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California Takes Issue With Microsoft Settlement Idea

Deepfoo writes: "Note from CNet on the California challenge to Microsoft's attempt to settle the 100 civil cases on file against it by donating equipment. The dissenters will argue that those harmed in the lawsuit aren't getting compensated directly in this way, and that the ploy of donating equipment to schools is a transparent effort to further extend its monopoly. The dissenting California lawyers estimate the actual damages due to Californians alone could be on the order of 3 to 9 billion (wide range, but that's what they've said). Is Microsoft a do-gooder, or up to no good?"

6 of 443 comments (clear)

  1. Is Microsoft a do-gooder, or up to no good? by pyrrho · · Score: 0, Flamebait

    ... sounds like a rhetorical question...

    --

    -pyrrho

  2. Re:Userfriendly - OT by Osty · · Score: 0, Flamebait

    has already covered this topic fairly well here

    "sir, we're a monopoly, we get to set the price"

    This is extremely off-topic, but isn't the point of a comic strip supposed to be that the strip is funny, or has some form of humorous value to it? Does anybody find UF funny? Rehashed, boring, tired old Microsoft jokes, linux pandering, etc.


    I won't even bother saying anything about the art, as anything that can be said about it already has been.

  3. Who's been harmed by HardCase · · Score: 2, Flamebait
    Flame away, I guess, but I still have to ask who has been harmed? I haven't. I use Linux for my day to day work and Windows 2000 for the few things that I can't do with Linux. I haven't bought a pre-built computer for several years, so I haven't had to wrangle over whether or not I'm going to pay for a copy of Windows.


    I guess my point is that even though I don't agree with the business tactics that Microsoft has taken, even though I think that Windows XP is overpriced for what you get, I believe that there are alternatives out there.


    Here's the hard part: to get what you really want takes a little work. So I built my own computers and installed my own operating systems. And I can honestly say that Microsoft hasn't harmed me, hasn't stifled my innovation and basically has had little to no impact on me.


    My personal opinion is that much of the Microsoft bashing goes on for a few reasons:


    1. You're jealous of Bill Gates because he made a lot of money.


    2. Microsoft is a big (relatively speaking) company and big companies are easy to hate.


    3. Microsoft aggressively protects its intellectual property interests.


    It seems to me that only the third reason *might* be a position to argue from, except that, from a legal perspective, MUST protect their IP interests.


    As far as the "innovation" issue, I'd say that's a red herring. Innovation, at least in the sense that most people bandy the word around, really doesn't exist. Very little work in any industry is innovative, regardless of what the marketing flacks might say. For the last several years almost every "new" product or idea has really been nothing more than an evolutionary improvement on existing work. Now that's not a bad thing...it really is how new products get introduced. But I don't think it's appropriate to say that Microsoft stifles innovation...the very complexity of many of the "things" that we use today really limits true innovation.


    And just as a bonus...for everyone who rails at companies who (mis)use US patent laws to protect their patently obvious software developments, remember that the antitrust laws that Microsoft was accused of violating were put in place to combat the excesses of the railroad barons of the 19th century...just as poor an application of the law to the Microsoft situation as the application of patent law to software and "methods". Read your history!


    And finally...the "Windows tax" isn't necessarily a Microsoft invention. Consider the economies of scale. I was part of management for a major computer manufacturer and one of the decisions that we had to make regarded the shipment of systems with no OS or a custom OS installed. From a cost perspective, it simply was too expensive to delete Windows from our configurations and create a special process for the small number of orders that required no OS. It wasn't a contract requirement, it wasn't Microsoft leaning on us to ship Windows, it was economics plain and simple. To knock $40 off the cost of a system and ship with no OS cost well over $40 to implement on such a small volume of computers. Want to blame somebody on the "Windows tax"? It's the corporate bottom line. Oh, and the company is still in business. And, in a sea of red ink, actually made a profit last quarter.


    -h-

    1. Re:Who's been harmed by kindbud · · Score: 1, Flamebait

      And I can honestly say that Microsoft hasn't harmed me, hasn't stifled my innovation and basically has had little to no impact on me.

      If that's so, you're the exception, not the rule, among computer users. Although, I don't think you've given a frank appraisal of how Microsoft can constrain your computing experience. If I may make such a bad pun, the peripheral effects on the market are pretty obvious to anyone who has tried to get commodity hardware working on other OS besides Microsoft's, or to get support for their hardware - or even their internet connection - when it is not running Windows.

      But that's neither here nor there, because:
      . I was part of management for a major computer manufacturer and one of the decisions that we had to make regarded the shipment of systems with no OS or a custom OS installed. From a cost perspective, it simply was too expensive to delete Windows from our configurations and create a special process for the small number of orders that required no OS. It wasn't a contract requirement, it wasn't Microsoft leaning on us to ship Windows, it was economics plain and simple. To knock $40 off the cost of a system and ship with no OS cost well over $40 to implement on such a small volume of computers.

      As management, you're admitting that you guys couldn't even figure out how to do NOTHING without it costing over $40.00 not to do it? THis is so telling of how management thinks totally ass-backwards. Why are you trying to delete Windows from the configuration??? Did it ever occur to you, JUST DON'T ADD IT?!?!? (and you claim that you've not been damaged - you're BRAIN DAMAGED!!).

      Oh, and the company is still in business. And, in a sea of red ink, actually made a profit last quarter.

      Oh how late 90's of you. Please tell me: I'm supposed to take whatever else you have to say seriously, because.... ????

      --
      Edith Keeler Must Die
  4. Re:RedHat's take by Kymermosst · · Score: 1, Flamebait

    Poverty level? According to this report, which was done in December of 1994, and this table within, teachers are NOT at the poverty level.

    The fact, if you trust the report, is that the starting salary for primary teachers in the U.S. is about $22K per year. This figure is comparable to, and even above most western nations. It also is very close to the average per-capita GDP. At mid career, they make about $34K.

    The point being, these people are FAR from starving, and the fact is, my fiancee and I barely make a combined income that matches the starting income for a teacher.

    I should also mention that teachers get excellent benefits.

    One could also note from the report that teachers in the U.S. work an average of 185 days. If you take a mid-career teacher making $30K, divide by 185 days, is $162/day, or $16/hour if they worked 10 hours a day, or $20/hour if they work 8.

    So don't give me this crap about teachers not making enough money and that they are at the "poverty level". I make $12K a year, and I damn sure aren't living in "poverty." I go to school, I pay my bills, I eat, and I even get to build a new computer every now and then.

    I WILL concede that the report concludes that teacher pay is low relative to the amount of time spent with each pupil, and number of pupils per teacher, compared to other western nations.

    I will also concede that teacher pay isn't comparable to most other jobs that require a masters or doctorate degree, and therefore don't attract more qualified people.

    I will NOT concede that they are starving and living in poverty.

    As far as your other issues are concerned, I don't know much about them.

    --
    "Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives" should be a convenience store, not a government agency.
  5. Put Apple back in the schools! by Xife · · Score: 0, Flamebait

    Linux is too unstable and difficult to maintain and difficult for a fifth grader to use (sorry KDE and GNOME, maybe in 3 years).

    Make MSFT buy 200,000 iMacs instead of PCs. If they want to write off the free Mac Internet Explorer, fine by me.

    --
    ---- Smokin' another sig.