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Buses and Interconnects: The Next Generation

mkarpinski writes "ExtremeTech has posted a nice overview of the next generation of peripheral buses and interconnects including PCI-X, InfiniBand, 3GIO, and HyperTransport. From the article, "All these future interconnects and buses have a few things in common. They use packet-based, point-to-point connections; in fact, InfiniBand implements a full switch fabric. They provide bandwidth in multiples of that offered by PCI. They decrease latency significantly, with HyperTransport and RapidIO showing the most dramatic decreases, crucial for their target communications and embedded markets. And all four strive to reduce pin counts in order to conserve power and system real estate." Open the floodgates!"

126 comments

  1. The killer application by ergo98 · · Score: 1, Interesting

    What is the killer application for these technologies? Seriously though it is largely irrelevant if you drop the best of the best video card on a AGP4x slot versus an AGP1x, because the extra-bandwidth largely isn't necessary. What would be the killer application that would encourage us to replace our architectures with it?

    1. Re:The killer application by Tower · · Score: 2, Informative

      Well, IB lends itself to a lot of chassis chassis connections (SAN, failover, clustering, etc)... The others pretty much stick to planars, but IB could network globally (a stretch, but theoretically, it is all there). Since IB is an application to application protocol, it has quite a bit of reach...

      Think - a generic server, boots from the IB link (possibly off of a SAN)... add more of these to the IB fabic as needed to increase the cluster. Great possibilities.

      --
      "It's tough to be bilingual when you get hit in the head."
    2. Re:The killer application by fetta · · Score: 1

      >>What is the killer application for these technologies?

      Think clusters. See this link for an example: http://www.nwfusion.com/news/2001/1029fujlin.html

      --
      ** The opinions expressed here are my own, and do not reflect those of my employers - past, present, or future**
    3. Re:The killer application by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting

      For something like PCI-X and HyperTransport, which are mostly internal, on-the-motherboard type technologies the dscaler project at http://www.dscaler.org/ could make use of it to do both fancier de-interlacing and support for source resolutions that are higher than NTSC and PAL. Probably not THE killer application because only specific people need what dscaler does, but dscaler already provides the equivalent of a $10K dedicated box for about $1K - added bandwidth would let them handle 1080i and such too, making them competitive with the $20K+ boxes.

    4. Re:The killer application by iso · · Score: 5, Flamebait

      The "killer application" for these technologies (at least HyperTransport and RapidIO) is mostly very high-end telecom infrastructure equipment. My last job involved working on the definition of a HyperTransport bridge product that was targeted for these types of systems. A good serialized interconnect is needed in these systems, as nothing else comes close in terms of speed and latency.

      PCI-X is also becoming very useful as a telecom backplane connector, and for drive arrays in high-end servers.

      Of course your message was completely stupid in the first place. Why is it that so many people on slashdot look at every technology as though the PC is the only important system on the planet? It's fine that all you use is your desktop PC, and it's fine that you wait for the most commoditized solutions to filter down to your local PC shop, but despite what you might think, the world doesn't revolve around PCs. Perhaps you'll want a HyperTransport video card in 2004, but your major Internet backbones aren't going to be connected through AGP4x today. Do yourself a favour and get a more rounded technical education.

      - j

    5. Re:The killer application by frank_adrian314159 · · Score: 2
      What is the killer application for these technologies?

      Two words: Beowulf Clusters.

      --
      That is all.
    6. Re:The killer application by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      One problem w/ the telecoms is that their equipment goes out of date in 3 years anyways and we(socity) are stuck trying to make do w/ crappy switching equipment (ie. I still can't get 56K on my damn modem line) thanks to an ESS1a switch my bldg has.

    7. Re:The killer application by athlon02 · · Score: 3, Funny

      Well for one, mechanical hard drives have had their day in the sun and probably in the next 10 years or so having say a 15GB SSD (solid state drive - basically a drive made from nonvolatile memory) won't be unheard of. In such a case we'll have "instant on" computers and then you should really see a big difference in thinks like Hypertransport vs. AGP. Right now mechanical devices are big hindrances to electronic parts, just as electronic parts are to say fiber optics.

    8. Re:The killer application by ergo98 · · Score: 1

      Of course your message was completely stupid in the first place. Why is it that so many people on slashdot look at every technology as though the PC is the only important system on the planet?

      Well gosh, I'm sorry to not live up to your standards oh-wise Guru. Let me quote from the story:

      They provide bandwidth in multiples of that offered by PCI...

      In case you're not aware, PCI is an intra-PC communications standard, hence the story set the tone by specifically putting it in context fuckwad. Do yourself a favour and get some context wanker.

    9. Re:The killer application by iso · · Score: 1

      Well actually PCI is often used in high-end servers and as a telecom backplane interconnect, which is probably why it is quoted there. So I stand by my original statement that asking a question of the "killer app" in term of a video card is a PC was a stupid question.

      - j

    10. Re:The killer application by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Why is it that so many people on slashdot look at every technology as though the PC is the only important system on the planet? It's fine that all you use is your desktop PC, and it's fine that you wait for the most commoditized solutions to filter down to your local PC shop, but despite what you might think, the world doesn't revolve around PCs. Perhaps you'll want a HyperTransport video card in 2004, but your major Internet backbones aren't going to be connected through AGP4x today. Do yourself a favour and get a more rounded technical education.

      BTW: The pretend elitism and pretentiousness of this message is astounding. This, a message board frequented by hundreds of thousands of PC-using "people" dare to care about the influence that this would have on the PC market? Give me a break. Go somewhere else fuckhead. The fact that you've been modded up for being a pretentious cocksucker is amazing and demonstrates the faults in the mod system.

    11. Re:The killer application by ergo98 · · Score: 1

      Of course this is all ignoring the fact that most high speed standards in the electronics field are developed for the low end consumer market and then filtrate up, rather than the other way around that you seem to believe. The other humorous thing is the fact that I can search on Google or Google Groups and find countless articles comparing AGP with PCI, PCI-X, 3GIO, and Infiniband : Crazy me talking about the PC (when the PC would be the marketplace that will almost certainly drive the financing and implementation of the standard).

    12. Re:The killer application by woody6423 · · Score: 2, Informative

      The PC will not need bandwidth of this capability for some time. This bandwidth is needed right now in the networking/telecommunications, server and storage area. With networking technologies pushing into and beyong the 10Gbs bandwitdth arena, technologies such as PCI-X and Infiniband are here just in time. Companies such as Mellanox are exploiting these technologies (Infiniband) just in time for applications in these areas.

      It also leads to other potential ideas. What about truly shared memory? Being able to put core memory for multiple processors in a distributed system? RapidIO will help us tie multiple processors together and share memory and I/O resources, and they will not need to be inches away, but possibly many many feet. The possibilities are truly endless with what we can do with this bandwidth.

      Routers typically use standard I/O busses such as PCI to route packets between various I/O interfaces and the central CPUS. We now can increase the bandwidth up to OC-192 and 10GE with a standardized interface. This implies lower cost ASICs with common bus interfaces. No longer will companies need to develop their own ASICs with proprietary interfaces to support bandwidths capable of 10gigs...

      Really cool technologies!

      --Chris

    13. Re:The killer application by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Quick note - Nvidia's new chipset has a HyperTransport link built into it. It attaches the North Bridge and the Southbridge together [i.e. tacks the memory/busses/processor to the drive/network/peripherals] http://www.aceshardware.com/read.jsp?id=45000232

      The new ATI chipset that is being designed supposedly also uses it.

      Oh, and of course there are the spiffy new 64 bit AMD processors that will have a whole pile of HT links for those of you who want to build up processor fabrics without the chipset headaches.

    14. Re:The killer application by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Sniff. I couldn't have said it better myself. Beautiful, sir. Thank you.

  2. Now Taking Bets... by Renraku · · Score: 1

    ...On how long it will be before the chipset developer scene splits into equal parts toward their favorite standard. Also taking bets on how long it will take before we're all going to have to buy 6 different adapters just to ensure we can use the hardware we want.

    --
    Job? I don't have time to get a job! Who will sit around and bitch about being broke and unemployed then?
    1. Re:Now Taking Bets... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

      I used kermit and xmodem many times back in the early 90s. Yet, I still don't feel I've lived. What am I doing wrong?

  3. Re:Can it be? by Renraku · · Score: 0, Offtopic

    If I were getting 2 FPS on some game for 10 hours, I'd be looking for a new God.

    --
    Job? I don't have time to get a job! Who will sit around and bitch about being broke and unemployed then?
  4. Yes but ... by Rosco+P.+Coltrane · · Score: 1

    where do I plug my Hercules video card ?

    --
    "A door is what a dog is perpetually on the wrong side of" - Ogden Nash
  5. wake up everyone. by laserjet · · Score: 3, Funny

    "Many people still don't fully understand and cannot effectively differentiate InfiniBand from PCI-X from RapidIO, or 3GIO from HyperTransport, for example."

    geez, what are you guys, a bunch of idiots? I can't *believe* that some people STILL don't fully understant inifiBand form PCI-X from RapidIO, or 3GIO! What is the world coming to?

    --
    Moon Macrosystems. Sun's biggest competitor.
  6. one can only hope... by turbine216 · · Score: 3, Troll

    ...that only ONE of these standards actually goes mainstream and takes the place of PCI. This reminds me of the DVDR-W versus DVDR+W conflict that's going on right now. You've got multiple standards that are totally incompatible with each other, and yet neither of them has any true advantage over the other.

    Hopefully one standard will emerge, so I can *safely* proceed with upgrading my PC hardware without fear of immeidate obsolescence.

    1. Re:one can only hope... by Salamander · · Score: 4, Insightful
      You've got multiple standards that are totally incompatible with each other

      But they don't all do the same things. Yes, there is some overlap, and it would be a great surprise if all five survived, but it's not hard to imagine a system that used HyperTransport or RapidIO chip-to-chip, PCI-X or 3GIO as an internal bus, and InfiniBand for SAN/clustering.

      and yet neither of them has any true advantage over the other

      Oh, but they do. They all have different latency/throughput balances, different levels of coherency and parallelism and switchability, and different backwards-compatibility stories. The differences are more subtle than, say, USB vs. FC, but they do exist.

      --
      Slashdot - News for Herds. Stuff that Splatters.
    2. Re:one can only hope... by Russ+Steffen · · Score: 1
      The differences are more subtle than, say, USB vs. FC

      I don't think anyone is serious trying to suggest that USB and Fibre Channel are competing standards. Prehaps you meant Firewire?

    3. Re:one can only hope... by MikeBabcock · · Score: 2

      In fact, there are very good reasons to have both Firewire and USB on the same machine as well as both SCSI and IDE (in the former case, technology, in the latter, price).

      Having multiple bus connectors won't be such a bad thing if they pull it off; I'm still waiting for internal USB modems ...

      --
      - Michael T. Babcock (Yes, I blog)
    4. Re:one can only hope... by Tassach · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Hopefully one standard will emerge, so I can *safely* proceed with upgrading my PC hardware without fear of immeidate obsolescence

      By the time any technology filters down to the consumer level, it's already obsolete. Your PC will always be obsolete; get over it. If you wait for every competing technology battle to settle down, you'll never upgrade. Take USB vs FireWire or Bluetooth vs 802.11b, or IDE vs SCSI. In each case, there are two competing standards which don't show any signs of going away - because each has it's own set of advantages and disadvantages.


      Don't go looking for this techology to be in PC's any time soon. As other people have said, the first place this is going to be adopted is in high-end applications like telecom switches and storage arrays.

      --
      Why is it that the proponents of "one nation under God" are so eager to get rid of "liberty and justice for all"?
    5. Re:one can only hope... by Matey-O · · Score: 1

      I'm finding that as I purchase parts piecemeal, I'd be much happier buying a computer in one fell swoop. Speaking as someone who started out with a motherboard/cpu upgrade, then got dragged from 100 to 133 memory, then needing an improved case, then a new video card, and finally a new harddisk to get current generation performance, I think I'll end up buying a whole system in the future.

      How does this relate? If I buy a whole system next time, and it's got a googolplex bus, then chances are, it'll have a gplex Harddisk, Video card, and margarita maker. It won't matter how the standards change independant of that purchase. (ignoring for the moment what happens when you need to replace that Micro-Channel device when Micro-Channel gets supplanted)

      --
      "Draco dormiens nunquam titillandus."
    6. Re:one can only hope... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Hopefully one standard will emerge, so I can *safely* proceed with upgrading my PC hardware without fear of immeidate obsolescence.


      Amazing how people, facing the apparent, manage to supress basic observations. Still, they can, causing sentences in which both the choice for PC hardware and the fear of obsolescence appear.



      I'm getting 8-track flashbacks here. "Hopefully one standard will emerge, so I can safely proceed with upgrading my 8-track player without fear of immideate obsolescence!"

    7. Re:one can only hope... by Salamander · · Score: 2
      I don't think anyone is serious trying to suggest that USB and Fibre Channel are competing standards. Prehaps you meant Firewire?

      No, I meant FC. I wanted to make the point that the differences between some of these five new technologies are quite subtle, and I wanted to highlight that subtlety by contrasting it with a difference that was extremely un-subtle, so I picked two technologies that are about as obviously different as they could be while still being in the same general category. I guess this sort of "meta-contrast" is hard to convey clearly.

      --
      Slashdot - News for Herds. Stuff that Splatters.
    8. Re:one can only hope... by Salamander · · Score: 2
      In fact, there are very good reasons to have both Firewire and USB on the same machine

      Absolutely. In fact, I'm actively using both on my laptop as I write this. As I just explained to another respondent, I was trying to make a different point involving Fibre Channel, not FireWire.

      --
      Slashdot - News for Herds. Stuff that Splatters.
    9. Re:one can only hope... by Russ+Steffen · · Score: 1

      Fair enough. I didn't get your meaning on the first read, but it makes sense now.

    10. Re:one can only hope... by mgv · · Score: 1

      It strikes me that having internal firewire connections (which doesn't seem to happen much) would make alot of sense rather than using an IDE bus for DVD/CDRW and probably even for your HDD.

      Its fast, hot swappable, autoconfiguring. It has no limitations on the number of drives or issues with accessing multiple drives concurrently. It could be configured to allow transfer between devices without intervention from the mother board.

      Do any of these newer technologies provide a compelling advantage over this for most internal devices - at least in the world of PC's?

      Michael

      --
      There is no cryptographic solution to the problem where the intended receiver and the attacker are the same entity.
    11. Re:one can only hope... by christooley · · Score: 2, Informative


      Bluetooth vs 802.11b... there are two competing standards

      These things aren't directly competing standards, one is for communication between a machine and it's peripherals, the other is for inter-machine communication. Bluetooth would not be very useful for coporate networking as the range isn't far enough, and 802.11b is to powerful for every device connected to every machine to be using in any rational manner in a corporate environment. There are some overlaps but these are not directly competing.

    12. Re:one can only hope... by Graymalkin · · Score: 3, Informative

      The other guy caught Bluetooth vs. 802.11b so I'll pick up USB vs. FireWire. What the fuck are you smoking? USB is a host based connection protocol and FireWire is a host independant protocol. That makes them not really even in the same ballpark. Just because they are both serial protocols don't mean jack shit. USB brokers all connections through a host controller, this host controller also acts as the switch for all communication on the bus. Everything has to pass through the host controller for any devices to talk to one another. FireWire is host independant which basically means every device on the bus is a peer of every other device (all devices are hosts). A FireWire DV camera can talk directly to a FW hard drive or DVD-RAM with no computer involved whatsoever. A USB webcam isn't going to be writing video to a USB hard drive any time soon because neither of them has a host controller. FireWire devices can also talk to each other directly rather than through a central host. Just because USB 2 is a high bandwidth version of USB doesn't mean it truely competes with FW. USB and FW are going to both be included in systems for a while since they both serve different purposes. You're not going to be seeing USB2 DV cameras for sale while FW cries in its corner.

      --
      I'm a loner Dottie, a Rebel.
  7. Not interesting for me, this news by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Losers ride the bus.

    1. Re:Not interesting for me, this news by morbid · · Score: 0

      Bozos drink and drive.

      --
      I'm out of my tree just now but please feel free to leave a banana.
  8. I thought PCI-X was "lost" by GISboy · · Score: 2, Interesting

    If my memory serves (occasionally it does) PCI-X has been "on the drawing board" for, what?, the past 5 fricking years?

    Quick with the acronyms, slow delivering anything useful...heck not delivered anything yet from what I've seen.

    3GIO, Infiniband and Hypertransport...remains to be seen. But at least there is a 1 out of 3 something showing up and relieving these "low bandwidth blues".

    Isn't Hypertransport supported by the AMA?
    whoops, acronym abuse...Apple, Microsoft and AMD?
    Seeing as Hypertransport is AMD's brain child.

    We'll see, but it winds up being a matter of "the chips falling where they may", especially in the hands of motherboard makers, where they belong.

    Whoever comes out with an actual working spec could say "Get on the bus, come ride with us" in a commercial and not be referring to city transit.

    (can you tell I want to go home an hour early?)

    --
    If it is not on fire, it is a software problem.
    1. Re:I thought PCI-X was "lost" by bstrahm · · Score: 2

      If my memory serves (occasionally it does) PCI-X has been "on the drawing board" for, what?, the past 5 fricking years?
      What do you mean... You can buy PCI-X motherboards today, and I belive for at least 18 months (I know I got mine 12 months ago)...
      Now if you are talking $100 motherboards, it isn't that cheap 66Mhz-64 bit wide isn't cheap..

  9. CLUSTERS COMES TO MIND by Brigadier · · Score: 1


    Plus with server storage moving into the Terabytes and everyone goign broad band it will only be a matter of time before there is a need to handle huge gobs of info at teh same time.

  10. RapidIO to be built into PPC G5 by morcheeba · · Score: 5, Informative

    RapidIO is in the PPC G5 roadmap and will be in moto's first g5-based chip. I've been drooling for some time now...

    1. Re:RapidIO to be built into PPC G5 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      My theory is that once will be the new system bus, and the other will replace the PCI bus. My only hopw is that this works out..I don't want to go back to the Nu-Bus days where different cards have to made for Macs again.

  11. Standards. by laserjet · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Even though we (myself included) always complain about all the "standards" there are, it really is a good thing in the long run. Even thought I hate having to deal with stuff like which keyboard to i need for this system (USB, PS2, Big DIN connector), it is good. I know the best usually wins. It's just like ISA vs. PCI vs. AGP, USB 2 vs. Firewire, SCSI vs. IDE, (yes, I know those are not apples vs. apples, but you get my point). Eventually, we just have to wait it out, and then buy whoemever the winner is. The unfortunate part is that the early adopters (a lot of slashdot readers) are the ones that pay the high price for new technology, but that's the way it goes.

    However, if we look at trends in 5 to 10 year periods, we can clearly see what technology won the battle for existence and standards. The best technologo doesn't ALWAYS win (think Windows Media...), but more often than not, and that gives time to sort out the better from the good. Right now, though, we do live with a lot of different, competing standards that are quite frustrating.

    --
    Moon Macrosystems. Sun's biggest competitor.
    1. Re:Standards. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The best technologo doesn't ALWAYS win (think Windows Media...)

      But.. I thought they were winning! I mean, WMA was fortunate enough to win the support of Microsoft, but I just don't see why everyone else doesn't adopt this cool technology...

    2. Re:Standards. by taniwha · · Score: 1
      The best technologo doesn't ALWAYS win (think Windows Media...), but more often than not, and that gives time to sort out the better from the good. Right now, though, we do live with a lot of different, competing standards that are quite frustrating.



      That's why anti-monopoly laws are great - they let competition occur on a fair playing field - you don't get a platform owner freezing out better standards for their own gain.

    3. Re:Standards. by laserjet · · Score: 2

      Very true. Although only in a utopia are the playing fields really level. We try and come as close as we can get, though, being mere earthlings.

      --
      Moon Macrosystems. Sun's biggest competitor.
    4. Re:Standards. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Just to get this out of the way IDE and SCSI don't really compete. IDE is for slower drives like thos ein most home PC's, where as SCSI is designed for those who want a large number of drives in a RAID, or just high performance.

  12. More on HyperTransport by ppetrakis · · Score: 3, Informative

    API NetWorks just released a HyperTransport "Switch" , See the press release .
    Interesting stuff. The PDF has some more info

    Peter

    --
    www.alphalinux.org
    1. Re:More on HyperTransport by iso · · Score: 2

      HyperTransport and RapidIO are mostly designed for the telecom market right now, as is that bridge from API Networks. The MIPS processor is the major driving force behind HyperTransport in this area right now, and they've been making some serious inroads on what has mostly been PowerPC territory in the past (PPC being the driving force behind RapidIO).

      Some other interesting parts with HyperTransport include PMC-Sierra's new 9000x2 processor with two 1GHz MIPS cores, and Sibyte's similar Mercurian processor.

      It's processors like these that require the serious speed and low-latency of HyperTransport. It will be interesting to see how these technologies filter down to the PC market after a few years.

      - j

    2. Re:More on HyperTransport by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's processors like these that require the serious speed and low-latency of HyperTransport. It will be interesting to see how these technologies filter down to the PC market after a few years.

      Why is it that so many people on slashdot look at every technology as though the PC is the only important system on the planet? It's fine that all you use is your desktop PC, and it's fine that you wait for the most commoditized solutions to filter down to your local PC shop, but despite what you might think, the world doesn't revolve around PCs.

    3. Re:More on HyperTransport by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You have no idea what's going on, do you? It can still be "interesting" but not important.

    4. Re:More on HyperTransport by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
  13. Busses & Interconnects? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0


    Busses & Interconnects? Try here, if you speak (or at least read) swedish:
    www.vasttrafik.se :)

    1. Re:Busses & Interconnects? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Du er faen meg ikke morsom.

  14. Is this by rhost89 · · Score: 1

    going to help out developers? Im not familier with these specs, but is it going to say help the device driver writer any by providing an easier means to access device registers, I/O addresses/data and such? Are they trying to implement a standardized device api or somthing. If the answer is yes to any of these questions then im all for them duking it out and picking ONE of these as a replacement for pci. But if pc manufactures start spec wars again, i think im going to stick with current hardware.

    --
    I will bend your mind with my spoon
    1. Re:Is this by levendis · · Score: 2

      Actually, from what I've read, for the most part the interface presented to the driver will be identical (or nearly identical) to that used by PCI. I doubt that any new bus standard which drastically changes the driver interface will be very popular.

      --
      ---- I made the Kessel Run in under 11 parsecs.
  15. Oops, spoke too soon... by GISboy · · Score: 1

    (pulling foot out of mouth...pheh, pheh)

    PCI-X seems to exist, but looks something like AGP 4X to 6X in light of this comment:

    At it's maximum 133 MHz frequency, a PCI-X bus only supports one slot, but allows segmenting using PCI-X to PCI-X bridging for additional slots.

    AAAAAaarrrrrruuuuugggghhhh!!!

    Am I losing (or loosing, either works) my grip on reality or was the whole point to have all your cards belong to us and on the same damn freq/speed/clock perhaps at the FSB rather than a seperate timing?

    Heh, an auto manufacture that says you can have all the torque you want, but one wheel at a time.

    Lovely.

    --
    If it is not on fire, it is a software problem.
    1. Re:Oops, spoke too soon... by morcheeba · · Score: 2, Interesting

      You're losing it :)

      Actually, the world is moving to a fabric-based interconnect rather than a bus-based one. RapidIO and Infiniband (and Sky and Race for the embedded world) all techincally support only one slot, too. And that one slot goes to a switch, which connects to other slots and all your other resources. Ideally, each processor would get its own connection, and maybe some memory would, too. That way, processor #1 can talking to the video card to play quake, while processor #2 serves up data from your hard drive to the LAN, while data goes directly from your HD to your DVD burner... all data takes a separate path and operates at full speed - no need to time multiplex, like with a bus.

    2. Re:Oops, spoke too soon... by Wesley+Felter · · Score: 2

      Am I losing (or loosing, either works) my grip on reality or was the whole point to have all your cards belong to us and on the same damn freq/speed/clock perhaps at the FSB rather than a seperate timing?

      You lost it. Having the bus clock run at an integer divisor of the FSB clock is good, but it has nothing to do with the number of slots per bus.

  16. PCIX 2.0 by shaka999 · · Score: 3, Interesting

    This article misses one crucial standard: PCIX 2.0. While not highly publicized it has some key features that make it more likely to show up in high performance systems that 3GIO. The PCIX 2.0 standard is due to be finalized at about the same time as the 3GIO standard will.

    --
    One should not theorize before one has data. -Sherlock Holmes-
    1. Re:PCIX 2.0 by stripes · · Score: 2
      it has some key features

      Those being?

    2. Re:PCIX 2.0 by shaka999 · · Score: 1

      Bandwidth for one! Its equivalent to 6-8X 3GIO. This hits a sweet spot in the server market.

      It is also backwards compatible with PCIX which allows easier IP reuse. I believe at the points the number of pins needed start to equal out as well but I don't have the exact info in front of me.

      --
      One should not theorize before one has data. -Sherlock Holmes-
  17. Upgrades to current solutions by uslinux.net · · Score: 1

    Rather than multiple competing standards for the *next generation* of devices, why won't someone devise a bus technology which won't be obsolete in two or three years? While PCI-X doubling the bandwidth to 1GB sounds great, with upcoming 10 Gb network adapters, you've ALREADY reached its limit WITHOUT ANY OTHER PERIPHERALS! Imagine what will happen when 100 Gb is standard!

    In the mean time, how about using some proven technology now? Five years ago, SGI was using multiple crossbars on their workstations to improve throughput, reduce contention, and decrease latency.
    Why can't something like this be implemented with the current PCI architecture?

    Okay, PCI-X sounds neat, and backwards compatibility is a plus, but if you read the article it states that PCI-X will run at the lowest common denominator - if you have three 133MHz/64-bit devices (up to 1.06 G/sec transfer) and one 33MHz/32-bit PCI device you're stuck at 33MHz. Four PCI cards, four crossbars, and you can get any speed you damn well like on any slot. Otherwise, the current crop of PCI modems and low-speed network adapters will end up limiting this anyway!

    The remaining protocols sounds nifty, but I don't see any performance specs. As hopeful as I am that *something* good will replace PCI, I'm going to be very disappointed if there are too many standards and vendors can't agree on something.

  18. Is it Friday yet? by bziman · · Score: 2, Funny
    You know you've had a rough week as a software engineer and you see "Buses and Interconnects" and you start thinking about advances in mass transit and wondering if "interconnect" is a British term. TGIF.

    --brian

  19. Lame Names by ENOENT · · Score: 5, Funny

    Why do hardware makers insist on using marketroid-designed names? I'm going to stay with PCI until somebody comes up with a new type of bus: the Magic Bus.

    Every day, I put a request on the queue.
    Ooh yeah, it's the MAGIC BUS!
    To get on the bus to my CPU.
    Ooh yeah, the MAGIC BUS!

    --
    That's "Mr. Soulless Automaton" to you, Bub.
    1. Re:Lame Names by frank_adrian314159 · · Score: 2
      Ooh yeah, the MAGIC BUS!

      I wan' it. I wan' it. I wan' it. I wan' it.

      --
      That is all.
    2. Re:Lame Names by iso · · Score: 2

      Why do hardware makers insist on using marketroid-designed names?

      Well that would be because, despite what you may hear around here, marketing actually helps in selling products, and with the help of a good sales force, this leads to a thing called revenue.

      You may not like it, but having a good names helps sell a standard, even when it's being sold to engineers. HyperTransport used to be called LDT, but nobody calls it LDT anymore, because the vast majority of people prefer the "sexy" new name.

      And if you're happy with your PCI bus, fine. But then again if you're still using PCI then you're not even remotely close to the real target market for these standards anyhow and nobody cares.

      - j

    3. Re:Lame Names by Amazing+Quantum+Man · · Score: 2

      the vast majority of people prefer the "sexy" new name.

      Remember when the Apple marketroids tried to get everyone to pronounce SCSI as "sexy" instead of "scuzzy"?

      --
      Fascism starts when the efficiency of the government becomes more important than the rights of the people.
    4. Re:Lame Names by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      But then again if you're still using PCI then you're not even remotely close to the real target market for these standards anyhow...

      What the fuck are you talking about??? All commercial computers are currently using PCI. HyperTransport won't be available in consumer computers? Pah.

    5. Re:Lame Names by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Think he meant 1995-style 32-bit 33mhz PCI, which is still what's shipping in most boxes.

    6. Re:Lame Names by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Then he's a tad dumb as PCI 64-bit/66Mhz is still called PCI, so it's a pretty dumb sort (that perhaps needs some education in the technical field) that would discount PCI when it's still the standard used in high end systems.

    7. Re:Lame Names by krmt · · Score: 2

      I'm personally waiting for the Short Bus.

      --

      "I may not have morals, but I have standards."

    8. Re:Lame Names by Captain+Nitpick · · Score: 1
      Why do hardware makers insist on using marketroid-designed names? I'm going to stay with PCI until somebody comes up with a new type of bus: the Magic Bus.

      Just so long as it doesn't come with Lily Tomlin or those annoying kids.

      --
      But then again, I could be wrong.
    9. Re:Lame Names by MrEd · · Score: 1

      Would it have Magnetic Alloy Gallium InterConnects?

      --

      Wah!

    10. Re:Lame Names by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's already here.

  20. think big (and small) by gonar · · Score: 2

    check out Mercury Computer Systems

    one of the co-designers of RapidIO, they make ppc shared memory multicomputers which will use RapidIO in the future.

    think 320 PPC nodes, 256MB RAM each, the whole thing in one 9u 19" rack mount chassis, running on standard power with no special cooling requirements.

    --
    The difference between Theory and Practice is greater in Practice than in Theory.
  21. Hypertransport is here now by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Being used as an interconnect in the X-Box.

    Its of course the least ambitious of the lot, but at the same time the only one really suited for today's application. Deserialization and clock extraction at a couple of gigabits is damn hard to integrate with standard CMOS (you might argue unnecessary too ... you can opt to use clock-forwarding and tapped delay lines to take care of synchronization).

  22. Packet Switching by Motheius · · Score: 1

    What seriously needs to be focused on is particle switching.

  23. differences with HPPI6400? by iritant · · Score: 1

    What is the difference between this stuff and what Cray & SGI did in the mid '90s? Same speeds, point to point (~ 6GB/s). I think the MSS on HPPI was large, but what are the other differences?

    1. Re:differences with HPPI6400? by gUmbi · · Score: 2, Funny


      What is the difference between this stuff and what Cray & SGI did in the mid '90s? Same speeds, point to point (~ 6GB/s). I think the MSS on HPPI was large, but what are the other differences?


      The main difference? It won't cost $8 million dollars.

    2. Re:differences with HPPI6400? by Peter+La+Casse · · Score: 1
      What is the difference between this stuff and what Cray & SGI did in the mid '90s

      These technologies are years away from living up to the claims of their adherents. HIPPI-6400 (aka GSN) is here now.

  24. Memory question by mrdogi · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I was reading through the article, and one question kept coming to my mind. It's great that they are coming up with higher bw busses, but it seems it will only help for I/O. What about memory? I know we have the 266MHz (I think) DDR memory, but how much is that really helping? How will memory access be affected by all of this?

    sigged out...

    1. Re:Memory question by gabebear · · Score: 1

      Memmory speed is a factor of the memmory spped/latency along with the main bus speed/latency. Different memmory standards don't make that much difference since few want to use old memmory modules.

    2. Re:Memory question by William+Tanksley · · Score: 2

      Some of the transport solutions, such as HyperTransport, can be used between CPU and memory. This is how nVidia's new 'nForce' chipset works; it hooks up an Athlon to DDR RAM via HyperTransport links.

      RDRAM (Rambus) got all of its speed by using a bus rather similar to these (although with some odd tradeoffs). These are essentially public versions of what Rambus was trying to make proprietary.

    3. Re:Memory question by Wesley+Felter · · Score: 2

      Some of the transport solutions, such as HyperTransport, can be used between CPU and memory.

      Well, between a CPU and northbridge.

      This is how nVidia's new 'nForce' chipset works; it hooks up an Athlon to DDR RAM via HyperTransport links.

      Nope. The protocol between the CPU and northbridge is the EV6 bus and the protocol between the northbridge and RAM is DDR SDRAM.

  25. Buses suck by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Light rail is the wave of the future.

  26. The real secret is not the interface, but... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Interesting

    ...the intelligent switching of devices on the bus. Having a packet-switched bus controller is important (and I've worked on the design of an Infiniband controller so it can work), but even having the application passing parameters to the bus controller is important. For example, should a network card in a workstation take priority away from the video capture card?

    Consequence to the capture card: dropped frames, necessitates recapture.
    Consequence to the network card: dropped network packets.

    Bandwidth is important, but again - the application must drive the necessity for the bandwidth. Intelligent switching and caching in addition to the increased bandwidth are necessary.

    ALSO, one important point - architectures such as HyperTransport are essentially point-to-point, so you need multiple HyperTransport interfaces per switch IC - something that will drive the costs up. Hopefully low-speed devices can all be dropped on the 1394b or USB2.0 buses and then those can be handled through specialized south bridges on PCs, for example. For high-end network apps, obviously the switching of multiple buses leading to optical driver modules is basically the application itself.

  27. Packet Swiching Busses? Great... by darkov · · Score: 1

    ... now script kiddies will be able launch denial of service attacks on my video card. But only if it's got a Microsoft driver.

  28. Actually by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    When I read the title I was thinking on the level of logic gates (and, or, inverters, etc).

  29. waittasec... Apple goes with HyperTransport? by jutus · · Score: 1

    Me confused.

    On that PPC roadmap, it claims the G5 will have "New bus topology/RapidIO Interconnect Architecture".

    Does that mean it will use Rapid IO for communication between it's processor cores, or to talk to the North bridge?

    Apple was one of the early members of the HyperTransport consortium... what does this say about the G5's motherboard architecture?

    1. Re:waittasec... Apple goes with HyperTransport? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      NO, to use RapidIO to fully mesh PPCs you need to have at least 1 crossbar ASIC in addition to the RapidIO interfaces.

    2. Re:waittasec... Apple goes with HyperTransport? by morcheeba · · Score: 1

      The north bridge is built into this first chip (it's aimed at embedded systems, see the highly-modded post on killer ap), along with essentially a south bridge, too (includes a 10/100 ethernet core, a pair of 10/100/1000 ethernet cores, PCI, serial and GPIO ports).

      In other chips it could be used to talk to the north bridge, or to interface to multiple processors... (as few as 2, see page 10 of the presentation, if it's accurate).

      But, I suspect it will get most use in embedded systems where the switched fabric can be used best (i.e. hardware customized to the application at hand).

    3. Re:waittasec... Apple goes with HyperTransport? by 2nd+Post! · · Score: 2

      It's because Motorola has traditionally included a lot of onboard support 'for free' in their embedded chips, such as memory controllers, interrupt handlers, SRAM, EEPROM, etc.

      It doesn't mean we won't see HT used on the motherboards, or that HT and RapidIO won't both be on the motherboard.

      It could be that RapidIO is used between CPUs and memory, with HT linking the video, sound, PCI-X(ugh, I think I like 3GIO better) together with the CPU-Memory systems.

      As an example.

    4. Re:waittasec... Apple goes with HyperTransport? by Wesley+Felter · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Apple was one of the early members of the HyperTransport consortium... what does this say about the G5's motherboard architecture?

      It probably means Apple is hedging their bets.

      OTOH, Apple likes nVidia, Apple likes HT, nVidia likes HT... nForce for PowerPC anyone?

  30. arggggh by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I'm picturing some kid from the Howdy Doody show banging his head into a wall (That coming from an oooold Mad Magazine issue :P )

    Chao

  31. Don't tell the RIAA by Virtex · · Score: 1

    They use packet-based, point-to-point connections

    If the RIAA found out they were using P2P technology, they would be in serious trouble. The RIAA has graciously enlightened us all about how P2P is a tool of criminals and has no legitimate uses in this world. Oh the horror!

    --
    For every post, there is an equal and opposite re-post.
  32. Predictions by richard-parker · · Score: 1

    I'll stick my foot out and make some predictions regarding the various interconnection technologies for desktop and server machines.

    PCI and PCI-X will be replaced by 3GIO as the predominant expansion bus.

    Proprietary cpu-to-chip busses like Intel's Pentium 4 bus, AMD's EV6 bus or Motorola's MaxBus will, in the longer term, be eventually replaced by 3GIO for I/O (with the memory controller a part of the CPU). In the shorter term AMD and maybe the PowerPC camp will make CPUs with HyperTransport. An interesting possibility for PowerPC CPUs might be Motorola choosing to make PowerPC CPUs with a RapidIO bus for the embedded market and Intel choosing 3GIO (or perhaps HyperTransport).

    Chip-to-chip interconnection will standardize around either HyperTransport or 3GIO depending on the flavor of CPU and expansion bus in the machine. It seems awkward to use HyperTransport to connect a 3GIO expansion bus, but it makes a lot of sense to use HyperTransport to connect a PCI expansion bus.

    The MIPS and PowerPC camps will push RapidIO in the embedded market, but I foresee RapidIO eventually being displaced by 3GIO in mid-range applications like printers.

    In the server-to-server and server-to-storage applications where IP networking is not appropriate FibreChannel will eventually be replaced by InfiniBand.

    1. Re:Predictions by Defiler · · Score: 1

      Aren't these the same predictions that the article makes? :)

    2. Re:Predictions by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's obviouse that Apple intends to use HyperTransport in some way on next generation hardware.

      "...when there is arising, there is passing away; and when there is passing away there is arising; when there is right, there is wrong; when there is wrong, there is right. By affirming we deny; by denying we affirm."
      -Chaung Tzu

    3. Re:Predictions by richard-parker · · Score: 1

      I'll confess that I agree that my predictions don't contradict any of the significant conclusions of the article, but I can't help it if Leon Erlanger is right. :)

      The article does a good job of laying out the merits of each of these interconnection technologies but it does carefully avoid actually picking winners and losers.

  33. I got a boner! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I just got a boner, but it turns out this isn't about Star Trek after all.
    CRAP!

  34. I hope the multiples are good ones by SecretAsianMan · · Score: 2

    multiples of that offered by PCI

    I sure hope that the multiples are real numbers greater than or equal to 2. I don't know if I could cope with (2+i) * PCI speed or -22/7 * PCI speed.

    --

    Washington, DC: It's like Hollywood for ugly people.

  35. I DO IT WRONG -- a press release by Banned+IP · · Score: 0
    When asked for comment, Big Ass Spork, AKA Banned IP said that "I prefer a frantic, skitzophenic approach to my trolling. I also refuse to disclose thst I am in fact using a second account due to my banning at the hands of thos sexually repressed hairy palmed editors over at /."

    Now you know the reeessst of the story...

    Well, maybe not all. It is funny how these assholes can't really plug all the holes. This is a nerd hangout after all, ban my IP will you, it's static after all ;)


    I do it wrong


    Laying here in the shadows of my room, I squint up at my love. My Ms. Portman.
    I am sore and tired after fucking her for eight solid hours. My chapped and aching
    dick is soaking in grits to relieve the pain. She gets on her knees and starts lapping
    the grits up out of the bowl. She places her beautiful hands on my penis and starts to
    lick the grits off my achy piece.


    Massaging my nutsack she....


    WAIT, I DO IT WRONG!!!!


    Yanking my dick out of her mouth I throw her to the ground and shove it in to her
    gaping freshly fisted ass.


    "OH BIG ASS SPORK, err, OOOHHHH BANNED IP!! Fuck my ass, fuck my ass good. DEEPER, my stallion, deeper!!
    Make a Beowulf cluster of sperm on my back!!"


    "Imagine a Beowulf cluster of this baby!"


    I DO IT WRONG!!!!





    Due to excessive bad posting from this IP or Subnet, comment posting has temporarily been disabled. If it's you, consider this a chance to sit in the timeout corner. If it's someone else, this is a chance to hunt them down. If you think this is unfair, please email jamie@mccarthy.vg.

    HAHAHAHAA fuckers! I am not ssooo wrong I can't recover! All your trolls are belong to... forget it...

    The /. troll HOWTO
    This is version 0.6 of a troll HOWTO, sort of a companion piece to jsm's excellent troll FAQ. As a draft, comments and criticism are always welcome, if not appreciated :)

    Section 1 - Trolling techniques
    There are techniques used by successful trolls to elicit the maximum amount of responses from unthinking /.ers. This section is dedicated to explaining how to use these in the course of your trolls. Remember though, a great troll can break any or all of these and still be successful...

    Timing
    Because you're posting as an AC, your troll will generally be ignored in favour of posters using their accounts, and so getting in early is essential. A good guideline is to get into the first 20 posts, so that people reading the article will see the troll before it is swamped out. One way of increasing the speed with which you get your troll into play is to prepare them beforehand, and then quickly customise them for the current article. This is easier than it sounds since /. typically repeats stories with small variations and runs lots of similar stories.

    Note that this is why Jon Katz stories are pretty worthless as trolling material - by the time you've found the article and prepared a troll there's already 50+ posts on it, most of them flaming Jon Katz anyway :)

    Exposure
    Once you've got your troll in, you need people to actually read it. You also want replies - /.ers are more likely to read your troll if it starts a large thread. You also want to remember that some people have set their comment thresholds to values higher than 0 - to get the attention of these you either want to get your post moderated up (see Style, below) or get a reply which gets moderated up to 4 or 5, in which case your troll becomes visible to all.

    Accounts
    An alternative to the time-honoured tradition of AC trolling is that of creating a "troll" account. This gives you the advantage of posting at 1 rather than 0, and slashbots are more likely to take you seriously, especially if you at least sound reasonable. If you do this, try to avoid posting stuff where it is obvious you're a troll under the account - post it anoymously instead - some slightly more canny readers actually check your user info before they reply. Not many though :)

    The ultimate goal of the troll account is to secure the +1 bonus, which is currently received once you hit 26 points of Karma. To get there, employ the techniques of karma whoring that we see every day on /. and watch the karma roll in. And of course once you get the +1 bonus, the world is your oyster in terms of /. Posts made at a default of 2 hit even those people with the threshold of 2, are more likely to get moderated up even further if they are at all coherent, and people tend to lose their critical thinking abilities in the face of the +1 bonus. Milk it for all it's worth.

    Layout
    To get people reading it a troll needs to be easily readable. Make sure you break it down into easily digestible paragraphs, use HTML tags where appropriate (but always make sure you close them properly) and use whitespace appropriately.

    Size
    Generally a troll shouldn't be too short, otherwise it'll get lost in the crowd. A workable minimum is a couple of medium paragraphs. Conversely, it shouldn't be too long, or no-one will bother to read it. Keep it to a happy medium.

    Spelling
    Whilst spelling is important if you want the troll to be taken "seriously", key spelling mistakes can draw out the spelling zealots, especially if you mis-spell the name of a venerated /. hero, like Linus Torveldes or Richard Strawlman (thanks dmg). Related to this is the use of the wrong word, explaining an acronym as being something it isn't or making a word into an acronym even when it isn't.

    Subject
    The subject line needs to draw attention to your post without making it obvious that it is a troll. A simple statement of the main point of your argument can work here.

    Style
    Once you realise that most moderators don't bother to read past the first paragraph or two, you can use this fact to craft trolls that can be moderated up as "Insightful" (note that I mean this in the /. sense rather than the real-world sense). Start off fairly reasonable, making statements that are /. friendly and not being too controversial. As the troll goes on, make it more and more controversial, building it up for the coup de grace in the final paragraph.

    Linking
    As we all know, a post with links is considered "informative" by the /. crowd. Moderators love it, and they rarely check the links, so be sure to include as many as possible. And make them wrong - a link to the Perl website should instead point to the Python website instead, and vice versa. The other alternative to incorrect links is "useful" links to places like www.linux.org and www.microsoft.com i.e. places /.ers could never have found on their own :)

    Feeding
    The ideal troll requires no feeding - it runs on its own, generating flamewars between clueless /.ers for your amusement. But often a troll requires some help and so you should consider feeding it. Feeding is best reserved for people making either completely clueless responses, people making responses with holes in, or those wonderful people who write a 2000-word point-by-point rebuttal of your troll.

    Know your audience
    Always keep in mind the kind of things advocated on /. so that you can play on and against them. This is why anti-Linux, creationist, gun-loving, pro-corporation trolls work well - the vast majority of /.ers hold the opposite viewpoints. And if a few people agree with you, so much the better - it merely validates your viewpoint in the eyes of readers.

    Arrogance
    Be arrogant. You, as a troll, know that you're right. No other explanation could exist. The wronger the "fact", the more assertively you should state it. Make it clear that you are better than everyone else - you know the truth and they are just too stupid to realise it. Use plenty of sarcasm, and use "quotes" to show it to people too dumb to realise.

    Offensiveness
    Being offensive in your initial troll can be counter-productive - it causes moderators to mark you down as flamebait in general. But if you're feeding, then you can get away with calling /.ers all kinds of things. Make broad generalisations about /. readers - call them "long-haired Linux zealots", "socialist open-source bigots" or whatever. Stereotyping is encouraged - people always want to think that they're an individual, and will point this out to you given half a chance.

    Indifference
    Great for articles with a political or social bent, this kind of troll expresses complete indifference to the topic at hand, wondering who on Earth cares about it. An alternative method is to say that the topic only concerns a certain group of people - criminals, idiots, hackers (always use this instead of crackers) or whatever group you want to offend.

    Sympathy
    Appear to take the same stance as the people you're trying to troll - claim you're as much a fan of Linux as the next man, but... This way you can make all kinds of claims in the sure knowledge that you actually know what you're talking about. A great phrase to use here is "In my experience". Remember to act like all the things you're pointing out are unfortunate but true.

    The common touch
    Always accuse /.ers of being elitist. This is an easy thing to do seeing as a lot of them are. Claim that is their grandmother couldn't use it, then they are just into it to feel better than Joe Sixpack rather than "doing it for the average user". This is always great for working into anti-Linux trolls - attack command-line tools and poorly designed desktops.

    The 31337 touch
    The opposite of the above. Claim that technology or whatever is only for the elite of society and that any attempt to open it up for everyone is wrong, an attack on intellectualism and possibly even dangerous. If people were meant to understand these things then they would, and it's their fault if they're too stupid to learn.

    Contradiction
    Never be afraid to contradict yourself, even in the space of a single sentence. The phrases "I am a top programmer who codes in VB" or "I am a supporter of open source who uses NT at work and 95 at home" will be sure to get a response from some weenie smugly pointing out the contradiction. Confuse the issue more by engaging in contradiction when you are feeding - this will confuse /.ers who will then make even more stupid replies, leaving them even more wide open for response.

    Clues

    If you're feeling brave, give the reader clues that this is an obvious troll. The classic example here is dmg's stock phrase "I am often accused of trolling (whatever that is)", but also feel free to use phrases like "I have not read the article, and I don't know much about XYZ but I feel I must comment". If anyone responds to a troll with these kinds of clues in it, feel free to bask in the glow of knee-jerk /. responses.

    Denial
    If you're unlucky someone will accuse you of being a troll (surely not!) and try and ruin it for you. If you don't want it all to end there, then be sure to counter it by accusing them of being small-minded and petty, saying that it's easier for them to say it's a troll than to accept that people have different opinions. Be sure to say this in the subject line, especially if their subject was the infamous "YHBT. YHL. HAND."

    Claiming credit
    Given that /. has its community of regular trolls (hi guys!), it's only polite to publish your troll on one of the so-called "hidden" forums for all to see and admire. This way, you get to bask in the praise of other trolls, they get to contribute to your's if they want to, and you get an easy way to find the troll later on when you want to check on its progress :)

    As for when to post it, that's a matter of opinion really. You can either post it straight away or leave it will after people start biting. Remember that the troll forum is also frequented by non-trolls, and sometimes you may get a self-declared "troll-buster" try and expose you. But remember, /.ers always post before thinking, and often it doesn't matter at all.

    There is no real current forum at the moment thanks to various spammers hitting the sids, but try trolltalk, the original troll sid started by 80md and osm way back in the day. Generally all postings are done there as an AC, with your name at the end of the post. Include a link to the troll somewhere in the text, which ideally will be directly to the post and its replies - click on the #XX link in the thread to get there.

    Ending the troll
    Sometimes you just get bored with a troll, or people start posting genuinely thoughtful stuff in reply (it does happen). When this happens it might be time to own up to the troll with a helpful "YHBT. YHL. HAND." post. Sometimes people will carry on a discussion of the issue, and if you're really lucky (and it was a great troll) they will completely fail to believe you and carry on arguing. If that happens, pat yourself on the back for writing a great troll :)

    The cheap $3 crack
    Finally, when all else fails and your troll gets moderated down to (-1, Troll) within ten seconds of you posting it, the only honourable thing to do is to accuse the moderators of smoking the cheap $3 crack (again) and give up :(

    Section 2 - Types of troll
    The Maniac
    Probably the most popular kind of troll, the Maniac holds an opinion on something, and won't budge from that opinion no matter what evidence to the contrary is presented. If challenged, the Maniac will simply get more and more agitated and abusive, deriding his opponents as "idiots", "wrong-thinking", "dangerous" and "subversive". Generally the Maniac takes a position that opposes the prevalent /. beliefs, but a similar effect can be achieved by taking a typical /. viewpoint and pushing it to ridiculous extremes.

    Maniacs can be crafted for practically every article /. posts, although some are more obvious targets than others. Civil liberty articles, especially on things like censorship, DMCA, UCITA that really get /.ers riled up, are usually extremely fruitful grounds for a well-crafted maniac. The other obvious type of article is anything which could possibly involve religion, especially evolution :)

    Here are some fruitful avenues to explore:

    The Right-Wing Maniac
    Always popular, the right-wing maniac (RWM) is a God-fearing, gun-toting, flag-waving American, and proud of it. They don't care about the rest of the world, unless it's to "prove" that America is better than everything else, and they cannot stand liberal whining over civil rights. They hate the moral decay of America and want it to revert into a nation of heterosexual, Christian whites like it was meant to be. Woe betide anyone that dares to suggest otherwise.

    Religion
    There are two ways to approach this kind of maniac. The harder to pull off is the militant atheist, but this is quite common amongst /. posters and you would have to be very offensive to get this to work. Of course with religion trolls, the argument can go on for ever once it's started... The more common approach is the Christian fundamentalist. They are ignorant, intolerant and bigoted in the extreme. For them the Bible is the inerrant word of God revealed to man - it contains no flaws and no contradictions. Thus they are strict Creationists - mentions of evolution or cosmology will set them off on vitriolic rants. Flaming denunciations of anyone daring to contradict the "Word of God" are the way to go, and any kind of proof can always be ignored by appealing to "secular humanist brainwashing". And let's not forget, the USA is the greatest nation on Earth because it has the righteous power of Jesus Christ behind it.

    Ideology
    Pick a philosophy, any philosophy. This troll is a troll with a cause - they have found some kind of ideological truth, and are out to expose every other philosophy as a sham. Whether it be libertarianism, objectivism, communism or capitalism, this troll will point out the obvious "flaws" in any other philosophies, whilst spouting dogma about their own. And the best thing is - you don't even need to know that much about what you're spouting - making doctrinaire mistakes will get both sides of the argument flaming you, adding to the fun.

    Software
    This is an old favourite and crops up in many forms, covering the gamut from OS maniacs (Linux zealots, MS-apologists or embittered BSD fanatics), language maniacs (Pascal vs. C, C vs. C++, C++ vs. Java, Perl vs. Python, VB vs. everything), application maniacs(GIMP vs. Photoshop, Netscape vs. IE, vi vs. emacs) and also includes people who complain about how technology should only be for the 31337 hackers.

    Guns
    Americans love their guns, and will always fight passionately for their Constitutionally guarenteed rights to bear arms and shoot people. Even the slightest hint of criticism of this will bring down the wrath of a thousand and one enraged gun-owners on you, so it's always a great point to work into a troll :)

    The Expert
    The Expert is someone who is "savvy" in their particular field, and is perfectly willing to give their opinion on any topic even vauguely related to their field. The Expert is most likely to be from a field which /.ers as a rule despise - the classic example is dumb marketing guy, but try consultants, lawyers, politicians, lobbyists, executives, journalists (just think Jon Katz). With this kind of troll sweeping statements with little content are the norm, along wire dire portents of future catastrophe and dark hints of "insider knowledge".

    Some possible angles to exploit:

    Industry knowledge
    The expert knows the computing industry from the inside - as a long-term pro, they can dispense knowledge knowing that they can "speak for the industry". Their smug self-satisfaction is bound to annoy, as is any suggestion that things aren't the way that /.ers would like it - saying "Linux requires the rock-solid guarantee of a trusted company like Microsoft" or "Apache cannot be trusted for mission-critical enterprise platforms" is guaranteed to get you denials explaining exactly why you're wrong, in excruciating detail.

    Helpful hints
    With their tech-savvy (or law-savvy or whatever) experience, the expert is obviously the best person to point out what's wrong with things or to give out useful "factual" information. In fact this probably works best with lawyer trolls - for all that /.ers protest "IANAL", they certainly seem to think they could be, and any mistakes you make will send them rushing to prove themselves by correcting you.

    Offtopic Trolls
    Not really a "troll" in the strict Jargon File sense of the word, but they certainly should be included here :) This category includes parodies, offtopic weirdness any all kinds of amusing stuff. Not really my area of expertise, this stuff is mainly done by gnarphlager and opensourceman. Thanks to gnarphlager for this section.

    Offtopic trolls, like any other, come in almost as many colours as an iMac, but generally not as cute. But then again, a good offtopic "troll" can affect more people than a repulsive little gumdrop on your desk, because you need to have someone SEE your desk before they can react. Simple? Moreso than even my overblown prose could indicate. Some basic examples:

    The serial troll
    Write a story. Keep expanding it. It doesn't matter what article you post it under, so long as it's high up. If you want people to recognize you, pick a couple themes or symbols, and carry them on throughout the story. Other alternatives include back linking or including the entire story, but adding more each time. Be funny if you want. Or if you don't feel like being funny, just be really weird. Someone will react.

    The random troll
    This has nothing to do with anything. Be it a stream of consciousness rant, or a description of the corner of your desk. Another favorite is a monologue, read as if spoken from any one given entity to another. The more outlandish, the better (a pair of socks talking to a mousepad, for example). If you really wanted to be artsy, work in an actual metaphor or legitimate meaning behind it, but it's not necessary.

    The vaguely related troll
    Start out with a comment about the article. Have a definite opinion of it. Then, after a little while, disintegrate into randomness. All roads eventually can eventually lead to cheese (yum), Natalie Portman, cannibalism, toasters, squirrels, futons, you name it. All it takes is a little bit of creativity. Oh, and feel free to use other trolls' motifs. Open source and all that ;-)

    General tips:

    If it's funny for a fleeting moment, then it's worth posting.
    Puns. Puns are only less vile than mimes, but it's hard to mime on /. So feel free/obligated to litter your offtopic and random bits with puns. Hurt the bastards. And if they're sick enough to laugh at them, then they'll eventually end up here ;-)
    Obscure cultural references and injokes are always good. SOMEONE will get them eventually.
    Several drafts of a serial or random post are common, but true elegance is being able to come up with something on the spot that still makes the top 40 posts (on a post-heavy article)
    Section 3 - Useful trolling links
    The following links contain background information useful for trolls needing quick quotes and "expert" opinions to include.

    General purpose links

    ddi.digital.net/~gandalf/trollfaq.html - How to deal with USENET trolls - learn your enemy :)
    www.don-lindsay-archive.org/skeptic/arguments.ht ml - A List Of Fallacious Arguments - Learn them and use them liberally
    www.altairiv.demon.co.uk/troll/trollfaq.html - USENET troll HOWTO
    www.baiting.org - Baiting.org
    www.fieldingtravel.com/df/index.htm - Fielding's DangerFinder - A guide to what and where's dangerous

    Religious links

    www.godhatesamerica.com/ - God Hates America
    www.chalcedon.edu/creed.html - The Creed of Christian Reconstruction
    www.demonbuster.com - How to cast out your demons and do spiritual warfare
    riceinfo.rice.edu/armadillo/Sciacademy/riggins/t hi ngs.htm - Things Creationists hate
    www.icr.org/ - Institute for Creation Research
    www.xenu.net - Operation Clambake - The fight against Scientology on the net
    www.hom.net/~angels/ - Citizens for the Ten Commandments
    www.bju.edu/rcnbc.html - The difference between Catholics and Christians
    www.geocities.com/prazske00/biblequotes.html - Bible quotes by category

    Political/economy links

    www.aynrand.org - The Ayn Rand Institute
    www.reason.com - Libertarian site
    www.freerepublic.com - Right-wing stuff
    www.jbs.org - Excellent site for all kinds of right-wingery
    www.dack.com/web/bullshit.html - Web economy bullshit generator

    Crackpot science links

    www.fixedearth.com - The Earth Is Not Moving
    www.jir.com/index.htm - The Journal of Irreproducible Results
  36. Bus this! by cmdrTacosBitch · · Score: 1, Interesting

    Kelly
    had
    just
    finished the last summer cheerleading practice.She was the first
    girl in ten years to make the squad their freshman year. Several of the other
    cheerleaders were upset. Kelly wasn't concerned about their thoughts. She shyed
    away from others and had very few friends. She didn't believe in the clicks
    people got into. Kelly is one of the prettiest girls in school. Shoulder length
    reddish blonde hair, acute face with a small button nose, and always smiled.
    Breasts the size of small grapefruits with nipples same size as quarters. Flat
    slightly sculptured belly, slender waist, narrow hips, small plump butt and
    perfectly shaped legs. All wrapped into a 5'4" 115pds frame.

    After showering Kelly dried herself, as she went to her locker. She noticed four
    girls across from her locker talking and snickering. Kelly ignored them. After
    slipping her cotton bikini pantys on, she grabbed her bra. Somebody had cut the
    straps. There was no way she'd be able to wear it now. She turned around to
    confront the now, laughing girls. They quickly walked out of the lockeroom.
    Kelly put on her low cut tank top, and shorts. After throwing her stuff into her
    bag, she headed out. Her breasts stood just as if she had a bra on. Her breasts
    firmly jiggled as she walked to the bus stop. Kelly was headed downtown to the
    library first. Then to a movie.

    Kelly had noticed lately that boys as well as men were looking her over as she
    walked by. Today more so than ever. After she got off the bus downtown. She went
    to walking the 4 blocks to the library. When a old black man walked out of a
    alley. Hey there. Where you headed? (shyly and quietly) Oh, hi. I'm going to
    have lunch with my dad. Kelly walked a little faster. She didn't notice that the
    old black man was following her. Kelly went into the library and looked over a
    couple of books untill it was time to go to the movie. She looked up. Over a few
    tables was the old black man. Since she had noticed men looking her way. Kelly
    was starting to become a tease. So, she walked his way to put the books away.
    She knew he wouldn't do anything in public place. When she was in front of him.
    She dropped the books. Bending over to pick them up. (without bending her knees)
    Her tank top layed so the old black man could get a good look at her white
    breasts. The old black man's mouth dropped open. Oh! Excuse me. (acting as it
    was an acident)

    Kelly headed to the movie. Which was a couple of blocks away. She loved the
    reaction she had got from the old man. The movie Kelly wanted to see was sold
    out. She wanted to see a movie. So, she got a ticket to another. Then she saw
    that another was starting and it was rated R and nobody was around. She went on
    in. Hardly anybody was there. Kelly sat towards the back . The movie started.
    When a nude scene started someone came and sat by her. She didn't even pay any
    mind. She in awe of what was on the screen. This was her first R movie. There on
    the screen was a black slave climbing on top of his master's white wife to have
    sex. Kelly liked the sight of the slave's black skin on the white woman's body.
    Kelly didn't even realize the person beside her had placed their hand onto her
    knee.

    But, when he moved his huge hand upto her thigh. Kelly regained her awareness.
    She turned. It was the old black man. She tried to push his hand away. He just
    leaned over and kissed her neck. He kissed his way down to the tops of her white
    breasts. As he moved his hand upto her shorts. He kissed the tops of her breasts
    as he rubbed her crotch. He then unbuttoned and unzipped her shorts. Even though
    she liked the sight of his black face to her white chest area. She knew she had
    to do something before he got any further. She thought to herself (that she
    shouldn't have teased this old man) As the old black man started pulling at the
    young white girl's shorts. Stop. Or I'll scream. At this time an usher was
    making his rounds. Kelly got up to leave. The usher stopped her. your not old
    enough to see this movie. I know. I came into the wrong movie by acident. Kelly
    left and went home.

    It had been several weeks since the incident with the old black man. School had
    started. Pro football season had started the week before, and Kelly's school was
    going to have their first game tomorrow morning. Today they were having a pep
    rally at the end of the school day. Kelly stopped over Stacy's house for awhile.
    It was about 6:00p.m. Kelly hurried home to help set up things for her dad's
    party. Every month her dad and some of his friends would get together and have a
    few drinks and discuss sports. This was her dad's turn to have it at his house.
    When she got home. Her dad told Kelly that her mother had went out with aunt Mae
    and that she'd be out late. Kelly helped her dad set things up. Most of the guys
    were there. Kelly fixed herself something to eat and took it to her room. She
    turned on the stereo as she ate.

    It was about 8:15 now and Kelly decided she'd take swim as it was unseasonabley
    warm tonight. Kelly danced around to the music as she got her bikini out.
    Without thinking she took her top and bra off. She was in front of the window
    and hadn't pulled the blinds down. She looked outside and noticed Mr. Turner
    looking up at her. Mr.Turner was retired runningback from the local pro team. He
    was black very muscular. He stood about 6 feet tall and weighed around 235
    pounds. Kelly was so embarassed. She hurried away from the window and put on her
    bikini. She thought about not swimming. But, after a half hour she went on down
    to swim. As she tried to sneak by the rec room. Mr. Turner walked out and almost
    bumped into her. Oh! Hi. Didn't mean to run you down. Kelly couldn't even speak.
    By the way. I didn't mean to stare earlier. It isn't everyday you see such
    beauty. That's ok. (very quietly) As she went onto swim.

    Kelly swam and relaxed poolside for a couple hours. She went on upto the
    bathroom and took a shower. Dried herself. Then, slipped on a robe. She went
    across the hall to her bedroom. As Kelly entered her room she looked to see who
    was coming up the stairs. It was Mr. Turner. May I use the restroom. Sure. Kelly
    pushed at the door. The door sounded like it closed. But, it came open slightly.
    Kelly saw Mr. Hicks looking through his upstairs window towards her. He must be
    around 73 years old. Kelly turned on the radio and started dancing. Her robe
    came open. Mr. Hicks just stared as she danced. Kelly turned off the overhead
    light after turning a lamp on. She thought to her self. She'd realy give
    Mr.Hicks a surprise. She slipped her robe off. Exposing her totaly naked body to
    him. After all he was in his house and to old to do anything. She danced around
    for a few more seconds. Then she layed down on her bed. Mr.Hicks still had view
    of her. Kelly was turning into a real tease and was liking it. She rolled over
    onto her belly, so that Mr.Hicks would get a good look at her butt.

    She heard the bathroom door open. She glanced at a mirror across the room, and
    noticed her door was open slightly. She thought about getting up and closing it.
    But it was to late. Mr.Turner was in the hallway next to her doorway. Kelly
    acted to be asleep. After a few seconds she heard the door close. Kelly figured
    that he pulled the door closed. But, when she heard some movement. She became
    terrified. She kept her eyes shut as if she was sleeping. She then felt
    Mr.Turner run his hand up the back of her white thigh. Kelly trembled as he
    caressed her young white buns. She instantly felt herself getting wet inside.
    Mr.Turner kissed her white butt. Kelly liked this but knew it was wrong. She
    turned over onto her back. Don't!

    Then she saw him. Totaly naked huge black man. Huge biceps, a very muscular
    chest, ripple tummy. Kelly let out a quiet gasp as she noticed his huge erect
    penis. It must be 11inches long and realy fat. She couldn't get her eyes off of
    his huge black monstercock. Mr.Turner walked upto her face. Suck on it. No! as
    she thought ( that would be gross) He rubbed his black cock across her lips a
    couple times. He then went to the foot of the bed and knelt down. He kissed the
    young white girl's thighs working his way up. Don't! Stop! I'll scream. As
    squeezed her legs together. He kissed her blonde pubic hair, then lower belly.
    Kelly became speachless as he kissed white belly and licked at her bellybutton.
    Mr.Turner wasn't going to take a no for an answer at this point. He kissed his
    way to her teenage white breasts. He kissed and sucked at her nipples at the
    same time ran his hand to her young pussy.

    Kelly let out a moan, as he inserted his finger inside her. She tried to push
    him away. Even though she was enjoying what he was doing. Kelly knew this was
    bad and besides he would most likely rip her in half. Mr.Turner rubbed at her
    teenage pussy for moment to lubricate the outside of her pussylips. Mr.Turner
    climbed onto the bed to mount her little white body. Kelly held her legs
    together. Please don't It will hurt me. It only will hurt for a moment. Ohhh! As
    Mr.Turner rubbed his huge black cock up and down her little pussy. He pushed
    forward. No penetration. He gave big shove forward. Still no penetration of the
    little white girl's pussy. He pushed again and finaly managed to get his
    cockhead inside her. Kelly tightened up. He pushed a little deeper. She felt his
    huge black cock press against her hyman. She knew that one more push would pop
    her cherry. Just as he drew back. A knock at the door. Kelly! Kelly! Are you
    awake. As the door opened. Mr.Turner jumped off the side of the bed.

    Hi dear. Mmmom! Yes. Are you ok? ya. Dad, said you'd be late. The movie was sold
    out. So, I came home early. Are you sure? That you are ok. Yes. Just tired. I've
    told you to pull the blinds down. You are old enough now that guys will love to
    see you dress and undress. You sure seem nervouse. Is there anything wrong? No
    mom! Well, you look flush and sweaty. I'll get the thermetor. No. That's ok. I'm
    alright. Ok. Call for me if you need me. Goodnight. Goodnight mom. Kelly was
    trembleing. Mr.Turner jumped up and dressed and quietly went back downstairs
    where there were still a few men gathered having their last drink. Kelly finaly
    fell asleep a couple hours later. But, within another hour she woke up from a
    bad dream. Her mother rushed in and comforted her. Kelly couldn't tell her
    mother that she dreamed about being raped by twelve black men.

    After this Kelly quit teasing men for a couple weeks. She started slowly once
    more. She would mostly like old black men. She would go without a bra and leave
    a button undone then lean over in front of them. During the holiday vacation.
    When her parents were at work. Kelly even went totaly naked. Except a long
    winter coat. She rode the public bus all the way downtown. She aboat croaked
    when an old black man sat beside her. They talked awhile. He was headed to work.
    He was going to retire in the spring, after 40 years of service. When he looked
    the other way. Kelly undid the top button of her coat. Which exposed just a
    little of the tops of her white breasts. Your a very pretty young lady. You need
    to be careful. Someone may try to have their way with you. I can take care of
    myself. Here's my stop. Take care.

    Kelly felt ashamed. She stopped such things. Untill the last day of school. She
    had worn her white blouse and plaid skirt.(the catholic school girl look) She
    decided to walk home since it was very nice day out and school let out early.
    She was walking through the park. She was nearing the walk bridge across the
    creek. She heard some voices coming from under the car bridge nearby. There were
    three black hobos. There was nobody else in sight. They were washing theirselves
    in the creek. She starred at them. They only had their pants on. But, she liked
    the sight o their black chests. Kelly also knew that they would most likely see
    her cross the walkway. She was realy excited. After a moment she slipped her bra
    then pantys off and put them in her backpack. This excited her. Even though they
    were to far away to notice. She only had two blocks to go to get home from the
    park. When she walked across the walkway. The men whistled and yelled to her.
    They were close enough to see that she was a pretty girl. Kelly liked this but
    ignored them. But, then she noticed they were following her. She picked up her
    pace. A short distance from the street. They caught her. One of the black hobos
    grabbed her. Turned her around. Man! We're goin to have a good time today. As he
    saw her quarter sized pink nipples poking through her blouse. Then a cop drove
    by. Then backed up. The men ran off. Mam! Were they bothering you? As the cop
    walked upto her. No sir. He was a tall black man in his fortys. He took a double
    take when he noticed her pirky breasts through her blouse. You need to watch how
    you dress. Your asking for trouble.

    That night she dreamed of Mr.Turner fucking her. She woke up in a sweat. She was
    showering when her parents yelled in at her. Honey! We're headed to work early.
    Kelly wondered more and more what it would feel like to be fucked by a black
    man. Mr.Turner was very gentle with her. She couldn't believe how close she came
    to being fucked. Kelly thought to herself-(I know it's wrong. But, I'm going to
    find out today) She put on her bikini pantys then bra and her summer sundress.
    After slipping on shoes she went downtown on the bus. Remembering the first
    experience with an old black man. She walked towards the alley where she first
    saw him. It was almost 10:00a.m. Ahead was a tall old black man. It might even
    be the same man. Kelly acted as if she didn't notice him. She walked as if going
    to the library. Hey baby! Don't you say hi to your friends? So, she knew he was
    the same man and he remembered her. Oh. Hi. (acting not to be interested) Hey!
    You want a puppy. (Knowing this was a ploy) (Even though she was scared-she was
    going through with her plan) Sure! Where is it? Down here. In a box. Directing
    her to the alley. Kelly nervousely followed. I sleep here and this puppy came
    upto me and had no tags. A third of the way through the alley. There were stacks
    of large cardboard boxes with blankets on them. There were five other old black
    men laying on their blankets. Untill they seen her. Kelly started to leave. Not
    soon enough. They surrounded her.

    Don't I'll scream! One of the black men pulled out a knife. No you won't.
    Unless! Kelly stood there while the black men fondled her. Two of them fondled
    her breasts and two others played with her firm butt. One watched the street as
    one of the black men unzipped her sundress and slipped the straps off of her
    shoulders. Her dress fell to her ankles. Please! Don't hurt me. The man with the
    knife walked upto her. Not saying a word. Cut the right strap of her bra. With
    the other black men laughing he cut the left strap. Starring into her eyes he
    ran the knife across the tops of her breasts. Then suddenly cut her bra in half.
    Kelly's bra fell to the ground. Exposing her firm white breasts to the old black
    bums. They all got quiet. Starring at the young white girl. The black man put
    the knife up. Then with two hands grabbed her pantys and ripped them from her
    petite teenage body. Kelly felt herself getting wet. Even though she was
    terrified. Here she was a virgin about to be raped by six old black men in an
    alley downtown. She didn't even know if they would kill her or not.

    Kelly just watched as the man in front of her dropped his pants and undershorts.
    He was black as midnight. His cock was hard pointing towards her. It was smaller
    than Mr.Turner's. But, Kelly didn't see how it would fit into her. Kelly shaked
    like a leaf and tears started to run down her face. The black man's cock pressed
    against her belly as he stepped closer. He shoved her down onto a blanket. He
    knelt down and pushed her legs apart. She was to scared to fight back. She
    looked to the side as he mounted her. She noticed that the other men's dicks
    were larger and fatter. He whispered to her I'm the nice one. The others would
    just ram it inside you. He rubbed his black cock up and down her blonde pussy 4
    or 5 times to slicken her up. He then pushed forward. Without sucess. Then
    another, and another. Your one tight chick. One more huge shove forward and
    Kelly felt his cockhead push inside her. Then another push and he was touching
    her hyman. He pulled back. Then with a smile gave a quick shove forward. Kelly
    screamed out in pain as his black dick ripped through her hyman.

    The black man took pleasure at the painful look on her face. Your just a spoiled
    white brat. As he slammed all 8 inches of his cock into her. Blood ran down her
    butt. He squeezed her white tits so hard she thought that they would pop. She
    felt his hairy black balls slamming against her white butt. The other black bums
    were urging him to hurry. They wanted their turn. The pain subsided after a
    couple minutes or so and Kelly was starting to enjoy the fucking she was
    getting. She wrapped her legs across the backs of his. Kelly let out moans of
    delight as the black man pounded his cock into her white pussy. She was about to
    climax when she felt the man cum inside her. With one more lunge forward. He
    pulled out of her. Who's next. She's a fine piece.

    The next black hobo ordered her to her hands and knees. Like a dog you know.
    After penetrating the young white girl from behind another got infront to force
    her to suck him. She learned quick how to suck. Kelly first thought it was gross
    to have a man's dick inside her mouth. After a couple minutes she even started
    enjoying cocksucking. The man behind her fucked her as hard and fast as he
    could. Making her buns and tits bounce around. She felt herself building to a
    climax again. This time she squeeled in delight as she climaxed and felt the
    black man cum inside her pussy. The old black man in front was cumming into her
    mouth as the man behind pulled his black cock out and squirted a couple times
    across her butt. The two black men quickly stepped away from the petite white
    girl. When another layed beside her and directed her on top of him.

    Kelly sat on his 12 inch black snake. She let out a gasp in dispair as the last
    4 inches went inside her. It was uncomfortable as he fucked her. But, after a
    moment it felt good being stretched this far. She figured he must have the
    biggest dick in the world. To her surprise one of remaining black men knelt
    behind her. He pushed her forward. He guided his 10inch black cock to her white
    butt. He gave a hard continued push. Kelly screamed and tears appeared again as
    she felt like she was being ripped in half. Without hesitation the black men
    fucked her hard and unmerciful. One in her white ass and the other in her blonde
    pussy. Even though it hurt after a few minutes of being double fucked. Kelly
    yelled out in another orgasm. As the black man inside her butt squirted streams
    and streams of cum inside her. Then the last black man traded places with the
    man that was buttfucking her.

    As he started buttfucking the teenage white girl. He yelled out. Hey! we're a
    oreo cookie. Kelly was getting exhausted and was going limp. It felt like she
    would pass out. Then she orgasmed again. After she came off of her third orgasm,
    the man pumped her white ass full of his black seed. He quickly withdrew from
    her as the man under her. Rolled over on top of her. He went to fucking his
    black 12 inch pole in and out of her as fast as he could. He sucked on her white
    breast. When he started cumming inside her he bit down. Kelly let out a yelp.
    This didn't stop her from climaxing again, for the fourth time. The man stood
    up. She was exhausted and just layed there. To her amazement they were still
    standing around naked. We want you to meet Bubba.

    Kelly was amazed when she saw Bubba. He was about 50yrs.old 6ft.6in. tall
    220pds. His cock must be around 14 inches long. As he mounted Kelly's little
    white body. He told her that he was going to fuck her brains out. It looked like
    a black monster mounting a little white doll. He entered her slowly. Even though
    she had been reamed out several times. It was slow going for him to get his
    black cock into her. After getting 10 inches inside her white pussy. He started
    fucking her hard. After a few minutes his huge black balls were smacking against
    her white butt cheeks. Kelly orgasmed first. Then she felt him shoot a couple of
    squirts of cum inside her pussy. He pulled his huge black cock out of her and
    finished cumming all over her flat white belly. After he stepped back. She was
    surrounded by the other six black men. They jirked theirselves off all over her.
    She was drenched in cum. Her hair and face was covered with cum. Her white
    breasts, belly, pubic hair, pussy, and butt was also was covered with cum. She
    thought to herself I can't move. She figured that she was about to pass out with
    exhaustion.

    Kelly just layed there naked and covered with cum. The black men were dressed.
    When she saw reflections of flashing lights. The black men had went to the
    entrance of the alley. Kelly heard them talking to what seemed like police
    officers. She slowly got up and peeked around the corner. It was the police. She
    grabbed her sundress. As she walked out the otherside of the alley she slipped
    on the dress. Her shoes had fallen off during all the fucking. Her breasts,
    pussy, and butt ached from the pounding and stretching. She was drenched in cum
    which was starting to dry on her now. No place to clean up. Oops. Excuse me. She
    bumped into a lady. Are you ok. Yeh! Sure. Kelly walked three block as everyone
    starred at her. Since she was such a mess. People kept asking if she was ok. She
    got home on the bus. She threw her sundress in the washer, showered. Redressed
    and fell asleep on the coach.

    --
    --I like to lick the shitty bits off Cmdr Tacos crusty ass
  37. mount /dev/infbnd /mnt/rad by Graymalkin · · Score: 2

    Woohoo InfiniBand. Finally small companies can build clusters that can compete with multi-million dollar SGI super systems. Beowulf clusters using Ethernet interconnects are nothing compared to a system with memory bridge level hardware interconnects. Current Linux clusters are often based around Ethernet which is very slow and has a high overhead when you want to put it to the use of letting processes on different machines talk to one another. Big Beowulf clusters have been shown to work well on embarrassingly parallel computational problems (key cracking, some types of CFD, and packet analisys like SETI@Home) but aren't really up to snuff with truely high end super computers without much faster interconnects. Some clusters (I think Microway and a few others) are built using Myrinet interconnects which are faster and actually provide the sort of connections big clusters need. Even using Myrinet you end up with alot of scalability problems because you only get your max throughput when transfering very large blocks of data to the same host. Having a Northbridge based interconnect (rather than something like a Myrinet card which is connecting to the PCI bus which in turn hooks to the Southbridge) is a very good way to speed up clustered systems. IBM, Sun, and SGI learned this a long time ago which is why they use high speed interconnects between individual boxes rather than trying to overextend network protocols.

    --
    I'm a loner Dottie, a Rebel.