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HP to Use Debian for Linux Development
wfrp01 writes: "Bruce Perens gives us the skinny on Linux Daily News. Notice his use of the term GNU/Linux in a business context." Of course, HP's printers are still shipping with Windows-only drivers... and Windows-only configuration tools... and described as "Linux-compatible" in their advertisements.
Of course if you really want a Linux-compatible printer, you buy a Lexmark. Their Z52 Linux driver dropped right in after I installed ghostscript, and even worked with USB.
Q: What does GNU/Linux mean?
A: GNU's not Unix Linux
Q: Could you elaborate?
A: GNU's not Unix's not Unix Linux
Q: That's odd.
A: RMS says it reminds people about their freedom.
Q: Of course, thank you.
As several people have already pointed out, there are official drivers right now that work very well with Ghostscript. While these drivers are not quite open source, they come fairly close. No binary-only drivers like the Lexmark Z52, these come with full source and rights to do your own modifications. The one restriction keeping them from being fully dfsg compliant is the requirement that they be used only with HP printers. The nice engineers at HP are very aware of the advantages of moving to a true free software model, and are busy shepherding this through the corporate bureaucracy.
All in all, I'm pleased and impressed with HP's support of Linux and free software. Given the context they're operating in, I'm not surprised that it's taking time to do things right, and I'm willing to grant them that.
LILO boot: linux init=/usr/bin/emacs
We've been working with HP's LaserJet division to improve support for their printers. Some of the work is starting to trickle over to the DeskJet Printers but that is a seperate division. Please have a look at http://hp.sourceforge.net for information. ben@valinux.com
As for config tools, there's been a Linux version of JetAdmin for some time now; also, their network printers from the 4000-range on up usually have web-based configuration these days which is also Linux compatible (and Solaris, and AIX and QNX and possibly even WebTV and Sega Dreamcast-compatible). Windows and Netware only need more elaborate config tools because with a few exceptions, client machines needed a print server to go through because the printers didn't support a protocol the client OS could speak to directly.
As for drivers, what's a Linux driver in this case? You can send PostScript right to any networked HP printer made in the last 3 years, and at least half of them from before that. What is missing are supported printcap entries for accessing advanced features like multiple trays, collating, sorting, duplexing and stapling. That would be nice to see.
Of course, HP's printers are still shipping with Windows-only drivers... and Windows-only configuration tools... and described as "Linux-compatible" in their advertisements.
While this is true, HP has pledged support for ALL its printers, heck, Bruce even works for HP now. The fact that the printers are being advertised as Linux-compatible is a big bonus - it gets the name "Linux" out to the public at large. This is called branding.
We have waited a long time (at least I have) for things like this to come about. Cut HP some slack. They are a big company, it will take them time to change their packaging and processing to include Linux drivers on the discs that ship with the printers.
I am more of the position: "Hey HP! Thanks for doing this, I am going to support your company because you support my favoured OS!"
(Maybe I am just over-reacting here, or maybe I have become jaded by the number of unjust flames I have seen originating from slashdot...)
Try to hack my 31337 firewall!
I've been to the support pages and inquired about linux drivers. A few months ago, I got a variety of reasons for not having linux support for DeskJets. One of them being that linux was considered a varient of unix and printers on unix systems were considered to be outputting 50k+ pages a month. More than what the DeskJet was spec'd for. Didn't matter that I informed them I was using a linux box as a workstation. I then started e-mailing for developer support and got nowhere there. I even took the time to examine the comments in the latest Ghostscript code and found that the developer had an extremely difficult time getting info from HP to build a better driver.
HP deskjets, according to a technician I met at a recent tech conference, informed me that deskjets have a proprietary way of mixing ink on the page to produce high quality output. It's an example they use to explain why their print quality is better than say Epson even though the competitor may have a higher number of dpi on their product. This jives with the Ghostscript comments I read.
Getting the same bang for your buck with a laserjet is no big thing to do on linux. It's when you try to do it on a DeskJet that linux just can't compete and that issue rests solely on HP imho. Providing support on getting linux to run on a PC is one thing. Getting them to develop quality linux drivers for their consumer printers is another.
I don't want knowledge. I want certainty. - Law, David Bowie
Gee, maybe they figured that Linux users could actually use the Internet and get the Linux drivers. You are aware that HP is the only printer company (at least that I know of) that is officially supporting Linux, don't you? Do a search for "linux" on the HP web pages and you get a lot of stuff. Do that on the Epson pages and you get zip. Look here for the actual open source drivers on sourceforge.
This was precisely the reason that I bought an HP printer recently when my Epson finally gave up the ghost.
So to Bruce: Know that at least in this one case, the fact that you're there and that HP is supporting Linux has helped an actual sale. Even if you insist on the silly "GNU/Linux" moniker, I can still respect that! :-)
Someone should create a form based template with a generic based letter with something like...
Sounds cheesy as all hell, but I'm sure customer service reps, and sales people would surely respond after getting slashdotted with a shitload of emails telling them to wake the fsck up.
Want Root?
There is HP WebJetAdmin for Linux here.
And of course the old standby telnet is very useable under Linux.
As for drivers, the LJ 5/6 drivers that come with the last few RedHat releases work fine for me.
Phear The Phat Penguin
What most people mean by this is the non-postscript printers -- the inexpensive inkjet models which for the most part lately have turned out to be WinPrinters.
Hey HP: If you really want us to believe you when you say you are jumping into the whole open source thing, how about contributing (GPLed if you like) ghostscript drivers for your deskjets? A lot of us would sit up and take notice if you did, and it really can't be that hard to do (given that you guys have all of the documentation we don't).
I prefer HP's inkjet technology, but support for Epsons in ghostscript is far better.
My eventual goal was to port the whole thing to C++/Gtk--, non-LPR:NG based setups and the other UNIX systems we supported as long as Gtk was available on them. All the stuff I did was very prototype-level code and it doesn't seem to have advanced at all since I left the company. You can find the drivers at http://www.printers.ibm.com/r5psc.NSF/Web/nppsdr.
Of course, IBM Austin's been cranking out a lot of printer drivers by porting the old OS/2 OMNI driver to GhostScript. If you watch freshmeat or lwn.net at all, you'll see new releases of this driver announced at regular intervals.
Driving printers is a major area where Linux lags behind Windows and OS/2 -- I got to work on those archetectures as well, while in PSC, and the design of the printer subsystem is actually pretty slick. X has Xprt, which seems to do approximatley the same thing, but no one has adopted it. Fortunately we're starting to see movement in this arena at the widget library level, which is better than nothing. I'd still like to see an elegant print rendering system that doesn't require any specific widget set to work, though.
I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?
shoot, if a printer is networkable and speaks postscript, are the tools for printer configuration that ship with linux not good enough already?
Last time I checked, a CMYK (i.e. color) laser printer cost well into four figures, too much for a home consumer's budget. Many of the CMYK inkjet printers are often called "GDI" printers (i.e. Winprinters), which means they connect through a parallel port and speak not PCL, not PostScript, but a proprietary language whose only primitive is horizontal strips of pixels one print-head tall. This is why you need (1) Ghostscript to render PS files to bitmaps, and (2) the printer driver to send the bitmaps to the printer. Printer makers often neglect to specify the interface from the computer to the printer, making it hard to develop (2).
Will I retire or break 10K?
The problem is that many (maybe even all of the current HP models) low cost inkjets (and some lasers from other brands) use a host based print engine to reach the highest resolution and color depths, and especially the best speed. Most are limited to about 300x300 in DOS, Linux, or any other operating system that doesn't have the drivers to print full speed and full resolution. Because networked printers generally are used by workgroups, they are more expensive and capable of higher loads, and thus have more processing power built in. But for ink jets (and many other parallel/USB/single user printers), you can use the host computer to do complex processing to offset costs. But Linux cannot do that processing unless the printer manufacturer releases the details necessary to process the print jobs.
Isn't that the way is usually is ? Things are not Linux compatible.. linux is -compatible instead :)
Probable impossibilities are to be preferred to improbable possibilities.
Aristotele
Well, if HP and Bruce are serious about the "real" name, I should start seeing GNUs spray-painted on the sidewalks next to IBM's penguins, right?
sulli
RTFJ.
Dealing with printer drivers on Linux, I've had the most success using the CUPS printer system. It replaces the standard Unix lp* tools, adds a neat web interface for printer configuration, ships with a heap of drivers supporting most of available laser printers. Support for spooling via samba is also possible.
^]:wq!^M
They already have. Here's a link to the project. You'll need Ghostscript 5.5. They've released it under a modified BSD license.
I got my Linux laptop at System76.
It's good HP is facing Linux now. I work for them (up until 3pm today, THANKS FOR THE LAYOFF CARLY!) and it's been a real pain in the booty explaining to people that no the hp equipment isn't supported for linux, but "most likely" it will work or there's a driver with your distro. HP's been making alot of bad decisions lately (besides closing operations in this state and offering to move me to kentucky, YEAH RIGHT, let me get right on that). The quality of support on products has gone to null, the products themselves aren't as good as they were (at least with the lower end stuff). One thing that's been hp's niche is what the name says, expensive but you get what you pay for. Now it's kind of hit and miss as far as the quality goes. Anyways, my bloody point is it's nice to see them making a decision that heads in the right direction. My advice to any /.'s though is stay away from anything HP that's priced the same as the competitors, it's junk. The stuff you lay down some green for is still the quality products you've come to expect from HP.
Beware blue cats moving at