of the time you can only see a fraction of the page on the tv screen and i don't have a keyboard so typing urls in is a pain - then, add that fact to the fact that you need to store the bookmarks on a memory cartridge that plugs in to one of the controllers ... even with a keyboard i can't imagine smooth surfing ...
but like i said, they missed the boat - though the games i have purchased are very good, it would be cool to play online and the ease (or perceived ease) of setting up and getting on would be a boon for many gamers - i.e. no worry about machine differences, sound cards, 3d cards, etc ... just log in and play ... but the success of these gaming consoles is not predicated on the power of the box, but the quantity and quality of the games ... probally quantity being more important ... (witness the sony playstation success ...)
anyway, i wish it would work for sega, but i don't see it happening ... sega will end up being sony's bitch just like ms ate up netscape ... l8
AZspot
I really hope Sega can pull this off. Regardless of what's coming around the bend, Dreamcast is a great system.
It's fun to take apart too. Here's some pictures of my DC with a blue power LED that I soldered in to commemerate its compatibility with a Microsoft product (WinCE).
One of the best features of Dreamcast online gaming is the way you communicate. ChuChu Rocket, and other future games, give you a standardized set of phrases and messages you can activate from the controller. The cool part is that these messages appear to other users in whatever language they're playing in. In other words, if I'm playing against someone in Japan, I can select English phrases on my screen and they'll appear in Japanese to the person on the other end. CCR just offers a few taunts and gripes, but the multiplayer online RPG Phantasy Star Online (coming out worldwide this summer) lets you construct entire translatable sentences out of stock words.
The biggest problem right now, of course, is game selection ;). Right now, there's only one game supported, ChuChu Rocket, which is basically Hungry Hungry Hippos on speed and is entertaining beyond belief. (If you haven't seen the infamous CCR commercial, you must download it now :P). Unfortunately, it gets old pretty quickly, and even in the month since it came out it's losing its appeal. There's a slew of online games coming up, though, including big names like Quake III and Half-Life.
As a diehard console gamer, I'm psyched that we're finally getting all the online features that our PC counterparts have been enjoying for years ;). If you've been playing Quake for years, DC netplay is nothing special, but IMO it's a big step in the right direction for console gaming.
Green Monkey