Posted by
CmdrTaco
on from the excellent-smithers dept.
kdgarris writes: "The KDE team has released the second beta for the KDE 2.0 desktop environment. Check out the announcement here." The new-and-improved list is pretty lengthy and very impressive. Worth a look see.
I don't have Kleopatra (yet) but I run the 06082000 build and it just keeps getting better. A lot of more evident bugs that were in Konfucious are gone now and the whole lot is really coming together. My only concern is the state of Konqueror which still seems too flakey for any real browsing, still looks more of a proof of concept thing. Koffice is usable now as is and I can recommend Kword to anyone frustrated with the hopeless UI of MS Word. I never used FrameMaker but this frame concept has much more appeal to me than the blooming MS Word templates that never work properly for anything beyond a two page letter.
I have a big beef with KDE though. No not the licensing silly! It's the fact that they ditched Corba as their component architecture. Why? It's not slow at all if you use in-process servers it's elegant in most languages and wiht the addition of POA it's extremely flexible. The argument that CORBA is to difficult to master for Joe sixpack developer doesn't hold anymore since the Henning Vinoski book's out. My biggest concern is that with OMG adopting the Corba Component Model all DCOPs and Bonobos will effectively become proprietary solutions. CCM will provide good intergration with JavaBeans which I'm sure all Java affectionados will appreciate too. Why oh why did they have to rid of CORBA?!
What's all the whinging for?
by
trellick
·
· Score: 4
Grow up. Stop all this 'Gnome is waay better that KDE doode' and vice-versa crap.
That's the point of open-source you get a CHOICE, you try it, you like it, you use it. You don't like it, then you don't use it. [and it doesn't cost the earth!]
And for those people who carp out about "well I don't need that I'm better of with a chisel, a rock, my vt100 terminal and a 1200/75 modem!", well fine!.....
BUT do you really thing the legions of windoze users are going to be tempted to move across to something that doesn't look purty and do what they could do??
Half of them spontaneously combust at the sight of a command line! [Trust me on this one;) ]
Personally, I take me hat off to both the KDE/GNOME boys and girls and thank them profusely for BOTH doing something different and moving their products [and Linux] onto the desktop of more and more users.
Yeah, can anyone help me with a Linux problem I have? I tried GNOME and liked it better, so I wanted to remove KDE. I got rid of all the packages starting with "k", and now LILO crashes.
j/k
--
Gates' Law: Every 18 months, the speed of software halves.
YOUR TROLL SCORE IS
by
Anonymous Coward
·
· Score: 4
4
You trolling skills are very rough and need to be honed. You lose major points by falling into the trap of many new trollers, you are way too obvious. Lets do some in depth analysis on your troll:
Wow. Yet another program whose job it is to devour my entire screen so I can run half-baked programs that duplicate everything I already have. No thanks
You troll entry point here is all wrong. If you start your troll routine on an agressive it sets off a red flag for the judges.I realize your adrenaline is runnig high but you need to start off a little slower to be an effictive troll
Give me a break. KDE and GNOME are worthless. I can run any program I want without a huge "panel", without a start button, and without a bloated gui. The insistence of the KDE and GNOME teams upon you only using their software is sickining. Why shouldn't I use software that hasn't been "blessed" by KDE with a spot on the K menu, or on the panel?
Okay now your deep into your troll here but your form is all wrong. Instead of going with the angry self-rightous tone maybe you should try the "I'm a confused newbie" tone, or my favorite, the "I'm a seasoned computer proffesional" tone. The angry troll rarely works well
Thanks, but I think I'll stick to xterm. It has a better interface anyway
Your troll dismount is sloppy and not well thought out. You really need a lot of work here.
Let me try to answer your questions about the current status of khtml (the html rendering engine of konqueror):
You can use aswell as to include html subpages. Or do you mean including the html directly? This is nowhere defined in the HTML standards AFAIK.
CSS positioning is supported except for fixed, but I'm confident we'll have that working by the time we release KDE2.
CSS2 support is however far from being complete.:before and:after pseudoclasses are still not supported, neither is the text-shadow property. But to be honest, there isn't a single browser out having support for text-shadow, the same is true for a lot of other CSS2 properties.
PNG alpha channels are not supported, but that is a limitation of X11 rather than konqueror. One could in principle work around that, but the price to pay for it is quite heavy, since one has to get the pixmap below the image from the server, blend the image on top and send the result back to the server. This would slow down rendering more than I am willing to compromise on for such a feature.
I'm not quite sure what you mean by XML namespace selection in CSS2 sheets. Anyway, khtml unfortunately still doesn't have support for XML (xhtml is supported however), just because the developers we have are booked out with other things.
I can give a short summary about the current status of khtml.
Html4: about 95% implemented.
CSS1: about 80%-90% implemented. Only very few properties are still missing.
CSS2: about 40%. Together khtml's CSS support is not far away from what IE5 on windows offers.
DOM Level 1: Almost complete. The HTML part is completely implemented, a few thigs specific to XML are still missing.
DOM Level2: The CSS part, traversal and ranges are implemented. Still missing are the events. This means about 70% is implemented.
Support for java applets is mostly complete.
Netscape plugins (flash, real player, etc) work.
Javascript: The core (ecma-262 version3) ist almost complete, but the DOM bindings still need some work.
khtml has support for bidirectional scripts (hebrew and arabic).
it is pretty fast:-)
khtml is still a bit buggy on some pages, but we expect to get that fixed until the release of KDE2. As long as you don't need too much javascript it is already very useable and many people are using konqueror as their main browser.
Slashdot Mirror
I have a big beef with KDE though. No not the licensing silly! It's the fact that they ditched Corba as their component architecture. Why? It's not slow at all if you use in-process servers it's elegant in most languages and wiht the addition of POA it's extremely flexible. The argument that CORBA is to difficult to master for Joe sixpack developer doesn't hold anymore since the Henning Vinoski book's out. My biggest concern is that with OMG adopting the Corba Component Model all DCOPs and Bonobos will effectively become proprietary solutions. CCM will provide good intergration with JavaBeans which I'm sure all Java affectionados will appreciate too. Why oh why did they have to rid of CORBA?!
Grow up. Stop all this 'Gnome is waay better that KDE doode' and vice-versa crap.
;) ]
That's the point of open-source you get a CHOICE, you try it, you like it, you use it. You don't like it, then you don't use it. [and it doesn't cost the earth!]
And for those people who carp out about "well I don't need that I'm better of with a chisel, a rock, my vt100 terminal and a 1200/75 modem!", well fine!.....
BUT do you really thing the legions of windoze users are going to be tempted to move across to something that doesn't look purty and do what they could do??
Half of them spontaneously combust at the sight of a command line! [Trust me on this one
Personally, I take me hat off to both the KDE/GNOME boys and girls and thank them profusely for BOTH doing something different and moving their products [and Linux] onto the desktop of more and more users.
Roll on September and KDE 2.0 final!
j/k
Gates' Law: Every 18 months, the speed of software halves.
4
You trolling skills are very rough and need to be honed. You lose major points by falling into the trap of many new trollers, you are way too obvious. Lets do some in depth analysis on your troll:
Wow. Yet another program whose job it is to devour my entire screen so I can run half-baked programs that duplicate everything I already have. No thanks
You troll entry point here is all wrong. If you start your troll routine on an agressive it sets off a red flag for the judges.I realize your adrenaline is runnig high but you need to start off a little slower to be an effictive troll
Give me a break. KDE and GNOME are worthless. I can run any program I want without a huge "panel", without a start button, and without a bloated gui. The insistence of the KDE and GNOME teams upon you only using their software is sickining. Why shouldn't I use software that hasn't been "blessed" by KDE with a spot on the K menu, or on the panel?
Okay now your deep into your troll here but your form is all wrong. Instead of going with the angry self-rightous tone maybe you should try the "I'm a confused newbie" tone, or my favorite, the "I'm a seasoned computer proffesional" tone. The angry troll rarely works well
Thanks, but I think I'll stick to xterm. It has a better interface anyway
Your troll dismount is sloppy and not well thought out. You really need a lot of work here.
Troll summary: Score 4 out of 10
Let me try to answer your questions about the current status of khtml (the html rendering engine of konqueror):
:before and :after pseudoclasses are still not supported, neither is the text-shadow property. But to be honest, there isn't a single browser out having support for text-shadow, the same is true for a lot of other CSS2 properties.
You can use aswell as to include html subpages. Or do you mean including the html directly? This is nowhere defined in the HTML standards AFAIK.
CSS positioning is supported except for fixed, but I'm confident we'll have that working by the time we release KDE2.
CSS2 support is however far from being complete.
PNG alpha channels are not supported, but that is a limitation of X11 rather than konqueror. One could in principle work around that, but the price to pay for it is quite heavy, since one has to get the pixmap below the image from the server, blend the image on top and send the result back to the server. This would slow down rendering more than I am willing to compromise on for such a feature.
I'm not quite sure what you mean by XML namespace selection in CSS2 sheets. Anyway, khtml unfortunately still doesn't have support for XML (xhtml is supported however), just because the developers we have are booked out with other things.
Cheers,
Lars
I'm starting to dislike all these "Krappy" names.
Anyone else feel the same way?
KDE is great, but, as somebody with a degree in advertising, I'd submit that too much of anything is always a bad thing.
________
1995: Microsoft - "Resistance is futile"
khtml is still a bit buggy on some pages, but we expect to get that fixed until the release of KDE2. As long as you don't need too much javascript it is already very useable and many people are using konqueror as their main browser.
Lars