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NASA Satellite Stranded

Account 10 writes: "BBC News has a story about one of NASA's newest and most sophisticated satellites. Launched a couple of weeks ago, it was supposed to have moved itself up into the correct orbit . Once there, one of its roles would be to route data between the ISS, other satellites and the ground as aprt of the TDRS (Tracking and Data Relay Satellite) project. However a fuel tank is leaking and it cannot reach its orbit. One suggestion is that it maneuver itself into an orbit where the shuttle can reach and rescue it - to repair it and send it on its way, or bring it home to be launched again."

10 of 167 comments (clear)

  1. Will Boeing take the $825m hit? by Constrain_Me · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Under the terms of the contract Nasa does not accept delivery of the satellite until it is in its final orbit. If it gets there Nasa will redesignate it TDRS-9.

    Who launched the thing? If they can't recover it will Boeing have to take the hit? Not a good year for the airline industry.

    1. Re:Will Boeing take the $825m hit? by jerryasher · · Score: 4, Interesting

      In the past it has been the insurance companies that take the hit. Of course, with each failure to achieve orbit, insurance prices have risen and risen, such that now, there is a reasonable chance that Boeing has self-insured this satellite.

  2. Cost of Repairs vs. Relaunch vs. Reentry by stuffman64 · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Well, NASA has 3 choices Re-entry, Retrieve and Relauch, or Repair.

    The first choice, Re-entry, is just to give up on it (in otherwords, send it back into the atmosphere and hope it doens't hit anyone, or hit a target so we get free tacos). I doubt they will do this considering the astronomical (pun somewhat intended) amount of money they would have wasted on the whole thing.

    Retrieve and Relaunch is probably unlikey too, because not only do they have to pay to send a shuttle up (although they can just do it on a regularly scheduled mission), but then they have to pay to launch it again. It would be pretty hard, IMHO, to snatch a sattilite, return it to earth, and relauch it without further damaging it. Plus, I'm sure it is more dangerous to land a shuttle with all that extra weight in the cargo area.

    That leaves us with repair, the most reasonable option. Send up some guys on the next shuttle mission with Duct Tape (about $1.50 a roll, depending on store and brand). Voila! Problem solved!

    --
    --- At my sig, unleash hell.
    1. Re:Cost of Repairs vs. Relaunch vs. Reentry by geoswan · · Score: 3, Interesting
      Well, NASA has 3 choices Re-entry, Retrieve and Relauch, or Repair. The first choice, Re-entry, is just to give up on it (in otherwords, send it back into the atmosphere and hope it doens't hit anyone, or hit a target so we get free tacos)...

      Maybe, maybe not. From the original BBC story it sounds like those at mission control don't know whether it has enough fuel to make it back to an orbit where the shuttle can retrieve it. I am going to speculate that if they don't have enough fuel to make it back to an orbit where the shuttle can retrieve it, then they don't have enough fuel for re-entry either.

      Obviously, Boeing had already started moving it up to geosynchronous orbit, or there wouldn't be any question of moving it back to an orbit where it could be retrieved -- it would still be in an orbit where it could be retrieved. This means it is much less of a problem leaving it in place. Unlike Mir, and Spacelab, if it is partway to geosynchronous, above where the shuttle can retrieve it, its orbit isn't going to decay to an altitude where it might crash for eons.

      ...Retrieve and Relaunch ... would be pretty hard, IMHO, to snatch a sattilite, return it to earth, and relauch it without further damaging it...

      How do you figure this? Matching orbits won't be a problem. NASA, and the Russian space agency, must have done this thousands of times by now. Heck, didn't the tugs that supplied Mir do it by remote control? (-8 And they only crashed one once. 8-)

      Isn't the robot arm strong enough, yet gentle enough to grab it, once it has matched orbits? Maybe they wouldn't be able to roll the photocells back up. What other problems did you anticipate?

      That leaves us with repair, the most reasonable option. Send up some guys on the next shuttle mission with Duct Tape (about $1.50 a roll, depending on store and brand). Voila! Problem solved!

      Yeah, we'll send Red Green. (whose movie, "Duct tape forever", opens up any day now. And my buddy who wins stuff won us advance tickets for the local sneak preview.)

      Seriously though, my question is, if Boeing has to wait for a next generation shuttle to retrieve it, how many years should they wait, before the satellite last its value? Two years? Five years? Ten years? Whose next generation shuttle will be ready first?

      If the Soviets could make robot frieghters dock with Mir, why can't someone make a robot tug just large enough to fly to high orbit satellites like this, and tow them down to where the shuttle can retrieve them?

  3. Re:Older rescue by jerryasher · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Yes, and depending on which web site you visit, the shuttle has launched up to seven of these tdrs satellites (but I don't know if any were of the same weight as this one). If it can safely launch one, then I have to assume that (ignoring fuel leaks) it can land with one.

  4. Who is going to build.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting

    Who is going to build the first satellite recovery robot/probe? As more satellites are being launched and seem to fail in orbit ,and/or die of age. Why not make a recovery vehicle that could park satellites in a low orbit and prepare them for service by a shuttle or robot. Obsolete satellites could be prepared for re-entry.

    I guess engery is the only limiting factor...

  5. liquid fuel? by stinky+wizzleteats · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Leaking fuel? As in liquid fuel? Since when can the shuttle carry up payloads with liquid fuel?

    Following the Challenger explosion, one of the safety regs imposed was that no payload could have liquid fuel. This required the Galileo team to adjust the launch trajectory for the spacecraft to include 2 slingshots around the inner solar system.

    1. Re:liquid fuel? by mobets · · Score: 1, Interesting

      Maybe they didn't put it up w/ the shuttle. Lots of satalites go up on a normal rocket.

      --

      It was me, I did it, I moved your cheese
  6. Blame the guy they appointed President. by fmaxwell · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I work in the aerospace industry. It's not NASA that needs convincing. It's President Bush. He has cut funding severely on some NASA programs like the International Space Station, where that the U.S. will not even be keeping its promises to its partners. The Pluto-Kuiper Express and Solar Probe were both cancelled due to his budget. He cut $207 million from the overall budget of NASA's Earth Science program, which uses satellites to study the effects of natural and human-induced changes on the global environment. (I worked on one of the satellites associated with that program and the satellite is now mothballed at my company.)

    If you want rockets to be used in weapons, elect a Republican President. If you want rockets to be used for space exploration and science, elect a Democrat. Just look at history. It was Kennedy who saw space exploration as a source of national pride. He pushed the Apollo program. It was Nixon who cut Apollo short by three landings and basically gutted NASA. Nixon ignored the recommendatons for Mars explorations made by his own task force. He only agreed to fund the development of the space shuttle because it would "bring the price of going into space down".

    Reagan pushed NASA and the shuttle into ever-increasing military roles, launching military satellites and contributing to the "Star Wars" efforts. In addition, the Reagan administration directed NASA to cancel one of its ongoing space science missions (the the International Solar Polar mission), and seriously considered terminating the entire solar system exploration program and transferring the Jet Propulsion Laboratory to some other government agency.

    Of course, when the main thrust of an administration is tax cuts for the wealthy, it's not surprising when funding for NASA suffers.

  7. Re:Shuttle rescue unlikely by Buran · · Score: 3, Interesting
    From http://www.ksc.nasa.gov/shuttle/resources/orbiters /discovery.html:
    "Two orbiters, Challenger and Discovery , were modified at KSC to enable them to carry the Centaur upper stage in the payload bay. These modifications included extra plumbing to load and vent Centaur's cryogenic (L02/LH2) propellants (other IUS/PAM upper stages use solid propellants), and controls on the aft flight deck for loading and monitoring the Centaur stage. No Centaur flight was ever flown and after the loss of Challenger it was decided that the risk was too great to launch a shuttle with a fueled Centaur upper stage in the payload bay."

    I think the modifications have since been removed. We now have no shuttle capable of launching a Centaur upper stage -- the other was destroyed. I have often wondered if this really is all that dangerous, considering the fact that the hydrazine maneuvering fuel used on many satellites the Shuttle launches is hypergolic, meaning it will ignite on contact with its oxidizer, no spark needed. Hydrogen and oxygen, on the other hand, require an ignition system.