Judge Demands Details Of FBI's Keylogger

wb8foz writes: "EPIC is reporting that Judge Politan has told the FBI to come up with details on the keystroke logger they used against Scarfo. Previously, the FBI claimed the technology was so Zuper-seKret that telling anyone how it worked would threaten 'national security'..."

Comments

Re:Speculation time. How does it work?

[gilroy]

Blockquoth the poster:

When did the US sink so low as to allow pigs to break into a man's home--his castle--and listen to his private conversations?

Um, since about 1928 (the first rulings on wiretapping from the Supreme Court). But since 1967 or so, the Court has ruled that gathering evidence by wiretap (or bug) is essentially the same as gathering it in person; that is, a warrant is needed.

The issue here is not, Are there any circumstances under which the government has a compelling issue in obtaining evidence by wiretap, bug, or whatever? The issue is, how high should the bar be set? How hard should it be for the government to show such need?

The FBI argues that this is not a wiretap and so it meets low standards. The defendant holds that it was a wiretap and hence needed a specific warrant to be placed.

People like to cast these things as black-and-white: Either the government can't bug us, and we are totally free; or the government can, and we are entirely enslaved. Unfortunately for such extremists, history has always been more nuanced: The American judicial system always works on the principle of balances and tensions. What's important is to set the price of such invasions so high that they be used only in the most extreme, most justifiable conditions.

This case is, in large part, not about the technology that is used but about the accountability of those who use it.

Re:who is the fbi afraid is gonna find out...

[SuiteSisterMary]

The Russians, the Chinese, and every other country that routinely run 'agents' against the US of A. As the chief counter-intelligence of the USA, the FBI is probably using these things against all sort of confirmed and suspected foreign agents. And now the FBI'll be forced to explain exactly what the thing is, how it works, what it looks like, and a lot of 'spies' are going to check their computers....

Not so fast

[agentZ]

Before everybody gets too excited, the general public isn't going to see how the FBI did it just yet. From the Judge's Order regarding what the Government has to submit: "This material shall be submitted in camera and under seal. Upon review of the government's submission, the Court will then determine whether to reconsider the procedure for disclosure as outlined in this Letter Opinion and Order."

This means that the Judge wants to see for himself exactly how the FBI device thing works. (The original government description was "gobbledegook".) From the rest of the order, however, it sounds to me like that the Judge does not believe a communications intercept has occured unless the FBI overheard Scarfo talking via a modem or other Internet connection.

In other words, IMHO it appears that the Judge is actually leaning against Scarfo, but doesn't quite understand the technology enough to make a decision. Remember, the law very narrowly defines a "communication" when talking about wiretapping...

Finally, a judge standing up to the police

[Super_Frosty]

I'm glad to see that this judge isn;t buying into the FBI's lies. No matter that involves the internal police actions of a country should be secret. The FBI, ATF, etc., should not have any right to claim national security.

Hopefully, this judge's courageous ruling will slow America's descent into a police state. The very idea that the FBI is conducting warrantless searches is contrary to everything Americans have fought and died for.