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VeriSign Accuses Competitors Of 'Slamming'
Da_Big_G writes: "Newsbytes is carrying this story about how Verisign (owner of Network Solutions) is accusing other registrars (particularly register.com and Tucows/OpenSRS) of impropriety in transferring domains. This is in response to those registrar's complaints over Verisign's new transfer procedure which makes it nearly impossible to transfer a domain away from NetSlo." sally_tor supplied more URLs: Verisign's complaint letter, and a draft response in the making. So let's get this straight: Verisign charges 5 times more than other registrars do, provides much worse service (for instance, my preferred domain registrar provides DNS service, email redirection, prompt web-based changes - all for $12/year), is now interfering with transfers by requiring additional "confirmations" via a system that doesn't accept those confirmations, holds onto domain names after they expire so that it can a) sell the names themselves for inflated prices and b) sell the service of watching for the names to expire, and they have the gall to complain that people are leaving them for other registrars!
The domain resellers in competition with Network Solutions are understandably unhappy, as reported in this article at Internet News. If you're not pleased either, you can sign this letter by e-mailing your name, e-mail address, and company affiliation to william@userfriendly.com. (No relation I can see to www.userfriendly.org.)
Network Solutions squatted my domain name for over 1 year. I couldn't register it with another registrar because it still showed up a year with Network Solutions being a registrar... even a year after I had let it expire with them. Network Solutions' explanation? It was "on hold" pending deletion... supposedly actual deletion is so intensive that they don't do it on a regular basis. They wouldn't delete my domain name so I could get a better deal and better service from any number of other (new) registrars out there. Finally, the notion of faxing ID and requesting a transfer took hold.
--
$x='S24;r)>63/* h@<5+oZ)32"5cz';$me='phroggy'x$];
$x=~y+ -xz+\0-Tx+;print$_^chop$me for split'',$x;
I got mail from NetSol asking me to renew a domain name which I have already transferred to another registrar (gandi.net) a few months earlier. I wonder what would have happened if someone actually tried to pay in a case like this - would they accept the payment? This is something that is actually likely to happen in a big company.
P.S. I really recommend gandi.net - they're a bunch of french open source geeks like us (one of the partners in gandi is the one behind the eu.org free DNS).
-
Stop worrying about the risks of nuclear power and start worrying about the risks of not using nuclear power.
VeriSign is claiming that their competitors are blatantly defrauding them, and that the evidence provided to VeriSign of the customers wanting to switch is falsified. Looks to me as if VeriSign is the one whose lying. Their analysis of the evidence (as presented in the letter) is bogus.
one provided copies of several e-mails described as having come from more than 20 different customers-all using exactly the same wording and type font; and another provided identical e-mails, all dated after the VeriSign Registrar's request, and claimed that they showed prior customer intent to transfer
Now, must ask VeriSign, how many ways are there to word a registrar switch? "Dear Verisign - we are dumping your ass for a better registrar?". No, they're all probably a standard business letter layout, with a body of:
Dear $ACCOUNTMANAGER
We are switching to using $REGSTRAR as our domain name registrar.
Thank you
$CUSTOMERNAME
There aren't that many ways to do it. In fact, if a large ISP was switching a lot of customers (read the main article), the wording should be the same. And as for same font, umm, wouldn't that be more dependant on the person printing them out? Last time I checked, email didn't embed the font (unless you use html, and not even always then), and that the font would be the same if they were printed by the same person. Nothing unusual at all in that. Hey, here's an open offer to VeriSign: 5 bucks if the font isn't Courier. My $5 is perfectly safe...
Now, the second set of emails being exactly identical is a bit erie, but as I said above, there are two good explinations: there are very few ways to politely word "go f*ck off verisign", and if a big ISP were switching customers they should be identical. As for the dates, well, if someone forwarded them, the email header would have the date of forwarding. And if they were printed, then they would all have the print date. Either way, it would be weird if the dates were before (not after, as stated) VeriSign's request, since that would mean the competing registrar anticipated VeriSign's request.
I doubt that Mr. Lynn (the President of ICANN) won't catch on to VeriSign's obvious attempt at fooling him. And I doubt that VeriSign will like the consequences.
Tell me about it. I registered a domain a couple of months ago, after having waited for it for years (some South African dude nicked it right before my eyes..).
Record expires on 02-Feb-2001.
Record created on 02-Feb-1999.
That's from a whois of the domain I did the 5:th of May!
A few days after that record semi-expired, listing only NS, not the original owner.
Not until the 18:th of May was the domain finally released and I could register it, so they held on to it for about three months after the record expired. Sucked.
Belief is the currency of delusion.
As much as I hate Network Solutions (and I really do), I just transferred my domain away from them to Register.com and had no problems from either registrar...it happened pretty much as it should, which was a nice relief, after hearing all of these horror stories...
Just my perspective...
Try to get another password (from the new interface, the "forgotten password" thingie), maybe it'll reset something in your account. It worked for me once.
:)
In extreme resort, you can still send them a fax. Did this a few weeks ago and they responded immediately to the problem.
Other than that, joker.com has always given me satisfaction, and the root server is 500 meters from my place
/max
-- It's always darker before it goes pitch black.
There's two versions of the interface, you have to use the same interface that you used to register the domains. It's kind of irritating really.
I registered several of domains through joker.com and now their website doesn't show that I own them. Yesterday it showed I owned them, but then I'd go to change one and it would say I had none. I guess they are working on the interface - but at least post a notice on the website! I mailed support and haven't heard back... so think twice about joker.com. Still, I'm never going to use NetSol again unless I'm forced to... talk about horrible service, horrible interface, and scummy spam-mail campains.
-- Virtual Windows Project
In the past, as a technical contact for a large number of domains that I may or may not have been the registrant of, I could make changes to the domain's contact assignments and DNS info via e-mail (using PGP to authenticate the request, of course). This was good because it could be automated and repeated without having any bit of information that was unique to each domain.
Under the new/recent system, domains registered are assigned an account number (it's possible to have 1 account number to N domains) with a password, and that information is required to make changes to the domain. The technical contact no longer has the authority to make changes unless he/she is given the username/password by the registrant.
There are definite security advantages here, don't get me wrong. But after pressing the NetSol tech on it for a while, he admitted that they have no provision for folks like me that may need to update a large number of domains at once. We were able to determine together that my options are:
A) obtain the account info and password for every domain and make the change myself, or
B) send the change information to every customer/domain registrant, and ask them to change it.
The horror or either option should be apparent, especially in that neither scales well at all.
To make things worse, NetSol is planning ("in the next few months", according to the tech) to assign account numbers and passwords to all the old-school domain registrations that can still be updated by e-mail. This will finally lock me out (as the tech contact) of any control for all of our hosted domains until I contact each customer and ask them to hand over their password.
Don't mean to whine - you can see where I'm going here. I'm wondering if anyone knows of an alternate registrar that allows e-mail based change requests (preferrably with PGP) or otherwise provides some tools to ISPs for bulk updates?
Who is NetSol complaining to? I'm sure the ISP that's about to lose my business because NetSol has refused to transfer my domain for 2- or 3- MONTHS will want to contact them as well.
NetSol has ignored approvals from me, from my existing ISP, ignored customer service queries about why they're failing to live up to their contract. I'm sure they also wrote the contract so they don't have to do a damn thing.
But the ISP that's going to have to cut a refund check because they can't set up www.mydomain.com isn't a party to that contract, and they're understandably pissed but they also understand you don't purchase a commercial web hosting contract to get email and web space under their domain name.
For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong. -- H L Mencken
Quick, please post the name/address of your company, I want some free cash too!
Why not sue NetSol for trademark infringement if they don't let go of your domain name?
That's happened to me, too. Some time before the expiry date of mutopiaproject.org, I attempted to transfer it to Register.com, only to have Network Solutions send me an email several days later, declining the transfer on the grounds that the account was not in a paid state. After three transatlantic phone calls, I resigned myself to having to sign up with Network Solutions for another year, and I paid by credit card through their website. Some time later, I received an email from them saying that the credit card transaction had been declined. I had to make yet another transatlantic phone call, during which I was told that "We've been having problems with credit cards being declined in the last few days, we'll put it though again ThankYouForCallingVerisign".
Separately from this, I've had quite a lot of problems with their "Mail-From" and "Crypt-PW" authentication systems, which seem to only work part of the time. Basically, whenever you change the details of your domain name, they send you a confirmation email, and you have to reply with the appropriate text depending on which authentication system you use. I had a period of about a week where neither system seemed to be working, though I tried repeatedly, and then suddenly I did the same thing for the 10th time and it just worked.
My advice to anyone who wants to register a domain name is this: don't touch Network Solutions with a barge poll; go to a different registrar, e.g. register.com.
perl -e 'fork||print for split//,"hahahaha"'
- "They have sought to obfuscate by justifying their policy (citing) a problem that doesn't even exist," [said by Tucows President and CEO]
Michael's simply unobfuscating it for you.--
totalnic is great and their support is amazing
http://www.totalnic.net
From my experience, NSI is very knowledgable about fraud.
We've had a slew of "invoice moments" over the past several years dealing with NSI's unique practice of sending an invoice to multiple parties (admin, tech, and billing contacts).
As I'm listed as the admin contact for a good amount of domains (having built the first ISP in these parts and dealt primarily with business accounts), I updated my NIC handle to have my current address and company two years ago when I took on a new position/company.
Suddenly, the NSI deliquent-looking domain deletion scare invoices started coming in to my new employer (for domains that had nothing to do with that company). If you've never worked in a good sized company, let me tell you how much fun it is explaining why all these bills are coming in for things that appear to be outside projects (especially when they belong to other well-known companies in town).
"Why are we getting billed for Youknowwho's domains?" "What do you mean, ignore the invoices? We can't do that. We're accounting!" "What do you mean you can't make them stop coming?" "How are we to believe that you didn't incur the expense on our behalf? It says our name right there (it sure does)."
I had numerous discussions with the CFO, COO and CEO explaining that these were bogus invoices (hard to believe, yes, from a "real" company) double billed, and only received by us because I was left as the admin contact for the domain. (The only solution I found was getting myself removed from the domains as admin contact - using multiple NIC handles is a pain, and since I've got a single number NIC handle, it's no fun to go get a 5-digit one).
And then the real fun comes when you found out that the idiots in accounting went ahead and paid them... and so did the real owner of the domain... and NSI pocketed the bonus.
Of course, anyone who gets compensated under government contract, and then turns around and double bills the users for what they're doing under contract, ought to have the double billing scam down well.
*scoove*
Last month, I was going through my own records at NetSol to see which of my domains were in need of renewal, when I found one had actually been taken from me. It turns out as part of a "bulk transfer" to Register.com, one of the domains I owned had been transferred not just to Register.com, but to another registrant as well. I was never informed of this transfer (much less asked for approval), but it took place anyway.
After tons of phone calls, e-mails, and faxes, I finally manged to get them to return control of the domain after challenging them to provide some shred of evidence that I had actually authorized the change. They never really came forward as to what happened, but with the ease at which the domain was taken originally, I'm actually very glad that NetSol is taking these steps.
I put in a transfer over a month ago away from NetSol and it still hasn't gone through. Now it's past the renewal date and NetSol says not to worry about the "Final Notice" letters that my domain service is going to be shut down. The person I talked to said it's normal to continue receiving these letters even after you've transferred. However, I've never been contacted by NetSol about the transfer...but from what I've read here I should've been contacted by them before they'd allow the transfer. What gives? Does this mean that they haven't gotten around to transferring it yet if they haven't contacted me to verify that this is what I wanted?
numb
I am in this situation right now. My domain at NetSol is expiring early August, so I decided to transfer it to register.com. After I paid $35 transfer fee, I received an e-mail from NetSol asking me to authorize the transfer. I did authorize it, but just a few days ago register.com sent me an e-mail that NetSol denied my transfer request.
I sent an e-mail to Customer Service at NetSol, but they haven't responded to it. Neither was I successful at trying to contact them by the phone.
When I read this, I thought I must have written it... This is verbatim the problem I've been experiencing for the last week or so. The most annoying thing I've seen is in their emails where they instruct you to send responses to another email address instead of using the reply-to field...
easyDNS.com, one of the OpenSRS companies, just sent me a reply about the next step in transferring away from Network Solutions (and I still haven't heard back from Network Solutions).
When easyDNS receives notification that the transfer has timed out from a pending registry approval (9 days), they can resubmit the request to Network Solutions. I guess I'll have to wait and see what Network Solutions does this time...
http://www.domainnamebuyersguide.com/
While it may not have EVERY registrar out there, it does provide a centralized resource for many of the choices out there - with comparisons of each registrar's pricing & contractual wording.
-ct
If anyone wants to investigate a company...it should be Verisign. These people have outright robbed me, and continue to try to rob me by sending me bills for services that they have no business sending me.
I got a letter from Network Solutions a few months ago sternly warning me that "Your domain name is about to expire!" In the letter they included a link to renew the name with them. It took me several minutes of web-browsing and head-scratching to realize that the name wasn't registered with NSI in the first place - it was registered with Register.com! They weren't literally slamming, because if you read things carefully, they said they were going to transfer the name to NSI and renew it for two years. But still, it was a rather deceptive tactic - it looked very much like their normal, legitimate renewal notices. I wish I'd saved the letter, so I could post it to back me up. It seems too bizarre that they'd be accusing others of slamming now.
One other unrelated NSI gripe that doesn't seem to have been mentioned above is the cost of transferring ownership of a domain with Network Solutions. When you transfer ownership from one party to another within the same registrar, it's up to the registrar what to charge. Network Solutions charges their normal (though irritating) $35 annual fee, and adds a year to the expiration date. However, the transfer takes up to two months to complete!!!! If you want "expedited service," where they'll change ownership within about two business days, there's an additional $199 service charge!! See this for details. Other registrars I've used let you change ownership in a couple minutes with password and e-mail confirmations, and while the security there is arguably too lax, a 2 month wait for a domain already protected with Crypt-PW or PGP protection is absurd.
Microsoft accuses Redhat of bullying
Andover.net posts a profit, hires all slashdot posters
-ted
I am in this situation right now. My domain at NetSol is expiring early August, so I decided to transfer it to register.com. After I paid $35 transfer fee, I received an e-mail from NetSol asking me to authorize the transfer. I did authorize it, but just a few days ago register.com sent me an e-mail that NetSol denied my transfer request.
I sent an e-mail to Customer Service at NetSol, but they haven't responded to it. Neither was I successful at trying to contact them by the phone.
I don't want to wait till my domain expires in order to renew it, and i DEFINITELY don't want to pay NetSol any more. They're probably the worst registrar out there right now. I am hoping this will get resolved, otherwise I might lose my domain, which would suck severely.
I am hoping /. is read by the VeriSign people and it gets through to their head how dissatisfied people are with their service.
If you open yourself to the foo, You and foo become one.
My ISP uses OpenSRS. However I'm interested in comparing other OpenSRS-compatible registrars' policies. Also, I'm interested in learning exactly how domain registry works and how it bridges into DNS, like what denotes an SOA and what prioritizes them if there are multiple SOAs by accident. Any pointers? Thanks!
===
The trick with NetSol is that they now allow you to back order domains so that you get them once they expire. Of course I'm not sure if they tell you if there is anyone in front of you "in line" who has first dibs.
I like Dotster too. What's funny is I live about 5 miles from the Dotster headquarters, and my sister in law worked there until she moved.
Daniel
Man, I'm glad I transfered all my domains away from Netsol.. I can't see how they can carry on in this way, this is a bit like realizing you cut yourself shaving and mummifying your head to stop the bleeding.
Get a clue Netsol, its called Competition and its not going away..
air and light and time and space
Now I have all my domains registered with Dotster, who are a joy to deal with. Everything is quick and web based, the site is decidedly non-Byzantine and has loads of nifty features, and they're pretty damn cheap too.
Disclaimer: I do not work for Dotster. I just like 'em a lot.
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NO TOUCH MONKEY!
What other registrar can you think of that, a full month or more after you've transferred a domain elsewhere, would send you _postal mail_ to let you know that it's past due and you should send them money... and then a month after that, send you mail _again_, this time letting you know that this is your FINAL chance to send them money for it?
Greedy fraudulent bastards.
(2 domains now with OpenSRS, 1 with Qroute)
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This one irked me VERY recently, when a domain I'd wanted (llight.com) was expired, but Network Solution was showing it as still registered for OVER A MONTH. After a long period of post-expiration registration (with it still showing some lady's name, Linda Light, in the WHOIS data (she'd registered her first name's initial plus last name, which happened to be a common word)), it finally expired and now the WHOIS data shows some company based in Korea as having it registered.
I'd like it if NSI actually just EXPIRED domain names and didn't put them into limbo, as appears to be the case here.
On a side note, and since I'm damned curious, does anyone know what happens to a domain registered through NSI once it expires? How many days does it sit idle, and if they do sell them, where?
All I know about Bush is I had a good job when Clinton was president.
I received the same letter. At first I was worried that NSI had perhaps bought out or acquired all of the domains from Register.com and I was unknowingly transferred to NSI. After reading it I came to the same conclusion you did - a sleezy and deceptive tactic to drum up business. They will NEVER receive my business now.
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We want some answers and all that we get
Some kind of shit about a terrorist threat
- Ministry
After about a 60 day "grace period" the domain goes "on hold" for about six days and then it expires at a few minutes after 6:30 am Eastern.
For the complete dynamics of domain expiring read this;
http://www.ecommercebase.com/article.php/352/20
This article has three parts, be sure you don't miss one. Also, there are links to the authors website, and he has more useful links.
These two companies "watch domains";
http://www.snapnames.com
http://www.dnsresearch.com
I have used the DNS Research service for a domain that I really wanted, but they were unsuccessful in registering it for me. At $99 with no guarantee It's pretty expensive. I didn't use snapnames as the snapback was already sold for that domain (so I knew I had competition). However, snapnames didn't register it for the customer either (I could tell because of the registries used).
If you have tried to register a domain at 6:30 am, you can tell that registries really seem to crumble under the load. So when a domain expires (and they do expire) they are only up for grabs for a few seconds. Thus the appearence that "they never expire". The name checker on enom.com website is current, so you can "watch" a name drop (that is if everbody is not trying to grab it - otherwise by time you hit refresh it's already registered). You have to be careful though, because the whois *is not* updated in real time, and many registrars use that to check name availability. You have to try to register the name to see if its available or not.
So, if you are trying to grab an expiring domain, chances are slim as you are a small fish among big fish trying to do the same thing. And yeah, the Koreans have rooms filled with machines trying to grab that "one good" domain so they can squat it. Read the above links for the full details.
If Verisign/ICANN actaully thought about fairness they could change things and make he "drop" a little bit more fair by enforcing the rules (they don't) and perhaps making the daily "drop" a little more random. In other words, ICANN would have to care, and we all know how much ICANN cares....
Take the cheese to sickbay, the doctor should see it as soon as possible - B'Elanna Torres, "Learning Curve"
I have 6 of my domains registered with Verisign and I attempted to transfer them to my preferred registrar maybe a week before the registration expired. My preferred registrar didn't get the email to them more than 24 hours in advance of the expiry date. I only blame my preferred registrar somewhat for this. I should have allowed more time for the thansfer processbut now I'm still screwed, because these domains were not vary important to me and I could vary easily wait for them to be released by varasign and re-register them with my preferred registrar, but alas, they insist on screwing with us and not releasing expired domains in a timely fashion. This is truly outragous - and the latest turn of events makes their behavior inexcusable.
--CTH
--
--Got Lists? | Top 95 Star Wars Line
I use enom, personally, who I love, great service and spiffy front-end, but who charges over twice as much per. I know you're trying to not use slashdot to promote other companies (erm, but, well, ok, maybe) but do tell...
closed minded is as closed minded does
Their name totally engenders trust.
Veri - Coming from the English "Very" meaning "a lot" or "to an absurd extreme" and
Sign - A derivative of the mathematical term "sin" meaning "opposite over hypotenuse" or "wrong" (e.g. Jesus done committed no sins)
Since "Veri" implies a plural, "Verisign" translates to "At least two wrongs" which in turn is equivalent to "not right" or "left" put simply. Since the "left" is the party of bleeding hearts and goodwill and brotherhood to all, it follows that Verisign was trying to invoke this feeling when thinking about the company name.
I feel all warm and fuzzy just thinking about it.
Dancin Santa
I recently transferred my domain from Network Solutions to another registrar. I was alarmed by how easy it was--there didn't seem to be very many checks in place that would have prevented someone else from fraudulently transferring my domain away from NetSol. As displeased as I was with NetSol, I have to say I agree with them that there should be some more barriers to prevent forged or fraudulent transfer requests.