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Neverwinter Nights Will Go On Win/Mac/Linux/Be
Faw writes "In an interview at Stomped Bioware's CEO Ray Muzyka mentioned that its next game Neverwinter Nights will be available for the PC, Mac, Linux and BeOS. I think this is the first time I have heard BeOS mentioned by a mayor game company. You can check the interview out as well." For those of you who don't know, Neverwinter is supposed to be the sequel to Baldur's Gate II [?] - and will have functions that allow DMs to make dungeons, and much better multiplayer support. Update: 12/29 06:53 PM by H :I've been corrected - NN doesn't have anything to do with the BG2 storyline. Must have been wishful thinking on my part. *grin*
Frankly, I'm a bit confused to find out that my machine, which happens to run Linux, is not a personal computer.
I've noticed this a lot lately. When did "PC", a fairly generic term for the type of computer you have, become synonimous with Windows, an operating system which runs on your computer?
I'm sure Apple contributed to this trend with their never-ending PC vs Mac press. I always felt this was a bit strange considering they were marketting a machine designed to be the most personal of personal computers.
Then again, maybe I misunderstood and Neverwinter Nights is being shipped for pollitically correct people and also those who use Linux and BeOS. BeOS and Linux both run on Macs and I'm shocked to hear they won't be porting this to MacOS (operating system vs hardware).
The world is neither black nor white nor good nor evil, only many shades of CowboyNeal.
Lionhead may not be a "major" game company, but it was founded by Peter Molyneux, who is certainly a major player in the game industry, and has been for years and years. He's been the guy behind some truly great games.
It's not enough to bash in heads, you've got to bash in minds. - Captain Hammer
FWIW, we Fed Ex'ed pressed CDs to people who ordered the game from us as soon as humanly possible--about two weeks after the Win32 CDs were pressed (I think less, actually). So it was hardly months.
Retail penetration of the boxes is a whole different situation, though, and is of course something we'd like to improve on.
m.
Loki Software, Inc.
"Sebastian you're in a mess. They called you King of all the Hipsters, is it true or are you still the Queen?" -- B
Neverwinter Nights, last I heard, was going to have all platform support in the same box.
Although it might be nice to be able to point to Linux sales of, say, Quake 3, the problem there is that they were slow in getting it out. Very slow. It wasn't available until several months after the Win32 version. I never saw it on the shelves at CompUSA or BestBuy. I want to buy one copy of a game, and be able to run it on whatever platform I desire. They're doing the right thing with Neverwinter Nights.
Say what you will, but gamers tend to be impatient. I know some people that used linux exclusively and went and shelled out money for windows!!! just so they could play Q3 the day it was out.
I'm posting this blind, since nobody has been modded up to 3 yet.
/bin/truth is out there.
Anyway, Scott Greig mentioned at a talk that he gave at my University that they would be continuing with the multiple platform projects only as long as there were no serious issues in porting the code. If some sort of BeOS-ism or something got in the way that would take them weeks (or maybe only days) to hack around, they'd drop it. The BeOS thing is something of a pet project for one of the developers, and the Linux thing just happens to be working out as they go. Fortunately, they seem to write clean, portable code, so nothing has really come up yet.
The
Just remember to register the game for support... and let them know what your operating system is.
I know I've been filling out 'Linux' under the OSs that I run at home (next to Win9x). I have to believe that when they start to get enough of these in the marketting department, then the engineers start to have the leverage to get managment to try new things.
This space for rent. All reasonable inquiries will be entertained at proprietors discretion.
I don't know, as much as I'd like to support Tux Games, Interplay has lately been tossing in 'extras' when you pre-order games directly from them (priming the pump I suppose), including the two extra CDs they threw in if you pre-ordered the Collectors edition of "Baldur's Gate 2" (one from ordering the Collectors Edition and one from pre-ordering it). These contained two new item vendors (high-priced but fun new items) and the sound track which made it worth while to me.
While I don't agree with these practices, I would still want to see what they might include with "Neverwinter Nights".
This space for rent. All reasonable inquiries will be entertained at proprietors discretion.
Blame the web.
Anyhow, I always preferred to conduct interviews live, and tape-recorded for accuracy. Needless to say, when a developer (or any interviewee) tends to get going, they reveal all sorts of juicy tidbits. In e-mail, they have more time to put thought into their responses, but also tend to self-censor, leading to less revealing interviews.
Follow-up questions rarely happen in e-mail interviews, mostly because the interviewer was so stoked to get the interview, they didn't want to seem to pushy. From a journalistic standpoint, it's the obvious thing to do ... get that story! But it just doesn't happen.
is still not out. Linus has said that it will be released 'when it's done.' I can't imagine how they'll have those kinds of graphics out for Linux without a new kernel. Hopefully Linus will release it soon, Linux users have been waiting for it for over a year.
A deep unwavering belief is a sure sign you're missing something...
BeOS actually does have gamma correction
>>>>>>>>
Really, and you get this info from where?
A deep unwavering belief is a sure sign you're missing something...
Why in god's name would you put an mpeg decoder in the kernel? Stuff like that belongs in userspace.
A deep unwavering belief is a sure sign you're missing something...
While I like the BeOS API, I'd hesitate to say it would be the best way to write a cross-platform game. POSIX, like it or not, is a well-established standard. A game written with strict POSIX and OpenGL complience should be easily portable to BeOS, Windows, Linux, FreeBSD, etc. Games are probably the best place to write portable code, because they don't deal with the OS very much. The only place one would really need to break from standard OpenGL and POSIX routines would be in the OpenGL initialization stage, which isn't a very large part of the overall program.
Still, if you like the BeOS API, there is a cross-platform library called ZooLib that looks an aweful lot like the BeOS API (though the function names are less elegant) and supports X, Windows, MacOS, and BeOS. Also, like the BeOS, it encourages multi-threaded applications and is SMP-friendly. It's still a little immature, and is mostly undocmented, but its progressing, and seems to have a lot of potential. You can find the home page here.
A deep unwavering belief is a sure sign you're missing something...
THe sad part is that it seems QNX RtP's gaming library is growing faster than BeOS's. THey have Quake III, and the UT port is in beta.
A deep unwavering belief is a sure sign you're missing something...
You apparantly missed the subtlty of what I said. I was pointing out that everybody thinks that when Linus says "it's done when it's done" it's a fine thing (as evidenced by the recent "kernel 2.4 is vaporware" article) but when Be says "it's done when it's done" people look on it as more evidence that Be is abandoning BeOS.
A deep unwavering belief is a sure sign you're missing something...
Which I haven't, as they don't exist. I said that QNX has Quake 3 and UT in beta.
A deep unwavering belief is a sure sign you're missing something...
True, but it does do networking, filesystem, and a lot of the other stuff a game needs to do. If you use POSIX for this (as opposed to Win32 APIs!) then porting will be that much easier. I forgot about sound, though. Right now there isn't really a standard for good audio. Of course, you could probably just code for DirectSound, since none of the other audio systems are really as feature complete anyway. (No 3D sound, no dynamic MIDI, etc.)
A deep unwavering belief is a sure sign you're missing something...
Of course, I couldn't really see how they could convert from AD&D 2nd edition to D&D 3rd edition (Wizard's of the Coast dropped the A when they got ahold of TSR)... The only thing I could see you could carry over is your ability scores, but then stuff like 18/50 strength would be more like 19, etc. Thieving abilities wouldn't really transfer, as the new system is entirely skill based. Unless you said every 15% was a skill rank or some such. Dual weilding skill is done completely different, weapon proficiencies are different (not to mention that fighters/paladins/rangers/barbarians all get proficiency in all martial weapons.) and the most non-transferable thing is a multi-class character!
Multi-classing in 3rd edition barely resembles multi-classes in 2nd edition AD&D. Rather than starting in 2 or 3 classes and advancing slowly (and only non-humans could do it.), every time you gain a level, you can choose to increase the level of your current class(es) or add a new one. You can have as many classes as you want, as well as any race being able to be any class, and any race can multi-class(No more annoying dual-classing). (Of course, you end up being level 1/2 in everything if you get every class)
In any case, while it'd be cool to transfer characters from BG2, and you're going to be able to do it, it'll be weird.
The current version of the kernel handles them just fine. Just patch the AGP patches in and install the DRM modules. The 2.4 test* series has been stable for me for the last 10 patches, and the interface won't change for the programmer anyway. And I know Linux will be around 2 or 3 years down the road. I'm not holding my breath for BE OS.
I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?
true, but from a developers standpoint if you approach your design around platform independence, your most likely thinking Windows+Other. In this case they we're probably thinking Linux, and then, I imagine one of the developers got into BeOS and showed that it could be ported to BeOS in X time, they managers realized that it could show a profit, so they said ok.
:). BeOS is really nice, if not a little sparse. however the API that is there is very clean and well thought out.
However I don't understand the lack of MacOS support, I maybe they are unsure if they will need to support OSX, or OS9. If I am right that 95% of the code base can be ported right across there shouldn't be an issue, then again something like threading is likely an issue in OS9, which while I've never writing for I imagine has flaky threading and memory management .
By the way I've ported my own project to Windows, Linux and BeOS, starting in FreeBSD. The Linux port was actually harder then the Windows port, mainly threading libraries and autoconf stuff (didn't need to setup autoconf for windows
I'm rambling now aren't I?
heh
-Jon
this is my sig.
It will be a very different game for many reasons:
(Pardon me while I use terminology that makes itr easier for me... I'm going to clal Bioware's upcoming game NWN2).
(1) NWN was turn based in combat, which leads to invoveld strategy. NWN2 is real-time combat which precludes that level of strategic thinking and detail.
(2) NWN held up to 500 people in the world at once in a commercially maintaiend persistant environment. You could go online and find your friends fairly easily. NWN2 has a designed maximum of 64 players and fans run the servers ala Quake (including tport gates that log you out of one sevre and into another.). Although there are some fan-dreams out there to bring up servers full time and somehow link them together in such a way as to provide a persistant "massively multiplayer" world environment, the hard scaling limits that are inherent in designing for a maximum of 64 players will probably preclude this.
I'm not saying it isn't a grat lookign rpoduct, it is. But the original poster is right, it won't be the same experience as NWN was.
No, NWN did not let people create and swap dungeons. You are thinking of "Unlimited adventures" which was a non-online RPG toll making kit buitl from the same code base-- the old "Gold Box Engine."
NWN was a fixed world. There were some limited sysop commands for creating items and I think monsters on the fly and for moving things around the world, but that was about it (I never sysop'd soI might have missed a few sysop abiltiies. Proabably they coudl edit char sheets, too.)
The rference to the old Unlimtied Advetnures thtough IS a good one. NWN2 is probably most like a modern 3D version of UA with the ability to "Lan Play" witha real-time judge both locally and over the net.
Umm...
What about NetRPG? WebRPG? GRIP? Chat rooms with dice bots?
Lots of people have tried over the years to bring table-top on-line. This is arguably the fanciest attempt to date.
You are correct. See the post above from one of the actual developers.
Which, btw noone has mentioned yet, is that 3D map editor is tile based. Building a 3D environment is as easy as using an old 2D editor was.. you just slap down pre-built world-peices.
:)
This IMO is also the msot significant thign abotu this game as it is going to empower a LARGE number of arm-chair game designers who a renot 3D whizzes to nbonetheless make modules.
A brilliant idea, guys
Isn't it confusing calling it NWN? When i heard this proejct orignally annoucend it was NWN2 and I stil think of it that way.
NWN was (arguably the first) massivley mutli-player RPG and was hosted on AOL (Thats for everyone else, I assume you know this Marc.) It is, in teh end, the REASON this product is called NWN-anything.
I find over-loading the name more then a bit troublesome in trying to dicsuss the history of this game-area with anyone. Maybe I'm alone in thiss
No. Go back and read what was written, dickhead. The interview mentions BeOS in exactly one place (a parenthetical aside, no less). The game's technical spec's page doesn't mention BeOS at all, and only mentions Linux once.
Again, this Slashdot "story" is not about a game being released for BeOS or Linux. This "story" is just Hemos creaming his pants because the president of a big, important game company incidentally mentioned BeOS in a press release about a game that may or may not ever be released for any platform, much less Linux, BeOS, or even Macintosh.
Slashdot is jumping the shark. I'm just driving the boat.
I don't mind the occassional story about Perl 6, or Microsoft's
I just wish they'd stop linking to marketing material for unreleased and unimportant products. This story contains no real information about a game may never be released, will not break any new ground, and which most of us may never bother to play. That doesn't count as "news for nerds" in my book. And linking to marketing material because it incidentally contains both the words "BeOS" and "Linux" is just palm-hair growing masturbation, any way that you look at it.
Slashdot is jumping the shark. I'm just driving the boat.
-- ShadyG
Nerd Rock In Progress
Actually, as of R5, BeOS's multimedia support is lacking... Most videos created using the Media Kit will not play back on most other platforms (Windows and Mac, primarily)...
q 0530.html
http://www.adamation.com/Support/pSFAQ/archive/fa
Ranessin
This will be a godsend for me and a group of my friends. We're all 30-somethings that have been playing a set of D&D campains now for about 5 years in a world our DM has taken about 10 years to develop. Once per month we devote an entire day to get together and play. But due to changing circumstances it looks like our beloved DM will be emigrating from the UK and going to live in Colorado in the US. We're looking at possible ways we could keep the game going and Neverwinter Nights appears to be the strongest candidate. A number of us have broadband at home and we run a mixture of Windows & Linux. So if NN turns out to be as good as we all hope it is, our monthly tradition will be able to continue.
More power to you Bioware
Macka
You can pre-order this game at Tux Games for $46
Tux Games. Your complete source for native Linux games.
The original Neverwinter Nights was one of the first graphical multiplayer games. I want to say it came out around 1988, but I'm no good with dates. Built by SSI, it had gameplay similar to Pools of Radiance, but allowed up to 500 people to connect to a central game server (run by AOL).
NWN was a 16-color DOS-based game that was simply amazing. It was a RPG, but the storyline was rather limited. That didn't matter though, the players stepped in and carried the roleplaying far beyond anything the designers ever intended. This was the first game I ever saw recognise player run guilds and clans.
PVP combat in NWN was nothing like PKing in any other RPG. There was a strategic element that I've never seen in any other game. It wasn't just reaction time or first strike, you actually had to plan your actions.
After AOL moved away from hourly rates they found they could make more money off chat rooms than gaming. Even though it was still running at max capacity almost every night, AOL shut NWN down.
I still know people from that game. Some of them are still members of the same guilds they were in 10+ years ago. We've been waiting for a remake of NWN for a long long time. This will not be that game. This will not be anything close to that game. But it will be nice to revisit the old days. To stroll once more through Triboar and Port Luskan.
Neurosis
BeOS makes perfect sense as a gaming platform more stable than winders and much better multimedia support than either winders or Linux. If more game publishers did this I might have to consider spending some money with the good folks at Be. BTW and OT has anyone had any luck running Red Alert 2 under Wine?
Cypherpunks: Civil Liberty Through Complex Mathematics. Those who live by the sword die by the arrow.
The Linux port of Neverwinter Nights is old news. That announcement has been around since the game was announced. The BeOS port is news to me. Seeems that after the Infinity engine (The engine that powered Baldurs Gate, Planescape, Baldurs Gate II, Icewind Dale) Bioware has learned how to make portable code. (I've heard rumors that the Infinity code is a mess from a portabily standpoint)
There is a good reason to release a Linux version. Without a Linux version there would be a lack of player run servers. Take a look at just about any game that uses player run servers. Most of the servers are UNIX based. I'm sure BioWare is also aware that Linux gamers are hungry for a RPG that isn't nethack.
So far Neverwinter Nights looks great. Just check out this 19 part preview (Got your mpeg player ready?) from Neverwinter Stratics.
I'll be thankful for the Mac version as well as I see myself getting a new Mac (Perhaps a G4 cube with that nice studio display...) as soon as OSX is released.
As for Be, well, there's definite potential there, but I'll leave commenting further to someone who knows more about Be than I.
Check out the preview, you'll be drooling in anticipation in no time.
I'm going to go back in my box and will think within the limits of my box: MS Sucks Linux Good I read too much Slashdot.
Unfortunately, this is a trend that has been going for a long time, and has only been aided by the growth of the www.
It used to be that companies needed magazines and news services to get their name noticed, therefore would submit to a really pointed interview (or at least one that didn't read, as you said, like a press release). However, with the growth of the niche magazine market and the 1000000000000 gamer sites on the Internet, publications now need to fight to get interviews from relevant companies. If they go too hard on the interview, they just might never get another one, therefore denying them site traffic/buyers for the their magazine. Therefore, they basically kiss up and allow their publication to be used as a secondary marketing platform, instead of a informative source for fans and enthusiasts.
There are some good sites and zines out there that do excellent interviews, however they tend to be the exception rather than the rule. Sometimes, the over-abundance of publications can hurt the quality and veracity of information being released. ugh. FYI - if you look around, you'll notice that this trend is not specific to gaming (or even just computing). Go to your local magazine rack and look through at "exclusive interviews" and you'll notice that they read more like pre-reviewed and press-agent prepared puff pieces, rather than a source of good information.
"Moving through the masses like a fish through water." syrup
I like the sound of this game, too. I like D&D, and I've wanted to try out a decent online game in the genre for some time. I know that there is Ultima Online, which is perhaps a little dated (am I wrong?) and also Asheron's Call, the Microsoft game, but ideally I'd like something on Linux because I plan, one day when I have the courage, to get rid of my Windows partition. Also, this game's website mentions that the player can control the plot of the game, and write it herself. Is that true? I'd be interested to know how that works, because I would like to make my own atmospheric scenarios and share them with my friends. Oh, and coo, it looks as though it has good graphics too! heheh :)
--Anticipation of a New Lover's Arrival, The
Why can't game magazines actually ask questions that follow up on previous answers, challenge the developers to say something more than what products they have in the pipeline, etc.? If we're really moving to the point where everyone can run a graphical MUD server on their Linux box/OSX machine/embedded BeOS refrigerator, wouldn't it be nice if the interviewer asked questions like "how does it work?" or "why are you making this sort of game?"
Instead, we get answers like this:
"Game sales have been at 92.3% optimization for the past three fiscal quarters. Market segmentation is decreasing as more developers work hard on great mega-games like our soon-to-be-released 'Everplaying Sites.' Currently, our primary action item is to decrease the potentially tremendous negative impact of the D&D movie on the perception of gaming in the girlfriend-who-was-dragged-to-the-movie market."
I'm not trying to start a flame war here -- didn't anyone else think that this "interview" read like a press release?
Think again, Lionhead will release Black and White for Windows, Linux, BeOS, Playstation and probably other platforms.
Monkey sense
didn't he say that the Linux platform was disappointing? Doesn't it worry everyone that Q3 didn't even do well in the stores, or is this going to be a Windows game w/Linux binaries on the net? I don't mind doing it that way myself you can then run the game on both platforms...
.02
I really like the fact that they are supporting alternative OS's, but are we supporting the developers enough for them to want to continue the development for us?
Just my worthless
Ok as I read through the comments there are a few points that I'd like to clear up as untrue.
1) The NWN engine is an internally developed engine based on the omen engine which powered MDK2
2) NWN is not the sequel to BG2. It is an entirely new game based on the 3rd edition AD&D and has nothing to do with the BG story.
3) The plan, as last revealed to the employees, is to ship all 4 binaries in one box, thus all versions will be complete and shipped at the same time.
** please note all comments are my own opinion and may not reflect the official stance of BioWare Corp., Interplay, or any other related companies.
Marc Audy
BioWare Corp.
Programmer - MDK2:Armageddon