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Nevada Lawmakers Nearer To OK'ing Net Betting
jyuter writes: "Nevada has approved in theory to license on-line gambling sites. It will probably take a while for them to actually start licensing since they need (among other things) "resonable assurences" that the vendors can prohibit minors. One lawyer even suggested "biometrics" or a fingerprint scan to detect minors, or GPS to determine if the person playing is in a legal state." The word "spoof" keeps hurling itself across my line of sight. (Should the state get to charge people $500,000 every two years for operating a business without toxic waste? Talk about a barrier to entry!)
I don't doubt for one moment that the mafia runs the games, or that the regulators know that. My take on it is that the legal, fair games are nevertheless so profitable that the mafia wants in. It's really quite clever; they've created a way for dishonest greedy people to make money legally and honestly. I really miss living in Nevada...they have a great attitude there.
The mob is gone. Oh, there are a couple of old mob figures around, but they're impotent these days. They just weren't able to survive the publicly traded casino--it has no kneecaps to break, etc. This weakened them enough that gaming control was able to mop up.
These days, they're only around as comic relief--the occasional news story as some 70 year old hobbles up to another's driveway, leaning on a cane with one hand while shooting with another, over some slight from the past.
while I'm at it, this is a bad idea. Las Vegas is *not* in the gambling business. It's in the fantasy business; gaming is just part of the fantasy. You step off the plane and enter an alternate world for 2 days, a week, or whatever. Destination gambling is fundamentally different than local gambling, which is predatory in nature.
hawk
> my $40 in gambling money is purchasing me a
>few hours of fun at the blackjack table
My goodness, you must be a good player, and lucky! Last time I was in a casino, $40 would
have played TWO HANDS of blackjack.
I couldn't believe the $20 and $50 minimums at tables, and that there were no $5 tables!
This was at a riverboat in Mississippi, but
I've seen a similar in Shreveport. I realize
if you live in Vegas you can still find $2.00
blackjack. I live in AZ but haven't checked out
the Indian casinos.
I don't care much for gambling places. I like the games themselves, but I don't like the depressingly mundane (yet garish) surroundings.
The "entertainment" in those places is always
meant to appeal to one or two previous generations.
-fb Everything not expressly forbidden is now mandatory.
I've been gambling on the net for quite a while now.
I'm on my third DSL provider.
Know what I like about atheists? I've yet to meet one that believes God is on their side.
...that anything I say with a subject like that will be modded up as funny!
Whaddya say, moderators? C'mon, eleven!
:)
--
Liberty uber alles.
Should the state get to charge people $500,000 every two years for operating a business without toxic waste?
Well, they haven't been able to get the online buffets working properly...
It doesn't mean much now, it's built for the future.
In the US, it's not 'illegal' per-se to make bets. It's illegal to run a book. You cannot sit there and take bets from people. Online gambling is HUGE, and *anyone* with a credit card an an Internet connection can already gamble and bet on sports. The only news is that the servers/business offices will be able to be in the US rather than having to run offshore. The high barrier to entry just means that only the rich can get into the business. If you want to go offshore, anyone with a hundred grand can get into the sportsbook business; the only hard part is the marketing.
Tax. Period.
There is already a *large* international online gambling market. The only thing *any* jurisdiction gets out of not permittiong 'online' gambling in their state/country is to force prospective businesses to leave the country to somewhere they can run their business legally.
It makes it makes it no easier or harder for someone to gamble online. It's just as convenient for you to gamble online now as it would be if Vegas was doing it.
What most slashdotters seem to not realize is that online gambling has been around for quite a while and is only becoming more common.
The big problem right now is that it's difficult for the common man to tell which of the online "casinos" are truly credible. Most of the casinos are in off-shore havens (Carribean, Central America), and there's no effective way to tell if you've been cheated. (Sorry sir, back luck on drawing that virtual 5 of spades!) On top of all of that, many people have reported problems getting payouts from certain organizations. If you lose, your credit card is debited. If you win, you may or may not see a check in three to four weeks.
The point of all of this is that Nevada gambling would at the least be regulated, accredited, and relatively trustworthy. There's so much money to be made from legal forms of gambling that none of the big players would risk their license over trying to cheat.
Is online gambling an evil? Maybe. But Nevada online gambling is a lesser evil.
The "correct" way to say Nevada;
Ney-va-tha with the "th" said with a lisp.
If you speak Spanish that is.
Amen.
Actually, I have fond memories of my Dad teaching me (at age 7-8) how to play poker, blackjack, and roulette.
After spending some time taking my pennies, we both noticed that he was doing well, and so he started teaching me why the house always won. "Daddy, what are the green numbers on the roulette wheel for?" is actually a pretty natural question for a seven-year-old.
So we switched sides, and I played the "house" in blackjack and roulette the next time. All of a sudden, my "luck" changed and I "won" my pennies back. And he taught me that luck had nothing to do with it. If you play enough hands and have an advantage, you will win. And the rules are set up so that the house has an advantage.
Was it real probability theory? Not really. But when a kid's just discovered fractions, it's pretty easy to show him that 18/38 is less than 18/36. If betting on black/red is like flipping a coin, it's a fair game. Except that two out of every 38 spins, the coin is designed to land on its edge.
Since then, I've gone to casinos and had plenty of fun. But I've always gone in with cash, and with the notion that my $40 in gambling money is purchasing me a few hours of fun at the blackjack table - in the same way that the same $40 could purchase me few hours of fun in a bar, at the movies, or at the arcade.
But the computer said there was! ;-)
Actually, I was aiming for (+1, Funny), but someone could get an easy (+1, Insightful) by pointing out that what I just described as "preposterous, who'd be dumb enough to play cards when you can't see the cards being dealt and you don't have the source code of the algorithm that deals the cards?" is exactly what players of VLTs (Video Lottery Terminals) and electronic slot machines are doing right now in the real world.
Hey, what's wrong with the mob?
Compare the payouts on the mob-run "numbers game" in with the payout ratio of the government-run lotteries. The mob offers better odds, according to what appears to be expert testimony on the subject:
SOURCE: Q&A session on the National Gambling Impact Survey, March 17, 1998
Given the choice, it looks like the mob offers a superior product in the gambling market. Which reminds me, both the government and the Mafia have programmes whereby they offer "protection" you didn't ask for in exchange for "protection money" you have to pay. Both have the power to see that Bad Things Happen to you if you don't pay up. What's the difference, really? (There are days when I think the only reason the government fights organized crime is because it can't stand the competition(Yeah, it was Reno, and they had a $5 table. I could hack a $20 minimum with $100 to play with, but anything beyond that is out of my league. It stops being fun when it's about real money. If I wanna do that, I'll play the stock market :)
> I like the games themselves, but I don't like the depressingly mundane (yet garish) surroundings. The "entertainment" in those places is always meant to appeal to one or two previous generations
You have a gift for understatement :)
Four of Hearts, Seven of Clubs.
Dealer is showing:
Unknown card, Six of Diamonds
Will you: Hit, Stand, or Double-down?
(Double-down)
Host: dealer.casino.nv.us contacted...
18K read (at 943 bytes/sec)
Player draws: Twelve of Clubs.
Player has: Four of Hearts, Seven of Clubs, Twelve of Clubs. Total=22.
Player Busts.
Dealer draws: Ace of Hearts.
Dealer stands.
Dealer turns over unknown card: Four of Clubs.
Dealer has: Four of Clubs, Six of Diamonds, Nine of Hearts. Total=21.
Dealer wins.
Wager again? Yes/No.
("Aaw, shit, again?!?!?! I always draw a twelve when I'm winning!")
Actually, there are several differences. The Mafia doesn't insist on knowing every detail of my finances, as long as they get paid. The Mafia doesn't care what chemicals I may choose to ingest in private. And I don't think even the Mafia could pull off as huge a pyramid scheme as Social Security.
How to solve most of our problems: 1.Lots of nuclear plants. 2.Cure aging.
I keep hearing "spoofing" more and more from the non-technical, although they have no idea what it means. Unfortunately we had a CTO who, whenever anyone mentioned security, would say "We're not going to be spoofed," so now our CEO has to ask about it all the time....
Packet sniffing seems to be making its way around as well, and is equally misunderstood. Maybe it's the familiarity with words like "spoof" or "sniff" that's helping them make the rounds, but either way it's getting annoying.
If it's on the net, minors will find it and gain access to it. Any kid that's reasonably determined will be able to find his way in - have they not learned this by now?
Ok, so you have biometrics. Get a piece of tape, take your parent's fingerprint off their cereal bowl. Big deal.
The point is, the net affords a certain level of anonyminity to its users, and no matter what protection measures they implement, there's no way to stop everything.
This is asking for some BIG legal battles.
I used to do programming for dog tracks. VictoryLand, while I was working there, would average $1.5 million a week. Birmhingham made about $1.8 million its opening night (Breaking a record.) Gulf Greyhound Park in Texas broke $2 Million its first night, a week after Birmingham. $500,000 every 2 years all of a sudden doesn't sound like so much...
I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?
This is really a bad news for all gambling addicts. Most of them can manage not to go near a casino, but with that even being near a computer could be "dangerous"...
Opus: the Swiss army knife of audio codec
Nevada already has such a favourable tax climate for business due to the casinos that the relocation of would-be online betting parlours to the state could have a very beneficial effect on the existing, non-betting-oriented businesses, particularly in booming Clark County (home to Las Vegas and Henderson, the fastest-growing collection of ugly tract homes in the world).
The question is not whether Nevada will legalise online gambling, but whether this legality will stand when the inevitable challenges happen in Federal court.
As for minors getting in to online gambling illicitly... the way most casinos are set up now could be used as a model:
If nothing else, they could use an age verification system as they do on porn sites.
OTOH, 13-year-olds with too much time and money on their hands vs. the authorities and their slow reactions, especially programmatic reactions...'tis no contest whatsoever.
Zaphod B
Zaphod B
When duplication is outlawed, only outlaws will have
Ever heard of video poker?
"Prefiero morir de pie que vivir siempre arrodillado!"
This was just on CNBC... apparently the assumed front runner for doing the security development took off today on the news despite the fact that this is at LEAST a year or two out and that there's no guarantee that they'd be the company that most people used.... Gotta love that market.
Nevada is not trying to license gambling sites in other states. Federal law says that interstate gambling is illegal. If you want to place a bet with a legititmate sports betting establishment in Nevada, then you must physically be in Nevada when you place that bet. You cannot call from New York to place a bet on who will win the Stanley Cup.
For an online sports betting page to be legally operating in Nevada, they must be able to prove to the gaming commission that all bets placed on their site originated from with the state of Nevada.
Other states that wish to implement online casinos, sports betting, etc. have the same burden of proof. They must be able to show that an online wager was placed from within the same state as the online wagering establishment.
That's my story, and I'm sticking to it!
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...they essentially legalized gambling in the entire frikkin' planet?
The $500,000 fee is to ensure that only serious, committed Mafiosi with a proven customer service track record can get involved.
I have to say: what's all the fuss about? We have online betting here in the UK, in fact the government recently lowered gambling taxes to dissuade people from betting using off-shore services. I'm known to occasionally have a little flutter on the Grand Prix myself (except you Americans and your CART racing seem to have led JP Montoya into bad habits since his amazing performance in F3000).
Anyway, don't most states in the US run a lottery? In what way is this not gambling?
--
Blaming GW Bush for the Iraq war is like blaming Ronald McDonald for the poor quality of food.
Or maybe they want to detect dirty fingers to identify teenagers ...
"A door is what a dog is perpetually on the wrong side of" - Ogden Nash
Programmers have proved for years that they can get their games to 'cheat'. Many of them substitute 'cheating' for difficulty levels rather than improving the game AI. Who's going to trust these guys NOT to cheat? At least in a real casino you can WATCH them pull your card off the deck. Would you play blackjack where the dealer was behind a screen and handed you a card from behind there? Of course not. Same thing here. I'm all for the concept of e-gambling, but there would need to be some SERIOUS assurances that everything was on the up-and-up. I'm thinking open-source casino software.
"Property is theft, therefore theft must be property, right?"
It comes down to this (IANAL, of course):
Is it OK to place a bet over the phone from another state that doesn't allow gambling?
If yes, then go to reasonable lengths to secure ID, etc., if not, I don't see how a computer connection is any different from a phone connection. You're in one state, completing a transaction in another state. It's either OK or not, regardless of whether you use the web (or at least should be, IMHO).
I'm over hnyah, and you're over hnnyah.
+5:offtopic,but anti-American
I see no reason why gambling should not be universally accepted. Why shouldn't minors be allowed to gamble? Gambling fosters an intense devoition to math, which more of our students and young children need. It also teaches them an appreciation for money - they have to save some of their allowance to spend on other entertainments; they cannot gamble it all away. A game of cards is the best teacher for statistics. Some people believe gambling is a tool of the devil, or a satanic ritual, or even an addictive habit. Those of us who are enlightened and know the truths about Darwin, and social habits, and the Bible, are not stumped by these elaborate christian winged throwbacks. Why not even have a gambling class in school? I hope Nevada puts all its casinos on the web. The casinos I've been in are all wholesom family centers of enjoyment. Yes, there are sections of scantly clad women, but you just have to keep your children away from there. Gambling could be just the thing we need to get our children interested in school, science, and economics. I'm all for it!
Unless they can figure out how to ship me the kick-butt $3.99 buffet they have.
Free unix account: freeshell.org
Unless there's some wacky tax thing that I don't fully understand, the State doesn't pull any tax dollars off of gambling online. No State revenue from gambling is a Bad Thing (tm). Want an example, take Hwy 50 going east out of Fallon. Last time I was down that way, the road was in a horrible state of disrepair. If these online casinoes start to crop up all over the United States, then the Great State of Nevada could stand to lose millions annually. Legal gambling in other states = bad.
Nevada has no "W" in it, so stop pronouncing it like it does. Nevada != Nuh vaw duh
Why is it when I hit ^R that ZSH calls me a cocksucker?