FreeBSD 5.0 Delayed One Year

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Posted by timothy on Friday August 31, 2001 @12:08AM from the measure-twice-cut-once dept.

Satai writes: "FreeBSD 5.0-RELEASE has been delayed a full year, until November of 2002. The reasons included a lack of support for SMPng - including a developer fall-off ratio of 15 to 1 - a desire to finish the PowerPC/Sparc64/IA64 architectures, and a general desire to robustly test the additions. The economic downturn even makes an appearance in the announcement."

7 of 264 comments (clear)

developer fall-off by TechnoVooDooDaddy · 2001-08-31 00:15 · Score: 4, Interesting

As a follower/lurker to BSD-Hackers, I offered to do some device driver development, apparently not to the liking of some of the leaders on there
*cough*TIM*cough*

anyway, at least the bsd-hackers forum can be quite hostile, and i've seen it keep more than a couple people away..
1. Re:developer fall-off by duffbeer703 · 2001-08-31 00:24 · Score: 5, Interesting
  
  The policy of FreeBSD's developers is not to cater to newbies. Linux and FreeBSD are targetted towards different segments of users, why can't we just accept that? Take a look at a typical posting from a Linux user on the freebsd-newbies list. We're talking two different worlds here.
  I am relatively young to the scene myself, but let's take a walk down memory lane say six years ago. Back in those days the Linux Howto's, especially the Installation Howto, were essentially Slackware Howto's. (The book I used to figure out how to install Linux was essentially the Howto's printed out.) My PC's BIOS from that era did not support booting from an ATAPI CD Rom drive. Hard drives were much smaller but the EIDE ones were coming up against a succession of limits, limits in where a kernel could be located and still be seen by a bootloader. For Linux there was a well-defined path introducing newbies: you installed and created a custom bootdisk. Linux installation instructions also told how to edit the kernel for the bootdisk floppy to change the root partition location.
  
  From my newbie perspective, this was installation Nirvana! I didn't have to worry about LILO if I didn't want to. From the perspective of other people sharing the PC I used, other than taking up hard drive space, they didn't have to know Linux existed. And Linux could be installed in an extended partition not just a primary partition. Keep in mind that hard drives were a lot smaller then, so for dual-boot setups it was nice to be able to dedicate some more room for the Windows C: drive. And not only that but since everyone did the custom bootdisk compiling as a rite of passage, people could compile bootdisks to help others if the default floppy didn't have the right drivers.
  
  Now from what I have read of the FreeBSD community's thoughts, they couldn't care less about such concerns. The ISP I used back then was hosted on a collection of FreeBSD boxes, abandoning a more monolothic solution with an SGI server, because the ISP's lead technical person knew how to do it. FreeBSD is more like an industrial consortium as far as the core developers go, and at least at that time there was a huge emphasis on stuff related to running ISPs. From their perspective it was laughable to devote much effort to support the most unreliable medium of all, a floppy, for custom booting a machine. And someone like an ISP wouldn't be using EIDE, they'd be using SCSI. 528MB limit, "get some real hardware, kid" I'd imagine they'd think. And they'd have their internal network and their own procedures for mass replicating setups to many machines.
  
  Six years later I think we can see everyone got what they wanted. The Linux community developed critical mass and got wildly popular with newbies. The FreeBSD community was left alone by the newbies they didn't want to deal with.
  
  --
  Conformity is the jailer of freedom and enemy of growth. -JFK
Re:This isn't all bad news - quite the contrary by Jon+Peterson · 2001-08-31 00:31 · Score: 5, Funny

Well, it's pretty bad news if you are a manager in a company and fought for using BSD.

Boss - "So, are we on schedule to start rolling out the 4-way file servers in July next year?"

Me - "Um, no, that will have to wait until, maybe, Jan 2003".

Boss - "Errr, why's that? You said to me last quarter that the new SMP stuff would be ready by the end of this year? Surely 6 months is plenty of safety margin?"

Me - "Actually, the release date slipped by 12 months. I just found out now. I think it was due to most of the developers leaving the project."

Boss - "What?!?!?!! They fired 14 kernel developers?! I thought you said this organisation wouldn't be affected by the economy, on account of not being an evil capitalist outfit that only cares about their quarterly results!"

Me - "Yeah, well, no-one got fired, it's more like, they, uh, just kind of stopped doing any work. I guess maybe they got bored."

Boss - "OK, that does it. We're going with Solaris x86, I don't care what you say."

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Not very good news, nevertheless... by Noryungi · 2001-08-31 00:41 · Score: 4, Insightful

As others have pointed out, it's good that the FreeBSD developers have decided to push the deadline by several (14) months.

But I can't help but wonder if the FreeBSD "core" isn't trying to do too much with too little.

SMPng is great. Porting FreeBSD to dozens of architecture may not be -- I thought NetBSD was the one group that was supposed to focus on portability? Stick with Intel CPUs, guys! =)

Nevertheless, a magnificent OS, and one that I use very often...

--
The right to offend is far more important than the right not to be offended. (Rowan Atkinson)
Re:15 to 1 ? by Nater · 2001-08-31 00:46 · Score: 5, Informative

Hmmm... I've been moderated a troll. Perhaps I should rephrase myself...

Don't think FreeBSD is impervious to the sort of misconfigurations that you've cited as faults for Linux. A naive user installing any operating system is still a naive user. I have seen in my life exactly one FreeBSD system, and it was r00ted once about three years ago and once within the last year.

Security is not platform-dependent, it is admin-dependent.

--
I like to play children's songs in minor keys.
"We're all sons of bitches now." --J. Robert Oppenheimer
Not necessarily bad news by dglo · 2001-08-31 01:33 · Score: 5, Informative

This isn't as bad as it might sound to Linux users.

FreeBSD has multiple branches:
* 5.0, aka -CURRENT, currently the target of
most new development.
* 4.4, the next release in the 4.x series,
due to be released today
* 4.3-RELEASE, which is updated with security
fixes as necessary
* 3.x, which is still being used, so it
occasionally gets a fix or two.

What this delay means is that the general public won't see most of the nifty 5.0 features until the end of next year.

That doesn't mean, however, that we won't get *any* new features; the list of 4.4 improvements will be evidence of that...
Re:15 to 1 ? by tmark · 2001-08-31 02:02 · Score: 4, Funny

Would we prefer they strip out everything that isn't ready, and released 5.0 in two months?
Then we could call it RedHat 8.0.