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Porting Debian to... Windows
mike_sucks writes: "The first step to porting Debian to the Win32 platform has been made - dpkg is compiling under Cygwin. Check out the post on debian-devel and the Debian GNU/w32 port's site." Some of the posters on the debian-devel list aren't too pleased with the idea.
I thought this was an odd idea.
Why would anyone want to port an OS to another OS (don't start with "Windows is not an OS, please!")?
Then I saw what this all meant.
If people can get used to using Debian tools and programs on Windows, then they won't be nearly as nervous about using them in a GNU/Linux environment.
Bravo! I can't wait to see how that turns out.
I have 3656.9 Bogomips. How many Bogomips do you have?
The folks here who *have* to run windows, don't really, they *have* to run certain windows apps, because they are a defacto standard in the relevant application domain and the linux apps aren't quite up to par yet and WINE isn't quite ready for that app.
They'll never willingly quit Windows cold-turkey, but if they can start to run debian/gnu/linux (pick one) apps on Windows, eventually the linux apps will overtake the quality of the windows apps and the people will then be using them and have no reason not to switch (cost, cost, cost).
I used to think that linux on the desktop wasn't a goal worth persuing at the moment - then I realized every Windows/Office purchase is money for Microsoft to use on its quest to eliminate linux.
My God, it's Full of Source!
OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
Waste of time? It only wasted a minute of your time, and most of that was wasted by you posting a reply.
Waste of time for the developers? They are working on what they are interested in. If you want them to work on something they are less interested in, pay them. "Silly" side projects is what makes this games work.
Waste of time for the users? Some folks have to use Windows in a job context, because the tools they use are Windows only. Once people are used to Unix tools, it's hard to go back. Plus, what happens to the Wintel platform when:
The user runs free office applications that freely work with Microsoft Office formats, but have an even better native format
The user ignores the latest "vital" Microsoft operating system extensions, in favor of tools ported from the Linux / BSD environments
The user uses non-Microsoft entertainment apps, because they are less restrictive than the "official" ones
Core Microsoft facilities are replaced with ones that work better with the "ported" tools
Users have the option of emulating Windows software/games, or buying a native Linux version, and start to seriously think about the Linux version
The hardest part about moving to Linux is learning the 200 basic facts that allow you to work at all (deleting files is called "removing", user files go here, applications go here, you start X11 by typing "startx", etc.). If you can learn 100 of those facts under a Windows environment, you are half-way there.
This is a stepping stone in a migration to the standard Debian, or it may be the start of new and interesting developments. We just have to wait and see.
(Dammit, responded to an AC again...)
I use native win32 ports of gnu tools daily. Why? Because they are small and just work. The application is king. I don't really care where I run it. quixotal
Except for some people who think choosing an operating system of importance equivalent to choosing a religion most of us don't care what OS we use. Instead most people care about what apps they can run on a given OS. My favorite apps/tools are Emacs, Perl, Internet Explorer, WinAmp, ICQ, ssh, bash, grep and Word. Windows runs all of them with the least amount of hassle and that's why I use it. This is true for most of the computer users in the world, the OS that the app happens to run on is incidental.
I used to think that linux on the desktop wasn't a goal worth persuing at the moment - then I realized every Windows/Office purchase is money for Microsoft to use on its quest to eliminate linux.
Short of acquiring a genie and using their three wishes to wish away Linux, Open Source, and college classes on operating systems there's no way that anyone can eliminate Linux. Most reasonable people realize this (including Linus) and rightfully don't see Linux vs. Microsoft as some sort of war that should be won at all costs.
Should we be porting software from Windows to Linux(e.g., WINE) instead of from Linux to Windows?
Really, who do you mean by 'we'? This may be a shock to you, but there are some people who actually *ghasp* like windows, myself included. The fact of the matter is, for me, A lot of things are just easier for me to deal with in windows then in Linux, even setting up and running Apache, because I'm more used to it. I have a little Linux box for playing around with, but for the most part I like windows.
I mean, the driving force of Open source software is people doing stuff because they feel like doing it. people doing stuff because they want to. You can't just say "we should work on WINE for accomplishing our political objectives" and then have Everybody magically want to spend their time reimplementing Microsoft skank-nasty APIs
This may bother you, but everything on Debian is Open Source. And that means that you can take it and do whatever you want to with it, including porting it to windows.
If this is a success, there's a good chance I'll be running it.
autopr0n is like, down and stuff.
A lot of people seem to think that the posters on debian-devel are trying to somehow suppress or forbid this port of software. Although some of us may be uneasy about it, I haven't seen anyone actually suggest that.
The question causing argument is whether this port should be officially recognized by the Debian Project, given that one of our foundational documents says "Debian will remain 100% free software", and that software which depends on non-free software to run is considered "not part of Debian".
The crux of the matter is this, from a post on the list by Stephen Langseck:
I recognize the advantages of a dpkg-based system for cygwin, and think
it's an interesting idea that will benefit many people who can't
necessarily choose the OS of their computer; but even so, I have
misgivings about using the Debian name on such a port. If the non-free
archive is not part of Debian, should a port built on a non-free kernel
be called 'Debian'? After all, unless all the compiling for this port
will be done using Wine and gcc, you effectively will have an entire
port with build-dependencies on non-free software.
Daniel
Hurry up and jump on the individualist bandwagon!