CEO of Brilliant Defends Sneaky Installation Practices

Em Emalb and other readers sent in follow-ups to our earlier story about yet more bundled crapware with Kazaa. Kazaa says they didn't do anything wrong; and so does Brilliant's CEO. I don't understand why anyone is still installing Kazaa, given their track record. Brilliant's brilliant plan is to use your computer to distribute their advertising, and give out Altnet resource dollars in exchange.

Comments

here's why

[Anonymous Coward]

" don't understand why anyone is still installing Kazaa, given their track record."

Because 99.9% of Kazaa users don't know about slashdot, don't know about spyware, and don't even care when I tell them.

All they want is to add to their 100GB collection of mp3's.

Anyone living in the dorms right now can attest to this I'm sure. It also makes me realize where the RIAA is coming from, when kids literally skip classes to download more music and movies.

Re:here's why

[Verloc]

I was coming in here to post just this comment.

I told my brother, my girlfriend and my sister about the spyware and the distributed client, and you know what? They don't give two shits.

Kazaa is the best way to get what they're looking for, and they don't care about anything else. Period. I have a friend who, instead of downloading music is now downloading music videos with Kazaa.

Sure it strikes me as odd that nobody cares, but that's why they're still installing Kazaa.

Re:here's why

[GreyPoopon]

We can't save people from themselves, can't make the horse drink, and can't represent our moral-technical views as the views of others because, well, they just don't care.

And I'm not sure that we should try. The important thing is that we make sure it is a requirement that people are adequately informed by the companies that distribute such software. Just because I don't like to use software that contains spyware and other such junk, doesn't mean that my neighbor should feel the same way. As long as (s)he understands what is happening and chooses to accept the risks, that's ok. The hard part is in making sure that users understand.

This whole thing isn't really much different than smoking cigarettes. I don't smoke. I would rather that nobody smoke. But I can't (and won't) force others to feel the same way. Today, cigarette packages (at least in the USA) must be marked with warnings. Smokers are free to ignore those warnings. Willful installation of software that has other "side-effects" is just fine with me, as long as those performing the installation are adequately warned. And also, you don't have to worry about "sidestream" effects of what your neighbor does. Hmmm. Or maybe you do -- cable modem anyone?

Re:here's why

[MWoody]

Yeah, and as we all know, radio as a format failed horribly. Oh, wait...

That's "Mister Karma Ho'" (how to remove it)

[Cpt_Kirks]

Here's how to remove the "Brilliant" code.

Re:That's "Mister Karma Ho'" (how to remove it)

[sam_handelman]

I'll summarise the instructions.

First, wander around the building until you feel the ground beneath your feet vibrate.

Then, reach over to your keyboard (a wireless is best, use a stick if necesarry, but don't move from that spot!) and do the following in exactly this order. You will need to have already downloaded any files mentioned below-

1) copy seven different .cnd files into Windows\Candelabra.

2) Go to your sounds control panel and change your error message to "Opening." Cause the error message to be played.

3) You now have five seconds to execute Windows\Candelabra\Light.bat, read Windows\Bookdead.txt and click "Accept."

4) A new button, marked with a double quote (") will appear on your explorer toolbar; this is a shortcut to \Windows\Yendor.exe. Open each and every folder on your hard drive, and click this button. While you're doing this, Brilliant Digital CEO Kevin Bermeister, whom you thought you killed when you got Bookdead.txt, will periodically teleport into your room, and try and seize your keyboard in order to hide the button, delete or rename \Windows\Yendor.exe. You're going to have to kill him several times during this process, so keep a firearm handy.

5) Restart your computer.

6) Dedicate your desk as an altar to Anhur (or some other god, but Anhur is easiest.) Take your desk to the astral plane. Pile your computer on your desk and make of it an offering unto him.

Congratulations, you have now uninstalled brilliant digital's software.

As an extra challenge, try uninstalling the software without depending on divine intervention or commiting genocide.

Just get KazaaLite

[Anonymous Coward]

www.kazaalite.tk

Extra Features compared to original KaZaA
- No Adware
- No Spyware
- No banners
- No bitratelimit for mp3 files
- No irritating websites loaded into KaZaA
- No crappy BDE Viewer
- No f*cking Bonzi Buddy
- Set up multiple users with the included PseudoTrack tool

They obviously know they are being tricky.

[viper21]

From what I have heard/read lately, it seems that this trojan program is silently installed on to a users hard drive.

If a user decides to remove their install of Kazaa, then Kazaa should remove ALL traces of what it put on a users computer.

By hiding it, and making it virtually impossible for a casual user to remove, this should definately be classified as a trojan. Also, I have heard that Kazaa claims that this program is only active when the client is runnng/connected. If this is the case, then why wouldn't it automagically uninstall if you chose to remove Kazaa from your computer?

I'm just hoping that, for once, the RIAA strings these people up. Ask for permission to use my cycles, I will probably let you. Hide it in your 1,000,000 page EULA, go to hell. This is almost as bad as when WebHancer was bundled with AudioGalaxy.

-S

Get Kazaa Lite

[spav]

Um....Get Kazaa Lite...no more crapware, same old Kazaa.

Interesting thought

[wiredog]

Since the software isbeing used for illegal purposes, could the advertisers be liable? They are supporting it, after all...

Why people use it?!?!?

[FortKnox]

I don't understand why anyone is still installing Kazaa, given their track record.

You get free sharing across a network, at the price of some advertising.


Lemmie put it into terms slashdotters will understand, at the cost of my karma (cause michael will slap this down in a matter of seconds):
I logged into slashdot today to find that there are LARGE ads in the middle of their articles! I don't understand why people use this site, after their trackrecord of ignoring their users, abusing their power, and insulting the users!

Is that example a troll? A flamebait?
Then so is the article explanation by michael!

How to remove - quick version

[tartanboy]

1.In the Windows Control Panel, select an option called "Add/Remove Programs." One of the options will be "b3d Projector." Highlight this and click the "Change/Remove" button.

You may get a message that the uninstall has been successful.

Search your computer for a "BDE" folder, which most likely will be found in the "WinNT" or "Windows" directory. In this folder will be a file called "bdeclean.exe". Run this to finish the first part of the process.

Delete the BDE folder.

Caution: An unrelated piece of software called Borland Database Engine also creates a BDE directory. If you think you may have this software installed, or if there is any confusion whatsoever, do not delete this directory.

2.In the "Temp" directory (this will normally be found inside the "Windows" or "WinNT" directory) is a folder called "Brilliant." This contains many files. Delete the entire folder.

3.After performing steps 1 and 2, you will need to locate and remove some additional Brilliant Digital files that have been placed in critical system-level computer directories. CAUTION: Deleting the wrong files could interfere with the normal functioning of your computer. These files will most likely be in the "Windows\System" or "WinNT\System32" folder(in windows XP I found them in Windows\System32\):

bdedownloader.dll
bdedata2.dll
bdefdi.dll
bdeinsta2.dll
bdeinstall.exe
bdesecureinstall.cab
bdesecureinstall.exe
bdeverify.exe
bdeverify.dll

Delete these files.

Why I still use KaZaA

[seldolivaw]

1. Morpheus is dead, and Gnutella clients are improving, but are not nearly good enough yet.
   
2. I find what I'm looking for. The user base is huge, 1,000,000+ users online at any time, so I'm very seldom disappointed. Using LimeWire and Bearshare (which I tested out when Morpheus first died) successful results take longer and downloads are more likely to abort unsuccessfully.
   
3. It's slick. Morpheus 2.0, BearShare and LimeWire were all huge resource hogs, and took hours to even find some servers to connect to, far less find me any media. And -- a minor but significant point -- their interfaces suck big time. LimeWire's was the best GUI, but the worst results, sadly.
   
4. Only moron users can't tell that KaZaA is loaded with spyware. If you're moderately experienced, it's piss-easy to choose the "custom install" option when installing KaZaA. All the spyware programs are clearly listed in that install, and avoiding them is as easy as unchecking the boxes (though the install program is cute, and asks you not to "in order to support our software").
   

The ALTNET / b3d client does seem to install itself without asking you, but it sits quietly in the "installed programs" list, and can be uninstalled in 3 clicks (which I performed yesterday after reading Brilliant's plans for ALTNET).

Summary: I use KaZaA because it works, and only morons can't uninstall the spyware.

Re:Why I still use KaZaA

[Tom7]

This is an excellent troll. So much so that I can't even resist responding!

KaZaa asks you about a *few* of the many spyware apps they want to install on your computer. But MANY of them are installed regardless of what you choose. Try running Ad-Aware on your machine, or check out the uninstallation instructions for their newest thing (they one that this article is about).

Re:Cycleware?

[Anonymous Coward]

I like the idea in some respects, but if it's anything like the opt-in distributed-computing projects (distributed.net, prime95, etc.), it hangs around forever, raising three issues:

1. Imagine the overhead of 30 or 40 of those programmes fighting over your CPU.

2. When have I made my penance?

3. Why does the guy with the 486/50 get the package essentially free, but my Thunderbird 1200 gives them loads of useful work in exchange?

I'd be more comfortable with a system where you "buy" the product with a specific piece of work, perhaps built into the installer. I'd like to see something like this:

"To cover the cost of this programme, we want to use your computer to help solve: 'New Preservative Design for Twinkies, Inc.'. Your contribution will require 1.7M of download, a 500k upload of the results, and approximately 25 hours of CPU time on a Pentium III/500. When your contribution is complete, the distributed-computing component will be automatically and completely removed from the system. [OK][Cancel][Huh?]"

Persuading the masses

[ShaunC]

I've managed to convince a few otherwise stubborn people that spyware, malware, and god-knows-what-it's-installing-ware are bad things. After trying several approaches, I found there's one argument that always seems to work: tell them that these sort of junk addons could delete their MP3 collection. The average KaZaA user, as you pointed out, doesn't care much (if all) about the privacy and security implications of clicking through the EULA. What they do care about is their MP3s, and you can use that thought to get them concerned about spyware. Think of it as reverse-psychology FUD; applying facts to a topic that's bound to scare them into paying attention.

To a lot of people, music trading is a compulsion, much like some people "collect" porn or warez. (The comment about kids skipping class to download more is a fairly sad indication of this.) It's not so much about using the stuff, as it is about having the stuff; the bigger the collection the better, etc. Compare someone who's really into MP3 swapping with someone who's really into warez. Chances are, you'll find that they have a large collection, the majority of which they never use personally, and some of which they probably don't even like but have saved to enlarge the packrat's nest. You'll probably also find that they're outright frightened by the thought of losing any of it, even the stuff they don't use. It's a hoarding mentality, regardless of whether it's warez, porn, music, or whatever.

With that knowledge you can make a pretty convincing argument, even to the most computer-ignorant people, about the possible repercussions of disregarding EULAs and letting the installer do whatever it wants. Toss around the idea that the spyware du jour might be a program written by record companies to delete all MP3s on the hard drive. Suggest that hidden background apps might be making lists of MP3 files and sending them to a record company's lawyer. These things are technically possible - and if this Altnet turdlet has been lying dormant and undiscovered in Kazaa for a few months, who knows what else is waiting? Maybe some innocently named function call in an installer-dropped DLL isn't doing what its name would suggest.

Don't get too technical (most people get lost if you say "RIAA" instead of "record company," for instance) but be sure to plant the idea that recklessly installing software could wipe out their music collection, or their porn collection, or [insert whatever data is most valuable to them]. You'll get their attention pretty quickly.

Shaun