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SonicBlue Going w/ReplayTV 4000 Despite Lawsuit
Ughhgu writes "Looks like SonicBlue is going to go ahead and start shipping. The Cnet article even has a quote from SonicBlue. It seems they can't understand why the industry would sue them. Sign me up for one!" I'd dearly love to test one of these.
For more information on ReplayTV 4000, see the official site. Interestingly, it's the only networked digital video recorder with broadband connectivity.
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Translation: "Our business model is antiquated, and instead of trying to find a new way we're just going to sue anyone who takes advantage of it." Methinks the networks want immunity from the darwinian aspect of capitalism. As I'm sure has been said on /. before, perhaps it's just time to find a better way.
Read a book! Go hiking! Learn to cook! Become a viking!
Fix that squeaky door hinge. Eat a banana. Buy a Japanese orange. Lay into some sweet ill-nana.
Log onto the web. Shave your head. Watch the tides flow and ebb. Don't be caught dead
watching that damned tv.
Life is waiting.
These units have the capability to send shows from one ReplayTV unit to another. There's not a whole lot of detail given about this functionality, but I wonder whether it can be fooled into thinking your PC is a ReplayTV unit. I slobber uncontrollably when I think about a DVR that would let me archive shows to my file server.
I've been a Tivo owner for almost a couple of years now, and in that time I've modified mine with extra disk space, a web interface, an ethernet port, and a shell prompt on a serial port. :> And there is some work going on right now to play raw video streams from the unit streamed over the network (Andrew Tridgell of Samba fame is the main culprit there), but something like this -- and the stand that SonicBlue is taking on this issue -- makes me sorta want a ReplayTV 4000.
For those interested, there's very little information on the "Send Show" functionality listed on the ReplayTV web site, but I am curious how a user with multiple ReplayTV units and a broadband hardware firewall would allow people to send video to them. I assume it's a TCP session and let-'er-rip, but the site is annoyingly lacking on details. I'd love to know.
You can buy it directly from ReplayTV.
I'll buy it when I can use a SMB or NFS drive over my network to store an amount of video only limited by my hard drives, and I can access the files from my PC (to play on the PC, to extract clips, whatever I feel like doing).
- For the complete works of Shakespeare: cat
MP3 players were supposed to be the end of music companies, VCRs were supposed to be the end of movie theatres, Photocopy machines were supposed to be the end of books, Radio was supposed to be the end of newspapers. You know what? None of them created the destruction that people feared they would. This will all blow over like the fears surrounding the RIO.
Fishy policy, I'd say...
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But we all know how big money..err..companies owns the legal system now <Insert MS jibe>
http://monkeyserver.com --- weeeeee
What is needed is a way to have a fully functional system that doesn't take the software upgrades that will inevitably be coming to disable the sharing features and other features that the networks are complaining about. To compare it to TiVo, to use the full TiVo features you must leave a phoneline plugged in to "phone home" and take whatever software upgrades are forced on you. Pull the phone line for more than 30 days and you basically have yourself a glorified VCR. At some point in SonicBlue is going to be forced to send a software update to disable or alter some of the features of the 4000. Unless there is a way to hack the software to have a fully functional system without taking software updates, you're just wasting your money on this.
Sonicblue's DVRs range from $700 to $2,000, depending on the size of the hard drive, which can hold 40 hours to 320 hours of programming.
Ya... exactly which hard drive costs over $1,000?
python -c "x='python -c %sx=%s; print x%%(chr(34),repr(x),chr(34))%s'; print x%(chr(34),repr(x),chr(34))"
Click on the link.. Then type "www.replaytv.com or "www.sonicblue.com" into your browser, and find out.
Moderators, this is not Flamebait, it's common (freaking) sense.
-- What you do today will cost you a day of your life.
From the email they sent me:
Dear SONICblue customer,
Thank you for pre-ordering the ReplayTV 4000. A customer service representative will be contacting you shortly to confirm the specific details of your pre-order. In order to expedite the shipment of your ReplayTV 4000 model DVR, you are encouraged to call us toll-free at 1-877-ReplayTV (1-877-737-5298) to verify your desired shipping method and other details.
Our Sales department can be reached Monday through Friday, 5:00AM to 5:30PM (PST).
Thank you and Happy Holidays!
SONICblue Customer Care
I immediately called and waited about 20 minutes on hold. The main options for shipping ran $22 (ground) $55 (2nd day) and$80 for Next day, though he mentioned that they ship friday so next day would be Mon at the earliest. CA residents need to pay taxes.
People think Microsoft is the answer. Microsoft is just the question, "No" is the answer.
* Ban the programatic detection and elimination of ads. Do this either with laws, or de-facto, by owning media "browsers"
* Make ads use non-standard and random time lengths, sizes, volumes, ect., so that ads cannot be programatically detected
* Interrupt TV, web pages, and even music CDs and movies with ads at irregular intervals so that ads cannot be even generally anticipated
* Supperimpose ads on the sidelines of shows, web pages, CD covers etc. with a constant, nagging presence so that it is difficult to escape from ads even after they have been identified
* Work ads into the background of the action of shows, web pages, etc. to make it more difficult to mentally "tune out" the ads' presenece
* Work ads into the hearts of the plots of fictions, the comments of characters, and the opinions of pundits so that it becomes difficult to even distinguish ads from non-ads
* Replace entertainment, information, opinion, and art with ads wholesale; completely removes the troubling burden of somehow "integrating" ads with non-ads
* Attempt to ban the use of all mass media except for ads; eliminates non-ad competition
What will they think of next?
I'm not going to get into the whole vinyl vs cd arguement, but suffice it to say that digital is NOT higher quality by definition - it is in the case of VCR's of course, but I'm sure an analog video system could be made better than a DVD, and a digital system could be made better than that too. The two are on equal terms when ti comes to quality, save for the longevity of digital.
In fact, you'd think the industry would be happier with formats that only lasted a few years as opposed to DVDs which might last 20 years or more.
By ease of use I meant the easy ability to modify, copy, and otherwise deal with digital information as opposed to analog.
What they're really scared of is that with devices like this in the hands of the consumer, the networks' plans for pay-per-view replays go out the window.
What the networks want is to get more money from the consumer by charging for video on demand replays of TV shows. Keep in mind that they're pushing for "locks" on digitally delivered programs so they can mark programs as "unrecordable" and "protected" at which point your VCR/whatever will refuse to record/show the time-shifted broadcast.
The only reason they could want something like this is to be able to charge you for a time-shifted showing.
"Not home for the big game? Well, you can't record it, but we'll let you watch it as video on demand for a small fee! Suck it down!"
With a network of digital recorders that can share programs you no longer have to ask of family and friends, "hey, did you tape ER on thurs.? I missed it and forgot to tape it." Instead you search and download...and if people can do that, why would they buy a rebroadcast from the network?
This isn't about protecting an old and out of date business model, this is about changing current laws and controlling the technology so that a new business model can take off.
The bottom line is, I think TiVo is doing a very good job of making both the viewer and the network happy. The sonicBlue box can share over the internet out of the box - on the TiVo, mods are necessary that put this out of the reach of Joe Blow on the street. And TiVo underground has "secret" remote sequences.. once of which gets you a 30 second skip button on your TiVo. I've actually gone back to using the Fast Forward button instead. The automatic backup when you exit makes it easier.
It seems to me that the media companies are not so much opposed to copying for personal use, perhaps not even copying to share with friends at no profit, but rather are opposed to high quality copies lacking the artifacts that analog devices inherently leave behind when making multi-generation copies.
VHS to VHS ulitimately makes a poorer-quality copy that few people are willing to pay money for (except before release on VHS format). Digital to digital (any form factor) results in perfect copies. People don't have to give up quality for a lower price like they do in analog.
The media companies fear, and I think it is a valid fear, that perfect copies will cut into their profits to a much greater degree than the analog formats of days past.
Where this fear loses its foundation is when you consider that most people who purchase pirated copies of media (digital, analog, software, videos, music, books, whatever) probably would not purchase the item if the (cheap or free) copy was not available.
Put another way, I will never buy a legal copy of Microsoft Office. In my opinion, the quality of the product is not commensurate with its price (I have a legally licensed copy of WordPerfect Office 2000 that I am very happy with). On the other hand, if a copy were made available to me at a low price (read: free), I may consider it. Profits be damned.
But then, it's none of your business how I spend my money, now is it?
Give me my freedom, and I'll take care of my own security, thank you.
The banner ad died, we cheered. Then came the pop-under, the flash ad between pages, etc.
Yes, perhaps the idea of putiing commercials into breaks in the programming so that it does not interfere with the content is over. Commercials will be integrated into the program so that it cannot be skipped without skipping the program.
Yes, we now get to see a station badge in the lower right corner, and now we will have a marquee running across our shows too. "Make 7 Up Yours!"
Hammy
Never, because that's not the only difference.
Actually, the biggest difference, in the eyes of the huge media companies, is something that too many Slashdotters tend to dismiss as an invalid argument: you can make perfect copies of digital material, with no loss.
Before anybody dismisses it: try to think like a big media company for a minute. You have rights over works that you've bought or hired people to produce, called "copyrights." They're exclusive, with certain exceptions. (You'd like to forget the exceptions of course, but that's beside the point right now.) One nice thing about the current media formats (a few years ago) is that copies degrade, even without copy protection measures. Books are really hard to copy cheaply (so anyone who does it likely has deep pockets and is quite sueable), and audio and video tapes get noticeably worse with each generation.
If anyone was going to pay for the material in the first place, they'd want a good copy, so they'd get it from your publishers. You can almost forget about the pirates' fair use excuses - nearly no impact on you, right?
So along comes the digital media. It looks and sounds great forever! But...you can copy it! Perfectly! No degradation! All of the sudden, you have a new brand of pirates: the ones that don't have much money. And there are a lot of them, at least potentially, and they're really, really hard to track down.
Now, I'm not saying that all of their actions and arguments are excusable, justified, and sane. I am saying that, at least in this one thing - the difference between analog and digital - they have a good point. It's something more people in the tech crowd should at least acknowledge if they don't want to look like punk 13-year-olds when they argue copyright issues.
I got my Linux laptop at System76.
Ok, slashdotters, think outside the "box" will ya...
Ok, it is a little about broadcast material. It will allow transfer of information outside the advertisor's area. (look at the SHIVA laws regarding protection of local broadcast rights and the effect it is going to have on picture quality of DBS systems)...
But here is where it really matters. ALL PAY PER VIEW material. This includes Actual PPV, Premium Channels, DVD's, and Video's from blockbuster. Since the Replay will be able to record anything coming in on a given channel (like channel 3) at high resolution, and then distributed across the Internet to those that have not payed for the privelage, a technology like this, will result in less potential income to content producers. Less money to HBO, less to Disney, Less to Don King, less to the WWF.
The biggest difference between this and VCR is convenience and distribution. Distribution of Video tapes is so limited to not really matter in terms of money. When distribution becomes "easy" (And in this case, Napster is an appropriate analog), then non-payment use of PPV material becomes rampant and uncontrolled.
In this case it will only be a matter of creating "replay" groups that will create material that will be "easy" to get... "Hey, I missed the last episode of the Soprano's can someone send it to me?" "Does, any one have "Shrek?""
Fair use laws never intended to allow easy distribution of copies of material in a fashion that allows use outside of the intended commercial distribution method. It is meant to allow fair personal use.
IANAL but I think that they can demonstrate that this moves from personal use, to extra-commercial distribution of intellectual property, without compensation to the owners of that property.
Congratulations, you now have a 50" widescreen TV with a 19" 4:3 picture. For a couple grand, plus the cost of your converter.
It'd be cheaper to just tape a couple of pieces of paper over the screen.
Excuse me, I think my screen must have gone blurry or something. Did you just say "DivX AVI's" and "perfect digital quality" in the same context?
Look up the term "lossy compression" some time. (:
"How can you claim that you are anti-crack, while still writing a window manager?" — Metacity README
I want some of what you're smoking. Hughes is beaming the signal, at their cost -- and you think it's unreasonable for them to want to get paid for it?
If I mail something to you unsolicited, I can't require that you pay for it, even if you actually want it and decide to keep it.
__
Do ya feel happy-go-lucky, punk?
As someone else pointed out in this thread, the legalease on their site states "SONICblue reserves the right to automatically add, modify, or disable any features in the operating software when your ReplayTV 4000 connects to our server."
What I envision happening at some point is a judge declaring that ReplayTV 4000 can only share programs that the networks allow them to, sort of an opt-in for the networks. So technically Sonicblue wouldn't be guilty of false advertising since you can still share *some* programs. At any rate, the disclaimer above seems to cover them removing features as they please.
Here's what I watch, and why I want a DVR:
Monday: Stargate SG-1
Tuesday: 24
Wednesday: Enterprise, The Amazing Race
Thursday: Survivor
Friday: whatever
Saturday: whatever
Sunday: Stargate SG-1 repeats, Simpsons
Friday and Saturday, there's nothing on. Most other days, there's all of an hour of TV.
There are also TV shows I watch when I'm bored, or nothing else is on, or I'm paging through the channel list and see them, and nothing else is on, or are on every day.
Earth: Final Conflict, Andromeda, Relic Hunter, CounterSpin, the CBC National news.
The thing is, these are really good shows, but are not good enough to justify rearranging my schedule. Likewise with the X-Files, which I just stopped caring about.
If I had a DVR, I would record these TV shows when they were on (during the day, middle of the night, etc); as well I would record movies that were on Movie Central (there are quite a few good movies on this month, but never when I want to watch them, it seems).
After I had them recorded, I could then watch them whenever I wanted. Lazy days off, while working at home, when my favourite shows are pre-empted by hockey games, and so forth.
Ideally, I'd like to be able to convert some things to MPEG-2/DivX and store them long-term, but the vast majority of things I would do this for are CounterSpin (like CrossFire on CNN or HardTalk on BBC, only better), and the national news.
I honestly don't think the CBC, which is largely funded by my tax dollars anyway, would object to me storing news for the long-term. It's not exactly a hot trading item on IRC fservs, and it won't get me any accounts on hotline, to be sure.
Also, I would like to use such a feature to store television shows that I -cannot- buy seasons of on DVD. I'd rather buy a season on DVD than record, encode, and store (on hard drive or via iDVD), but if necessary, I would buy an 80 gig hard drive (or three, and RAID them) to store these episodes.
It would also be nice if they stopped charging so much for the damned DVDs. I mean, they cost me more than VHS tapes and they probably cost about $0.50 to press. Come on, cut me some slack here!
--Dan