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Interview With Herb Sutter
Anonymous Coward writes "Herb Sutter, a C++ luminary, recently joined Microsoft's Developer Platform and Evangelism Division, where he acts as a liaison between Microsoft and the C++ developer community. In this interview he speaks about his new job, the role of C++ in the .NET framework, and the current state of C++."
An interesting point he makes about HTML being the best means for a cross platform interface for programs, C++ or otherwise.
.NET language suite is quite a suprise to me since I though C# got most development focus when creating the new tech.
I think he's right.
Also C++ being the best performing language in the
Rys
- 'sup, G?
I find it pretty strange that the same guy who is secretary in the standards committe now works for a company that market a definetly non-standard compatible C++ developement suite.
I've worked with Visual Studio in the past, and was always irritated by the microsoft-specific stuff and especially the automatically generated code, which is inserted at compilation time and thus can't be read or seen. I don't like using mystery code in my appilications.
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"The chances of a demonic possession spreading are remote -- relax."
So... when are we going to see the linux kernel compiled on VC++?
Considering the linux kernel uses non standardised GCC extensions...i doubt it.
It might just be me, but to me, it seems.. well.. wrong, for someone recommending the C++ standard to be part of ANY commercial company who's job it is to write C++ code.
Ok that sound's a bit silly on the surface but think about it: they might recommend specs that make thing's easier for them but harder for other's, or basically have a hidden agenda.
this is ESPECIALLY true for a company like Microsoft who.. well, Lets not kid ourselves Microsoft Apologists: rarely follow standards, and tend to "embrace and extend" the standards they do choose to follow. it just seems like a reciepe for a little underhanded.
But maybe i'm missing something, anyone want to make a constructive critism?
Microsoft IIS is to webserving as KFC is to healthy eating
But you're missing the fact that VC++7.0 can still generate non-.NET binaries. And the fact that it can is a Good Thing. .NET isn't going to be the whole world, and for some while yet it's still a fairly small corner of it.
Maybe now with him joining the MS team he can maybe push for more compatabilty between the compiler sets. I know theres alot of G++ and VC++ extensions that people would like to see in both sets. Maybe one day this may make porting apps specialised for one compiler to another easier. Just my 2 cents :)
"What do you mean you have no ice? Do you expect me to drink this coffee hot?" - Random Customer, Clerks
No matter what people think of him going to MS, the man knows his C++. Merit is what counts people, not where you sit at work, or the name attached to your business card. The only thing worth keeping is ones integrity and work ethic. Companies, languages and platforms come and go, so don't get too attached to the latest fad.
I'm really interested in reading that book. I've found it, and when I get the time, I'll buy it and read it. However, I have read that he doesn't think that you have to design a language before you sit down and write it. This seems to fit the current state of C++, since bad design decisions are being squirrelled out and ironed over later.
/. doesn't archive anything under 4 letters, making it hard to search for C++ comments. :P
/. archives on topics like OSX and Objective-C. Many more eloquent people than me can tell you what's right with Obj-C and what's wrong with C++. Even better, go and pick up a book on Objective-C, and see for yourself.
When I say nobody has ever made a fully compliant compiler, I mean that. The standard is huge, and at last estimation, it appeared that there must be an error in the grammar. I'd provide a link to the comment and the author who was a compiler programmer, but
I've programmed in C, Java, Objective-C and Smalltalk (among other things, but those are the ones that are relevant) and each of them has something that offers itself as a better solution than C++. Above all, each of them has a clearer and less convoluted syntax. Java, Smalltalk, and Objective-C all offer (in my opinion, in any case) a superior object model to C++.
I write C++ code every day. I write it, and I don't like it. I admit, I'm not a master at the language, but the amount of work it would take to do so seems somewhat ludicrous. By comparison, it's easy to master C, Smalltalk and Obj-C because of the tight design and relative smallness of the languages in comparison to C++.
I agree that bad programmers will always find a way to do damage, but C++ gives far more ammunition than most languages. Every syntactic structure is another noose to hang yourself with.
The fact of the matter is that you don't need a language like C++ to to big projects, write complicated systems, or have a flexible system. I'd argue that Objective-C and it's runtime system are far more flexible, easier to program, and have done a good job at implementing a complex system (ie. OSX). Check through the
I won't lie to you, and deny that I'm biased against C++. But I'm biased against it for the same reason I don't like Windows. It's too big, it's too complicated, and there are better alternatives. But this is all just my opinion. Take it or leave it.
I'll leave you with this quote that has always appealed to me:
"If you think C++ is not overly complicated, just what is a protected abstract virtual base pure virtual private destructor and when was the last time you needed one?" --Tom Cargin (C++ Journal, Fall 1990)
I do, in fact, do what you suggest, and use the C subset of C++. :)
I'd rather be using Objective-C, though. It always stuns me that an excellent language like Obj-C (or even Smalltalk, for that matter) never really got popular, and an extremely complicated language with a few benefits over C got super popular.